328 réponses à ce sujet

[o Ventus]

Now you're the one totally changing things. Who said "revolutionary art" when referring to Bioware before you? The OP is appreciating (note the title) how far Bioware has taken the homosexual dynamic.

 

 

The OP says that other companies treat LGBT character as simple fanservice. A lot of them certainly do, I won't contest that, but (to use my earlier example) Juri isn't lesbian because of fan service. Her sexuality honestly isn't even her defining trait, it's just another thing about her. It isn't like Capcom is saying "hey, look, we have gay people too!" and pointing it out at every opportunity to appease people.

[FadelessRipley]

...Josephine is so traditional that I cannot picture her in a scandalous homosexual relationship that holds no prospect of children, inheritance, etc. She also has no homosexual dialogue outside a relationship, yet shows interests in men (Ex: Blackwall, Iron Bull and Cullen naked).

Did you read the Codex about Sexuality in Thedas? Mind you, Antiva isn't covered. Maybe or has a bit of a Tevinter attitude. Ah, I get what you're saying, though. That's why I see Leliana and Isabela as pretty well "established", as it were.

[congokong]

My 2nd post in this thread, the very first sentence:

???

 

Several have already stated that Bioware takes the homosexual dynamic further than most, and without the characters being defined by their homosexuality. Hence the appreciation. You're being rather cynical about it.

[o Ventus]

???

 

Several have already stated that Bioware takes the homosexual dynamic further than most, and without the characters being defined by their homosexuality. Hence the appreciation. You're being rather cynical about it.

I misread your post the first time. See my edit.

[Xilizhra]

I was largely referring to dialogue that relates to sexual preferences. Merrill shows fondness for qunari men, an example I was thinking of actually, yet I can't recall anything suggesting lesbian tendencies outside of the romance. Anders... Certainly can see him as bi. But Josephine and Fenris? I just don't see Fenris as bi, and Josephine is so traditional that I cannot picture her in a scandalous homosexual relationship that holds no prospect of children, inheritance, etc. She also has no homosexual dialogue outside a relationship, yet shows interests in men (Ex: Blackwall, and Iron Bull and Cullen naked).

Um... Josephine's position has nothing whatsoever to do with her orientation, in addition to the fact that none of the straight Inquisitors are great prospects for alliance anyway (also, homosexual relationships aren't really scandalous).

[Xilizhra]

Did you read the Codex about Sexuality in Thedas? Mind you, Antiva isn't covered. Maybe or has a bit of a Tevinter attitude. Ah, I get what you're saying, though. That's why I see Leliana and Isabela as pretty well "established", as it were.

Actually, Antiva is stated by Zevran to be the most open.

[daveliam]

The OP says that other companies treat LGBT character as simple fanservice. A lot of them certainly do, I won't contest that, but (to use my earlier example) Juri isn't lesbian because of fan service. Her sexuality honestly isn't even her defining trait, it's just another thing about her. It isn't like Capcom is saying "hey, look, we have gay people too!" and pointing it out at every opportunity to appease people.

 

I don't think anyone is saying that Bioware is the only one that does this.  So your example with Juri (who I'm not familiar with) sounds valid as well.

 

That being said, the fact that you've latched onto one other example is pretty telling.  It's not like you are picking from a bunch of examples and the reason is because pickings are slim when it comes this type of character.  Yes, we can all list out examples of them.  But the fact is that the very idea of being able to list them out tells us something.  Could you imagine trying to list out all of the straight characters who are explicitly straight and not 'fan-service' in video game history? 

[congokong]

Did you read the Codex about Sexuality in Thedas? Mind you, Antiva isn't covered. Maybe or has a bit of a Tevinter attitude. Ah, I get what you're saying, though. That's why I see Leliana and Isabela as pretty well "established", as it were.

I read it but cannot remember. Its summary seemed to be that it's different everywhere. lol  Barring the codex, my impression of Thedas is from a feudalism standpoint more or less based on what we've seen. In such bloodlines are very important, with homosexual relationships being counter to that. Look at what happened with Dorian for example. That's why Josephine, being so dutiful and immersed in such politics, seems very unlikely to delve into homosexuality to the point of shunning an arranged marriage; only emphasized by how she doesn't make any comments outside of a romance regarding homosexual attraction.

[o Ventus]

I don't think anyone is saying that Bioware is the only one that does this.  So your example with Juri (who I'm not familiar with) sounds valid as well.

 

That being said, the fact that you've latched onto one other example is pretty telling.  It's not like you are picking from a bunch of examples and the reason is because pickings are slim when it comes this type of character.  Yes, we can all list out examples of them.  But the fact is that the very idea of being able to list them out tells us something.  Could you imagine trying to list out all of the straight characters who are explicitly straight and not 'fan-service' in video game history? 

Telling of what, exactly? Giving examples is my way of simply pointing out they exist.

[daveliam]

Telling of what, exactly? Giving examples is my way of simply pointing out they exist.

 

There aren't many examples.  That's the point.  Just a handful in 30+ years of gaming.  So when they do show up, it's still kind of a big deal. 

[Zobert]

I heard this about females in games, too.  Oh, there was Zelda or Midna or Amy Rose Lara Croft, etc.  Compared to how many males though? The fact that they can be named shows how exemplary they are.

 

Although my favorite female in video games (prior to being able to be the hero in Bethesda games) was Kitana in MK.

[Zobert]

Fenris definitely. Anders always struck me as gay, despite his Awakening comments. Merrill and Josephine are slightly more plausible. By "demeanour", well I mean naive and innocent people can be gay or bi, too. Merrill is hot for Qunari blokes though, we know. Don't remember any particular contradictory dialogue for either. I romanced Josephine, and have to admit it was kind of fun doing this textbook traditional soppy romance story as a female PC.
Conversely, I've always felt Morrigan, Alistair and Cassandra come across as definitely straight, and I'm baffled by mods to change them. The reaction to such mods for Dorian and Sera is a bit hypocritical in that sense. Though Cassandra did break my gay little heart.

I've seen people going postal that Cullen is racist. :s I agree, it's more realistic and simply a preference.

 

Yes, Fenris seemed straight and Anders did always seem gay by their own comments.  The Karl thing, for example, and Fenris and Isabella's banter.

 

While Isabella did always seem "bi" like Zev,.

[Rannik]

I don't find Bioware's LGBT characters to be particularly good...

 

Some like the trans Krem are an abomination, and others like Dorian feel like cheap pieces of projection.

[Xilizhra]

Yes, Fenris seemed straight and Anders did always seem gay by their own comments.  The Karl thing, for example, and Fenris and Isabella's banter.

 

While Isabella did always seem "bi" like Zev,.

So, wait, to be bisexual, you have to be constantly verbally hungry for the attentions of both genders?

[In Exile]

So, wait, to be bisexual, you have to be constantly verbally hungry for the attentions of both genders?

 

Apparently. I believe simply carrying a giant sign is the preferred solution.

[Xilizhra]

Apparently. I believe simply carrying a giant sign is the preferred solution.

Instead of "Don't," this one reads "DTF."

[Zobert]

So, wait, to be bisexual, you have to be constantly verbally hungry for the attentions of both genders?

 

I said that?  Wow.  Huh.  I must have been in an altered state when I wrote that post and then deleted it...which post did I say that you have to be verbally hungry for both genders to be bisexual?  I can't seem to find it.

 

See...I am thinking I probably wouldn't have said that as I am someone who society would categorize as bisexual and i am not equally yoked nor do I walk  around saying "Hey, I'm Zoe, I'm a bisexual, wanna ****?"

 

[Zobert]

Just once on this forum, I would like someone to kindly say, "I may have misunderstood you, but are you saying______________?" Instead of assuming what someone means (usually the worst).

 

That would like...cool or something.

[FadelessRipley]

 
See...I am thinking I probably wouldn't have said that as I am someone who society would categorize as bisexual and i am not equally yoked nor do I walk  around saying "Hey, I'm Zoe, I'm a bisexual, wanna ****?"
 

Wait, ladies can be bears...?

I'm sorry, that joke was terrible. I'm leaving now.

[Zobert]

Ahem, I shall clarify....

 

Isabella is established already in DA:O as bisexual before we moved to a more playersexual game.  Because Fenris does not mention a "Karl" and if left alone will have sex with Isabella and not anyone else I tend to forget he's playersexual.  Anders mentions Karl and it is a deep emotional connection that feels like they intended for him to be fully gay and then drew back.

[Zobert]

Wait, ladies can be bears...?

I'm sorry, that joke was terrible. I'm leaving now.

 

 

 

It's my protest avatar.  I am constantly attacked by respawning hordes of darkspawn bears. in this game.

[NaclynE]

Well honestly I have no quarms with the fact that BIOWARE has gay or lesbian characters in their games. Frankly I wish companies would be open minded when making characters in games and and say stfu to haters. Sure DAI is banned in India but frankly I don't care. People should care for who they care for and video game companies have every right to do whatever they want when making there games.

[Zobert]

Well honestly I have no quarms with the fact that BIOWARE has gay or lesbian characters in their games. Frankly I wish companies would be open minded when making characters in games and and say stfu to haters. Sure DAI is banned in India but frankly I don't care. People should care for who they care for and video game companies have every right to do whatever they want when making there games.

 

Bioware has kinda done that, though.

[FadelessRipley]

 
It's my protest avatar.  I am constantly attacked by respawning hordes of darkspawn bears. in this game.

I hated those f*****g bears. Never a great bear that you could actually use to somehow improve your courtyard or something, oh no. Sh*tty normal yet demonically overpowered bears!!

[Zobert]

I hated those f*****g bears. Never a great bear that you could actually use to somehow improve your courtyard or something, oh no. Sh*tty normal yet demonically overpowered bears!!

 

Amen sister.  It should be Bear Age, not Dragon Age.