542 réponses à ce sujet

[Farangbaa]

Congratulations. You utterly misunderstood that post.

Oh I didn't just read how someone made the combat interesting by purposely hampering himself?

Gosh.

[Rawgrim]

When people say Origjns didn't require tactics, I wonder if they played the same game I did.

Or is it just because I never played a Warrior?

 

They say it because they really like DA:I, and think they are defending the dumbing down in it by pointing out some "poor bits" from previous games. Basically "Since there was one turd on the floor some years back, its ok if you dump a truckload on it today". That kind of thing.

[Farangbaa]

I edited my post even before I could read your response
 
 
No, you misunderstand what I am trying to say here, psychovore ...
 
My point is ... that it is important to have options and to have flexibility as well as depth ... so that you can find your own solutions and your own system within the system! If you take BG for example ... There are so many skills available - you will never use them all in one playthrough - even if your go super complex and challange yourself! But these skills are not there without reason. You can make very different characters and go for very different playstyles. Freedom and variety is important. It has so much to offer ... Normally that is a no brainer when developing RPG's! But with Inquisition I feel that mages are no longer wellcome! It is all about DPS of the skills and spells, now! THAT IS BORING AS HELL, MAN !!! DA:O was never that dull to me - not in a single playthrough! I have never played a RPG for dull action combat and people who do not care about this - Frankly are better of playing "god of war"!

What are you on about? I've played 4 mages and they were all very different.

[Rawgrim]

Oh I didn't just read how someone made the combat interesting by purposely hampering himself?

Gosh.

 

Someone described roleplaying to you.

[ThreeF]

When people say Origjns didn't require tactics, I wonder if they played the same game I did.

Or is it just because I never played a Warrior?

I'm actually getting same reaction when I read people saying that you can't play DAO without messing with the AI tuning. I mostly played rogue and I think once a mage.

[Farangbaa]

They say it because they really like DA:I, and think they are defending the dumbing down in it by pointing out some "poor bits" from previous games. Basically "Since there was one turd on the floor some years back, its ok if you dump a truckload on it today". That kind of thing.

DA:O's combat was 'challenging' until you understood the mechanics, which for most people who've played RPGs since BG took about 2 hours or something.

[Rawgrim]

DA:O's combat was 'challenging' until you understood the mechanics, which for most people who've played RPGs since BG took about 2 hours or something.

 

Yup. Guess what? You had to make an effort at understanding the mechanics in it. In DA:I, there really isn't any. You cast barrier and button mash.

[Il Divo]

When people say Origjns didn't require tactics, I wonder if they played the same game I did.

Or is it just because I never played a Warrior?

 

Or never played a Mage. If I'm at the point in a game where I'm using my spells simply for the flashing colors and not because they are the most effective combat option, there's a good chance tactics aren't required, beyond my own amusement. 

 

Take any combination of Mage/Spirit Healer/Arcane Warrior/Blood Mage and the game is pretty easy to steamroll through, including soloing the Archdemon. 

[Iakus]

Or never played a Mage. If I'm at the point in a game where I'm using my spells simply for the flashing colors and not because they are the most effective combat option, there's a good chance tactics aren't required, beyond my own amusement. 

 

Take any combination of Mage/Spirit Healer/Arcane Warrior/Blood Mage and the game is pretty easy to steamroll through, including soloing the Archdemon. 

Having a bug where Mana Clash causes a crash to desktop more often than not does add to the mage challenge though

[Bioware-Critic]

What are you on about? I've played 4 mages and they were all very different.

 

What I am "on about" is that I had lots of fun with the combat system in DA:O and in DA:I I have these very much narrowed down range of skills for mages that is so utterly boring and uninspiring that I have no fun at all with the combat!

It is always the same BS in the combat in DA:I !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Rinse repeat, rinse repeat, ... AAAAAAahhhhhhhh !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And mages ... are no fun at all in DA:I !

 

There is no complexity to be found ... NO MATTER WHERE YOU LOOK!

[Il Divo]

Having a bug where Mana Clash causes a crash to desktop more often than not does add to the mage challenge though

 

Good point. 

 

It's funny here because I am dissing on the level of tactics Origins required, but it's by far my favorite Bioware game in terms of Mage gameplay. I don't think I've ever had as much fun with my Mage/Arcane Warrior/Blood Mage/Battle Mage complete with a lightning sword. 

[PhroXenGold]

Good point. 

 

It's funny here because I am dissing on the level of tactics Origins required, but it's by far my favorite Bioware game in terms of Mage gameplay. I don't think I've ever had as much fun with my Mage/Arcane Warrior/Blood Mage/Battle Mage complete with a lightning sword. 

 

I'm guessing you never player BG2:ToB? Nothing quite like firing off 40+ spells within a single time stop...

[Iakus]

Yup. Guess what? You had to make an effort at understanding the mechanics in it. In DA:I, there really isn't any. You cast barrier and button mash.

 

I miss the days when I can say "Anders, wait until at least three enemies are clustered together before lanching a fireball.  Merrill, hit anything I disorient with a stonefist"

 

Now I have to hope they don't hit my Inquisitor witih a barrier when no one else is in range.

[Il Divo]

I'm guessing you never player BG2:ToB? Nothing quite like firing off 40+ spells within a single time stop...

 

I was never too big on Vancian Casting, despite playing a lot of tabletop DnD growing up. That does sound pretty damn sweet though. 

[Hexoduen]

Isn't it all highly dependent on class, build and playstyle whether or not DAO is a breeze to go through, and thus a highly subjective discussion? I've replayed it several times because of its great story, and while some of my characters can almost sleep through the Broodmother fight or the Archdemon, other characters I create keep dying repeatedly

 

The big difference of the two games in my opinion is that DAI is a dumbed down version of a classic RPG, while Origins is not.

[Iakus]

Good point. 

 

It's funny here because I am dissing on the level of tactics Origins required, but it's by far my favorite Bioware game in terms of Mage gameplay. I don't think I've ever had as much fun with my Mage/Arcane Warrior/Blood Mage/Battle Mage complete with a lightning sword. 

My mage was a Spirit Healer/Blood Mage who took almost exclusively Entropy and Spirit spells.  Subtle, but can really mess you up.  Great for setting up enemies to be chopped into kibble by your allies  and locking down enemy mages.

 

WHen not crashing to desktop

[Iakus]

Isn't it all highly dependent on class, build and playstyle whether or not DAO is a breeze to go through, and thus a highly subjective discussion? I've replayed it several times because of its great story, and while some of my characters can almost sleep through the Broodmother fight or the Archdemon, other characters I create keep dying repeatedly

 

The big difference of the two games in my opinion is that DAI is a dumbed down version of a classic RPG, while Origins is not.

hate to say it, but yeah, combat was overly "streamlined"  More so even than DA2.

[PhroXenGold]

I was never too big on Vancian Casting, despite playing a lot of tabletop DnD growing up. That does sound pretty damn sweet though. 

 

It was....incredibly fiddly and micromanagement intensive (Improved Alacrity allowed you to cast a new spell as soon as the previous one finished rather than waiting for the end of the "round", Robe of Vecna and an amulet whos name I forget together reduced your casting time by 5, meaning anything with a cast time of 5 or less became instant cast. Turn on the "auto-pause when spell cast" mode and...well...), but it was utterly hillarious when you pulled it off. Particularly when you do it four times in a row at no risk to you thanks to your Greater Contigency loaded with Projected Images that triggered when you cast another Projected Image. And then followed it up for a Wish that restored all the spells you've cast....

 

Yeah. High level mages were broken beyond all belief in ToB. Or D&D in general for that matter...

[Iakus]

 

Yeah. High level mages were broken beyond all belief in ToB. Or D&D in general for that matter...

Heh, that's why I liked playing a paladin with an upgraded Carsomyr and other magic-resist gear, plus  all the elemental resistances I could get.  Leave enemy mages with nothing to work with

[Hexoduen]

It was....incredibly fiddly and micromanagement intensive (Improved Alacrity allowed you to cast a new spell as soon as the previous one finished rather than waiting for the end of the "round", Robe of Vecna and an amulet whos name I forget together reduced your casting time by 5, meaning anything with a cast time of 5 or less became instant cast. Turn on the "auto-pause when spell cast" mode and...well...), but it was utterly hillarious when you pulled it off. Particularly when you do it four times in a row at no risk to you thanks to your Greater Contigency loaded with Projected Images that triggered when you cast another Projected Image. And then followed it up for a Wish that restored all the spells you've cast....

 

Yeah. High level mages were broken beyond all belief in ToB. Or D&D in general for that matter...

 

Well the mage did start out as a nothing, highly dependent on warriors to survive... Later on, war gods

 

[Bioware-Critic]

Isn't it all highly dependent on class, build and playstyle whether or not DAO is a breeze to go through, and thus a highly subjective discussion? I've replayed it several times because of its great story, and while some of my characters can almost sleep through the Broodmother fight or the Archdemon, other characters I create keep dying repeatedly

 

The big difference of the two games in my opinion is that DAI is a dumbed down version of a classic RPG, while Origins is not.

 

I think you nailed it!

 

 

No game is really hard if one understands its mechanics. But that isn't the question when it comes to FUN, either!

 

The question is ... "Was it interesting and did it have lots of freedom and variety to it?" ... so that you could go about it in different ways!

[PhroXenGold]

Heh, that's why I liked playing a paladin with an upgraded Carsomyr and other magic-resist gear, plus  all the elemental resistances I could get.  Leave enemy mages with nothing to work with

 

You were lucky they didn't hit you with a sequencer full of the unresistable magic resistance reducing spell (I forget the name). Just what you need to soften up an annoying paladin (or dragon) before you unload enough firepower to level a decent sized city within a single instant.

[Bioware-Critic]

My mage was a Spirit Healer/Blood Mage who took almost exclusively Entropy and Spirit spells.  Subtle, but can really mess you up.  Great for setting up enemies to be chopped into kibble by your allies  and locking down enemy mages.

 

WHen not crashing to desktop

 

... freedom regarding building your own style that is very special to you personally - that is what I miss when playing a mage in Inq!

I loved entropy and many other spell schools! But they are all gone now ...

[Bioware-Critic]

You were lucky they didn't hit you with a sequencer full of the unresistable magic resistance reducing spell (I forget the name). Just what you need to soften up an annoying paladin (or dragon) before you unload enough firepower to level a decent sized city within a single instant.

 Do you mean level drain?

[PhroXenGold]

 Do you mean level drain?

 

Nah, there was a spell that just took off MR. Lower Resistance perhaps? Something like that.

 

Level drain, incidentally, was one of the most retarded mechanics I've some across in an RPG. Totally and utterly unfun.

 

 

Oh, and I forgot to mention: when I say a "mage" is doing all this, I actually mean a level 13 kensai who's dual classed to mage. Meaning he has, barring HLAs, comparable or  better combat abilities that any non-kensai warrior and, with Ghost Armour or similar, armour almost as good as said warrior even prior to protection spells like Stoneskin.