23 réponses à ce sujet

[veramis]

In patch 5, a mouselook toggle was added  The purpose of the function is to reduce or even eliminate the need to hold down on the right mouse button in order to move the camera around your character when using a mouse/keyboard. Bioware says that it is a work in progress, and although it has some big issues, it is already superior in important ways to the right mouse button hold macro that performs the same function, so I have moved over to this. If you're a mouse/keyboard user and you've never tried out the macro or the in-game mouselook toggle, I recommend that you at least give it a try because IMO it makes the game experience significantly better (actually feels like a hack-n-slash game and not some epic struggle against controls), but admittedly, it does currently have some major quirks with AoE placement. On the other hand, there is almost no good reason to not use either this new function or the right mouse click hold macro if you are playing MP using a mouse/keyboard and a character without AoE abilities.

 

Here are some tips to players on how to use this function while minimally negatively-affecting AoE placement. Aside from tip #1 the advice here is mostly not applicable when playing characters WITHOUT AoE abilities:

 

1. To use the mouselook toggle, go to options, keybinds, scroll all the way down, and set a hotkey for the function (I like C, V, or B, since I usually hit the toggle several times per round). Put mouse cursor at the head of the character or center of the screen before activating toggle.

2. When mouselook is activated, AoE's you try to place will appear on the screen where your mouse cursor was last when the toggle was activated.

3. When mouselook is activated, AoE's have difficulty centering upon targeted enemies with that "auto-snapping" of AoE's feature, partly because of the mouse cursor's original location when enabling the toggle and partly because the mouse cursor isn't there to facilitate moving the AoE onto the desired target. Toggle off mouselook if you want accurate AoE auto-snapping on enemies.

4. If you often enable mouselook even when casting AoE's, remember and use your own default mouse cursor positioning which you should then always move to when turning on the toggle (I do the head of the character or center of the screen).

5. If you often disable mouselook to cast AoE's, you may prefer to use the medium or large mouse cursor in options so you can easily find where the mouse cursor is to make placing AoE's easier.

6. Tabbing out, going into the menu overlay, going into the overlay where you can kick and mute people, will turn off the toggle and the mouse cursor will be able to move around, and after going  back to the game screen the toggle will be re-enabled where the mouse cursor currently is. This can cause your AoE placements to start in very weird locations. You will want to re-center to your default mouse cursor positioning before exiting the overlays, or re-center it later with the toggle hotkey.

 

Here is some feedback to bioware on how to improve this feature. You guys almost have a game with decent PC controls. You can do it!:

 

1. Automatically activate this function for players using mouse/keyboard and a character without AoE's. The only drawbacks I can think of right now is it may interfere with casting AoE potions and highlighting enemies with the mouse to attack, but #2-3 in this list address these issues. Make it more obvious to people that the function is available, whether with some kind of in-game loading screen tip, pop-up detailing the feature, etc.

2. Allow users to define and/or give us a universal default starting location on the screen where AoE's start if a user begins to cast it while mouselook is enabled. The mouse cursor location should always reset to this user-defined or universal default location when toggling and when re-entering game screen (maybe also when entering overlays). A default mouse cursor location is the one aspect which the macro is superior to the in-game function.

3. Allow AoE's to "snap" onto targets better when mouselook is enabled, with offensive AoE's only able to snap onto enemies and defensive AoE's only able to snap onto players (i.e. no barrier centered on enemy).

4. If at least #1-3 in this list are addressed, option to automatically activate the function for all characters when loading into the game.

5. Option to set different levels of brightness/intensity of AoE circle lines.

6. Option to highlight enemies that will be affected.

7. Option to see the mouse cursor when casting AoE's while mouselook is enabled.

 

If #1-4 are done this MP will get veramis' unofficial decent PC controls seal of approval and devs a voucher to not get yelled at by him for a month.

[Robbiesan]

TL:DR  Console peasant here.

 

Liked for being helpful.

[akots1]

Also, there is no need for cursor to completely disappear. It can be changed to some other non-functional cursor. It is there after all, why it completely disappears? This was my main problem with the macro as I was "losing" it constantly and had to resort back to holding RMB. Also, if a double LMB click and/or an AOE placement can cancel toggle automatically or at least make cursor visible, that would be nice. The toggle itself can be snapped to some small, maybe a quarter or 1/8 of total screen, area invisible box in the center so that it cannot move outside of this box.

 

Also, circle lines, especially for group healing potion, should have slightly brighter boundaries and as you mentioned, yes, highlighting enemies/party members would be very nice although sort of difficult to implement with precision due to lag and movement as some AOE take time to cast.

 

I tried it yesterday and it did not work for me. I'll give it another try with your tips. Maybe it would help. But having to keep track of it and having an additional key to press in real time is not that easy.

[veramis]

akots1, one of the major benefits of the in-game mouselook toggle over the macro is that AoE movement on the ground more linearly reflects mouse movement so that it is relatively easier to place AoE's despite the lack of a cursor, but yeah it ain't perfect either.

 

You make a good point about the cursor disappearing when holding down right mouse click. Your solution of making it visible but non-functional would be a good optional feature (some people might not like a visible cursor always visible), but I would still like at least the option to have the mouse cursor reset to a default position every time I try to cast an AoE as I describe in feedback #2, maybe the same way that AoE placement starts at the position of where the mouse cursor was when enabling mouselook but without the different ways of losing the user-defined position.

[teltow]

I have only tested mouselook toggle on the AW and Katari. I love it on the Katari. It's a different (fun) game now with warriors in general I guess.

But AoE spells or effects (when tossing something - I'm curious how it works with Mark of Death) is a pita with it and I don't want to switch it on and off several times in a game.

 

I would like to place my AoE spells with a hold down right mouse button and execute them when I release the button.

[veramis]

Mortiel, some of the things you bring up aren't actually issues with how the in-game mouselook toggle works.

 

I'm not sure what you mean by auto-disable based upon character. It is currently disabled for everyone until you activate it with hotkey.

[junker1990]

In fact, it will be much better to toggle cursor visibility by right mouse button click (not hold). I'm curious why Bioware did not implement this obvious solution.

[veramis]

In fact, it will be much better to toggle cursor visibility by right mouse button click (not hold). I'm curious why Bioware did not implement this obvious solution.

 

It would be very nice to be able to hotkey this function to right mouse button click. Right now RMB click is used for canceling placement of AoE's, but I think it would be fine to either make AoE canceling re-mappable or make it so that if mouselook is on and the character is placing an AoE, first right click will cancel AoE placement and the second click will toggle mouselook off.

[junker1990]

It would be very nice to be able to hotkey this function to right mouse button click. Right now RMB click is used for canceling placement of AoE's, but I think it would be fine to either make AoE canceling re-mappable or make it so that if mouselook is on and the character is placing an AoE, first right click will cancel AoE placement and the second click will toggle mouselook off.

 

Or even better: if you choose AoE ability while cursor is hiding, you automatically have it visible; after land the AoE marker cursor is automatically hiding again; if you choose to cancel the cast, just click RMB and then cursor is hiding automatically again.

 

Really, console support changes dev minds irreversibly.

[veramis]

Auto-disabling was a general suggestion for fixing issues with targetable AoE spells. The auto-diabling based on characters was a typo... I meant auto-enabling based on characters without AoE abilities, as you suggested, would be horrible. That's all.

 

Why would it be horrible?

[Zorinho20_CRO]

Tnx Biower,can you please refund me 50 bucks

[veramis]

Mortiel, I suggest you try out the function first. And be sure to try it out on melee characters and tell me how it is bad. I see that you are arguing a lot but there's  just not much to be responded to because they just aren't that applicable to how the function works.

[Ghost Of N7_SP3CTR3]

The keyboard/mouse configuration of this particular game forced me to buy a Xbox controller for Windows before it gave me carpal tunnel syndrome.

Btw,nice work on the OP. "

[akots1]

I'll give it another try with your tips. Maybe it would help. But having to keep track of it and having an additional key to press in real time is not that easy.

Tried yesterday again. I'm still losing track of the cursor. It ends up in some weird places and I think, it moves with the camera somewhere and somehow. It just does not re-appear in the place where I turned mouselook on. WTF, I don't really know. Maybe, mouse is moved after all so it is reasonable but why the cursor "has" to disappear is still a mystery to me. It might have something to do with my drivers. I use a Sensei mouse and I have the Engine version 3 software running at start up. Maybe, it can be disabled but then, the resolution usually defaults outside of my comfort zone. I'm not sure what other people are experiencing.

[akots1]

The keyboard/mouse configuration of this particular game forced me to buy a Xbox controller for Windows before it gave me carpal tunnel syndrome.

I was seriously considering myself and even looked at one in Bestbuy but decided that I'm too old for this **** and the controller has way too many buttons and sticks and whatever. Actually, it is not that bad once you get used to holding RMB which took about a week for me.

[Ghost Of N7_SP3CTR3]

I was seriously considering myself and even looked at one in Bestbuy but decided that I'm too old for this **** and the controller has way too many buttons and sticks and whatever. Actually, it is not that bad once you get used to holding RMB which took about a week for me.

I felt the same way about the controller.I bought one for my wife,then checked it out.It made the game so much easier,I had to get a second one.I won't use a keyboard for this game again after getting the controller.I highly recommend them.

[veramis]

I am not really saying anything about mouse-look itself, but rather your suggestion regarding auto-enabling it for characters without targetable AoE spells. In my mind, it should be auto-enabled for all characters, or none at all (as it is now). Otherwise it would be horrible and confusing. Does that make sense?

There's nothing confusing about mouselook when you never need to exit it, and such is the case with all of the classes without AoE's in MP. If you don't cast AoE's, your mouse cursor is useless. If you look at the rest of my feedback besides the first one, I do suggest that the option should be made available to have mouselook automatically load for all classes, but only after #1-3 have been addressed, and I do want it as an OPTION because the existing camera would naturally be preferable by some players for AoE placement vs. even a very good mouselook system, and because it takes a very long time for a player to get used to a new control system for AoE placement. The argument you make right now is similar to what I already said, but I prefer that melees and archers get the proper controls ASAP until bioware can refine it enough for AoE casters whereas you think somehow people will be confused by it even though everyone who plays has learned or will learn by trial or reading that right mouse button hold=mouselook. Such difference of opinion is most certainly not something to be so vehement about and it's disappointing you want to make such an issue of it, but since you seem so adamant I am wrong I'll try to explain my reasoning.

Let's do a hypothetical. If I was playing a katari for 500 hours without mouselook automatically enabled, I would have the habit of holding down right mouse click in order to rotate around my character. If bioware did a ninjafix so that my katari always has mouselook automatically enabled, all that will happen is I can't see or move the mouse cursor. But the thing is, a katari doesn't need it the entire game (aside from some exceptions which I addressed before). I could press down the right mouse button click and move the mouse around on the mousepad just like normal and there would be zero difference in the camera rotation in either control system. The only difference between before and now is that I will notice, I can rotate around my character when I DON'T hold down the right mouse button, which can't in any way be detrimental to the game experience as far as I can tell... unless maybe you're someone who likes to play a melee character, move the mouse all around the mousepad like a madman and enjoy the mouse cursor streaking across your monitor.

Computer games have mouselook always enabled in the normal game screen for decades, i.e. half-life, and the vast majority of people who have ever played computer games with mouse/keyboard should be familiar with it. So in summary, there's nothing confusing about giving the non AoE characters automatic mouselook ASAP, and then work out the rest of the items in my feedback list until all of the other classes can be fixed enough that there would be less negative impact from having AoE characters with the option for automatically-enabled mouselook.

If you still want to talk more about the issue I would appreciate if we could discuss it in PM so as not to derail the thread.

[veramis]

Tried yesterday again. I'm still losing track of the cursor. It ends up in some weird places and I think, it moves with the camera somewhere and somehow. It just does not re-appear in the place where I turned mouselook on.

 

Read tip #6 if you haven't. In short, being tabbed out, using any in-game overlays such as menu, etc., will cause you to exit mouselook, and when you re-enter the game screen, it will lock your mouse cursor at its new current location.

[akots1]

Read tip #6 if you haven't. In short, being tabbed out, using any in-game overlays such as menu, etc., will cause you to exit mouselook, and when you re-enter the game screen, it will lock your mouse cursor at its new current location.

Even if I do use some overlay, I have no idea about it. I mean, Origin is an overlay and it is enabled in game and I have no plans to disable it. I have also tried it in single player and there, I also run Afterburner with Riva fps/gpu tempperature overlay but only in single player as it is not compatible with Origin in game. There is a lot of crap running in Windoze as well that might classify as overlay and there is little that can be done about it. It is an old problem of EA/Origin and they have said a few times they won't fix it. It seems their drm is not comfortable with overlays.

 

The last thing to try is to play in windowed mode, not full screen. That might actually work. But then some of colors become messed up sometimes.

[veramis]

akots1, yeah there can be a lot of overlays, and the mouselook toggle can become a huge headache with enough software triggering the automatic mouselook off. The right mouse button hold macro doesn't suffer from this since it is always on until manually turned off, but the macro has its own issues as mentioned before.