111 réponses à ce sujet

[daveliam]

it's all because you are trying to find a reason where there was none other than a technical one.

 

I guess that's where my issue lies.  It's a technical issue being disguised ("It's for story reasons") or justified ("He has preferences.  The qunari in Kirkwall and his heathen comment about dwarves is the evidence") as one that is adding to the 'realism' or 'depth' of the setting. 

 

Was Alistair race gated?
But I just don't think Cullen is that into Dave, no matter what sex dwarf you indentify with. Really, he probably sees through your Bugs Bunny costume change anyway . To answer your hypothetical, either would make for a night of staff polishing I guess, but I won't say I would prohibit anything from happening with the short guy. He's just have to be at the top of his game I guess.

 

Alistair wasn't technically race-gated, but if you made him king, he'd break it off with non-human ladies (I think it was also possible to be his mistress in some situations, but I'm not really sure).

 

Ha!  Okay, okay, there is a totally coincidental overlap between my disinterest in this type of gating and the fact that Cullen is sexy.  I promise that's not what's driving my thoughts on it. 

 

So your point at the end is the thing that kind of bothers me about Cullen.  Preferences only go so far.  Most people are more than happy to venture away from their preferences if they find someone who is what they are looking for in other ways.  So, knowing that Cullen will reject a dwarf who is exactly the same in every way as a human who he won't reject, doesn't make him a compelling character unless they give us a reason outside of "preferences".  That just makes him seem shallow, which kind flies against what we know of him.  Again, if they went full hog and just made him a racist, at least that'd be something.  But to leave it at it is just doesn't seem interesting or add anything in my opinion.  That's my point. 

[AppalachianApex]

The race gating made sense to me. Not everybody in Thedas in going to have the feels for every single race and/or sex, plus there's the technical side of things to consider. Having some LI's race-gated lent a sense of realism.

 

Now, what I DID find superfluous was the race-gating of different armor types. Now THAT really made me mad. Why on earth can I not equip my QunQuisitor with Grey Warden armor?? She'd look so badass! Same goes for all the other race-gated items. Not a fan.

[eyezonlyii]

At the same time though, it would venture into "one true love" territory, like we were talking about not wanting in the kisa thread. So it would be extremely difficult to write, which I think is a large part of the problem.

[ThreeF]

I guess that's where my issue lies.  It's a technical issue being disguised ("It's for story reasons") or justified ("He has preferences.  The qunari in Kirkwall and his heathen comment about dwarves is the evidence") as one that is adding to the 'realism' or 'depth' of the setting. 

Did the writer came out and said that it was done for  "It's for story reasons" or "He has preferences.  The qunari in Kirkwall and his heathen comment about dwarves is the evidence"? It's not disguise, if it is so.

 

And on a side note: You want specific "reasons" because for you that will add depth, it doesn't need to work what way though, sometimes just "reasons" is enough to add depth in a different sense, it is a matter or perspective. I mean you do not expect a "reason" for Dorian's or Cassandra's sexuality, right?

[(Disgusted noise.)]

Solas's gating was fine, in my opinion. Cullen's always just felt like "we didn't have time to animate two other body models, sorry."

 

So, I'm not for or against it, but if it's used in the future, I would like there to be deeper reasoning.

 

And I would prefer that all the "bonus" options don't go to the same people. 

[JosieRevisited]

At the same time though, it would venture into "one true love" territory, like we were talking about not wanting in the kisa thread. So it would be extremely difficult to write, which I think is a large part of the problem.

 

"It's supposed to be hard. If it wasn't hard, everyone would do it. The hard... is what makes it great."

 

What I mean by that is I really don't like when professionals say they are shying away from doing something because it might be difficult. Well, sure it will be difficult, but that's progress, right? That's evolution. That's what makes the next game a next-gen experience that is revolutionary and changes the way we think about everything. 

[(Disgusted noise.)]

Did the writer came out and said that it was done for  "It's for story reasons" or "He has preferences.  The qunari in Kirkwall and his heathen comment about dwarves is the evidence"? It's not disguise, if it is so.

 

And on a side note: You want specific "reasons" because for you that will add depth, it doesn't need to work what way though, sometimes just "reasons" is enough to add depth in a different sense, it is a matter or perspective. I mean you do not expect a "reason" for Dorian's or Cassandra's sexuality, right?

Sexual orientation is not the same thing as "preferences."

 

And you do get a reason. A female Inquisitor who flirts with either of them gets unique dialogue options and they let you down gently.

[daveliam]

At the same time though, it would venture into "one true love" territory, like we were talking about not wanting in the kisa thread. So it would be extremely difficult to write, which I think is a large part of the problem.

 

Not necessarily.  I mean, Sera's into qunari ladies and Bull's into redheads, but it didn't go that way.  I think they would just need to have a few lines where he expresses his preference (kind of like how Kaidan goes all gaga over asari) and it would establish his preference without having to have it go the whole "One twu wuv" approach.

 

Again, I'm not terribly against this (despite what I've typed).  I'm just not convinced that it's worth it. 

[ThreeF]

Sexual orientation is not the same thing as "preferences."

 

And you do get a reason. A female Inquisitor who flirts with either of them gets unique dialogue options and they let you down gently.

You do get a reason, vague yes but still, when Cullen let you down.

 

And deep down preferences are just the way we are wired, some people have a specific type, some don't, just because someone doesn't have a very spesific  identifiable preference, it doesn't mean they will be attracted to anything that moves, it just mean that those preferences can not be easily categorized and probably are very fluid.

[AresKeith]

I guess that's where my issue lies.  It's a technical issue being disguised ("It's for story reasons") or justified ("He has preferences.  The qunari in Kirkwall and his heathen comment about dwarves is the evidence") as one that is adding to the 'realism' or 'depth' of the setting. 

 

I always thought the story reasons comment was Bioware not trying to point directly at Solas lol

[daveliam]

Did the writer came out and said that it was done for  "It's for story reasons" or "He has preferences.  The qunari in Kirkwall and his heathen comment about dwarves is the evidence"? It's not disguise, if it is so.

 

And on a side note: You want specific "reasons" because for you that will add depth, it doesn't need to work what way though, sometimes just "reasons" is enough to add depth in a different sense, it is a matter or perspective. I mean you do not expect a "reason" for Dorian's or Cassandra's sexuality, right?

 

When they announced that Solas and Cullen were they said it was for "story reasons".  Then they never mentioned it again.  I can see it for Solas.  I'm just not seeing it for Cullen. 

And (disgusted noise) already stated my response to the last point. 

 

Solas's gating was fine, in my opinion. Cullen's always just felt like "we didn't have time to animate two other body models, sorry."

 

So, I'm not for or against it, but if it's used in the future, I would like there to be deeper reasoning.

 

And I would prefer that all the "bonus" options don't go to the same people. 

 

Yeah, pretty much this.  It's not awful how they did it with Cullen, but it's just not satisfying so I'm left wondering why people are happy with it and nothing's really been a great answer so far.  I think it boils down to me just not liking it and others do and that's that.

[ThreeF]

I always thought the story reasons comment was Bioware not trying to point directly at Solas lol

Me too.

[daveliam]

You do get a reason, vague yes but still, when Cullen let you down.

 

And deep down preferences are just the way we are wired, some people have a specific type, some don't, just because someone doesn't have a very spesific  identifiable preference, it doesn't mean they will be attracted to anything that moves, it just mean that those preferences can not be easily categorized and probably are very fluid.

 

I don't know.  I don't prefer men.  Why?  Because there is nothing in the world that will get me to be with a lady.  I prefer blondes, but it's not a deal breaker for me if a guy's a brunette or ginger.  And, given that there's no such thing as "white-sexual" or "tall-sexual" or "blonde-sexual", I see them as fundamentally different.  Maybe that's just me, though.  For me, the only deal-breaker is if the person is a lady.  Outside of that, no physical trait is a total deal-breaker in and of itself so the concept just seems weird and hard for me to understand.

 

I always thought the story reasons comment was Bioware not trying to point directly at Solas lol

 

That's very interesting.  That might be totally what that was.  I can understand that.  It just came across a little vague and unsatisfactory to a point.

[Panda]

I don't support race-gating and I hope it isn't included in next game. If it is, then of cource dwarf and qunari are again getting screwed badly like always. How does it increase my enthuastism to play the game again if I can't pick some races at all cause lack of options? Of cource it seems like qunari and dwarves are going to get screwed anyways animation and story-content-wise like in DAI, but romance options too, no thanks.

 

Qunari =/= Tal-Vashoth. Qunari are heathens in face of Chantry, they have their own "religion" that they follow and force on people. Andrastian Tal-Vashoth is way less heathen than apostate human who hates Chantry and Andraste for example.

 

If there is going to be gating's after preferences (which is stupid in my opinion cause preference is not something mandatory and limitating, it's something that would be extra), I hope BW is going to hand-over guides on how to make PC that certain character would like to romance. Heck, why not skip CC and just have presets to choose from so LI can get character they prefer.

[AresKeith]

That's very interesting.  That might be totally what that was.  I can understand that.  It just came across a little vague and unsatisfactory to a point.

 

That's why I wish Bioware would stop being vague most of the time

 

Probably would've cut down on the "Cullen is racist" topics a bit lol

[ThreeF]

I don't know.  I don't prefer men.  Why?  Because there is nothing in the world that will get me to be with a lady.  I prefer blondes, but it's not a deal breaker for me if a guy's a brunette or ginger.  And, given that there's no such thing as "white-sexual" or "tall-sexual" or "blonde-sexual", I see them as fundamentally different.  Maybe that's just me, though.  For me, the only deal-breaker is if the person is a lady.  Outside of that, no physical trait is a total deal-breaker in and of itself so the concept just seems weird and hard for me to understand.

Preference when rigid is called "fetish" and within "fetish" the "tall-sexual" is a very possible concept.

 

In a sense straight and gay have a rigid sexual preference, bisexuals less so, pansexuals are the most fluid.

[eyezonlyii]

But again, what would you have Cullen say? "I'm sorry Inquisitor, but I prefer it if [you/I] didn't need a stool to embrace one another comfortably"?

Though this goes out the window with everyone else, so...yeah.

[ThreeF]

But again, what would you have Cullen say? "I'm sorry Inquisitor, but I prefer it if [you/I] didn't need a stool to embrace one another comfortably"?

Though this goes out the window with everyone else, so...yeah.

Just imagine him saying it with his deadpan voice!

[JosieRevisited]

 

If there is going to be gating's after preferences (which is stupid in my opinion cause preference is not something mandatory and limitating, it's something that would be extra), I hope BW is going to hand-over guides on how to make PC that certain character would like to romance. Heck, why not skip CC and just have presets to choose from so LI can get character they prefer.

 

Likely because this detracts from the immersion factor of the game. There's something to be said about the process and the surprise. Sometimes it's good, sometimes it's seriously just 'wtf' - but the experience is always worthwhile. And at its core, this is not a romance sim. It's a high fantasy game that happens to have some pleasant side stories so you don't have to feel like your character is going it alone. 

 

So for that, I think what they have done is more than anyone could have expected. This is still, to my knowledge, the only company that takes these considerations so seriously and does them so well. 

[Panda]

Likely because this detracts from the immersion factor of the game. There's something to be said about the process and the surprise. Sometimes it's good, sometimes it's seriously just 'wtf' - but the experience is always worthwhile. And at its core, this is not a romance sim. It's a high fantasy game that happens to have some pleasant side stories so you don't have to feel like your character is going it alone. 

 

So for that, I think what they have done is more than anyone could have expected. This is still, to my knowledge, the only company that takes these considerations so seriously and does them so well. 

 

I know it does. But so does race-gating for me as well. With DAI it really seems like Bioware doesn't even want people play Dwarves and Qunaris, not only romance-part, but also CC, story and other aspects.

[daveliam]

But again, what would you have Cullen say? "I'm sorry Inquisitor, but I prefer it if [you/I] didn't need a stool to embrace one another comfortably"?

Though this goes out the window with everyone else, so...yeah.

 

I mean, there's like a dozen ways for this to happen.  I'm not a creative person when it comes to writing, so my examples are all rubbish, but it could be as simple as Leliana teasing him in the War Table banter about finding "elves pretty".  Not "pluck their eyes out and wear them as a necklace pretty", but something like that.  You know?  I doesn't have to be any more explicit than Bull's, "Redheads...mmmmmm" or Sera's, "Qunari....makes me think things....." or Kaidan's, "Asari.....huh?  I got distracted."

[stop_him]

But again, what would you have Cullen say? "I'm sorry Inquisitor, but I prefer it if [you/I] didn't need a stool to embrace one another comfortably"?

Though this goes out the window with everyone else, so...yeah.

Doesn't a dwarfQuisitor stand on a stool in the closing scene with a romanced IB? IB is up for anything: stools, dragons, stick-beatings, you name it.

 

Yes, Cullen may be a reformed man after ten years, but... he's still got some "racisty" preferences. I always found that to be a perfectly legit explanation, and believe it's supported through the 2 games. Even in real life, people are often willing to be friends with people of "X" race, but still won't date them. It's a preference informed by racism...kind of.   

 

Yes, you could make the most beautiful dwarf, and Cullen would turn her down, while making the fugliest human inquisitor and he's tap that, but I don't think the majority of players try to make fugly PCs. Plus, I'm not sure the game would know how to "rate" attractiveness. Just look at the presets in the CC--most of them are average at best. 

 

That being said, I am fine with even more race-gated ("racist"), picky romances in the future. Totally cool with a gay only romance with dwarf KISA who will only romance another male dwarf with red hair who dons beard #6 in the CC.

[ThreeF]

That's why I wish Bioware would stop being vague most of the time

 

Probably would've cut down on the "Cullen is racist" topics a bit lol

 

I'm kind of tempted to post that  gif, you know with the blond girl in the snow....swirling....singing....

[daveliam]

That being said, I am fine with even more race-gated ("racist"), picky romances in the future. Totally cool with a gay only romance with dwarf KISA who will only romance another male dwarf with red hair who dons beard #6 in the CC.

 

I will tell you what, to get a gay dwarf KISA, you can sure as hell bet that I'd be creating a male dwarf with red hair and beard #6.  Trust and believe!

[Lady Artifice]

I thought the reason for Cullen's race gating was that they just didn't have time to handle the cinematics for scenes with shorter Dwarves and taller Qunari.