20 réponses à ce sujet

[Personette]

I was playing Origins & stopped by the Wonders of Thedas, where the Tranquil proprietor explained that the Circle supports itself by selling the work of Tranquil enchanters. 

 

I had wondered about Circle finances--if the Circles were subsidized, how mage labor was valued & exchanged. Turns out the Circles are self-supporting. Nobody's "giving" the mages anything. 

 

Abusing the Rite of Tranquility has been a thread through all three games. It's really clear that lots of people are happy to make use of the Tranquil--not just to make jailing the mages easier, but because the Tranquil are industrious and easy to abuse. Meredith and her Tranquil assistant, constant hints about Templars who rape the Tranquil, etc. 

 

Which makes it extra creepy that there's a clear economic benefit to abusing the Rite of Tranquility. Ties the whole thing up in a bow. A system that can't survive without a steady supply of Tranquil labor is going to turn dirty fast. Corruption is baked in from the start. 

[Cadeym]

I had actually forgotten about that.. but you have to remember that people such as VIvienne only want what is best for the mages...

 

So don't go and be fooled by what you learn in DA:O.. that is just the ferelden circle and totally not how all the others operate. Also, it's actually a good thing because it ensures that the circles can continue their function without being a huge burden on everyone else.. there really is no corruption... anywhere.

 

I do however wonder why Vivienne was so fond of being first enchanter.. well, it can't have had anything to do with money.

[Lumix19]

I had actually forgotten about that.. but you have to remember that people such as VIvienne only want what is best for the mages...
 
So don't go and be fooled by what you learn in DA:O.. that is just the ferelden circle and totally not how all the others operate. Also, it's actually a good thing because it ensures that the circles can continue their function without being a huge burden on everyone else.. there really is no corruption... anywhere.
 
I do however wonder why Vivienne was so fond of being first enchanter.. well, it can't have had anything to do with money.

I'm not sure if this sarcastic or not. Vivienne doesn't seem to care about anything but herself. Her reasoning behind her support for loyalists, while somewhat legitimate, instead masks a desire to preserve the Circle to protect her station. She wants a system that rigidly controls Mages because she knows how to play that system to increase her station and gain powers and rights that her fellow Mages could never have.

As for the Formari yes the system is quite scary. The Tranquil do everything from cleaning to raising money to maintain the Circles so it does seem a somewhat frightening prospect that good Mages could be put through Tranquility just to ensure they have enough.

[snackrat]

I find that interesting, because it creates a little parallel to Tevinter slavery.

They abhor that so much, but that's what they're doing to the Tranquil - using the labour of those so used to following orders they don't operate independently for the good of their own lifestyle/well-being.

Actively branding people (oft against their will) draws parallel to the slavers going out kidnapping people to fund their slave-based economy.

 

Yikes.

[Cantina]

Not to mention the Tranquil crafts bring in The Chantry's largest source of income. Which is no doubt why The Chantry is willing to overlook a Mage becoming Tranquil for punishment even if he/she has passed their Harrowing.

 

Kind of a crappy system in my opinion.

 

<Shrugs>

[ModernAcademic]

I've always wondered about that. It's an excellent question.

Maybe the Chantry helps the Circle somehow? Certain expenses necessary to maintain the Circles' regular activities cannot be financed only by commerce. The Circle needs a stable, constant source of income. 

It's the least the Chantry should do for imposing so many prohibitions and regulations on mages.

[Cantina]

I've always wondered about that. It's an excellent question.

Maybe the Chantry helps the Circle somehow? Certain expenses necessary to maintain the Circles' regular activities cannot be financed only by commerce. The Circle needs a stable, constant source of income. 

It's the least the Chantry does for imposing so many prohibitions and regulations on mages.

 

They probably do, but cover it up saying its for the benefit of The Templars - not the mages- thus they can do their duty.

 

Would not surprise me if The Chantry did this, they are sneaky.

[Cadeym]

Oh? I thought I made it fairly obvious that I was being highly sarcastic.. hmm, maybe I wasn't?? it's hard to tell these days.

[Personette]

Oh? I thought I made it fairly obvious that I was being highly sarcastic.. hmm, maybe I wasn't?? it's hard to tell these days.

 

I figured it out after a couple of sentences. Clearly many of the mages are corrupt as well--skimming off the top? 

 

 

I find that interesting, because it creates a little parallel to Tevinter slavery.

They abhor that so much, but that's what they're doing to the Tranquil - using the labour of those so used to following orders they don't operate independently for the good of their own lifestyle/well-being.

Actively branding people (oft against their will) draws parallel to the slavers going out kidnapping people to fund their slave-based economy.

 

Yikes.

 

Yes. And, of course, the false benevolence: Mages are dangerous, can't be left to their own devices, nothing to do with the fact that we're over here getting rich & not passing the profits back to the people who do the work...

[Big I]

Other things mages could and should do to make money:

 

1) Magical healing - when non mage "doctors" (like the quack working in Skyhold) are talking about leeches and trepanation, it's obvious mage healers could make a killing. There should be mage healers in every town and city.

 

2) Communications  - The (semi)canon novel Asunder says that the Circle had a system of magical devices that allowed instantaneous communication. Mages should set up a telecomunications company and make millions.

 

3) Closing tears in the Veil - Non-Breach related Veil tears (like the ones in DA:O and DA:A) could be shut by mages (Avernus did it, Solas mentions using magic to try closing the Rifts in DA:I). Since there's only one Inquisitor, mages should charge to protect people from demons.

 

4) Education - DA:O showed that the Circle had a wealth of knowledge on non magic related topics, like history, alchemy, and languages. The Cirlces (or the new College of Enchanters) should open their doors to (paying) non mage students to further their education.

[TK514]

Not to mention the Tranquil crafts bring in The Chantry's largest source of income. Which is no doubt why The Chantry is willing to overlook a Mage becoming Tranquil for punishment even if he/she has passed their Harrowing.

 

Kind of a crappy system in my opinion.

 

<Shrugs>

 

The Chantry doesn't get anything from the Circle's sales.  The Cirles get it all.  The only 'financial' relationship between the Chantry and the Circles that we know of is that the Chantry provides the Circles with Lyrium, apparently free of charge.

[Ryriena]

Please then why is lyurim bought from circles, even from the quartermaster.

[X Equestris]

I've always wondered about that. It's an excellent question.
Maybe the Chantry helps the Circle somehow? Certain expenses necessary to maintain the Circles' regular activities cannot be financed only by commerce. The Circle needs a stable, constant source of income. 
It's the least the Chantry should do for imposing so many prohibitions and regulations on mages.

The Chantry provides food, clothing, and quarters. The Circle appears to make money otherwise through those Tranquil who choose to stay with the Circle instead of going their own way.

[Ryriena]

The Chantry provides food, clothing, and qurters. However, the circles also give money back to the Chantry through the use of tiths and such thing like that, since all circles have a place of worship for the workers and mages. I would assume they would gather tiths from blessings, items being sold, ect. The Circles are chantry controlled and thus must get some revenue in return from them, I mean why in the world would the Chantry be so upset that the mages rebelled.

[keesio74]

I do however wonder why Vivienne was so fond of being first enchanter.. well, it can't have had anything to do with money.

 

Power. Status. Influence.

[Br3admax]

Not to mention the Tranquil crafts bring in The Chantry's largest source of income. 

Source? Never seen that anywhere. 

[TK514]

I mean why in the world would the Chantry be so upset that the mages rebelled.

You mean the Chantry that does nothing to prevent the mages from leaving, to the point that the Templars had to dissolve the Nevarran Accords and declare themselves seperate and independent once again in order to prosecute their war on mages?

 

Certainly there are many in the Chantry that aren't happy with the way things have turned out, but that's a matter of Faith rather than economics.  The Chantry gets nothing, monetarily, from the Circles.

[Hellion Rex]

Source? Never seen that anywhere. 

I think that the poster is referring to Circles, not the Chantry, which would make that post true.

[Ryriena]

You mean the Chantry that does nothing to prevent the mages from leaving, to the point that the Templars had to dissolve the Nevarran Accords and declare themselves seperate and independent once again in order to prosecute their war on mages?

Certainly there are many in the Chantry that aren't happy with the way things have turned out, but that's a matter of Faith rather than economics. The Chantry gets nothing, monetarily, from the Circles.

You do realize that the Templar's are the former military arm of the Chantry, and thus are apart of the chantry higherarcy.

Oh you mean the Chantry, whom basicly allowed the mages the right to vote on disloving the circles loving the circle based on the laws they had at the time. It was the templars that are the military arm of the Chantry that caused the war.

Keep saying they don't get any money from them, since apparently they do.

[AlexMBrennan]

I was playing Origins & stopped by the Wonders of Thedas, where the Tranquil proprietor explained that the Circle supports itself by selling the work of Tranquil enchanters.

I don't quite buy that - this rests on the assumption that non-tranquil mages can do nothing to generate profits, which I doubt (mages are rare, so the services they can provide due to having magic will fetch a decent price).

Still, if you want easily controlled slaves than tranquil seem like an ideal solution.