568 réponses à ce sujet

[o Ventus]

The problem isn't with you being forced to do the joining, since you can be conscripted. It's that after Ostagar you're forced to IDENTIFY as a Grey Warden. DAI is great about never forcing you to actually say you're Andrastian or to identify as the Herald of Andraste. It goes to great lengths to try and support multiple motives. After Ostagar DAO devolved into saving Ferelden because you're a GW, oftentimes railroading you into dialogue about how much you are they Grey Wardening-est Warden who ever Wardenend.

That's problematic when the origin story - the hook - gives you absolutely no reason to want to be or adopt that identity. It's one thing to want to go with Duncan to escape death - and it's one thing to want to save Ferelden - but none of that requires buying into the identity which you're forced to buy into.

 

The entire idea is that only a Warden can stop the Blight, and that your entire purpose in the game is to stop the Blight.

 

How does one stop the Blight if they aren't a Warden?

[In Exile]

The entire idea is that only a Warden can stop the Blight, and that your entire purpose in the game is to stop the Blight.

 

How does one stop the Blight if they aren't a Warden?

You don't need to be a "Warden" to stop the Blight anymore than you need to be the "Herald of Andraste" to stop the Breach. Only someone who's done the Joining can kill an AD - but you don't even know that before you meet Riordan, so that's not a reason to adopt the identity - and there's nothing special about being a Warden that ever matters in-game in terms of acquiring allies. The only time the GW treaties matter is when you have to get into Ostagar and you don't even have to prove your a GW (not that you even can besides telling someone you are, which it turns out is easy to fake). DA:I even lampshades this with how comically easy it is for someone to fake being a GW by having

Spoiler

Rainer to pretend to be the deceased Warden Blackwall the entire time, even using Warden treaties to obtain resources to fight a Not-AD

. You don't need to be a GW to stop the blight. 

 

All you need is someone who does the Joining. And before Riordan tells you about the US, you don't even know that you need the Joining; all it takes (as far as you know) is (a) gather a big enough army and ( go dragonslaying. 

[o Ventus]

You don't need to be a "Warden" to stop the Blight anymore than you need to be the "Herald of Andraste" to stop the Breach. Only someone who's done the Joining can kill an AD - but you don't even know that before you meet Riordan, so that's not a reason to adopt the identity - and there's nothing special about being a Warden that ever matters in-game in terms of acquiring allies. The only time the GW treaties matter is when you have to get into Ostagar and you don't even have to prove your a GW (not that you even can besides telling someone you are, which it turns out is easy to fake). DA:I even lampshades this with how comically easy it is for someone to fake being a GW by having

Spoiler

Rainer to pretend to be the deceased Warden Blackwall the entire time, even using Warden treaties to obtain resources to fight a Not-AD

. You don't need to be a GW to stop the blight.

 

So in order to stop the Blight, you need to be a Warden, but you don't need to be a "Warden". When your case is "well, you don't have to call yourself a Warden", it is not a very strong case.

 

Also, you learn why Wardens are necessary to end Blights long before you meet Riordan.

 

The treaties come into play in every single main quest (besides Redcliffe). The treaties (plus the favors you do as per the events of the quests) are what prompt the elves, dwarves, and mages (should you recruit them) to help you.

 

 

 

 

All you need is someone who does the Joining. And before Riordan tells you about the US, you don't even know that you need the Joining; all it takes (as far as you know) is (a) gather a big enough army and ( go dragonslaying.

 

Have you payed attention at all to DAO? Duncan and Alistair both make it pretty clear that you need a Warden to stop an Archdemon.

[AWTEW]

Bioware should make a Warden app, where you can feed them and pet them and dress them and smother them with unhealthy obsessive affection.

Presenting the all new:

Wargotchi virtual pet!

Avalible for 25.95 at leading bioware retail stores.

Batteries sold sepretly.

[Nimlowyn]

I think Bioware knows what they're doing and I trust that not bringing the Warden back is the right choice. Including for reasons I have no insight into, because I am not a developer, and I do not work at Bioware.

 

While I was pleased with the way my Hawke turned out in DAI (she behaved basically how I expected her to), I know there were people who weren't thrilled, with good reason. While I feel somewhat ambivalent in this because I enjoyed seeing her (just not what I had to do  ) I say keep our protagonists ours, and don't take them over in future installments. 

[In Exile]

So in order to stop the Blight, you need to be a Warden, but you don't need to be a "Warden". When your case is "well, you don't have to call yourself a Warden", it is not a very strong case.

Also, you learn why Wardens are necessary to end Blights long before you meet Riordan.

The treaties come into play in every single main quest (besides Redcliffe). The treaties (plus the favors you do as per the events of the quests) are what prompt the elves, dwarves, and mages (should you recruit them) to help you.





Have you payed attention at all to DAO? Duncan and Alistair both make it pretty clear that you need a Warden to stop an Archdemon.

The treaties absolutely never come up besides Orzammar. Ferelden has nothing to do with the treaties. Neither Irving nor Gregoire ask for them or even care for them to aid you; they take you at you'd word. Same with Zathrian.

And the difference between doing the joining and adopting the Warden identity is substantial. It's the difference between having the anchor that let's you close rifts and believing you've literally been chosen by Andraste.

A GW is irrelevant. The only thing that matters is doing a blood magic ritual with darkspawn blood which you could in principle do en masse before the final battle.

The Wardens go on and on about how important they are but they don't do anything to justify it. And Duncan is an idiot - his sole plan at Ostagar is to suicidally doom Ferelden by risking the life of the only assets that could stop the AD which he knows for a fact has risen but tells no one.

[dsl08002]

We still have 2 old gods in the deep roads waiting to awaken. A blight is guarantied. Personally i have always felt that bioware could hold the warden off untill a final game where you must stop a blight again. The same story with the same character that atarted the whole thing will conclude it as well. A classic combination that always works.

[(Disgusted noise.)]

Thank God he isn't.

[Sifr]

The problem isn't with you being forced to do the joining, since you can be conscripted. It's that after Ostagar you're forced to IDENTIFY as a Grey Warden. DAI is great about never forcing you to actually say you're Andrastian or to identify as the Herald of Andraste. It goes to great lengths to try and support multiple motives. After Ostagar DAO devolved into saving Ferelden because you're a GW, oftentimes railroading you into dialogue about how much you are they Grey Wardening-est Warden who ever Wardenend.

That's problematic when the origin story - the hook - gives you absolutely no reason to want to be or adopt that identity. It's one thing to want to go with Duncan to escape death - and it's one thing to want to save Ferelden - but none of that requires buying into the identity which you're forced to buy into.

 

Just to point out, that our Warden isn't really that great at being a Warden at all, when you stop and think about it? Actually, they're awful at it!

 

The Warden blantantly ignores the long-standing policy of remaining apolitical and instead get involved in deciding the outcome of the civil war of two sovereign nations. They can enage in criminal activities such as the murder, theft or fraud of several nobles during the Antivan Crow and Slim Couldry missions, they can aid the Mage Collective by helping them bribe sympathetic (or lyrium addicted) Templars to look the other way, can engage in lyrium smuggling as well as getting involved in mercenary work for the Blackstone Irregulars. They can also allow desire demons to possess two children and enslave a Templar, interfere with the caste system in Orzammar by finding evidence that the Legion of the Dead can be elavated to minor noble status, can allow Orzammar to once again have the means to create an army of Golems, can betray the very Dalish allies their treaty sent them to find by murdering the clan with an army of Werewolves lead by a Spirit, simply to get an army? Finally, they possibly allow the soul of the Archdemon to survive via conducting the Dark Ritual and allow Morrigan to abscond with the child?

 

In Awakening, while in their new station of Arl of Amaranthine (which seems to violate the whole apolitical thing) they can do a terrible job of running things and nearly allow a noble conspiracy to assassinate them and riot to break out happen on their watch. They can allow a Spirit possessing a corpse of a former Warden to remain in their ranks, despite technically qualifying as an Abomination, also denying Kristoff's wife the chance to give her husband a funeral? Then they can make unilateral decisions such as allying with the Architect, without bothering to see if the leadership in Weisshaupt thinks this is a good idea or not?

 

Yeah... even if we discount the obvious jerkass options, even a heroic Warden is extremely bad at following their official mandates, spends half the time engaged in activities that don't involve darkspawn and are questionable to say the least, and ignores the neutrality rule entirely?

[SmilesJA]

Just to point out, that our Warden isn't really that great at being a Warden at all, when you stop and think about it? Actually, they're awful at it!

 

The Warden blantantly ignores the long-standing policy of remaining apolitical and instead get involved in deciding the outcome of the civil war of two sovereign nations. They can enage in criminal activities such as the murder, theft or fraud of several nobles during the Antivan Crow and Slim Couldry missions, they can aid the Mage Collective by helping them bribe sympathetic (or lyrium addicted) Templars to look the other way, can engage in lyrium smuggling as well as getting involved in mercenary work for the Blackstone Irregulars. They can also allow desire demons to possess two children and enslave a Templar, interfere with the caste system in Orzammar by finding evidence that the Legion of the Dead can be elavated to minor noble status, can allow Orzammar to once again have the means to create an army of Golems, can betray the very Dalish allies their treaty sent them to find by murdering the clan with an army of Werewolves lead by a Spirit, simply to get an army? Finally, they possibly allow the soul of the Archdemon to survive via conducting the Dark Ritual and allow Morrigan to abscond with the child?

 

In Awakening, while in their new station of Arl of Amaranthine (which seems to violate the whole apolitical thing) they can do a terrible job of running things and nearly allow a noble conspiracy to assassinate them and riot to break out happen on their watch. They can allow a Spirit possessing a corpse of a former Warden to remain in their ranks, despite technically qualifying as an Abomination, also denying Kristoff's wife the chance to give her husband a funeral? Then they can make unilateral decisions such as allying with the Architect, without bothering to see if the leadership in Weisshaupt thinks this is a good idea or not?

 

Yeah... even if we discount the obvious jerkass options, even a heroic Warden is extremely bad at following their official mandates, spends half the time engaged in activities that don't involve darkspawn and are questionable to say the least, and ignores the neutrality rule entirely?

 

Well as part of being a Warden your job is to stop the blight at any cost. So It wouldn't be out of the question to engage in morally dubious actions as long as it leads to to one step closer to ending the Archdemon and the blight.

[Saphiron123]

The problem isn't with you being forced to do the joining, since you can be conscripted. It's that after Ostagar you're forced to IDENTIFY as a Grey Warden. DAI is great about never forcing you to actually say you're Andrastian or to identify as the Herald of Andraste. It goes to great lengths to try and support multiple motives. After Ostagar DAO devolved into saving Ferelden because you're a GW, oftentimes railroading you into dialogue about how much you are they Grey Wardening-est Warden who ever Wardenend.

That's problematic when the origin story - the hook - gives you absolutely no reason to want to be or adopt that identity. It's one thing to want to go with Duncan to escape death - and it's one thing to want to save Ferelden - but none of that requires buying into the identity which you're forced to buy into.

It's what the main character is. He/she IS a grey warden. Conscripted, and the most important thing is stopping the blight, as wardens do. That said, I disagree entirely, talk to wynne, most of your optional dialogue with her is about having doubts about being the warden, about never having a normal life. I guess you could always be certain if you chose the right dialogue, but most of my wardens had serious doubts, they did what they had to do.

The inquisitor may not always identify theologically as the herald of andraste, but he/she sure as hell answers to the inquisitor. Every inquisitor is called the inquisitor, same as every warden is called the warden. And as the warden's legend spreads, same as the inquisitor, others hear them called by that name and repeat it.

And yes, you're going to introduce yourself as a warden, because your main reason for meeting pretty much everyone is building an army as per the warden. Nobody's going to promise 1000 dwarven soldiers to Solona the elf.... Anora doesn't care about the fact you're a dwarf, and when people are in trouble, they don't with darkspawn they don't want you to be just another dude, they want a warden.

It's the most important job in ferelden, and there's nobody else to do it. I could be tim the mage, but nobody gives two sh!ts about time the mage, they do however care about tim the warden, who saved redcliff and found orzimmar a king and slew the archedemon.

The only reason people care so much about the inquisitor's race is they believe he/she IS the herald of andraste, and it's weird if he'she is a dwarf. Its not weird for a dwarf to be a warden, so people aren't weirded out, and being a warden doesn't conflict with your culture because it's a matter of being built to kill very real and very visible monsters that absolutely exist, when nobody else can.

To be honest, I don't really understand the issue.. why wouldn't you want to identify as a warden, when you're one of two with warden treaties to try and save ferelden, and that's what the world needs. Nothing else would have gotten the job done. I guess the warden could just quit and be just an elf, but everyone dies.

 

Basically, you're comparing jobs and religions. The inquisitor is still the inquisitor either way, just as the warden is the warden.  
 

 

Well as part of being a Warden your job is to stop the blight at any cost. So It wouldn't be out of the question to engage in morally dubious actions as long as it leads to to one step closer to ending the Archdemon and the blight.

Agreed. I think killing the archdemon makes him pretty good at it, I mean sure, he could have stayed out of politics and been eaten while the land was biighted and everyone died... not sure that would make him "good" at being a warden. Hell, the warden didn't know much about beign a warden anyway, all the older wardens save alistair were dead, and they didn't even know why a warden was needed to kill the archdemon. They were kids, basically.

The warden did a pretty decent job, what with everyone getting to keep living, and all. 

A world where everybody died but the warden could say "hey, I didn't ruffle any feathers" wouldn't be that nice a place to live.
 

 

Just to point out, that our Warden isn't really that great at being a Warden at all, when you stop and think about it? Actually, they're awful at it!

 

The Warden blantantly ignores the long-standing policy of remaining apolitical and instead get involved in deciding the outcome of the civil war of two sovereign nations. They can enage in criminal activities such as the murder, theft or fraud of several nobles during the Antivan Crow and Slim Couldry missions, they can aid the Mage Collective by helping them bribe sympathetic (or lyrium addicted) Templars to look the other way, can engage in lyrium smuggling as well as getting involved in mercenary work for the Blackstone Irregulars. They can also allow desire demons to possess two children and enslave a Templar, interfere with the caste system in Orzammar by finding evidence that the Legion of the Dead can be elavated to minor noble status, can allow Orzammar to once again have the means to create an army of Golems, can betray the very Dalish allies their treaty sent them to find by murdering the clan with an army of Werewolves lead by a Spirit, simply to get an army? Finally, they possibly allow the soul of the Archdemon to survive via conducting the Dark Ritual and allow Morrigan to abscond with the child?

 

In Awakening, while in their new station of Arl of Amaranthine (which seems to violate the whole apolitical thing) they can do a terrible job of running things and nearly allow a noble conspiracy to assassinate them and riot to break out happen on their watch. They can allow a Spirit possessing a corpse of a former Warden to remain in their ranks, despite technically qualifying as an Abomination, also denying Kristoff's wife the chance to give her husband a funeral? Then they can make unilateral decisions such as allying with the Architect, without bothering to see if the leadership in Weisshaupt thinks this is a good idea or not?

 

Yeah... even if we discount the obvious jerkass options, even a heroic Warden is extremely bad at following their official mandates, spends half the time engaged in activities that don't involve darkspawn and are questionable to say the least, and ignores the neutrality rule entirely?

 

"Hey architect, I know the mother is currently tearing a bloody swath through Ameranthine and everyone will be dead by the time a messenger travels to the Anderfels, but can I get back to you in 3-6 weeks?"

It's the middle ages dude, it's not like he has a phone, he's warden commander and it's his call. If your warden was a dick to others... well, that's kind of on you and your choices, right? The wardens didn't have time to meet the architect (right before facing the mother further down the hall) to go back to his besieged fortress and ask his boss for permission as she spawned an army of horrors to kill everyone around him.

If anybody ever offers you the job of saving earth, please turn it down. And what does the warden know about wardens aside from what Alistair tells him, and what does Alistair know? Not a ton. The HoF was a warden for like one day before the other wardens died.

And even if you made some bad choices, saving the entire world is going to earn you a lot of goodwill, and if you ever sided with the werewolves, you know they've been twisted into monsters for three generations by a twisted elf keeper who feels the decendents of long dead rapists should be cursed FOREVER.,  The only reason they attacked the elves was to force the keeper to find a cure after centuries of suffering. They tried to talk many times. the elves didn't care.

So whose more evil if peace isn't on the table? The warden who defends the keeper's victims, or the warden who slays them all knowing the people who hurt the keeper's child died like 200 years ago.

And again, saved the entire world. That's solid job performance.

[Saphiron123]

The treaties absolutely never come up besides Orzammar. Ferelden has nothing to do with the treaties. Neither Irving nor Gregoire ask for them or even care for them to aid you; they take you at you'd word. Same with Zathrian.

And the difference between doing the joining and adopting the Warden identity is substantial. It's the difference between having the anchor that let's you close rifts and believing you've literally been chosen by Andraste.

A GW is irrelevant. The only thing that matters is doing a blood magic ritual with darkspawn blood which you could in principle do en masse before the final battle.

The Wardens go on and on about how important they are but they don't do anything to justify it. And Duncan is an idiot - his sole plan at Ostagar is to suicidally doom Ferelden by risking the life of the only assets that could stop the AD which he knows for a fact has risen but tells no one.

They may not ask for them, but would anybody care if some elf walked up and asked for their help? The warden treaties, brought by a warden, are the basis for seeking an army. Sure there was stuff going on, but the warden didn't know that, and the treaties made a lot of sense in terms of where to start building an army. And honestly, who cares if the warden called himself a warden, it's semantics, it's how people knew him. Do you know how many people would have know whO Darrian the city elf was outside the alienage? Probably none. Maybe a few in Denerim would avae known him as he kid who cut the arl's son's head off.

But yes, if you weren't a warden, you would have been stuck outside orzimmar twiddling your thumbs until they had a king. if the tower wasn't under assault the mages and templars wouldn't have given you the time of day 9walk up tto white house, introduce yourself and ask to see the president, see how it goes), and if the elves didn't have a werewolf problem they would ahve told a non-elf to blow off. The only one you could have reliably seen without being a grey warden is the arl, and that's just because you have alistair. The archdemon would burn down denerim while you were hanging out in front of the dwarven gates waiting to be let in, and all because you didn't wan't to identify as your job.

It's smart to identify in a blight as a warden, it gets stuff done. Like I said, I don't understand the issue with identifying as a warden when that is literally the character's job, in a time where the biggest threat is the foe wardens are custom built to kill. Any warden who refused to do so, refused to use the treaties, would have failed.
 

 

Quote

All you need is someone who does the Joining. And before Riordan tells you about the US, you don't even know that you need the Joining; all it takes (as far as you know) is (a) gather a big enough army and ( go dragonslaying.

Oh is that all?

"Hey, I'm Dave, would queen Anora like to lend me 10,000 men? It's for a good cause, I promise". If you do the joining you are a warden, I seriously don't understand why it's bad to refer to yourself as such. If that annoys you then the inquisitor responding to inquisitor should drive you crazy. He also defines himself through his job... even if he doesn't agree with the religious aspect.

Couldn't he close rifts without being the inquisitor? he has the mark. All he has to do a) gather a big enough army, and close rifts.

[Ieldra]

The problem isn't with you being forced to do the joining, since you can be conscripted. It's that after Ostagar you're forced to IDENTIFY as a Grey Warden. DAI is great about never forcing you to actually say you're Andrastian or to identify as the Herald of Andraste. It goes to great lengths to try and support multiple motives. After Ostagar DAO devolved into saving Ferelden because you're a GW, oftentimes railroading you into dialogue about how much you are they Grey Wardening-est Warden who ever Wardenend.

That's problematic when the origin story - the hook - gives you absolutely no reason to want to be or adopt that identity. It's one thing to want to go with Duncan to escape death - and it's one thing to want to save Ferelden - but none of that requires buying into the identity which you're forced to buy into.

I agree DAI handled this particular aspect rather well, but I don't recall being forced to identify as a Warden in DAO. Do you have some relevant quotes from the game? In any case, at least my main Warden has always seen this as a job description rather than a matter of identity, and a job he hadn't chosen and a temporary one at that if he could at all influence things, which is why I'm rather happy about what DAI does with him. Maybe the silent protagonist made me tune a few things out, but I really don't recall any forced characterization in that regard.

[erikdlan]

@At the OP topic
So the HoF has no more interesting stories to be told because is dead or riding into the sunset with his/her lover, right? Oh dear, the whole riding into the sunset thing could be true for every possible living HoF at the end of Origins, but it wasn't even the whole truth at the end of Awakenings, had a very big hole at the end of DA2 (hello, Sister Nightingale), and after DA:I events it seems quite off for many potential outcomes.

Yeah, the hero can be dead, all alone and happy about it, have gone with Zevran, or be as peaceful as a king or queen of Ferelden can be. But those are not all the possible Wardens out there. Not after Dragon Age:Inquisition.

The Hero can be the lover of Warden Alistair. If he wasn't left the Fade in DA:I, then Alistair is going to Weisshaupt. Nothing evil or thrilling seems to be happening there and the Grey Wardens seem to have no trouble at all there. If Alistair didn't leave the Fade, the Warden will quickly forget about him and she will not try a heroic deed to get her lover's remains or even to save him if still alive. Nothing to see here.

The Warden can be the lover of Divine Leliana, the most revolutionary Divine in the whole Chantry history. There is no scenario where we can assume the Warden will have to fight to protect Leli, or be involved in complicated intrigue plots. Their nugs or crows army will protect them. Just perfect happiness and peace for them.

The biggest offender among the potential lovers of the Warden can be Morrigan. Being the couple of Morrigan is a peaceful retirement for the Warden, right? Because the daughter of Flemeth who potentially draught from the waters of the Well of Sorrows isn't going to have any important part in future Thedas history. Of course. Mythal and Fen'Harel will never be involved with her. Don't be absurd and think otherwise.

Then we have the plot they used to justify the Hero didn't help us in Inquisition. The quest to cure the Calling isn't an interesting adventure to be told, and the resolution for that quest isn't dramatic or important for Grey Wardens, or even for Thedas if it's related to the very essence of the Blight. Again, nothing to see here. Damn! If some good modders out there surprise us with a good cure the calling mod for Origins I will reconsider reinstalling Origins just to play it, and this wasn't in my plans at all.

I understand there are very good reasons to never bring back the Warden as a playable character or as an npc: there are too many variables, bringing back the silent character who wasn't completely silent but had too many VA and personalities is very difficult or expensive, the people who chose the heroic sacrifice deserve that their option isn't treated as an inferior one, those of us who have headcanoned a happy ending can be very upset if the Warden is brought back to be Virmired or, even worse, to be killed without any option to be saved. But this wasn't what Patrick Weekes said and the whole there are are no more stories to be told about any possible HoF is something I just don't buy. Not with all the things important people in the Warden's life can be doing.

[9TailsFox]

The problem isn't with you being forced to do the joining, since you can be conscripted. It's that after Ostagar you're forced to IDENTIFY as a Grey Warden. DAI is great about never forcing you to actually say you're Andrastian or to identify as the Herald of Andraste. It goes to great lengths to try and support multiple motives. After Ostagar DAO devolved into saving Ferelden because you're a GW, oftentimes railroading you into dialogue about how much you are they Grey Wardening-est Warden who ever Wardenend.

That's problematic when the origin story - the hook - gives you absolutely no reason to want to be or adopt that identity. It's one thing to want to go with Duncan to escape death - and it's one thing to want to save Ferelden - but none of that requires buying into the identity which you're forced to buy into.

DA:O have great role play. Yes you are forced but still you have pretty good range you can talk as anti grey warden, like dialogue with Wynne you have option's I hate being grey warden. Yes I play ass good guy but I always see dialogue options with is opposite to what I pick. You can even sacrifice elf's if you city elf your family for few constitution points.

[KennethAFTopp]

I think this is why I actually like the Warden Dying in the original campaign, though it does kind of remove the options of the post-Campaign DLC like Witch Hunt and Golems and the Expansion Awakening, which is why I feel it is still a mistake you couldn't import an ultimate sacrifice into awakening and have him be dead.

I am thinking that Clarel in DA:I was the main character of DA:A or something, I don't know.

[KennethAFTopp]

Secondly personally if the Warden was dalish and Hawke killed the clan, I would expect somekind disagreement between them.

[jtav]

Considering DAI Hawke was as interesting as watching paint dry, this is all to the good. The Warden's story is over, even if their life isn't.

[Sifr]

"Hey architect, I know the mother is currently tearing a bloody swath through Ameranthine and everyone will be dead by the time a messenger travels to the Anderfels, but can I get back to you in 3-6 weeks?"

It's the middle ages dude, it's not like he has a phone, he's warden commander and it's his call. If your warden was a dick to others... well, that's kind of on you and your choices, right? The wardens didn't have time to meet the architect (right before facing the mother further down the hall) to go back to his besieged fortress and ask his boss for permission as she spawned an army of horrors to kill everyone around him.

 

Yeah, I know that there was no way of getting any message instantly over a thousand miles away to the leadership at Weisshaupt, but you do realise that nothing was really stopping us from asking the Architect to wait until we'd dealt with the mother before hashing out plans to make an alliance?

 

It wasn't really a "this must be done now" kinda thing like Shepard was faced with in ME3 where he had to choose Ctrl, Alt or Del with a ticking clock, we were already in her lair and aside from some fire support from the towers if we allied with him, he's not involved in helping us take the Mother down?

 

Not that I disagree with the actual alliance itself, it's what I chose in that situation, but what baffled me was how quickly we just agreed to help him further perpetuate the sentient race of Darkspawn, when that decision could have been easily been made later? Granted, the Architect had a better bargaining position if he forced us to chose then and there, but for all he knew, we could have all died horribly and so that alliance would have ended anyway?

 

And while it's safe to say that the epilogues are always semi-canon, it did mention that a lot of Wardens are bothered by our decision to ally with him? How did we know that Weisshaupt wouldn't refuse to go along with the plan, even after we gave the Architect our word?

 

It also makes me wonder how the Inquisition would react to learning of this alliance, considering that it's not that much different really from what Clarel was attempting to do at Adamant? Except that we actually know we're helping a Darkspawn Magister (although we obviously didn't know he was likely one of the  original Magisters) in this case, whereas she was tricked into doing so?

 

(Incidentally, while there aren't phones, the Mage Circles and the Divine apparently have Sending Stones that function in pretty much the same way. Of course, we neither have one, nor likely does Weisshaupt, just pointing out that long-distance communication devices do exist in this universe)

[dsl08002]

It makes me wonder this is that the present and future heroes of dragon age will probably never have any closure to thier story they will be left open forever if the same thing regarding the warden is to be applied here as well.  

[Zatche]

I'm still not sure why people hold the HoF on such a high pedestal. He or she is a blank slate character. What do you think Bioware can do with the Warden that they can't do with a new blank slate character?

[Darkly Tranquil]

I'm still not sure why people hold the HoF on such a high pedestal. He or she is a blank slate character. What do you think Bioware can do with the Warden that they can't do with a new blank slate character?

Regain the respect of DAO fans?

[AlanC9]

Regain the respect of DAO fans?

As opposed to just plain DA fans, right?

[phantomrachie]

It can't work as a cameo because you say so? No, you'll need an actual reason, if these are yours below, well here you go, it took me 2 minutes.

 

1) You'd pick the voice type, as you do with your character.

2) The title, and plot surrounding the warden, all the experiences you put him through and shaped are his personality.  - This is not hard to cater to when written well. His/Her personality is already shaped, it doesn't need to be re-shaped or explained further hence why it is a wasted opportunity not to put them in, or draw on it.
 

3) They pulled this off easily in awakening, and indeed every other time a character has been dead, in every other quest or story.

 

4) The warden could work as a silent protagonist quite easily actually, if the cameo was action based and he or she were assisting you in a battle or some such. You could have a quest to discover what happened to him/her. You could have someone silently turn up, pick you out of rubble save your backside and be on his/her way. The entire mission or quest could FORCE him/her to be silent. You could have a diary from the warden, letters from the warden, clues from the warden, magical dream sequences, visions, anything.

 

We weren't asking for much just some fanservice, could be done in the matter of few days with access to the right tools.

 

 

You're not being realistic, think about it again.

 

Sure you could pick the voice type, but the most you could possible pick from is maybe 4 like in DA:I. The reason why people like Silent Protagonists so much is that their voice can be literally anything. Even with a choice of 4 voices, fans of the Warden & Silent Protagonists would complain because they would say that BioWare hasn't provided them with the 'right' voice. People are very invested in the Warden and there is no way that BioWare can provide enough voice actors for people to choose from.

 

When you are thinking about the Warden's voice you are thinking of a voice that would perfectly fit your own Warden, but that wouldn't fit everyones Warden & there is no guarantee that BioWare would pick the VA that could do your Warden's voice justice.

 

What does that mean in terms of Dialogue? Choices and personality are different. I could've made all of the 'evil' choices in DA:O but my dialogue options could've been witty & charming. With BioWare just pulling from my choices, I could end up with gruff aggressive Warden. Every word BioWare writes for this Warden would be totally out of character for them.

 

True but because of that most of the camos are short or relatively meaningless because why put much effort into a camo of a character who can be dead.

 

In a game where everyone has a voice it would be extremely noticeably and immersion breaking to have one character who 'for some reason' didn't speak. It might work as a dream, but why would a protagonist of a new game be dreaming of the Warden?

They don't know them.

 

It might work if the next protagonist was another Warden, but I'm hoping we get to experience another viewpoint on Thedas in the new game.