DAI is like DA2 the main protagonist is not yours, in DAO the character was fully yours, now the series is going the route of a you are the hero book ( as ME is with Shepard ) bringing back HoF is really problematic, not impossible but still one hell of a headache to do.
In the case the series keep the ME,DA2 and DAI trend, better off not brining back the HoF
DAI is like DA2 the main protagonist is not yours, in DAO the character was fully yours, now the series is going the route of a you are the hero book ( as ME is with Shepard ) bringing back HoF is really problematic, not impossible but still one hell of a headache to do.
In the case the series keep the ME,DA2 and DAI trend, better off not brining back the HoF
The character has never been fully yours in any Bioware cRPG. The character is always confined by what the writers allow. The only way one gets a fully realized character is in tabletop. For example in DAO you cannot write your own origin but must choose from what is provided. The same with the dialogue. The lines are written in a sequence that actually denotes tone given by the writers.
Stop trying to make the Warden's return "happen", Gretchen.
The moment I don't have enough faith in bioware to think they can make a good game, is the moment i never play another. If you're already at that point, and you're hoping for something that's just okay, why are you here?
You wouldn't be if you didn't believe they can still do the series and it's characters justice.
I have faith they can make a good game. I just don't think they can resist retconning previous PC into the personality they want every time they appear. They even did it to Revan in TOR. I rather never see my favourite PC (The Warden) then see him become something else than I what I saw in DAO.
Hell, it's not just PC they do it. They made Oghren a terrible joke of himself in DAA even after everything I did for him in Origin or turned Anders into a horrible whiner for DA2. This is the same for the Mass Effect series, I finally convinced Garrus to join the Spectre program. Roll on ME2 and it doesn't matter what choice you made with him. Bringing characters back always ends up with some choices being ignored or retconned.
And beside, where the hell did I say that Bioware can't make a good game or was saying they can't do the series justice.
I wholeheartedly agree with the OP. They would have a massive hit on their hands if they brought us back to the Hero of Ferelden. There's plenty of material to cover too, such as the rebuilding of the Grey Wardens at Weisshaupt, revisiting Vigil Keep and Warden's Keep, his personal quest to research the Blight and a cure for the Calling (possibly with help from Avernus), exploration and clearing of the Deep Roads, possibly finding Griffons again in some far off, distant land, not to mention all the NPC tie-ins you could have with Morrigan, Leliana, Varric, Shale, Alistair, the Dwarven King (depending on whom you chose), and so on. There's lots of possibilities here.
They could call it, "The Warden Chronicles".
If your Warden died in DA:O, the story of the game could easily center around a different Warden. The Grey Warden (whether he was the original Hero of Ferelden or some other up and coming Warden) could rise to prominence from the Warden Commander of Ferelden, and ultimately become the new First Warden. As we all know, the Wardens are in rough shape after the events of the Inquisition. So the story could bring us back to the Inquisitor and helping to rebuild them.
For me, one of the coolest and most original aspects of the DA universe was the concept of the Grey Wardens, and I've always wanted to play one again since DA:O. So I for one would be very excited about such a game, and it would be almost as cool as playing the same main character through all three Mass Effect games. You'd already be invested into the character, and there's a wealth of backstory from previous DA games to draw upon.
As opposed to just plain DA fans, right?
I wholeheartedly agree with the OP. They would have a massive hit on their hands if they brought us back to the Hero of Ferelden. There's plenty of material to cover too, such as the rebuilding of the Grey Wardens at Weisshaupt, revisiting Vigil Keep and Warden's Keep, his personal quest to research the Blight and a cure for the Calling (possibly with help from Avernus), exploration and clearing of the Deep Roads, possibly finding Griffons again in some far off, distant land, not to mention all the NPC tie-ins you could have with Morrigan, Leliana, Varric, Shale, Alistair, the Dwarven King (depending on whom you chose), and so on. There's lots of possibilities here.
Or they could have had the plot of what happens to the Wardens already jotted down years ago and are now following that thread as the games are made and the story moves along. It's obvious something is up, and it might not be something that people who are hero-worshipping the Wardens will necessarily like. They could be crumbling to ruin or infighting could be breaking them apart completely. They might turn and actually be the leaders of the next Blight or have all packed up shop and moved to Rivain to become acapella singers. If a future game calls for another warden character to be the protagonist, then it's likely something long since decided. If not, then there was never going to be a time we would ever play as a warden again, let alone THE Warden.
Everything you mentioned could be an interesting story in its own right, but it's probably not the story they are telling with the Dragon Age.
Yeah, I know that there was no way of getting any message instantly over a thousand miles away to the leadership at Weisshaupt, but you do realise that nothing was really stopping us from asking the Architect to wait until we'd dealt with the mother before hashing out plans to make an alliance?
It wasn't really a "this must be done now" kinda thing like Shepard was faced with in ME3 where he had to choose Ctrl, Alt or Del with a ticking clock, we were already in her lair and aside from some fire support from the towers if we allied with him, he's not involved in helping us take the Mother down?
Not that I disagree with the actual alliance itself, it's what I chose in that situation, but what baffled me was how quickly we just agreed to help him further perpetuate the sentient race of Darkspawn, when that decision could have been easily been made later? Granted, the Architect had a better bargaining position if he forced us to chose then and there, but for all he knew, we could have all died horribly and so that alliance would have ended anyway?
And while it's safe to say that the epilogues are always semi-canon, it did mention that a lot of Wardens are bothered by our decision to ally with him? How did we know that Weisshaupt wouldn't refuse to go along with the plan, even after we gave the Architect our word?
It also makes me wonder how the Inquisition would react to learning of this alliance, considering that it's not that much different really from what Clarel was attempting to do at Adamant? Except that we actually know we're helping a Darkspawn Magister (although we obviously didn't know he was likely one of the original Magisters) in this case, whereas she was tricked into doing so?
(Incidentally, while there aren't phones, the Mage Circles and the Divine apparently have Sending Stones that function in pretty much the same way. Of course, we neither have one, nor likely does Weisshaupt, just pointing out that long-distance communication devices do exist in this universe)
You're not being realistic, think about it again.
Sure you could pick the voice type, but the most you could possible pick from is maybe 4 like in DA:I. The reason why people like Silent Protagonists so much is that their voice can be literally anything. Even with a choice of 4 voices, fans of the Warden & Silent Protagonists would complain because they would say that BioWare hasn't provided them with the 'right' voice. People are very invested in the Warden and there is no way that BioWare can provide enough voice actors for people to choose from.
(...)
About the voice thing, some people actually forget that the Warden was not exactly silent... we choose a voice for him and although he didn't participate in dialogs with that, he would speak while in action and stuff... They could just use those voices for full dialogue now.
And about the OP, really, it makes me think that the Warden is more likely than not after reading that...
About the voice thing, some people actually forget that the Warden was not exactly silent... we choose a voice for him and although he didn't participate in dialogs with that, he would speak while in action and stuff... They could just use those voices for full dialogue now.
And about the OP, really, it makes me think that the Warden is more likely than not after reading that...
I mean, let's face it.. it's true not everyone will be happy with the voices offered, but it's the modern age of video games and silent protagonists don't exist anymore. If DAO was made today, you'd have chosen a voice.
Can't live in the past afterall. Technologically. I'm aware of the irony of saying that while pushing for the return of a former protagonist. You'd think these people would want solid snake to stay 16 bit and silent... he didn't have a voice either until metal gear solid.
I just hope the Warden won't be killed off-screen, and my Warden and Dog would both find the blight cure and live forever. That's pretty much it, thank you.
I just hope the Warden won't be killed off-screen, and my Warden and Dog would both find the blight cure and live forever. That's pretty much it, thank you.
And don't forget killing the magisters, the sleeping archdemons, and a whole lot of broodmothers in the process.
Except the architect only wanted to ally to kill the mother, it's not like the wardens are having dinner with darkspawn. It was a one shot deal before he vanished back into the deep roads... There's no actual alliance, no matter what you did. It's just an agreement not to stick a sword in his face and team up to stop the children.
The warden didn't make actual peace with the darkspawn, he just made a personal choice to trust the architect and push forward. I doubt his return will be entirely peaceful, he appears to be one of the magisters, he just wants a different fate for the darkspawn then he others.
From the wiki on the awakening epilogues:
If he gains the trust of the Warden, the Architect will keep true to his word, freeing the darkspawn from the Old Gods' call and gathering his remaining disciples to follow the rest of their kind back underground. Those Grey Wardens in other nations were appalled to hear of the Architect's continued existence, saying that it guaranteed another Blight, but were unable to track him down despite years of effort. However, darkspawn sightings grow increasingly rare and the dwarves claim that the Deep Roads have never been quieter.
So yeah, he just vanished and kept making talking darkspawn.
I wholeheartedly agree with the OP. They would have a massive hit on their hands if they brought us back to the Hero of Ferelden. There's plenty of material to cover too, such as the rebuilding of the Grey Wardens at Weisshaupt, revisiting Vigil Keep and Warden's Keep, his personal quest to research the Blight and a cure for the Calling (possibly with help from Avernus), exploration and clearing of the Deep Roads, possibly finding Griffons again in some far off, distant land, not to mention all the NPC tie-ins you could have with Morrigan, Leliana, Varric, Shale, Alistair, the Dwarven King (depending on whom you chose), and so on. There's lots of possibilities here.
They could call it, "The Warden Chronicles".
If your Warden died in DA:O, the story of the game could easily center around a different Warden. The Grey Warden (whether he was the original Hero of Ferelden or some other up and coming Warden) could rise to prominence from the Warden Commander of Ferelden, and ultimately become the new First Warden. As we all know, the Wardens are in rough shape after the events of the Inquisition. So the story could bring us back to the Inquisitor and helping to rebuild them.
For me, one of the coolest and most original aspects of the DA universe was the concept of the Grey Wardens, and I've always wanted to play one again since DA:O. So I for one would be very excited about such a game, and it would be almost as cool as playing the same main character through all three Mass Effect games. You'd already be invested into the character, and there's a wealth of backstory from previous DA games to draw upon.
Any upcoming title can just as well be a major hit with or without the Hero of Ferelden, so I don't believe that there's anything particularly special about this character that should guarantee anything. Heck, if anything, I would fully expect to see a lot of complaining about how many things BioWare got wrong in bringing the character back, like not bringing back all of the Warden's skills that were acquired over the course of Origins and Awakening, the likely absence of the dual-wield warrior, the level the character starts off (my Warden was a lvl 35 rogue. Shouldn't the character remain this powerful?) and so on and so forth. Seems a lot of wasted effort to cater to a character that could just as well be dead for over a decade by the end of the third game.
Or the DA franchise could go in a direction that sees the Warden order destroyed for good.
I have been secretly craving this since completing Awakening.
Or the DA franchise could go in a direction that sees the Warden order destroyed for good.
I have been secretly craving this since completing Awakening.
Except the architect only wanted to ally to kill the mother, it's not like the wardens are having dinner with darkspawn. It was a one shot deal before he vanished back into the deep roads... There's no actual alliance, no matter what you did. It's just an agreement not to stick a sword in his face and team up to stop the children.
The warden didn't make actual peace with the darkspawn, he just made a personal choice to trust the architect and push forward. I doubt his return will be entirely peaceful, he appears to be one of the magisters, he just wants a different fate for the darkspawn then he others.
I didn't say the Warden made peace with the Darkspawn, just that by siding with the Architect instead of killing him, they were agreeing to allow him to perpetuate a new race of Awakened Darkspawn with their endorsement?
As for whether or not the Architect is actually working with the Wardens... Nathaniel mentions them in DA2, although the exact phrasing can be seen as not a direct confirmation that the "allies" are indeed the Architect and his Disciples and he could be referring to someone else?
Nathaniel: After the Warden-Commander spared the Architect, we thought the ensuing struggle amongst the darkspawn might make the Deep Roads safer. The Warden's allies assured us these tunnels would still be mostly clear... but it seems they were wrong?
Hawke: They seem to know a great deal about darkspawn, are these allies dwarves?
Nathaniel: No, not dwarves... it's complicated. Let's just say we live in strange times.
Hawke: Who is the Architect?
Nathaniel: The Architect was the first of the speaking and thinking Darkspawn. Very dangerous. He spread his "gift" to other darkspawn... the Disciples. Fortunately their numbers are few?
"In the end there must always be grey wardens"
I guess that really depends on what happens to the darkspawn. If the franchise sees them eradicated, or changed somehow that they're no longer a threat, the Wardens become defunct.
I'd be okay with this if this bit wasn't entirely untrue:
you had chance to die heroically, or you had chance to survive and ride off into the sunset with their lover.
That kind of got thrown out the window in favour of some vague quest in the middle of nowhere, with most of said potential lovers being more important somewhere else...
So true. I wouldn't say a single word if they actually allowed my Warden to "ride off into the sunset with their lover". If they wanted to leave Warden's story behind they shouldn't have sent HoF on some unfinished quest, separating him/her from a loved one. Now we are once again in the middle of the unfinished story and the unfinished romance. What about romanced Leliana? Will she search for the Warden, will they meet again? And how she'd do it being Divine, for example? I'd certainly loved to see their reunion! What about romanced Morrigan? What about disappearance of Queen of Ferelden if we romanced Alistair?
I agree that the Warden had a good story. As for the riding off into the sunset ending, in my eyes thats only applicable to the ending of Origins\Awakening. <...> If they really want to leave the Warden behind, they probably shouldnt have mentioned they are on an important quest that could have a big impact. So can you really blame people for wanting to know how this turns out?
I think most people with living wardens just want to know if they were successful in trying to cure the calling and if they reunited with their LI. At least thats all I want to know. Sadly we don't get that and now it seems we might not find out. Guess we'll just have to wait and see what they decide to do with the curing the calling business.
I completely agree.
So true. I wouldn't say a single word if they actually allowed my Warden to "ride off into the sunset with their lover". If they wanted to leave Warden's story behind they shouldn't have sent HoF on some unfinished quest, separating him/her from a loved one. Now we are once again in the middle of the unfinished story and the unfinished romance. What about romanced Leliana? Will she search for the Warden, will they meet again? And how she'd do it being Divine, for example? I'd certainly loved to see their reunion! What about romanced Morrigan? What about disappearance of Queen of Ferelden if we romanced Alistair?
We're always in the middle of a story as long as the characters aren't dead, or stuck forever in a totally boring "happily ever after" scenario, which is as bad as death as far as I'm concerned. That's why I said the only final closure is death, and if people keep begging that's what Bioware will eventually give us. It is the only thing I do NOT want (neither of the two types of death I mentioned), and for that reason I'll continue to argue against bringing the Warden back. I'm fine with him doing something meaningful somewhere where I don't get to see it (as it is now), eventually - at a time I do not know - to meet up with his LI again and continue his life...somehow and somewhere.
Also, Bioware has a really bad track record with returning characters as far as I'm concerned. It feels like they're always one step away from derailing someone for one reason or the other, and I don't want my Warden to suffer from the Hawke effect (or should I call it the Anders effect. Or the Oghren Effect. And don't get me started about ME...).
Edit:
Yes, you could argue that "derailing" equals "character development you don't like", but what I like should actually matter if the returning character has been my protagonist. As far as I'm concerned, such a character is NOT fair game.
<...>That's why I said the only final closure is death, and if people keep begging that's what Bioware will eventually give us. It is the only thing I do NOT want (neither of the two types of death I mentioned), and for that reason I'll continue to argue against bringing the Warden back. <...>
Also, Bioware has a really bad track record with returning characters as far as I'm concerned. It feels like they're always one step away from derailing someone for one reason or the other, and I don't want my Warden to suffer from the Hawke effect (or should I call it the Anders effect. Or the Oghren Effect. And don't get me started about ME...).
Good point, I can't disagree with this. And if choosing between my Warden's heroic death and her travelling/adventuring somewhere we can't see - I certainly would choose the latter.
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