The only thing that bothered me was that the reconciliation between Morrigan and Flemeth seemed a bit too pat. After coming across as a villainous, cackling hag in previous games Flemeth is suddenly all, "Oh, child. You were never in any real danger from me. I'd never make you do anything against your will blah blah blah." I get the feeling that this is intended to be 100% truthful and it just feels like revisionism to me.
This so much. It kind of feels like a retcon to me.
I doubt we have seen the last of Flemeth.
I doubt we have seen the last of Flemeth.
Calling it right now.
Flemeth Jedi Spirit cameo in DA4.
I doubt we have seen the last of Flemeth.
I'm with you on that. Hopefully she has some tricks up her sleeve.
This so much. It kind of feels like a retcon to me.
How? We never get clear details on it or how it's done. How can it be a retcon if it's something we don't even know about or understand?
The Chasind would know if she took any of their children and devoured/murdered them. They've been her neighbors for centuries. Plus I remember a scene in The Stolen Throne where she had men hanging from vines, or something to that effect. I think we have enough proof that Flemeth is close enough to how the Chasind see her. And what about Yavana? Flemeth could have spared her to handle the dragon situation. Doesn't mean she didn't take her other daughters' bodies. Yavana may have believed it was a misunderstanding in Morrigan's case because her situation with Flemeth was different.
Yes, the people who pass story by mouth and rumor for hundreds of year are a valid and accurate analysis of a hermit witch who live far from people who kill anyone that gets near them with trees. 
Spoiler
I doubt we have seen the last of Flemeth.
When I saw Flemeth I began to laugh out loud. It felt that absurd. And after that I was like "they did not do that did they omg they did". It was so bad. It was so terrible. Flemeth in DA2 was bad enough and then they had to drag that hag in this game too. Why? Obviously they thought it was a cool idea, and exiting. It was not.
I ignore Inquisition canonically as a whole to be honest. Flemeth's lackluster fleshing-out is a big part of that reason.
How? We never get clear details on it or how it's done. How can it be a retcon if it's something we don't even know about or understand?
In my case I feel it's a matter of tone. Yes, Flemeth's motives and plans are never fully explained. However, DA:O certainly strongly implied through both its lore and dialogue that there was something malevolent going on and that Flemeth was a conniving and probably quite nasty person.
Just because it's not fully fleshed out doesn't mean there wasn't still a general direction in which the story seemed to be going. It would be like DA 2 spending the game hinting that Anders was planning something dramatic to push for mage freedom whilst he rants about the excesses of the Templars- and then ultimately he just says "Actually, this was all a misunderstanding, you see. My real plan was simply to open up a discussion on the matter." Sure, you could say it's not a retcon in the sense that it technically doesn't contradict anything previously laid out as fact. However, it would certainly feel like a retcon in terms of this person's character.
In short, I think it's more that it feels like they changed Flemeth's personality just so they could quickly wrap up a subplot that had been hanging around for a few games.
In my case I feel it's a matter of tone. Yes, Flemeth's motives and plans are never fully explained. However, DA:O certainly strongly implied through both its lore and dialogue that there was something malevolent going on and that Flemeth was a conniving and probably quite nasty person.
I never got the sense that Flemeth was particularly malevolent. It was clear she had her own agenda, and was playing a long game and was willing to do whatever it took to see that agenda played out, but not that she was spectacularly evil, or even 'nasty', as you put it. The obsession we finally see in DA:I dovetails perfectly with her character from previous appearances, in my opinion.
Eh, agree to disagree on that, I guess. DA: O left me with the impression that there was something sinister to her but I suppose I could see the interpretation of her as a pragmatic free agent playing different sides. Still, I really didn't get the feeling that there was much true warmth between her and Morrigan so it was strange to see her acting that way.
When I saw Flemeth I began to laugh out loud. It felt that absurd. And after that I was like "they did not do that did they omg they did". It was so bad. It was so terrible. Flemeth in DA2 was bad enough and then they had to drag that hag in this game too. Why? Obviously they thought it was a cool idea, and exiting. It was not.
Then you clearly don't see what going on. Even in DAO she is much more then she seems. She's not being forced in, her story is part of the greater story going on. You just have taken the time to see it.
In my case I feel it's a matter of tone. Yes, Flemeth's motives and plans are never fully explained. However, DA:O certainly strongly implied through both its lore and dialogue that there was something malevolent going on and that Flemeth was a conniving and probably quite nasty person.
Just because it's not fully fleshed out doesn't mean there wasn't still a general direction in which the story seemed to be going. It would be like DA 2 spending the game hinting that Anders was planning something dramatic to push for mage freedom whilst he rants about the excesses of the Templars- and then ultimately he just says "Actually, this was all a misunderstanding, you see. My real plan was simply to open up a discussion on the matter." Sure, you could say it's not a retcon in the sense that it technically doesn't contradict anything previously laid out as fact. However, it would certainly feel like a retcon in terms of this person's character.
In short, I think it's more that it feels like they changed Flemeth's personality just so they could quickly wrap up a subplot that had been hanging around for a few games.
More like she can be nasty. That has nothing to do with her agenda. Hell, Loghain can be a nasty person but his goals are for a greater good in a perspective.
Action are not always intent. A person who act nice to everyone and does good thing can easily have a malevolent goal. Sorry, but your still using assumption. That's never enough to say or dictate what going on. It can only be a retcon if something was firmly stated was changed to something else with no one in the story recognizing the change.
All this is is just something happening what you don't expect....That's called a twist.
While I didn't find the revelation itself disappointing I did actually felt a little let down by how frelly she gave it. So i agree with you OP, 50% at least.
While I didn't find the revelation itself disappointing I did actually felt a little let down by how frelly she gave it. So i agree with you OP, 50% at least.
I would not say she gave it so freely. Think of it as her final lesson to Morrigian. With God baby Kieran there, more like a final test.
Yes, the people who pass story by mouth and rumor for hundreds of year are a valid and accurate analysis of a hermit witch who live far from people who kill anyone that gets near them with trees.
Where did I say their views on her were 100% accurate? They know about Flemeth and her daughters, and they definitely know more about her than anyone else in Thedas. Hell, one Chasind could tell Morrigan was Flemeth's kin just by looking at her (Morrigan says this in a convo in Origins) I would say that the Chasind are the most credible source we have on Flemeth.
When Flemeth does have interactions with people, it's usually with the Chasind. I think they know some things about her.
When Flemeth does have interactions with people, it's usually with the Chasind. I think they know some things about her.
Agein, these are people who pass story by mouth and rumor for hundreds of year are a valid and accurate analysis of a hermit witch who live far from people who kill anyone that gets near them with trees.
It's impossible for them to know the most about Flemeth and her daughters. They die if they get too close. And the people know her the most are the dalish.
Very true, haven't gone that route personally yet. Wouldn't the connection to Flemeth make it revelant to bring up the origin of Mythal all the more so.
I would not let Morrigan to drink from the fountain, her Warder is waiting for her. Inq instread is is expendable nobody. Warden for protagonist semi-confirmed rumor for DA4!
Flemeth going down with a whimper was a bummer though. I expected more from her.
Agein, these are people who pass story by mouth and rumor for hundreds of year are a valid and accurate analysis of a hermit witch who live far from people who kill anyone that gets near them with trees.
It's impossible for them to know the most about Flemeth and her daughters. They die if they get too close. And the people know her the most are the dalish.
Once again, I never made the argument that the Chasind have vaild and completely accurate views on Flemeth. You are putting words in my mouth. I'm saying that what they know of her should be mostly true considering that they have lived amongst her for centuries. It doesn't matter that she's a hermit. They're not. I'm sure they've ran into her several times over the centuries. How else would they know of her?
And what does it matter if the stories are passed down verbally? Why do you keep using it for your argument? Yes, in most cases verbal accounts of events can become exaggerated as they are told by countless people. But in this case, I don't see that happening. Considering how dangerous Flemeth is, it would be stupid for the Chasind to purposely tell their children made up stories about Flemeth. Their own survival depends on correct knowledge of her. They need to tell the upcoming generations what she is capable of so that they will stay away from her, or know how to talk to her if she is encountered.
I'm sure that out of the countless centuries that the Chasind have been Flemeth's neighbors, some have survived to spread rumors with some truth to them. If she killed every single Chasind that went near her, no one would have lived to tell the legends, accurate or no. Until Bioware says otherwise, I choose to believe that the Chasind know some things about Flemeth. They have no reason to spread lies amongst their own kin about her.
And now you're just contradicting yourself lol. You said in a previous post that the Dalish knowledge of Flemeth is minimal and can't be trusted. Now all of a sudden they know the most?
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