18 réponses à ce sujet

[robsonwt]

I was playing a NG+ with my Iceman Infiltrator, so my routine is freeze or chill with Cryo Ammo and then Incinerate unprotected frost enemies for Cryo Explosions.

 

I was in the Surkesh mission, and when I was fighting the Atlas, the boss level of that mission, I finished it with an Incineration Blast, after it was chilled with Cryo Ammo and it Cryo Exploded. 

 

I always thought that Cryo Ammo would not prime protected enemies. But if the enemy dies for the last blow when he was chilled the Cryo Explosion occurs?

The only doubt is that maybe there were a frost Assault Trooper next to the Atlas and it was him that Cryo Exploded and not the Atlas.

 

What do you guys think? Thanks for the attention.

[Vazgen]

I don't think Cryo Ammo can prime armored targets for Cryo Explosions, even on a killing blow. I think it was the trooper next to the Atlas.

I did manage to chill the Atlas pilot once though. Not sure if it counts as priming

[robsonwt]

I don't think Cryo Ammo can prime armored targets for Cryo Explosions, even on a killing blow. I think it was the trooper next to the Atlas.

I did manage to chill the Atlas pilot once though. Not sure if it counts as priming

 

I was using the Viper with piercing mods. Maybe I primed the pilot and it was him that Cryo Exploded. Or maybe it was only a trooper next to atlas.

 

Thanks for the attention.

[capn233]

Yeah, it shouldn't be possible to prime armor for a cryo explosion using any of the normal powers in SP.

[robsonwt]

I just did it again. It was on Tuchanka: Bomb mission. I shot the Atlas with Cryo Ammo, and finished it with an Incinerate. I don't think there were any assault troopers near the Atlas at that time. Maybe it's the pilot that gets Cryo Exploded.

[robsonwt]

I'm playing my Iceman build again, and I think I manage to find out how to cryo explode an Atlas. This is what I did:

 

1. Unloaded a clip of an Indra with Cryo Ammo (Level 4 Squad Ammo and Level 6 Freeze Chance upgrade), with a Piercing Mod against the cockpit of the Atlas.

2. Ordered Garrus to do a Consussive Shot (Level 6 with Cryo Ammo amplification)

 

I've did this 3 times in a row and everytime I've got a Cryo Explosion. I think has something to do with chilling the pilot in the cockpit and the Concussive Shot. I was unable to do that with other detonating powers (Incinerate etc.)

 

I've did this in Priority: Citadel 2, where there's an Atlas in a Balcony. I don't think there were other enemies around.

 

I'll do a test later in Armax Arena to confirm that.

 

Thanks for your attention.

[KrrKs]

Did the very first Concussive shot result in a Cryo Explosion?

If not, it is maybe the amplified conc shot that does apply ammo effects regardless of defences or their effect to the used ammo.

[capn233]

Hmmm that is interesting.  I don't recall being able to detonate CE's on armor in SP, given that the effect on armor should be 'chilled' and not 'frozen.'

 

If it was the pilot, could be possible.  Amplification acts as a second power applied before the main CS damage / detonator.  Which is why you get the odditiy of chained Fire Explosions on armor with Amplified-CS / Incendiary Ammo.  Targets aren't supposed to count as primed until completely frozen, but I could always detonate a CE right after hitting with Cryo Blast.  I didn't think CS would prime/detonate with Cryo Ammo in one shot from back when RedCaesar discovered it worked that way for IA.

[RedCaesar97]

I may make a point of trying to do this sometime this week to see if I can also replicate it, maybe get an idea of what is happening.

 

Depending on how soon you hit the enemy being chilled/frozen, it may cause a cryo explosion regardless of whether it is supposed to or not. (Same with how I can sometimes detonate fire explosions with Energy Drain on organic health even though it is not supposed to.)

[robsonwt]

I've made some tests in Armax Arena.

 

With my Iceman Infiltrator:

 

Test 1

 

1. Cryo Ammo only for Shepard
2. Garrus with Concussion Shot (therefore without Cryo amplification)
3. Did not manage to Cryo Explode the Atlas.

Test 2

1. Cryo Ammo for squad
2. Garrus with Concussion Shot with Cryo amplification
3. Managed to Cryo Explode the Atlas multiple times.
4. Made sure it was the last enemy on the map.
5. It was not the CS alone that Cryo Exploded, because I've used a few times and didn't work.
6. Tried with other powers to detonate with no success.

 

How it seems to work:

1. Fire multiple rounds at Atlas Cockpit (with Piercing Mod) until it generates what appears to be a cloud of broken glass (The glass don't actually break). It worked with rapid fire weapon (Indra with Level 6 Freezing Chance, full clip) or slow fire (Viper, full clip)
2. Atlas Pilot appears to be chilled. He is whiter.
3. Use CS with Cryo Aplification as a detonation power.

 

Anyone have tried this?

 

Thanks for your attention.

[RedCaesar97]

Okay, I spent about an hour or so testing this out.

 

I could not replicate the results with an Infiltrator. I tried to imitate your original conditions (Infiltrator with Indra) but no luck.

 

Then I switched to a Soldier with amplified Concussive Shot. And well, see for yourself:

 

Spoiler

 

It does not happen with 100% consistency, but depending where you hit the Atlas, it will prime for a cryo explosion. I have no idea why.

[robsonwt]

It appears that is an effect of the Concussion Shot alone, and not depending at all of priming with weapons. You prime and detonate the Cryo Explosion instantly with the CS. It seems to work when you hit the Atlas Cockpit in a certain way, probably because the explosion is happening in the guy inside. In the test you came closer and hit the Atlas Cockpit more directly, you managed to CE everytime.

In your test you are not applying any other powers but CS, right? 

 

Thanks for your attention and time for run and record the test. Regards,

[KrrKs]

It seems to work when you hit the Atlas Cockpit in a certain way, probably because the explosion is happening in the guy inside.

 

Seems like it. Probably the radius evolution of conc shot affecting the pilot.

I know that I've never been able to cryo explode an Atlas in MP, and the 75cm* radius of Concshot should definitely be enough to reach the pilot, when hitting the canopy.

 

 

*AFAIK there is a bug that all stated radii in the character screen are actually diameters.

Penetration distance for a double hit on an Atlas should be around 1m.

[capn233]

You don't need 1m penetration distance to double-hit an Atlas.

 

It is a good hypothesis that this is due to the pilot in SP Atlas.

[capn233]

It looks to me like CE on armor with amplified CS may be a result when two units are near to each other and the armor unit getting the wrong effect applied.  I was able to get a couple CE's on Brutes at the beginning of TGES Mineral Works but it looks like a unit may need to be nearby.  But it is not entirely clear what is happening because sometimes it works if the other unit is armor, and sometimes it appears to work within a window after the other target has died.  My guess is applying freeze via radius (which could happen in SP Atlas from the pilot) regardless of what target it hits.

 

I parked the squad at the top of the elevator, which is why I tried not to move off.  The first time I did this (not recorded), I was able to get Garrus to Overload the Marauders, which I tried to do and didn't work after I reloaded for whatever reason.

 

[robsonwt]

I think I've managed to Cryo Explode an Atlas with Incinerate. I've used the CS with Cryo Ammo amplification first and then when I hit Incinerate the Atlas Cryo Exploded. I think CS primed the Atlas (or the pilot). I have Radius upgrade in both powers.

 

I will try this again in the Armax Arena and post new developments.

 

Regards,

[robsonwt]

For the tests people are posting, it appears that the best Iceman character is a Soldier with Garrus and Ashley as squadmates. Shepard with Squad Cryo Ammo and all of them with Concussion Shot with amplification and all sporting Falcon Assault Rifles (freezing at every shot with AoE for freezing multiple enemies per shot). All 3 priming and detonating cryo explosions with each other Cryo Ammo amplified Concussion Shot in almost any characters, protected or not.

[MichaelN7]

I love how we all get together and analyze these nitty-gritty details of just HOW the game mechanics work.

I love it!

 

I do the same thing, it's how I got my "ideal" builds, all based on what class I am.

 

But anyway, I agree that it's more likely the pilot is being primed for cryo.

However, I've been able to prime for fire (Vanguard's Incendiary Ammo) and for biotics (Sentinel's Warp), even when it's shields are up, so maybe it's not so "out there" to think that cryo could be primed as well?

[RedCaesar97]

However, I've been able to prime for fire (Vanguard's Incendiary Ammo) and for biotics (Sentinel's Warp), even when it's shields are up, so maybe it's not so "out there" to think that cryo could be primed as well?

 

Biotic combos always work on shields (Warp will always prime on shields in this case), but they deal reduced damage to shields.

 

Incendiary Ammo is not supposed to prime fire explosions on shields... but I have had it happen occasionally in multiplayer with the Salarian Engineer (detonating with Energy Drain), so I suspect it is a matter of timing. I know capn233 has pointed out in the past that you can detonate a cryo explosion before an enemy freezes if you hit it just about when it starts to freeze, otherwise you have to wait until it completely freezes. Something in the game logic I guess.