181 réponses à ce sujet

[AresKeith]

So..... How until this thread gets locked?

 

Monday

[Killdren88]

While I hate the movies very existence, I remember in Air bender they made the fire nation brown skinned while making water white...it was as it Shamylan was actively trying to run the movie....

[CoM Solaufein]

What, villains are not the dark skin, dark hair and dark eyed swarthy types?

And British accent cuz we all know them Brits are just pure evil.

[KaiserShep]

While I hate the movies very existence, I remember in Air bender they made the fire nation brown skinned while making water white...it was as it Shamylan was actively trying to run the movie....

 

Ye gods, what a mess that was. It's like slashing someone's tires, after setting their car on fire.

[windsea]

It is because Bioware started in Canada.

 

Their main enemy is the snow, snow is white, so subconsciously they make the villains white.

[Loghain Mac-Tir]

Ye gods, what a mess that was. It's like slashing someone's tires, after setting their car on fire.

 

It's just a terrible movie IF you haven't seen the Animated show, because then you'll  ust cry yourself to sleep, seeing how one of the few good western animated tv show was butchered by a has-been director. 

[sillymonkboy]

Whether this was properly conveyed in Dorian's quest is something to be debated but it was confirmed that, that was what was intended to be conveyed.

I get what they were trying to do. It's just that the way it was written didn't really convey that. Most of the focus should have been about him wanting to be his own, independent man, unbound by the chains of Tevinter's version of The Game.

In my head, based on what we were presented with, it should have went something like this:

Dorian: "Dad, I don't want that kind of life. I don't even like women. I'm gay."

Dad: "Son, I couldn't care less who you wish to have sex with. You can sleep with Qunari for all I care. Just do the official marriage for political purposes, show up to a few functions together, pump out a couple of kids for our eugenics program, and we're good. In the meantime, You and your wife can both take lovers, who are welcome to stay in the guest rooms. After the grandkids, you can divorce or whatever and go spend your life however you like."

And then the discussion goes on from there about how he wants to live a completely different life that what dad has planned.

It's very similar to Miranda's conflict with her own father, except in her case it was a lot more clear that that's what it was about.

[KaiserShep]

It's just a terrible movie IF you haven't seen the Animated show, because then you'll  ust cry yourself to sleep, seeing how one of the few good western animated tv show was butchered by a has-been director. 

 

While it's impossible for me to separate the two, since I've been a fan of the series for some time, it's just so boring and inept regardless. But then I have a very strong dislike for this guy's body of work.

[Andraste_Reborn]

Why would Bioware even bother with something so trivial? Must be a new hire.

 

That's kind of hilarious, given who wrote Dorian and his personal quest.

 

Anyway, if someone thinks the thread should be locked, they should probably report it. (I don't think it's doing any harm, personally.)

[Loghain Mac-Tir]

That's kind of hilarious, given who wrote Dorian and his personal quest.

 

Anyway, if someone thinks the thread should be locked, they should probably report it. (I don't think it's doing any harm, personally.)

 

Dorian was one of my most favored character, after Solas and Cole (Varric didn't had charm that he had in DA 2), but I too, thought that his personal quest was over the top, to be honest, it just came out of nowhere and left me feeling a little ugh, sure I get the whole discrimination thing, but the blood magic ritual was a little hard to swallow. I felt like they were giving a social message just for the sake of giving a social message. 

 

If the OP was being your run of the mill SJW, then this thread should indeed get locked, because stupidity should not be promoted or even tolerated. But if they were genuinely curious, then I think they have already got their answer, in which case no need to lock. 

[Raiil]

Dorian was one of my most favored character, after Solas and Cole (Varric didn't had charm that he had in DA 2), but I too, thought that his personal quest was over the top, to be honest, it just came out of nowhere and left me feeling a little ugh, sure I get the whole discrimination thing, but the blood magic ritual was a little hard to swallow. I felt like they were giving a social message just for the sake of giving a social message. 

 

If the OP was being your run of the mill SJW, then this thread should indeed get locked, because stupidity should not be promoted or even tolerated. But if they were genuinely curious, then I think they have already got their answer, in which case no need to lock. 

 

 

I think Dorian's problem is that you don't get enough information before the quest. Dorian deflects a lot and you don't get to the meat of it, just really vague statements. If he had spoken more of his personal run ins before the quest and his decision to live a more authentic life, it wouldn't have been as heavy handed. Instead they had to cram it into a two minute scene.

[SmilesJA]

Does really matter if they're white? The fact that most of those villains commit atrocities earns my ire regardless of the color of their skin.

[Twilight_Princess]

I was just going to walk on by this thread BUT

 

Exact opposite of Transgender

 

*edit*

 

Well...yes and no. What you said is correct but the way its used makes me think people mistakenly think the term just means "not trans". Cis means you subscribe to the belief or feel that you yourself have an internal gender that matches with your body. When someone says "No I don't feel like I should have a different body/I'm not transgender" the assumption is made that that person feels they "identify" with their sex or believe they personally have a mental gender that matches with their biological sex. They are then called cis. It can be an assumptive label because its used to describe a state of feeling and belief another person has about their gender...often without their say so. No one can read minds or know what someone else feels. This is just my 2 cents but unless someone describes themselves as such, I don't think its a label that should be automatically given to someone simply because they don't identify as transgender.

[Loghain Mac-Tir]

I think Dorian's problem is that you don't get enough information before the quest. Dorian deflects a lot and you don't get to the meat of it, just really vague statements. If he had spoken more of his personal run ins before the quest and his decision to live a more authentic life, it wouldn't have been as heavy handed. Instead they had to cram it into a two minute scene.

 

Well, I already knew he was homosexual, Bioware/EA made sure I knew, since i had to import the game in my country mostly because of Dorian, you're damn right I knew he was gay. So, I pretty much expected the discrimination plot when his side quest came up, but when I actually completed the actual quest ... well, let me just say, I've never felt this uncomfortable from a video game scene . 

[Loghain Mac-Tir]

I was just going to walk on by this thread BUT

 

 

 

Actually no. People mistakenly think the term means "not trans". Cis means you subscribe to the belief that you yourself have an internal gender that matches with your body. When someone says "No I don't feel like I should have a different body/I'm not transgender" the assumption is made that that person feels they "identify" with their sex or believe they personally have a mental gender that matches with their biological sex. They are then called Cis. It can be an assumptive label because it describes a state of feeling and belief another person has about gender...often without their say so. No one can read minds or no what someone else feels. Unless someone describes themselves as such I don't think its a label you should give to everyone simply because they don't identify as transgender.

 

Well, I don't know how people actually use it, because I have never actually seen it used outside of the Internet, but I meant the exact opposite because ;

 

Cis : Latin prefix for 'on this side of'

Trans: Latin prefix for 'on the other side of'

 

So I took the Occam's razor to it, and came to that conclusion. 

[Loghain Mac-Tir]

Does really matter if they're white? The fact that most of those villains commit atrocities earns my ire regardless of the color of their skin.

 

Actually you can argue (if you really wanna be a ******) that this series is racist towards white people, because it shows them as evil, unscrupulous and insane. 

 

Same argument I make, when someone says that 'GTA is misogynistic because it shows women as housewives and prostitutes' . I say that ; 'then it's also misandric because it shows men as psychopaths and criminals'

 

'What? you think that all men are actually psychopaths and criminals? Well then, fu*k you too'

[Twilight_Princess]

Well, I don't know how people actually use it, because I have never actually seen it used outside of the Internet, but I meant the exact opposite because ;

 

Cis : Latin prefix for 'on this side of'

Trans: Latin prefix for 'on the other side of'

 

So I took the Occam's razor to it, and came to that conclusion. 

 

I've seen it get used as a default description for people who aren't transgender but IMO I don't think its always a helpful term. Cis requires the feeling/belief of a dualistic form of gender.  Transgender means you aren't matching,  to match there needs to be two things working harmoniously (mental and physical). So if you don't believe/feel you yourself have two things working together that makes you feel OK about the body you have,  logically it follows you cant be cis.  When I see someone describe someone else using that term without asking them first, like Cole I wonder "How do you know?". 

 

Anyway are the mods asleep today?

[Raiil]

Well, I already knew he was homosexual, Bioware/EA made sure I knew, since i had to import the game in my country mostly because of Dorian, you're damn right I knew he was gay. So, I pretty much expected the discrimination plot when his side quest came up, but when I actually completed the actual quest ... well, let me just say, I've never felt this uncomfortable from a video game scene . 

 

 

That would be your country then, and not BioWare. BW didn't make those rules. As for discomfort, eh I guess that has more to do with yourself? IDK.

 

As for your other comment, I'll agree that it's very easy to flip the situation around saying that certain games make all men criminals, all white people bad guys, etc, but it's also not entirely true. White males make up the vast majority of protagonists, or even just males in general, and men are allowed a whole plethora of roles. Traditionally, this isn't the case for women or minorities, and they're just now really starting to become more than set pieces or MacGuffins. One of the reasons why BioWare tends to stand out amoungst game developers (I'll say that Bethesda, the other main proprietor of westerns RPGs) is that they write their games in a manner that allow minorities to stand out and be something other than stereotypes.

[Twilight_Princess]

And British accent cuz we all know them Brits are just pure evil.

 

Oh yes British people are always diabolical Forgot about that one!

[Loghain Mac-Tir]

That would be your country then, and not BioWare. BW didn't make those rules. As for discomfort, eh I guess that has more to do with yourself? IDK.

 

As for your other comment, I'll agree that it's very easy to flip the situation around saying that certain games make all men criminals, all white people bad guys, etc, but it's also not entirely true. White males make up the vast majority of protagonists, or even just males in general, and men are allowed a whole plethora of roles. Traditionally, this isn't the case for women or minorities, and they're just now really starting to become more than set pieces or MacGuffins. One of the reasons why BioWare tends to stand out amoungst game developers (I'll say that Bethesda, the other main proprietor of westerns RPGs) is that they write their games in a manner that allow minorities to stand out and be something other than stereotypes.

 

I think I wasn't clear in getting my point across, I'll try again

 

Well, I already knew he was homosexual, Bioware/EA made sure I knew : I was actually referring to the excessive focus pre-release on Dorian being homosexual 

 

since i had to import the game in my country mostly because of Dorian, you're damn right I knew he was gay. I am actually blaming my country not Bioware/EA , though it's not actually illegal to sell games containing homosexual characters, EA just didn't wanted to risk, because the sales were gonna be pathetically low anyway, so why bother.

 

Also I was joking or at least trying to be funny, but apparently failing at that too, I'll be sure to add some smiley faces and/or lol's next time.

 

As for the other comment, I specifically said GTA, because I happen to agree on the whole that women are indeed sexualized, even in games where they are the main lead. Anyone else remember the Lara Croft "mods". 

 

I give a pass to GTA because it's made for psychopaths and pre-pubescent teenages , not really though (see what I did there), GTA goes way ahead of its way to satirize almost everything, so whatever they show is not what they actually believe, but just what the society thinks of itself, or at least their fan base. lol (man I am on fire,right now) 

 

TL;DR Just read the fu*cking thing, it's bascially 15-20 lines, how much comfort in life do you want ?  

[Raiil]

I think I wasn't clear in getting my point across, I'll try again

 

Well, I already knew he was homosexual, Bioware/EA made sure I knew : I was actually referring to the excessive focus pre-release on Dorian being homosexual 

 

since i had to import the game in my country mostly because of Dorian, you're damn right I knew he was gay. I am actually blaming my country not Bioware/EA , though it's not actually illegal to sell games containing homosexual characters, EA just didn't wanted to risk, because the sales were gonna be pathetically low anyway, so why bother.

 

Also I was joking or at least trying to be funny, but apparently failing at that too, I'll be sure to add some smiley faces and/or lol's next time.

 

As for the other comment, I specifically said GTA, because I happen to agree on the whole that women are indeed sexualized, even in games where they are the main lead. Anyone else remember the Lara Croft "mods". 

 

I give a pass to GTA because it's made for psychopaths and pre-pubescent teenages , not really though (see what I did there), GTA goes way ahead of its way to satirize almost everything, so whatever they show is not what they actually believe, but just what the society thinks of itself, or at least their fan base. lol (man I am on fire,right now) 

 

TL;DR Just read the fu*cking thing, it's bascially 15-20 lines, how much comfort in life do you want ?

 

 

Perhaps for you to explain yourself more clearly, instead of presuming that the rest of us are mind readers who can read intent in text without tone and content.

[Loghain Mac-Tir]

Perhaps for you to explain yourself more clearly, instead of presuming that the rest of us are mind readers who can read intent in text without tone and content.

 

The supposed 'joke' wasn't the point anyway, whether I actually furious at EA or I was joking has nothing to do with what I said, though if you must know, I was at one point pissed off at EA for announcing 5 ****** days before the release date, when I had already waited for it, for about 1 and a half years, sure tease all fans with awesome tidbits for 2 frickin years and then at the last moment announce that they are not gonna release the game hear because of some archaic law,that no one even cares about (outside of family gatherings, that is). Every fan was heartbroken, and when I say every fan, I mean all 3 of them, including me. So yeah, whatever.

 

Though honestly, at this point I think we are beating the dead horse to .. death, but I've got an hour or so to kill,  so what the hell ....

[Raiil]

 

 

I disagree with someone who said that it is because it would be a shitstorm, " because only white straight males " can be the baddies. 

 

I agree, but it's a problem with perception versus reality. 

 

Of course there are going to be tumblerinas who cry and moan about it, but if you want a critically acclaimed series where women can and are portrayed as both heroes and villains, game of thrones/a song of ice and fire are a good start. While Cersei Lannister is as cunning as a wet paper towel, she is unabashedly a bad guy and speaking as a SJWesty, motormouthed feminist, I like that she's a bad guy because in order for their to be equality, we ladies have to be seen across the spectrum.

 

It's not like we've never had female baddies in game- the Baroness and Majorlaine, and depending on your POV, Anora and Celene can be viewed negatively as well. From there both Isabela and Vivienne can be considered polarising, if not 'evil' by any stretch of the imagination. And there are some serious bad women in the Fallout Franchise, if one wishes to see more evil ladies.