316 réponses à ce sujet

[PsychoBlonde]

I thought you were missing my point by mentioning gunpowder. Because I was comparing them to the real world. Not the rest of Thedas.

 

The Qunari have seemingly come about a very sophisticated view on gender and how people identify themselves (in general)... One that the modern world isn't close to yet. That's what I find a bit insulting. 

 

It's not actually a particularly sophisticated view on gender, otherwise they wouldn't tie your gender to your potential employment.  What if you want to be feminine and a warrior?  Why is that against the rules?

 

They simply don't think that gender and sexuality are identical.  It's never discussed WHY they believe this.

 

But there's not some sort of linear societal progress thing where primitive societies were super-uptight about gender and modern societies are gradually getting rid of this.  Actually, over most of the world they're discovering the notion that our ancestors were particularly upset about this kind of stuff is, in many cases, a misapprehension of the historical record or just plain made up, and until fairly recently nearly EVERYONE was, in fact, pretty chill about it all.

[PsychoBlonde]

To add to this: Overall-Thedas is quite "evolved" when it comes to sexism, skin-colour racism, and homophobia, as others have said. That makes me wonder why people think that the Qun has do be "devolved" in every way. To me, that's unrealistic. In fact, I think the Qun is "evolved" regarding transgender people for entirely the wrong reasons, as they still maintain the sexism of the Qun. It also makes me confused as to why David Gaider thought same-sex marriage in DA would not fit, because Thedas has less of a problem with it than our world, yet it's legal in parts of ours. That's the disconnect for me. But he's not in charge anymore, so who knows what will happen now?

 

Also: I tend to avoid these kinds of threads for the headaches they cause, but people are making surprisingly good points. Good job!

 

Same-sex marriage may not fit in (all) parts of Thedas because marriage may be, at least in part, considered to be about producing offspring.  Vivienne even says this:  "Marriage is the business of alliance and inheritance."  It may be purely a legal distinction.  Heck, we don't even know, in legal terms, what getting married INVOLVES in Thedas except for some vague generalizations.  Is someone required to officiate, or can people just announce "hey, we're married now".  Are there contracts to sign and forms to fill out?  Does it vary for different classes?  (Nobles, for instance, are probably extremely picky about said inheritance/alliance issues.)  It's known, for instance, that City Elves at least sometimes conduct arranged marriages which are officiated by a Chantry sister.  Are non-Chantry marriages legally recognized?

 

We don't know any of the particulars, and I'm not sure this would be a profitable thing for the game to explore in any great depth.  There's limited value in just grafting some modern hot-topic issue undigested onto a fantasy world in the name of looking modern.  Gay marriage as a topic just kind of bugs me not because I'm opposed to it in any way (I believe everyone should have the same rights) but because of the abject FIXATION on the word MARRIAGE as if it were some kind of magical incantation of happiness and rainbows instead of a legal arrangement that, if not taken seriously, can screw up people's lives and that isn't in any way necessary for people to, say, live together, share common property, etc. etc.

[PsychoBlonde]

All I see is the writers trying too hard to defy expectations. They set up a faction that they know creates ominous and oppressive perceptions in many people, and then try to mess with that now. It's a conscious decision to screw with people. I wouldn't like this approach, no matter what the subject.

 

Boy, are you EVER slapping your own interpretation on this with absolutely no basis.

 

Besides, I know people who would consider the Qunari take on gender to INCREASE their "ominous" and "oppressive" perception.

 

The whole friggin series is about the interactions of "gray" groups with good and bad aspects where nobody's completely The Good Guy and nobody's completely The Bad Guy.  Even the DARKSPAWN have had their "not the faceless pure evil of evilness" moment.  So the ENTIRE SERIES is about NOTHING BUT "screwing with people".

[DementedSheep]

All I see is the writers trying too hard to defy expectations. They set up a faction that they know creates ominous and oppressive perceptions in many people, and then try to mess with that now. I wouldn't like this approach, no matter what the subject.

 

I would have thought nothing of it if they created an entirely different faction that thought along these lines. You get this in, say, Star Trek, every episode. There's always some new race the Enterprise stumbles upon every week that has a unique perspective. I accept it easily.. I have no expectations. 

I think I see why this sort of thing causes problems all the time. The writers cannot show every aspect of culture or character as soon as they are introduced and there are always going to be a ton of things where they just haven't considered how they would respond to that yet but even based on small amount of information you get an impression of how that person or culture is and fill in blanks. Then when they introduce more information because people filled in the blanks themselves they think it's a retcon when it isn't.

However it is not the writers fault that you made assumptions and they don't have to keep in line with them. If you make a wrong assumption and its gets corrected you should accept you were wrong. They do not need to keep adding new races or cultures when they want to show a different viewpoint on a particular issue when it dose no contradict what they already have. Doing so makes for shallow races/cultures that seem to exist only to explore that one viewpoint on a particular topic.

[Paul E Dangerously]

Boy, are you EVER slapping your own interpretation on this with absolutely no basis.

 

Besides, I know people who would consider the Qunari take on gender to INCREASE their "ominous" and "oppressive" perception.

 

The whole friggin series is about the interactions of "gray" groups with good and bad aspects where nobody's completely The Good Guy and nobody's completely The Bad Guy.  Even the DARKSPAWN have had their "not the faceless pure evil of evilness" moment.  So the ENTIRE SERIES is about NOTHING BUT "screwing with people".

 

My problem with this is that "different viewpoint" shouldn't mean "evil" - as funny as that sounds to be saying it.

 

I kind of liked the idea that the Qunari were this alien, impersonal viewpoint instead of something more identifiable. The entire thing was about the submission of the individual and whatever personal desires/ideals/quirks they had into becoming a role to serve the greater whole. You are what the Qun says you are. You do what it is best for you do to according to the defined roles that have been set.

 

This kind of screws with that just a tad. I get that Bioware wants to make everything this hugbox zone sort of thing where nobody can be offended, but it's not wrong to have a culture in DAI that doesn't line up with the RL viewpoint they want to paint everything with.

 

Hell, the Arishok's entire arc in DA2 is "I need to clean this place up because none of you know your place and Kirkwall is a cesspit because of it.".

[Nefla]

Anyways, I'm out if this is gonna be about how great the Qunari are. **** that noise. 

 

Seriously.

 

I'm all about liking Krem though. She's OK. Been playing Kotor again recently too. I had no idea all this time Bastila was Jennifer Hale.

Dat fake accent

[PsychoBlonde]

They aren't grey at all. They're ****** monstrous. I barely consider them a faction like others.. and more like a swarm of locusts. Something primal, impersonal, unable to be reasoned with.

 

But you're talking to a Libertarian. What do you expect?

 

So it's "Libertarian" to dehumanize people who live under a system you detest, possibly against their will?

 

If they were a swarm of locusts, they wouldn't have any converts.  But for many in Thedas (as has been explored in the games) the Qunari system represents a BETTER way of life than the one they WERE in, where they were maltreated slaves or starving to death in the gutter.  That's not the same thing as saying that the Qunari are awesome or that their system is a good one in philosophical terms--but neither is ANY OTHER political system in Thedas.  They are all jacked in some way, leaving people basically to pick their poison.  Once that happens, you have to start getting into not just the overall political philosophies on display but the actual day-to-day implementation of those philosophies and how they would interfere with your own personal interests to determine better and worse--and then, only for yourself.

 

Kind of like today in the real world, actually.

 

Oh, and I'm an Objectivist, which to many means I'm kind of a libertarian.  That doesn't have to mean I'm incapable of subtlety.

[Sylvius the Mad]

I have no clue. It's up to the player, of course.

It isn't, though. All female clothing in DAO looks feminine. The whole game assumes the Warden is cisgendered.

And given a cisgendered Warden, Sten's remarks make perfect sense, even when considered alongside the Krem example.

[Nefla]

It isn't, though. All female clothing in DAO looks feminine. The whole game assumes the Warden is cisgendered.

And given a cisgendered Warden, Sten's remarks make perfect sense, even when considered alongside the Krem example.

Not the heavy/massive armor that looks exactly the same on both genders

[Sylvius the Mad]

Not the heavy/massive armor that looks exactly the same on both genders

Good point.

But the game does still assume a cisgendered Warden.

[Nefla]

Good point.

But the game does still assume a cisgendered Warden.

Yes,  and I don't know why I replied to that part. Sometimes I get derpy and my hair isn't even blonde anymore.

[BansheeOwnage]

Same-sex marriage may not fit in (all) parts of Thedas because marriage may be, at least in part, considered to be about producing offspring.  Vivienne even says this:  "Marriage is the business of alliance and inheritance."  It may be purely a legal distinction.  Heck, we don't even know, in legal terms, what getting married INVOLVES in Thedas except for some vague generalizations.  Is someone required to officiate, or can people just announce "hey, we're married now".  Are there contracts to sign and forms to fill out?  Does it vary for different classes?  (Nobles, for instance, are probably extremely picky about said inheritance/alliance issues.)  It's known, for instance, that City Elves at least sometimes conduct arranged marriages which are officiated by a Chantry sister.  Are non-Chantry marriages legally recognized?

 

We don't know any of the particulars, and I'm not sure this would be a profitable thing for the game to explore in any great depth.  There's limited value in just grafting some modern hot-topic issue undigested onto a fantasy world in the name of looking modern.  Gay marriage as a topic just kind of bugs me not because I'm opposed to it in any way (I believe everyone should have the same rights) but because of the abject FIXATION on the word MARRIAGE as if it were some kind of magical incantation of happiness and rainbows instead of a legal arrangement that, if not taken seriously, can screw up people's lives and that isn't in any way necessary for people to, say, live together, share common property, etc. etc.

Yes, it depends on what "marriage" consists of in Thedas. I would assume that overall, there is a lot less paperwork or contracts, except for nobles. It also wouldn't matter as much if they're legally recognized, again, with the exception of nobles. Although, it would be nice to have your spouse automatically be able to use your land, etc, I'm sure there are other ways to own something jointly, and in the case of death, simply leave it to them in a will. Of course Vivienne holds that view, but it's obviously not a universal opinion. Why would anyone care if the common folk (or non-heirs) wanted to produce offspring or not? Would they ask straight couples if they planned on having children, and if they said they did not, not marry them? So again, that's only an issue for nobles, and mostly for the oldest in a family only.

 

As for "running off and declaring you're married": Of all the romances in Dragon Age (besides Alistair I guess), Sera is the one you can propose to. Now, I haven't seen it so I don't know whether the Inquisitor is planning on eloping or having an official marriage. (Another point against Gaider's excuse that same-sex marriage "hasn't occurred to thedosians"). I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of "married" couples in Thedas simply bought rings and called it a deal.

 

As for same-sex marriage itself, I'm not sure what you mean by it not being a "profitable" thing to include in the games. If you think that marriage shouldn't be in DA at all, fine, but that's not the impression I got. Bioware will continue having same-sex romance options in their games, so if they added marriage as an addition to romances, why not same-sex ones too? It's not a question of it being "profitable", especially considering any point they made about the LGBT community has already been made. Adding marriage doesn't change that.

 

Do I think marriage is an incantation of happiness and rainbows? No, but why does that matter? How does that make adding it as an option worse?I don't want them to add it because it's a "hot topic issue". I don't want them to add it because it's "modern". I want them to add it because I, personally, think adding marriage as an option to certain romances would add to the experience. That's all.

 

Edit: I forgot to say that in the case of being a noble Inquisitor, you are the youngest of several children, which might make a difference to Trevelyan as to whether she would be "allowed" by her family to marry someone she couldn't copulate with. But I doubt it mattered. Wow, that's a lot of text!

[Dai Grepher]

Krem isn't a woman. That's the point you are missing.

 

No, the point you are missing is that the Qun would consider Krem to be female based on physical traits. This isn't about what gender Krem or The Iron Bull or any of us think Krem is. This is about what the Qun dictates.

 

The Qun already identifies children as male or female and then sets their education accordingly. How do they determine their gender except by physical traits?

 

The Qun then forces the Qunari to fulfill the roles they were assigned. Those who do not, for any reason, are reeducated.

 

I submit that the Qun would identify Krem as female based on physical traits, assign Krem a female role, and reeducate Krem if the role was refused or not followed properly.

 

A baker cannot be a warrior, even if he is male. He cannot change his role. Krem's claims of being male would not persuade the Qunari.

[Draining Dragon]

How do the Qunari determine whether someone is legitimately transgender? And why do they care how someone identifies, anyway? It at least would have made sense if they used a person's biological sex to determine their role, since that can be easily determined at birth.

Also, doesn't Sten say "you LOOK like a woman" to female wardens? That isn't the viewpoint of someone who thinks there is a difference between gender and sex.

None of the new lore on the Qunari makes sense.

[Dai Grepher]

I said that being a mage is different than being a man or woman. Being a man/woman has no effect on society outside of one's own personal sphere. Being a mage, however, has the potential to have a negative impact on others. I believe that the Qunari take action against those who are born mages, regardless of how they identify, because being a mage has the potential to harm others, regardless of one's own personal feelings on it. However, I do not believe the Qunari would take issue with someone identifying as a man or woman, provided they fit into the role the Qun has slated for each gender. 

 

The Iron Bull has no real need of Krem, so I don't see why he would lie about the Qun accepting transgender people. Additionally, the Iron Bull is someone who has voluntarily submitted to re-education. While others may perceive the Bull's action as those of a Tal-Vashoth, I would argue that the Iron Bull believes whole-heartedly in the Qun, and wouldn't voluntarily compromise its set of morals. Now if Krem were someone in a position of power, or a keeper of secrets, than your argument that the Iron Bull is lying to Krem might hold more weight, but as it is, Krem is little more than a swordsman. 

 

I think you are interpreting Sten's words to mean something they do not. Sten said that 'trying' would lead to frustration, but in Krem's case, he isn't trying. He is a man, despite what his biological beginnings were. He has embraced the role of being a man, and the social attachments that comes with it. 

 

"Being a man/woman has no effect on society outside of one's own personal sphere." Your opinion. Not the Qun's teaching. As you admit, "I believe" this, and "I do not believe" that. These are your beliefs, not the Qunari's. However, The Sten also informs us of the roles given to Qunari. For example, a baker cannot be a farmer. He is assigned his role as a baker and the Qun demands he fulfill his given role. The baker cannot claim to be a warrior and become one. Such an attempt would be met with reeducation. This is despite the fact the baker could be male. Tell me, would society be affected negatively if the baker became a warrior? No. Yet the Qunari do not allow it. Krem's case is even more complicated than the baker's. The Qunari would not accommodate Krem's wishes. The baker could fit the role of a warrior with training, but this does not matter to the Qunari. Krem's abilities would not matter to them either.

 

The Iron Bull has no need of Krem, but he does value each and every one of his men. He has gotten to know them. They had become a second family of sorts. He struggles with the decision to recall them or allow them to be killed, even at the cost of his own place within the Qun, which he also values greatly. One possible reason to lie to Krem is that he wants to boost morale or confidence within the team. Reassurance. Affirmation. Another reason is perhaps The Iron Bull is describing what he thinks the Qun should dictate. Or there is another option, which is that The Iron Bull was telling a half truth. Yes, there are aqun-athlok, but he never said what the Qunari do with them. He made his statement, Krem asked if they are treated like real men, The Iron Bull dodged the question and answered with his own personal opinion that they are real men and then reassured Krem.

 

That he willingly submitted to reeducation proves that he does not always follow the Qun. This means what he said about gender recognition within the Qun is unreliable. Your opinion that the Qun would recognize Krem as male is based solely on The Iron Bull's unreliable statements.

 

I think you are ignoring The Sten's words. There is no other interpretation. He said what he said. A female cannot be a male according to the Qun. Period.

[DomeWing333]

The Qun already identifies children as male or female and then sets their education accordingly. How do they determine their gender except by physical traits?

The same way they determine any other job role. Watching. Observing. Writing down specific behavioral traits that would be an asset for a certain occupation. They see a kid with nimble hands? Artisan. They see a kid who's adept at lying? Ben-Hassrath. They see a kid who's good at fighting? Warrior.

 

They might use physical traits as the initial sorting mechanism, but that's not where the sorting stops. It's like assigning a kid to the third grade based on her age, observing that she greatly excels at her studies, finding out she has a genius IQ, and then bumping her up a few grade levels.

[Handsome Jack]

Pre-Established Fact: There are no warriors that are female amongst Qun society.

Retcon by SJW Bioware: Krem would fit in prefectly in that society being a warrior according to Bull despite her being biologically female so she can't be a soldier!

Qunari are very liberal eh?

 

I've been mad at that for a while.

 

Qunari got a massive SJW retcon in Inquisition.

[Hiemoth]

As I was reading this thread, it finally clicked to me why these threads always drive me slightly nuts. Essentially the arguments in these topics very fast go to "Qunari were such an awesome people who had this weird, completely alien and different outlook on society and life. Wait, they are not following our set standards of prejudices? That doesn't make any sense?" Just the fact that they are so often in this very thread referenced as the grey giants by people swearing by the lore of them, which is weird because according to the lore race has nothing to do with being a Qunari. In the same vein it is weird to think that a culture where what race you were born as is indifferential in your status, the gender you were born as is paramount.

 

I am also mystified in this thread by somehow placing Sten as the base truth of what the Qunari should be for two reasons: 1) It would basically the first Swede you ever meet is the ultimate truthful depicion of Swedish culture and every Swede you meet after that making contradictory claims is lying, and more importantly 2) Sten doesn't actually say that much about Qunari culture. He actually refuses to speak about the Qun in majority of instances, making those few statements he makes very difficult to interpret since there is almost context to base it on. I think that is part of the reason why some people were able to build so far-reaching headcanons of what he said as there was such a huge amount of available interpretations.

 

Related to my second point, what baffles me in the examples used is that almost all of the things now considered crucial for the Qunari culture were not established by Sten or even in DAO, they were established in DA2. The Triumvirate, the Tal-Vastoth, division of tasks, etc, and one of the characters in the game was one of the leaders of the whole Qunari. Tallis tells us much more about the Qun than Sten and what they did with Krem is not contradictory with anything presented in that game and culture. Yet not only is that ignored, for some unfathomable reason Sten's insanely vague statements are seen to discredit the massive work DA2 did on this matter and, according to this thread, their horns somehow made them more human. This argument makes my head more and more.

[DomeWing333]

How do the Qunari determine whether someone is legitimately transgender? And why do they care how someone identifies, anyway? 

They don't and they don't. They just care about whether or not someone is legitimately good at fighting and is willing to fight as a male. As long as those things hold, that person can be either a regular warrior or an Aqun-aathlok.

 

You're a female who identifies as male but can't fight? Too bad. Re-education time. Or you're a male who can fight but identify as female? Re-education. The idea that the Qun cares about gender identity is false. They care about extracting the maximum utility out of their people based on their abilities. That's it.

 

For people who still think this is a retcon, look at post 14 of this thread, which was created well before Dragon Age 2 was out. There, a Bioware writer states that even if you've been specifically bred as a warrior, if you end up being more intellectual, you will get reassigned as a priest or weapons researcher, or Ben-Hassrath. Job roles in the Qunari are not and have never been assigned at birth.

[Winged Silver]

"Being a man/woman has no effect on society outside of one's own personal sphere." Your opinion. Not the Qun's teaching. As you admit, "I believe" this, and "I do not believe" that. These are your beliefs, not the Qunari's. However, The Sten also informs us of the roles given to Qunari. For example, a baker cannot be a farmer. He is assigned his role as a baker and the Qun demands he fulfill his given role. The baker cannot claim to be a warrior and become one. Such an attempt would be met with reeducation. This is despite the fact the baker could be male. Tell me, would society be affected negatively if the baker became a warrior? No. Yet the Qunari do not allow it. Krem's case is even more complicated than the baker's. The Qunari would not accommodate Krem's wishes. The baker could fit the role of a warrior with training, but this does not matter to the Qunari. Krem's abilities would not matter to them either.

 

The Iron Bull has no need of Krem, but he does value each and every one of his men. He has gotten to know them. They had become a second family of sorts. He struggles with the decision to recall them or allow them to be killed, even at the cost of his own place within the Qun, which he also values greatly. One possible reason to lie to Krem is that he wants to boost morale or confidence within the team. Reassurance. Affirmation. Another reason is perhaps The Iron Bull is describing what he thinks the Qun should dictate. Or there is another option, which is that The Iron Bull was telling a half truth. Yes, there are aqun-athlok, but he never said what the Qunari do with them. He made his statement, Krem asked if they are treated like real men, The Iron Bull dodged the question and answered with his own personal opinion that they are real men and then reassured Krem.

 

That he willingly submitted to reeducation proves that he does not always follow the Qun. This means what he said about gender recognition within the Qun is unreliable. Your opinion that the Qun would recognize Krem as male is based solely on The Iron Bull's unreliable statements.

 

I think you are ignoring The Sten's words. There is no other interpretation. He said what he said. A female cannot be a male according to the Qun. Period.

 

Okay. Sure. My opinion. And potentially that of the Qun. Why would someone's decision to identify as man or woman affect society? I don't believe there's ever been a moment in game where someone of the Qun specifically states "You saying you're a man and acting like a man even though you were born a woman is tearing the fabric of society apart". And when you say "These are you beliefs, not the Qunari's" where are you getting that? Is the tome of the Ashkaari Koslun a rare codex we can pick up and read? Because if not, than all we can do is speculate to the best of our abilities given the limited nature of the evidence presented. That is primarily why I use the phrase "I believe", seeing as I have no way to confirm everything. And neither do you. 

 

Krem is not Qunari, so your comparison of the baker isn't really applicable. However, on that note, the Qunari who is placed into the role of a baker (which is a woman's job in the Qun, implied by Solas discussing seeing a female Qunari baker put a pinch of sugar in the center of each loaf, as her own small rebellion (if you talk to him about his journeys into the Fade)) is placed there based on an evaluation of physical and mental traits. While this baker may wish to be a warrior, it has been determined that by said traits, this individual would not be suitable as a warrior. Thus, his being a warrior would be a detriment in that he would not be realizing his full potential in his contributions to his society. And this is just hypothetically going with the idea that a baker would be a male in Qunari society, to fit your argument. What must be remembered is that the Qun takes a different view on what harms a society. In our own society, we very much believe in letting a person self determine their fate. This does not appear to be the case in the Qunari society.

 

You are describing possibilities, and not facts. While these may be the case, I do not interpret his actions to equate your assertions. If the Iron Bull is describing what he thinks the Qun should be like, than that may play into something we do see in our own world very often - various degrees of religious fervor. It is not unthinkable that there would be different levels of devotion amongst the Qunari. And one simply being more devoted than another does not immediately equate 'bad religion'. I think if you made that argument, there would be many people of different faiths who would find fault with that line of thinking. And, as I said before, since Krem doesn't care much about the Qun, there would be little reason for the Iron Bull to lie/half truth about the Aqun-Athlok. Now if Krem had expressed an interest in game about joining the Qun, this might have more meaning. But he doesn't. So there's not really any reason for the Bull to pretend that his religion would accept Krem, if they didn't. 

 

You keep calling the Iron Bull unreliable, but this is solely based on your interpretation of events. If he were truly uncertain of the Qun, he would not have submitted himself for re-education. His willingness to do so, even knowing what happened to those who underwent it, is indicative that he truly believed in the Qun. Additionally, we've only had close contact with two individuals of the Qunari faith, each of whom were quite different. But that difference does not immediately indicate that one is 'more correct' than the other. Until we've actually visited  Par Vollen, this is something we will only be able to speculate about.

 

"A female cannot be a male" but Krem isn't a female under the Qun. Krem says he is a man. Krem does manly things. Therefore, he fulfills the role as set by the Qun. The Qun takes issues with women doing manly things. Krem isn't being a warrior woman. He is being a male warrior, which falls into the right category. If you watch the video I linked earlier, Sten says the female warden must either be lying about being a woman, or a warrior. In Krem's case, he isn't being a woman, he is being a male who fights. 

[Dai Grepher]

In every respect that matters to the Qun, Krem is male. No one ever claims otherwise.

The Qun simply demands consistency. If you do one male thing, then you may only do male things. If you do one female things, then you may only do female things.

People who find this confusing are making the mistake of assuming that biological sex is a relevant criterion. It isn't. Perhaps it would be easier to understand like this:

Imagine a society wherein all roles are tied to gender. Some roles are male-only and all other roles are female only. There are no roles that allow both or either - each role is assigned to one gender only.

Define 10 people and assign them to roles on this way, but don't assign them biological sex. Leave that undetermined. Understand how the gender roles still make sense.

Now assign them biological sex, but do it randomly (actually randomly - flip a coin for each). Understand how the gender roles still make sense.

 

There is no one else in the game to claim otherwise. The Iron Bull is the only character who knows both Krem and the Qun. He is the only source, and he has been proven to be an unreliable source. Your claim hinges completely on him, and I contend that he is incorrect.

 

The Qun demands truth. Physical reality shows Krem is female, and that is what the Qunari would go by to determine Krem's role.

 

Prove that biological sex is not a relevant criterion to the Qunari in determining the roles of others brought under the Qun.
 

Your scenario has no relevance to this discussion. The Qunari do have roles that can be filled by either gender. Only certain roles are gender specific. The Qunari do not assign biological sex. Nature does this. The Qunari merely recognize it. The people are evaluated for their skills and assigned their roles based on that, but their biological sex is always clear and apparent. A female might show skill with a blade as well as a spatula. Her being female means she will not be assigned to the sword. Baker it is for her. Unless she shows skill in agility, in which case she may become a Ben-Hassrath spy like Tallis. If people were assigned roles based only on skill but not on biological sex, then you could not logically call these gender roles. Again, biological sex is not assigned by the Qunari, and they certainly don't flip a coin to determine it.