1074 réponses à ce sujet

[Lebanese Dude]

Artists lose control of their work when they sell it. 

 

Not entirely true

 

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By the way this discussion has merit on both sides. As a consumer it's up to you to live by your conscience regarding what or what you don't use.

[Teddie Sage]

I see your point, Nova. Sorry, I was still upset at the other user for the dictator insult. Anyways, I'm washing my hands with this thread. Everytime modding is mentioned, it triggers some anger into me and I'll try to restraint myself from now on.

[Teddie Sage]

Not entirely true

I'm with Lebanese Dude with this. It's still their property even if it's shared with the rest of the world. As an artist myself, if someone deformed or changed my characters without my authorization, I would be very upset at them. I'm starting to understand why Ann Rice doesn't like it when people do fanfics of her work.

[HTGBlackGuard]

Does anyone know how to make this offering for the trials in order to enter the arena?

[Steppenwolf]

Not entirely true

 

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By the way this discussion has merit on both sides. As a consumer it's up to you to live by your conscience.

 

Content creators have no authority to keep consumers from modifying products for personal use. Ridley Scott can't keep people making fan-cuts of Blade Runner, Katy Perry can't keep people from making remixes of her songs, authors can't keep people from making fan-fic using their characters, etc. Mods effect no one but the people who choose to use them and do nothing to undermine the success of the franchise they're made for.

[Steppenwolf]

I'm with Lebanese Dude with this. It's still their property even if it's shared with the rest of the world. As an artist myself, if someone deformed or changed my characters without my authorization, I would be very upset at them. I'm starting to understand why Ann Rice doesn't like it when people do fanfics of her work.

 

Doesn't matter at all. You have to deal with it.

[Toasted Llama]

Content creators have no authority to keep consumers from modifying products for personal use. Ridley Scott can't keep people making fan-cuts of Blade Runner, Katy Perry can't keep people from making remixes of her songs, authors can't keep people from making fan-fic using their characters, etc. Mods effect no one but the people who choose to use them and do nothing to undermine the success of the franchise they're made for.

As soon as this sort of stuff is released back on the interwebs though, the creators can call a copyright claim in some cases iirc.

[Steppenwolf]

As soon as this sort of stuff is released back on the interwebs though, the creators can call a copyright claim in some cases iirc.

 

Only if money is being made using someone else's IP or you're keeping the creator of the IP from making money.

[Toasted Llama]

Only if money is being made using someone else's IP or you're keeping the creator of the IP from making money.

Which is often implied in the copyright claim even though it may not exactly happen. There's also terms and conditions on use, which can include prohibition of material being used in hate, excessive gore, violence and pornography.

Things like "white washing" could be seen as hate.

[Lebanese Dude]

Content creators have no authority to keep consumers from modifying products for personal use. Ridley Scott can't keep people making fan-cuts of Blade Runner, Katy Perry can't keep people from making remixes of her songs, authors can't keep people from making fan-fic using their characters, etc. Mods effect no one but the people who choose to use them and do nothing to undermine the success of the franchise they're made for.

 

Basically this:

 

There's also terms and conditions on use, which can include prohibition of material being used in hate, excessive gore, violence and pornography.

Things like "white washing" could be seen as hate.

 

[Steppenwolf]

Which is often implied in the copyright claim even though it may not exactly happen. There's also terms and conditions on use, which can include prohibition of material being used in hate, excessive gore, violence and pornography.

Things like "white washing" could be seen as hate.

 

That's something that has to be dealt with on a case by case basis. Most mods have nothing to with whitewashing so to say all mods shouldn't exist because some of them might have been made with malice or ignorance is absolutely absurd. 

[Lebanese Dude]

Doesn't matter at all. You have to deal with it.

 

Very capitalist of you

 

Personally I endeavor to respect the wishes of the creators when they express an opinion regarding something, even if I'm not bound to do so.

 

Mutual respect and all that.

[SuperNose]

I see your point, Nova. Sorry, I was still upset at the other user for the dictator insult. Anyways, I'm washing my hands with this thread. Everytime modding is mentioned, it triggers some anger into me and I'll try to restraint myself from now on.

 

All good. Trust me, I enjoy the game as it was intended by the Devs at least once.  I owe them that much for putting that amount of effort into their games. And I'll agree that there are Mods out there that I feel should simply not exist, but to each their own. 

 

Also, just as an FYI, it's SuperNOSE, not SuperNOVA :-P Happens quite often, unfortunately lol.

[Teddie Sage]

All good. Trust me, I enjoy the game as it was intended by the Devs at least once.  I owe them that much for putting that amount of effort into their games. And I'll agree that there are Mods out there that I feel should simply not exist, but to each their own. 

 

Also, just as an FYI, it's SuperNOSE, not SuperNOVA :-P Happens quite often, unfortunately lol.

I'm partially blind these days... You'll have to forgive me for that... 

[Steppenwolf]

Very capitalist of you

 

Personally I endeavor to respect the wishes of the creators when they express an opinion regarding something, even if I'm not bound to.

Mutual respect and all that.

 

Selling your art puts you at the mercy of capitalism. Artistic control ends when money is exchanged. That has been affirmed time and time again in courts all over the world. So long as money isn't being made off someone else's IP or an IP's controller being prevented from making money there is nothing you can do to keep people from enjoying products they purchased however they choose to enjoy them.

[thruaglassdarkly]

Does anyone know how to make this offering for the trials in order to enter the arena?

 

After you talk to the Avar next to the arena, you make the offering at your requisitions table.  From there the arena quest should open.

[Lebanese Dude]

Selling your art puts you at the mercy of capitalism. Artistic control ends when money is exchanged. That has been affirmed time and time again in courts all over the world. So long as money isn't being made off someone else's IP or an IP's controller being prevented from making money there is nothing you can do to keep people from enjoying products they purchased however they choose to enjoy them.

It's not as simple as you make it out to be.

 

As Toasted Llama said earlier there are some things that the consumer is incapable of doing without facing some consequences. Social responsibility is still a thing.

 

Personally I find your opinion to be very ... clinical. In the world of artistic creations, the bond between creator and creation is very much real and is typically treated with respect. You don't buy someone's painting, paint over it, and then show it off to the painter as if you upgraded it. Rude...

 

Now this comes with a discussion of whether games are art, and while I think they are, that's a debate for another day.

[SuperNose]

It's not as simple as you make it out to be.

 

As Toasted Llama said earlier there are some things that the consumer is incapable of doing. Social responsibility is still a thing.

 

Personally I find your opinion to be very ... clinical. In the world of artistic creations, the bond between creator and creation is very much real and is typically treated with respect. You don't buy someone's painting, paint over it, and then show it off to people even if you aren't selling it. It's just rude.

 

Now this comes with a discussion of whether games are art, and while I think they are, that's a debate for another day.

 

Lol calm down please. This forum still hasn't come to a consensus on WHAT an RPG is, much less if DA:I IS an RPG >_< Lets start small and leave the huge debates for another time :-P

[Lebanese Dude]

Lol calm down please. This forum still hasn't come to a consensus on WHAT an RPG is, much less if DA:I IS an RPG >_< Lets start small and leave the huge debates for another time :-P

 

LOL don't worry I don't want to even touch that topic. 

 

By "another day" I meant when the sun sets in the east and rises in the west and when the seas go dry and the mountains blow in the wind.

 

No sooner.

[Bunny]

But I think we should try to establish those definitions (which is not as easy as it sounds) to be able to clear up and add focus to all this back and forth Duck Season Wabbit Season rhetoric.

[Steppenwolf]

It's not as simple as you make it out to be.

 

As Toasted Llama said earlier there are some things that the consumer is incapable of doing without facing some consequences. Social responsibility is still a thing.

 

Personally I find your opinion to be very ... clinical. In the world of artistic creations, the bond between creator and creation is very much real and is typically treated with respect. You don't buy someone's painting, paint over it, and then show it off to the painter as if you upgraded it. Rude...

 

Now this comes with a discussion of whether games are art, and while I think they are, that's a debate for another day.

 

Games are art, but they're interactive art. Paintings are passive art. You look at them and that's the experience. Games are experienced by playing them and immersing yourself in them. They're inherently unique in the realm of art. How they're used and what's acceptable to do with them is also unique. Modding is widely regarded as perfectly acceptable because no game is perfect and players obviously want to enjoy the games they've paid for as much as possible. 

As for the legal consequences of modding, there's nothing illegal about making free mods. Modding is older than BioWare and it will be around longer than BioWare. Their attempts to stymie modding are farcical and misguided. Sure, some mods are insensitive and/or offensive, but that's life. Stupid, ignorant and reprehensible people will always exist. I don't say white people shouldn't exist because the KKK is a thing so I won't say mods shouldn't exist because there's one that turns Josephine into a white woman.

[Bunny]

Has BioWare communicated their explicit position on modding?

[Bizantura]

Multi nationals are all about money nothing artsy about that.  In this world everything is about money even that supposed art.

 

I'm sorry but I dont see much produced art in todays world.  But the hiding behind that word in todays world is immense.

 

Mods today dont fit in anymore, no reason too with the boxes not to mention the control the compagnies want over gamer and product and therefore everyting must be tied or better completely online.  In yesterday a lot of creativity came because of the modding community, it is because it is made nearly impossible that mods now are often reduced to silly nude mods ect...  No creativity possible.

 

If anything todays world blocks creativity that could lead to art.

[ModernAcademic]

Mods shouldn't be an issue. If not for mods, I wouldn't've bothered to finish Origins. The game was good, but left to be desired in many areas. 

 

If something is explicit, offensive, demoralising or illegal in any other way, then the company is more than correct in demanding a certain modification is removed from the internet. If not, it helps gamers customise the game so as to render the experience more enjoyable.

[Steppenwolf]

Has BioWare communicated their explicit position on modding?

 

They used to support it. They released the toolkit for Origins so modders could make more and better mods.