339 réponses à ce sujet

[LPPrince]

I just think a lot of people don't know how to properly handle giving constructive criticisms. That in combination with the need some humans have to feed on negativity and you have what is perceived as disrespect towards the developers and developer disrespect towards the fans.

 

A lot of people think constructive criticism is saying, "This product sucks, it was terrible, you people are the worst, I'm gonna get this game by this other developer and its gonna rock". See, that helps nobody.

 

You have to be calm, cool, collected, composed, controlled, and clear(sometimes concise) when giving constructive criticism on products.

 

Otherwise you're just spewing hatred, nonsense, vitriol, or you're not actually making a point so no real criticism is given. If the creators don't have proper criticism to take into account, they can't change what people don't like.

 

On that subject, some people think constructive criticism can be conveyed in the vaguest of explanations. "Don't be like Skyrim" says nothing. You have to elaborate on exactly what it is you approve/do not approve of.

 

For example, after completing Jaws of Hakkon, my biggest takeaway was that it was more of the same from Inquisition, which I didn't mind. I do hope with the next add-on they experiment more, hopefully trying new things that would freshen up the experience. What those experiments are, I'm not to say. Not my place, thats on their creativities. But that gives them far more feedback then a simple, "this could've been better".

 

Basically, I think a lot of the problems that stem from developers and consumers here exist due to a lack of proper and appropriate communication. I don't believe everyone involved knows the proper ways to discuss things, and that goes for both sides at times. I've been around here a long time, and I've been annoyed and sometimes insulted by the comments from both other players and developers themselves;people are people no matter what side they're on, so we're all carrying the potential to not do something to the best of our ability.

 

Best we work on trying though.

[Icy Magebane]

But they clearly haven't done their best. Its more of the same gameplay that players dislike the most about the game with an inconsequential story. And for people in regions other than the US its hideously overpriced, yes this is EA's fault not Bioware's but it reflects on Bioware. 

Not just the US.... if what I heard was true, this DLC is $5 in Mexico.

 

Oh yeah, the topic... I think it's fine to criticize the game, so long as it doesn't include personal attacks on the devs.  I don't know if it's a good use of time, since these criticisms don't seem to matter to Bioware at all, but I don't see the harm in it as long as doesn't get out of hand.

[LPPrince]

Oh God, thats another thing- the reflection/deflection of distaste/hate/responsibility to other parties.

 

Good lord that blows. So a figurehead somewhere makes a decision that trickles down to affect the product the consumer purchases and because of that we're supposed to look down on the one who actually created the product?

 

I'm supposed to be mad at the baker of the cupcake I'm eating because I'm being charged a premium by corporate for the paper cup its in?

 

Thats what happens here so much it hurts to see;to think that a writer, game tester, editor, etc etc are gonna get flak because a suit made a decision way beyond their pay grade is depressing.

[perfect_victime]

I agree with the OP completely. I don't see how you can compare other DLC's by price, esp when everyone knows prices go up. If Citadel was release today it would cost more than 15 USD, maybe as much as 20. It was 2 years ago. Also the ME3 disappointing ending caused a lot of flak to Bioware who probably wanted to push for a great ending DLC for that game and its fans.

I think constructive critic is better than immature criticism.

[AWTEW]

welp, D:OS didn't have fancy EA marketing campaign... i'm pretty sure it did well enough for Larian, otherwise they wouldn't expand (hello, new Canada studio) :3

 

^ This

 

Marketing is a huge cost, and takes a major cut out of any AAA title's budget.

[line_genrou]

Because the devs didn't respect me when they marketed the game as in "made for PC gamers", "so similar to Origins you're going to climax when playing it"

When they lunched the game full of bugs even stuttering on the title screen. No walk toggle and CTD.

And looks down on the same community that made them.

 

Go get your money from consoles players, EAware.

[fizzypop]

You can respect someone and still think the work they did was terrible. I don't have the DLC, but from the looks of it, it is still making the same mistakes that they made in DAI. If you keep making the same mistakes I'm going to keep pointing them out until you learn from them. I respect that they spend time and energy on their product, but I'm not going to lie or downplay how disappointing it is. That does nothing to help them improve.

[LPPrince]

You can respect someone and still think the work they did was terrible. I don't have the DLC, but from the looks of it, it is still making the same mistakes that they made in DAI. If you keep making the same mistakes I'm going to keep pointing them out until you learn from them. I respect that they spend time and energy on their product, but I'm not going to lie or downplay how disappointing it is. That does nothing to help them improve.

 

Aye. I don't feel negatively at all about Jaws of Hakkon, but I definitely had strong feelings about DA2 and ME3. Doesn't mean you can't respect the creators even if you don't like a product or two.

[Dr. Rush]

Because most people are selfish and uninformed consumers who have no regard for how the sausage is made, they just want to keep stuffing their faces and consuming. And when they are told they can't keep consuming, they become indignant and incensed. 

[BioWareMod03]

Let's keep it civil in here please.

[line_genrou]

lol you sound so defensive

throwing around sarcasm doesn't make you smart, just shows you have no argument

[zambingo]

Why don't people respect the devs?

It's human nature to both want more and to believe we can do better just because.

[NaclynE]

Square Enix is now overpassing the western RPG makers now imo. With the changes to the traditional FF gameplay to a more action-orientated combat that western fans are used to I think western RPG makers need to start looking at what Square is up to. FFXV is going to be so big! FFType-0 has fantastic combat and it still has the original FF feel to it as well.

 

Western RPG makers seem to be sitting in complacence because they poo-poo "JRPGs".

 

*face palm* Lol....Oh don't get me started on SQUARE ENIX

 

1: Around the time period of EIHIENDER; SAGA FRONTIER; and BUSHIDO BLADE 1,2 releases SQUARE ENIX were planning to sequalize these games. They even clearly said that "We will be having BUSHIDO BLADE 3 out for PS3's launch" (official quote by Square Enix BTW). Now we have a PS 4 out and BUSHIDO BLADE 3 HASN'T EVEN CAME OUT YET! It's like somewhere between then to now SQUARE ENIX has decided to only release FINAL FANTASY games and that's it for some bloody reason and made us all give up on waiting for sequels for games (even though EINHIENDER has a good reason because the original label was NAMCO so I have no clue how they released the first one in America anyway).

 

2: FF8 was unfinished. The original intent was going to be two games so to speak: Squall and Laguna. They were going to do RESIDENT EVIL 2's "zapping system" where what one character picked up the other won't get or will get if not picked up by the first. For some reason down the line this idea was cancelled and from my research Square Enix was in a rush to fit the dead line.

 

3: Square originally planned exclusivity to the XBOX years ago but somewhere down the line they decided to make FFXIII P I for all systems. To be honest this to me makes then undependable about "making deals".

 

4: From what I heard alot on the web for FF 13 P 2 people hated having to pay for the DLC to get a good ending. Game companies that expect you to pay for good DLC endings need to be shot. Again i can give props to BIOWARE for the DIRECTORS CUT DLC for MASS EFFECT being free because for a while I followed a-lot of videos of people complaining that they wanted more out of the ending (honestly me and a select few were completely fine with the non directors cut ending). When that came out I didn't mind it and it seemed like the ending hatemail went away.

 

5: SQUARE ENIX intends to rush KINGDOM HEARTS 3 so one of the developers can jump into another project. As I mentioned before rush projects are usually not very good in my book. I don't care if they gotta do (I think it was FF XV) just take your time in making a kick butt game and not do KINGDOM HEARTS 3 in less than a year JUST BECAUSE!

[fizzypop]

FF8 was still a more complete game, requires easily double perhaps even more to complete than most rpg games on the market today, and was actually pretty good even if unfinished goes to show you square was on top of their game. They even fixed FF14 after it was basically crap. How many western markets have really redone an entire game because it was crap? **** how many have even admitted that mistake? Square is not perfect and I haven't played any of their games since FF14 debacle (not a console player anymore), but they are way ahead of the game in terms of developers in the west. I just really wish more games would go back to the root of rpgs. I'm tired of boring games with no story, no engagement, and no impact. I'm also really tired with how short rpgs are the last several years. I can watch netflix if I want some short entertainment and the price there is only $8. If I'm paying 60+ for a game it better keep me entertained for a long time.

 

"Game companies that expect you to pay for good DLC endings need to be shot." lol this is funny considering bioware required you to get a dlc to make sense of their crappy ending for ME3. Leviathan dlc is the only way to get that ending to make sense without that it makes no sense. No the free dlc did not make it better. It was just as crappy as before, but with more options! So yeah if that's your complaint welcome to western gaming. Square has been becoming more westernized for years. That's probably my biggest issue with them. The western market for rpgs ****** sucks. I don't know why they want to copy suck.

[Hazegurl]

Oh God, thats another thing- the reflection/deflection of distaste/hate/responsibility to other parties.

 

Good lord that blows. So a figurehead somewhere makes a decision that trickles down to affect the product the consumer purchases and because of that we're supposed to look down on the one who actually created the product?

 

I'm supposed to be mad at the baker of the cupcake I'm eating because I'm being charged a premium by corporate for the paper cup its in?

 

Thats what happens here so much it hurts to see;to think that a writer, game tester, editor, etc etc are gonna get flak because a suit made a decision way beyond their pay grade is depressing.

I used to work the phones for a company years ago, if I had a dime for how often I was cursed out on the other end because of a decision made by the ones in charge I would be wealthy as hell and retired on a tropical island I bought.  It used to stress me out big time but eventually I realized that these people are just angry and need to vent to someone in "company uniform".  Cause deep down, they know that the main folks in charge don't give two craps about them or their issues with the product.  But they just have to get it out before ditching.  Also, a lot of my stress occurred because I had to keep the customer returning and thus encouraged to lie to them as well as cosign lies told by my coworkers who were encouraged to do the same.  Once I stopped lying and let the customer leave without feeding them a bunch of BS, I was much happier and so were they.  Thank goodness I don't do those jobs anymore.

 

In a perfect world, no one would blame the baker if their boss makes a decision. But if the only person "representing" the bosses decision is the Baker, then they will just have to deal with it.   Alternatively, if the the baker is lying and talking bs for the purposes of keeping a customer coming back, then they aren't innocent and deserve the wrath of the customer along with the CEO.

[NaclynE]

FF8 was still a more complete game, requires easily double perhaps even more to complete than most rpg games on the market today, and was actually pretty good even if unfinished goes to show you square was on top of their game. They even fixed FF14 after it was basically crap. How many western markets have really redone an entire game because it was crap? **** how many have even admitted that mistake? Square is not perfect and I haven't played any of their games since FF14 debacle (not a console player anymore), but they are way ahead of the game in terms of developers in the west. I just really wish more games would go back to the root of rpgs. I'm tired of boring games with no story, no engagement, and no impact. I'm also really tired with how short rpgs are the last several years. I can watch netflix if I want some short entertainment and the price there is only $8. If I'm paying 60+ for a game it better keep me entertained for a long time.

 

"Game companies that expect you to pay for good DLC endings need to be shot." lol this is funny considering bioware required you to get a dlc to make sense of their crappy ending for ME3. Leviathan dlc is the only way to get that ending to make sense without that it makes no sense. No the free dlc did not make it better. It was just as crappy as before, but with more options! So yeah if that's your complaint welcome to western gaming. Square has been becoming more westernized for years. That's probably my biggest issue with them. The western market for rpgs ****** sucks. I don't know why they want to copy suck.

 

True about FF8. Frankly I didn't mind how FF8 was but the thing is the dev's for FF 8 were planning to do the whole RESIDENT EVIL 2 Leon and Clair thing for the whole game. From what I initially heard they were going to allow you to flip flop between Squall and Laguna at certain parts throughout the whole game. However due to time they made the game 95%% Squall and 5% Laguna. Still no matter FF8 was fine to me but it's a take it or leave it issue on if you feel the game is fine how it is or do you feel they should of made it they way it was intended.

 

Also frankly as I said before I was fine without the non directors cut ending along with a very select few but I swear I came across way to many bloody people hating BIOWARE for doing a ****ty job with MASS EFFECT 3's and wouldn't let it go. Also my bottom line point with my comment was if I remember right people had to pay like $5 or $10 or something for FF XIII P2's better ending while MASS EFFECT 3 was free. to me people shouldn't be paying extra money for cop out endings or beginnings or things that need to be fixed. I don't mind paying for DLC's here and there even though at times I prefer them to be free but if they are to be worth it and cost well. I know there are still debates about even paying for DLC.

 

I do agree that SQUARE ENIX needs to stop being al westerny too. I still miss their 3D WORLD RUNNER, KINGS KNIGHT days. They need to take a chance like how they took a chance with TOBAL #1.

[KBomb]

I used to work the phones for a company years ago, if I had a dime for how often I was cursed out on the other end because of a decision made by the ones in charge I would be wealthy as hell and retired on a tropical island I bought. It used to stress me out big time but eventually I realized that these people are just angry and need to vent to someone in "company uniform". Cause deep down, they know that the main folks in charge don't give two craps about them or their issues with the product. But they just have to get it out before ditching. Also, a lot of my stress occurred because I had to keep the customer returning and thus encouraged to lie to them as well as cosign lies told by my coworkers who were encouraged to do the same. Once I stopped lying and let the customer leave without feeding them a bunch of BS, I was much happier and so were they. Thank goodness I don't do those jobs anymore.

In a perfect world, no one would blame the baker if their boss makes a decision. But if the only person "representing" the bosses decision is the Baker, then they will just have to deal with it. Alternatively, if the the baker is lying and talking bs for the purposes of keeping a customer coming back, then they aren't innocent and deserve the wrath of the customer along with the CEO.

I can echo this. Long ago I worked in Customer Service for Verizon and I was cursed out on a daily bases. Someone even told me that because I wouldn't take off his daughter's $300 data charges, he hoped someone beheaded me and threw me in a ditch somewhere. I had another customer that when I hung up, I said, "Happy Holidays, sir." To which he replied, "I hope you and your whole family burns to death in a fire!"

I can laugh at the craziness now, but at the time it was extremely stressful. I was only 19 and had never been spoken to like that. It does wear you down after a bit. I often wondered if they talked with people like that face to face, or if they lacked decorum because it wasn't in person.

I am pretty sure a lot of people at Bioware get heat when they have nothing to do with it. I have seen threads where people get angry at Bioware because Xbox games release a few days before Sony, as if Bioware makes that call. Still, it would be nice to hear something. I will admit most of my complaints are small in comparison to those who are unable to play the game fully because of bugs. I believe if they were assured that they are being heard and action was being taken, the screaming may reduce some.

[Chiramu]

 

Go get your money from consoles players, EAware.

 

Nintendo found out how well they did from isolating a huge chunk of their fanbase too. I wonder how long Bioware will realise that they are isolating their PC gaming fans? I find it a massive hassle to set up my controller, atm it is sitting on the shelf gathering dust because it takes too long to set it up! 

[BobZilla84]

I absolutely love B-Ware and I am slowly regaining my respect for them but and I agree the Dlc price is a little too high but its ok Dlc not amazing but its ok.
I hope the rest of the SP Dlc will be at least Citadel's Quality because while I love the open world exploration thats not why I buy these games its Story & Character Developement.

[AWTEW]

This place is  respectful and squeaky clean compared to tumblr.

[DanteYoda]

There are many Developers i respect as companies and how they treat and interact with their communities. Sadly Bioware and EA aren't what i'd call easy to associate with or even relate too, respect for them imo is at an all time low, compared to many other game companies..

 

I would say from what i've seen from Bioware and EA Games they seem a very arrogant and egotistical game company.

[Chiramu]

This place is  respectful and squeaky clean compared to tumblr.

 

Do you mean the language or the content? There are a lot of... um, sexually explicit things about Bioware and Dragon Age on tumblr. Plus if you have any criticism on Dragon Age this massive fantards RAGE against you, "AS IF YOU HAVE AN OPINION THAT IS NOT MINE?!"

[AWTEW]

Do you mean the language or the content? There are a lot of... um, sexually explicit things about Bioware and Dragon Age on tumblr. Plus if you have any criticism on Dragon Age this massive fantards RAGE against you, "AS IF YOU HAVE AN OPINION THAT IS NOT MINE?!"

 

I meant both..

 

Yeah, Tumblr has some questionable content, that's for sure. Liarax Vorcha gif anyone? 

[line_genrou]

I meant both..

 

Yeah, Tumblr has some questionable content, that's for sure. Liarax Vorcha gif anyone? 

I don't even want to ask...