78 réponses à ce sujet

[WarlordThor]

sinosleep wrote...

If you take a second to look under the posted score, you'll see that the USER SCORE is a 9.3.

Based on 297 users who frequent ONE SITE. I don't wish to belabor the point anymore so I will simply stop trying to impart what constitutes an acurate sample of opinion. If you put stock in reviewers, yes, you are correct they all praise the game. I personally don't, and 297 people on one site does not make me think it is good. And even if it is a million, it doesn't change people's rights to have personal opinion. To come into a thread discussing opinions acting as if they can't be had because review scores different, its not very productive to the conversation. These flaws arn't facts, they are open to individual assessment. I would hope people would make their own assessments and discuss them rather point to some media outlet's.

As to mikey3k, im not sure if you noticed this, but I did not quote you or reply to you. Thus why I wasn't mentioning only things you said. It's hard for me to take you seriously when you are commenting on my credibility without even paying attention to what is being posted or said.

[Shinobi2u]

WarlordThor wrote...

I don't expect this thread to be taken kindly by Bioware, but I really hope they don't decide to censor it with a lock as I will try to be as polite as possible.

From what I have seen lately, Bioware is headed downhill in many ways. Not mentioning recent issues with dragon age, I have just started my play through ME2, and while I hope the story will be great, I can't say I am pleased.

The first issue I have, as I see many have, is the helmets on the custom armors. I really feel ripped off by this, and think many others might as well. I do not care if the way you acheieved the look was by doing it all as one piece. I would have taken a worse look then so I could see my characters face once in awhile. If I had known about this, I wouldn't have pre-ordered and would have likely waited for the game to drop in price. So, touche on marketing exploitation.

Secondly, the inventory system. It would be nice to be able to use my terminus gun as well. But I guess I am waiting utnil I have a weapons locker or some such to be able to touch it. And apparently if I want to switch between weapons while out and about, I am just plain out of luck. Nice and realistic, but I think we have all already accepted the unrealistic nature of being able ot carry around multiple guns and accepted it.

I am also a bit confused on this Zaeed issue. How do you not have the dlc designed to be out on day one, availible for the xbox 360 on day one?

Overall, my opinion is that Bioware is going downhill and probablly will continue. I feel a lot of this has to do with EA, which I have always had problems with in terms of customer service and satisfaction. I am sure many. I hope Bioware comes off so harshly in these forums in there attempts to silence criticism because they themselves are furstrated by the limitations imposed on them by their parent company. If not, and this is all solely on the hands of Bioware, I regret to see a maker of fine games slowly lose itself. I can only hope leads will split off and form a new company to supply us with both good games, and good service. At least one of these has seemed to be lacking at most times with Bioware recently.

The more 'advanced' games become, the more expensive they are to make, the more complex they are, the more likely things will break. It's the nature of the beast.

Last I checked, the custom armors are all DLC - free DLC, mind you. It's an incentive to preorder the game. Would it be nice if the helmets could be removed on them? Sure, but it's a want, not a need and it doesn't ruin the game. The armor looks cool and has beneficial stats to them and if you don't want to use it, you don't have to. I'm sure you could have waited until a price drop and then spent a couple bucks on the inevitable person selling one.

Regarding the Terminus gun, this is again a want, not a need. Why would they allow you to use a ridiculously powerful gun in the very beginning of the game? It comes down to their design choice to give the player their 'tutorial' section of the game before handing them the big guns...literally.

Next, Zaeed. Plans are made when making a game. Then there is reality that shatters those plans. It's one thing to test the game on a test server and have everything go well. It's another when it goes live and something goes wrong. Things happen and they are working on a quick fix to get it up as soon as possible, so waiting a day or two is not a big deal.

So two wants and an unforeseen issue means a company is going downhill? I understand you have some gripes, almost everyone has one for every game, but you have to look at the bigger picture. Bioware has worked over 2 years on trying to make a good product and it shows in their work. Will it be perfect? Nothing in this world really is, but you can't blame a company on going downhill on a few minor issues or design choices you don't agree with. The other thing you need to remember is game companies are businesses. They have deadlines to meet, things they have to painfully cut from the game, budgets to not go over (if they want to stay in business), and many other hard choices.It's so easy to judge and be a critic from the consumer view, but it is important to bear in mind what they have to do as well. But if you can look at the game and say they didn't work hard on it and put thousands of hours of love, frustration, trying to improve upon people's gripes with the first Mass Effect, and dedication into it, then you must be blind. If it's not your game and you don't like it, or you don't like aspects of the game that's fine, it's your opinion and you are entitled to it. But take a second and imagine you have worked hard on a title for two years to have someone callously just come in and say you and your company are going downhill. How would you feel?

Now, I'm not saying excuse them of everything and agree with how they made their game, but if you want to help, offer constructive criticism. Bioware is listening because they want to make good games and that definitely means they are not going downhill. I think the amount of changes they have tried to make ME2 better than ME1 shows just that and I'm sure ME3 will see even more improvements as they find the right balance to the formula.

I've said this before and I'll say it again to those who so easily bash games, if you don't like the game and think you could do better, make your own game or help game companies make better games. See how you feel once the critics and consumers rip into it. I'm not trying to berate you, I'm just asking you (and all others) to take a step back and look objectively at the big picture at the game and both sides (developer and consumer) just want the best from the game they play/make.

[Crackseed]

You know, when BG2 came out, people typed this stuff too. They also griped about the game after 2 hours in, when Irenicus's dungeon did kind of drag on.

Funny when you look back and realize how nostalgia is - and how we as gamers evolve. We've become spoiled and whiney about things - there's always room to improve but to claim that Bioware is headed downhill when they keep giving us better things is just silly.

You have to consider that much of the changes in ME2 were because WE, the fans, asked for them. Things like helms being toggled are so minor and hopefully, doable down the road. I am thankful for the game, the experience and the devotion given by Bioware to us, who spend our money on their products.

The few quibbles I have don't diminish the game's awesomeness, though I am sure as the launch issues settle down we'll have our chance to point out things we'd like to see corrected. For the record, I would like the DLC helms to be toggleable, I just don't think it's any kind of major issue atm. Would rather see people with install/Cerb Network issues get those handled first.

Modifié par crackseed, 27 janvier 2010 - 04:55 .

[WarlordThor]

Erode_The_Soul wrote...

I appreciate your concerns OP but, quite honestly, if we're basing their "downfall" on your points alone, then I think it's just plain silly.
I agree with you about the custom armors. That was a poorly thought out design choice, but they have insinuated that they may be looking into the issue. Not in any way ironclad, but it's certainly better than a "We designed it that way, f**** you."
I don't really understand your gripe about the guns, as I didn't really have any issue with it, so I'll bypass that. In terms of Zaeed, I would rather receive fully functioning DLC a day or so late than download it on day 1 and have it screw something up.

And, someone else mentioned customer service being terrible. Yes. Yes it is. EVERYWHERE. It doesn't matter who you call -- Microsoft, Sony, Nintendo, Bioware, EA, Activision, Ubisoft, Naughty Dog, Capcom, etc -- their customer service is going to suck. That's pretty much how "customer service" is defined nowadays; a crappy support number used to distract you from the real problem by making you listen to a recorded hold message until you can speak to a human who, in a completely apathetic way, tells you your screwed regardless. This is customer service. Everywhere.

It may be that I simply viewed Bioware in too high of a light before. I never had such problems with customer service or the problems that seem to occur every few weeks. I am scared to think of the problems that will come with any ME2 dlc at this point.

In the past few weeks Bioware ahs been making many moves that in my mind are complete blunders. Perhaps it is a temporary setback, but it should still be recognized. Many are of the philosophy of sitting back and giving companies a break. I'm not. They are getting paid by me and many others for their work. To condone any mistake is inexcusible. Yes they will happen, and each one should be met with criticism to ensure they do not become commonplace. The problem I am seeing right now, is that it appears they are becoming commonplace, and many people are perfectly content with that.

[Sir Ulrich Von Lichenstien]

Terror_K wrote...

Just because Mass Effect 2 is a great game, doesn't mean it's a great RPG. It could probably be considered as the deepest shooter out there. It could also probably be considered to be the shallowest RPG.

In your own shallow opinion yes. Some people do see it for what it is though, that being a great RPG and before you ask, no I haven't got it yet, but I've seen streams of it and know that it is definitly still an RPG.

As for the OP, unrealistic carrying 4-5 weapons that when not used compact into smaller shapes so they can all nicely sit on the back, yet you are moaning about them gaining even more realism by limiting the inventory rather than allowing you to carry around 150 suits of armor if you wanted, yeah sorry I don't recall seeing that huge trolley that my character was constantly carrying around with me in ME1.

The Zaeed situation, aww such a shame, least you'll still be playing that DLC before most of the rest of the world will be. So technically as far as 'International Street Date' is concerned, you are actually getting it ahead of some people still if it is out wednesday or thursday.

Mass Effect 2 to me looks like a great game and I am really looking forward to playing it, shame you aren't enjoying it but it won't affect me one bit.

Edit: @OP Just saw your comment where you are constantly arguing about that site that gave a score... sorry but I really have to ask, are you seriously as dumb as you sound?

You reckon that because 297 people voted for it giving it a good score that your rating of it overrules them?

Hmm, 297-1, sorry but your odds aren't looking very good there are they?

Modifié par Sir Ulrich Von Lichenstien, 27 janvier 2010 - 05:01 .

[sinosleep]

WarlordThor wrote...

sinosleep wrote...

If you take a second to look under the posted score, you'll see that the USER SCORE is a 9.3.

Based on 297 users who frequent ONE SITE. I don't wish to belabor the point anymore so I will simply stop trying to impart what constitutes an acurate sample of opinion. If you put stock in reviewers, yes, you are correct they all praise the game. I personally don't, and 297 people on one site does not make me think it is good. And even if it is a million, it doesn't change people's rights to have personal opinion. To come into a thread discussing opinions acting as if they can't be had because review scores different, its not very productive to the conversation. These flaws arn't facts, they are open to individual assessment. I would hope people would make their own assessments and discuss them rather point to some media outlet's.

As to mikey3k, im not sure if you noticed this, but I did not quote you or reply to you. Thus why I wasn't mentioning only things you said. It's hard for me to take you seriously when you are commenting on my credibility without even paying attention to what is being posted or said.

This line of reasoning is so dull.

The point, and it should be plainly obvious, is that you are clearly in the minority. Not that you can't have your own opinion. No rational person is going to say you can't have an opinion, so assuming I, or anyone else for that matter, implied as much just doesn't make much sense.

As for the whole one site thing, just let it go dude cause you're only digging yourself further into a hole. You didn't realise the site's score was an aggregate score and you should have just left it that. Everything you've said to try to discredit the site itself has just made you look worse.

If it's from one website it's bad. If it's from multiple websites it's bad cause they're all review sites and they're bad cause they're not from fans. And if the fans post on one site, well then they're wrong for all being on that same site.

Look, go to any damned site you please, what you're going to find in regards to mass effect 2 in terms of reviews is overwhelmingly positive. The only places where you're going to see constant griping are forums like these because that's their purpose.

[WarlordThor]

Shinobi2u wrote...

The more 'advanced' games become, the more expensive they are to make, the more complex they are, the more likely things will break. It's the nature of the beast.

Last I checked, the custom armors are all DLC - free DLC, mind you. It's an incentive to preorder the game. Would it be nice if the helmets could be removed on them? Sure, but it's a want, not a need and it doesn't ruin the game. The armor looks cool and has beneficial stats to them and if you don't want to use it, you don't have to. I'm sure you could have waited until a price drop and then spent a couple bucks on the inevitable person selling one.

Regarding the Terminus gun, this is again a want, not a need. Why would they allow you to use a ridiculously powerful gun in the very beginning of the game? It comes down to their design choice to give the player their 'tutorial' section of the game before handing them the big guns...literally.

Next, Zaeed. Plans are made when making a game. Then there is reality that shatters those plans. It's one thing to test the game on a test server and have everything go well. It's another when it goes live and something goes wrong. Things happen and they are working on a quick fix to get it up as soon as possible, so waiting a day or two is not a big deal.

So two wants and an unforeseen issue means a company is going downhill? I understand you have some gripes, almost everyone has one for every game, but you have to look at the bigger picture. Bioware has worked over 2 years on trying to make a good product and it shows in their work. Will it be perfect? Nothing in this world really is, but you can't blame a company on going downhill on a few minor issues or design choices you don't agree with. The other thing you need to remember is game companies are businesses. They have deadlines to meet, things they have to painfully cut from the game, budgets to not go over (if they want to stay in business), and many other hard choices.It's so easy to judge and be a critic from the consumer view, but it is important to bear in mind what they have to do as well. But if you can look at the game and say they didn't work hard on it and put thousands of hours of love, frustration, trying to improve upon people's gripes with the first Mass Effect, and dedication into it, then you must be blind. If it's not your game and you don't like it, or you don't like aspects of the game that's fine, it's your opinion and you are entitled to it. But take a second and imagine you have worked hard on a title for two years to have someone callously just come in and say you and your company are going downhill. How would you feel?

Now, I'm not saying excuse them of everything and agree with how they made their game, but if you want to help, offer constructive criticism. Bioware is listening because they want to make good games and that definitely means they are not going downhill. I think the amount of changes they have tried to make ME2 better than ME1 shows just that and I'm sure ME3 will see even more improvements as they find the right balance to the formula.

I've said this before and I'll say it again to those who so easily bash games, if you don't like the game and think you could do better, make your own game or help game companies make better games. See how you feel once the critics and consumers rip into it. I'm not trying to berate you, I'm just asking you (and all others) to take a step back and look objectively at the big picture at the game and both sides (developer and consumer) just want the best from the game they play/make.

Are my opinions not constructive criticsm? They are discussing the problem with the game, and how they could be better. Rrmovable helmets, dlc out on the right time, better inventory system. Boom done.

I appreciate the long response, but I feel it was awfully apologetic in nature and counter-productive to constructive criticism.

Also I do not, nor will I ever subscribe to the "if you think you can do it better go do it" method. I do not accept that from a doctor if he diagnoses an illness wrong. I do not accept that from a car wash if my car comes out dirtier than it went in. I do not accept it from a restaurant if my food is cold. When you pay for a service, you expect that service. If I had the time, resources, and desire to make my own games I would. Instead I am paying other for it, and expect it to be well worth the money.

Again, perhaps I am the only one. But these problems seem to be compounding in rapid succession. Maybe its because it just launched and things are stressed. I still don't think its much of an excuse and would like to see better. I will also admit I am heavily bias based on the community structure here, where I see a lot of hostility and such towards warranted criticism. Sadly there are a lot of those who get on here screaming profantities and demanding their money back or whatever, but that does not make others criticisms less credible.

[AGogley]

The "free dlc" is not free. We preordered the game, which I would NEVER, EVER do normally. I purchased Dragon Age just for the armor for ME2. Then I purchased the collector's edition just for the extra armor. So none of it was free.



It's a valid complaint that you cannot toggle the helmets off and should not be trivialized.

[Rymdyoghurt]

Damn, this forum need a whole new category labeled "Mass Effect 2 Complaints".

Sure, a lot of said stuff is valid, but it doesn't need more then one thread.

[WarlordThor]

sinosleep wrote...

This line of reasoning is so dull.

The point, and it should be plainly obvious, is that you are clearly in the minority. Not that you can't have your own opinion. No rational person is going to say you can't have an opinion, so assuming I, or anyone else for that matter, implied as much just doesn't make much sense.

As for the whole one site thing, just let it go dude cause you're only digging yourself further into a hole. You didn't realise the site's score was an aggregate score and you should have just left it that. Everything you've said to try to discredit the site itself has just made you look worse.

If it's from one website it's bad. If it's from multiple websites it's bad cause they're all review sites and they're bad cause they're not from fans. And if the fans post on one site, well then they're wrong for all being on that same site.

Look, go to any damned site you please, what you're going to find in regards to mass effect 2 in terms of reviews is overwhelmingly positive. The only places where you're going to see constant griping are forums like these because that's their purpose.

I suggest you do some research on polling and opinion gathering. I believe it is covered in sociology type classes or political science ones. It is like when a certain media news outlet does a poll on an issue. The overwhelming majority of people will agree with whatever the news outlets stance is on the issue. Why? Because the majority of the people voting in the poll watch that news outlet because they agree with them most of the time. You look at another outlet with the oppossite bias, and you find oppossite results.

As such, you have 297 people out of how many people who have bought this game? The only ones getting on to review the game on any site, let alone this site, are the ones who care enough to do so. To care enough to do so usually means you love the game unconditionally, or hate it completely. ME2 definitely does not deserve to be hated completely. So again, I find it no surprise the people getting on to review on their favorite review site would be in the positives.

You can go ahead and call that all an excuse, but it is valid and academic, rather than personal opinion. And even bearing all that, I agree I may still be in the minority on the issue. Thus your point was to come into the thread and add that I am in the minority? Doesn't add much to the discussion, but thank you and point noted.

[Sir Ulrich Von Lichenstien]

WarlordThor wrote...

I suggest you do some research on polling and opinion gathering. I believe it is covered in sociology type classes or political science ones. It is like when a certain media news outlet does a poll on an issue. The overwhelming majority of people will agree with whatever the news outlets stance is on the issue. Why? Because the majority of the people voting in the poll watch that news outlet because they agree with them most of the time. You look at another outlet with the oppossite bias, and you find oppossite results.

As such, you have 297 people out of how many people who have bought this game? The only ones getting on to review the game on any site, let alone this site, are the ones who care enough to do so. To care enough to do so usually means you love the game unconditionally, or hate it completely. ME2 definitely does not deserve to be hated completely. So again, I find it no surprise the people getting on to review on their favorite review site would be in the positives.

You can go ahead and call that all an excuse, but it is valid and academic, rather than personal opinion. And even bearing all that, I agree I may still be in the minority on the issue. Thus your point was to come into the thread and add that I am in the minority? Doesn't add much to the discussion, but thank you and point noted.

Sorry I didn't realise we had over 300 people posting on this site saying that the game sucks? Oh wait I know why, we DON'T.

So if anyone needs to do some research it is you

[Shinobi2u]

WarlordThor wrote...

In the past few weeks Bioware ahs been making many moves that in my mind are complete blunders. Perhaps it is a temporary setback, but it should still be recognized. Many are of the philosophy of sitting back and giving companies a break. I'm not. They are getting paid by me and many others for their work. To condone any mistake is inexcusible. Yes they will happen, and each one should be met with criticism to ensure they do not become commonplace. The problem I am seeing right now, is that it appears they are becoming commonplace, and many people are perfectly content with that.

People aren't content with it (as the numerous thread regrading this kind of stuff shows) and it has certainly been noticed. It is true it is more of a commonplace occurance that something goes wrong. Like I said earlier, the more complex and intricate a process, they more room for mistakes. It is good to voice concerns, but you have to think about how you are approaching this. Again, it comes down to constructive criticism versus complaining, bashing, or completely negative criticism. One is more likely to be heard and seriously looked at than the other. It's not an easy thing to do, especially when you feel strongly or personally about something, but it'll help them correct the issues while not making them as stressed. Honestly, the best thing people can do is create a list of things/processes that they don't like/have had problems with and give facts or constructive opinions as to why you feel that way and maybe what would help or be better. Help them make a better game and they will help you have a better gaming experience.

[WarlordThor]

Sir Ulrich Von Lichenstien wrote...

WarlordThor wrote...

I suggest you do some research on polling and opinion gathering. I believe it is covered in sociology type classes or political science ones. It is like when a certain media news outlet does a poll on an issue. The overwhelming majority of people will agree with whatever the news outlets stance is on the issue. Why? Because the majority of the people voting in the poll watch that news outlet because they agree with them most of the time. You look at another outlet with the oppossite bias, and you find oppossite results.

As such, you have 297 people out of how many people who have bought this game? The only ones getting on to review the game on any site, let alone this site, are the ones who care enough to do so. To care enough to do so usually means you love the game unconditionally, or hate it completely. ME2 definitely does not deserve to be hated completely. So again, I find it no surprise the people getting on to review on their favorite review site would be in the positives.

You can go ahead and call that all an excuse, but it is valid and academic, rather than personal opinion. And even bearing all that, I agree I may still be in the minority on the issue. Thus your point was to come into the thread and add that I am in the minority? Doesn't add much to the discussion, but thank you and point noted.

Sorry I didn't realise we had over 300 people posting on this site saying that the game sucks? Oh wait I know why, we DON'T.

So if anyone needs to do some research it is you

I was not referring to this site. If you had been following the conversation, we were discussing the reviews on metacritic.

Or are you positing that in order for any criticism to be valid, there must be more people on the social bioware site complaining than there are in favor of the game on metcritic? If that was your point, while I think it is silly and disagree with it, at least you comment doesn't show you were criticisizing someone for not doing research, when you clearly did none of your own.

[WarlordThor]

Shinobi2u wrote...

WarlordThor wrote...

In the past few weeks Bioware ahs been making many moves that in my mind are complete blunders. Perhaps it is a temporary setback, but it should still be recognized. Many are of the philosophy of sitting back and giving companies a break. I'm not. They are getting paid by me and many others for their work. To condone any mistake is inexcusible. Yes they will happen, and each one should be met with criticism to ensure they do not become commonplace. The problem I am seeing right now, is that it appears they are becoming commonplace, and many people are perfectly content with that.

People aren't content with it (as the numerous thread regrading this kind of stuff shows) and it has certainly been noticed. It is true it is more of a commonplace occurance that something goes wrong. Like I said earlier, the more complex and intricate a process, they more room for mistakes. It is good to voice concerns, but you have to think about how you are approaching this. Again, it comes down to constructive criticism versus complaining, bashing, or completely negative criticism. One is more likely to be heard and seriously looked at than the other. It's not an easy thing to do, especially when you feel strongly or personally about something, but it'll help them correct the issues while not making them as stressed. Honestly, the best thing people can do is create a list of things/processes that they don't like/have had problems with and give facts or constructive opinions as to why you feel that way and maybe what would help or be better. Help them make a better game and they will help you have a better gaming experience.

I believe your point is valid, and I truly hope it does not come off that I am bashing the game simply because I refuse to talk to Bioware like a baby and compliment them for every criticism I give. I still have high hopes for the game, as indicated. One of my criticisms was actaully a question. Regarding the dlc, I really don't see how it could be delayed when it was suppossed to coincide with the game release. It hsould have been done well in advance. If something downright horrible was found in coding or what not, perfectly acceptable, but I really have no clue for the reasons as of now.

[sinosleep]

WarlordThor wrote...

I suggest you do some research on polling and opinion gathering. I believe it is covered in sociology type classes or political science ones. It is like when a certain media news outlet does a poll on an issue. The overwhelming majority of people will agree with whatever the news outlets stance is on the issue. Why? Because the majority of the people voting in the poll watch that news outlet because they agree with them most of the time. You look at another outlet with the oppossite bias, and you find oppossite results.

As such, you have 297 people out of how many people who have bought this game? The only ones getting on to review the game on any site, let alone this site, are the ones who care enough to do so. To care enough to do so usually means you love the game unconditionally, or hate it completely. ME2 definitely does not deserve to be hated completely. So again, I find it no surprise the people getting on to review on their favorite review site would be in the positives.

You can go ahead and call that all an excuse, but it is valid and academic, rather than personal opinion. And even bearing all that, I agree I may still be in the minority on the issue. Thus your point was to come into the thread and add that I am in the minority? Doesn't add much to the discussion, but thank you and point noted.

I know how polling works in regards to where the question comes from. It's the reason why you can flip to FOX and see a poll question answered by their viewers have the opposite answer of the same question asked of the viewers of MSNBC. The issue with that though is that sites like metacritic and rottentomatoes have no reviews of their own and as such aren't going to be a vicitim of bias. They post what reviews are available, and give you a percentage based on that. Their own opinions don't mean anything and as such the numbers represented on their sites tend to hold a lot more water.

Unless of course you hold to the reasoning that all of the reviewers whose reviews they've gathered are corrupt by nature of being reviewers.

Modifié par sinosleep, 27 janvier 2010 - 05:21 .

[BaronIveagh]

I might point out that Metacritic is owned by CBS, who are making a tidy amount of money running EA's ads for this game. (And the user score continues to drop, but that's beside the point)

[spernus]

Unfortunately,this is what happen with highly rated game. 

You will find more and more Bioware drones on this forum,so be prepared for a massive backlash if you dare speak against it (the same is true when someone or something is highly praised anyway.It's easy to bash a director like McG or Uwe Boll,but try to attack Aldomôvar or Pixar and be ready to be ripped to shred).

[RazielSlipknot]

Are people seriously complaining that the special armors don't have an option to toggle off helmets????



Seriously???





"WAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHH"



Some people need to grow up and stop complaining about trivial things. I can't believe how some gamers this generation feel they are entitled to stupid requests......YES, they ARE stupid requests.

[sinosleep]

BaronIveagh wrote...

I might point out that Metacritic is owned by CBS, who are making a tidy amount of money running EA's ads for this game. (And the user score continues to drop, but that's beside the point)

Metacritic doesn't write any reviews themselves so what's the point? It's not as if they haven't previously posted bad scores for heavily marketed games before.

[AGogley]

Well Christina Norman put the armor question to rest. The armor was specifically designed that way. Christina said she had the same issue before ship, but the lead artist explained why it needed to be that way. Personally, I think this was a major error in calculation on their part and I would love to have a discussion with the lead artist sometime as to why they felt the need to design it this way.

[WarlordThor]

sinosleep wrote...

I know how polling works in regards to where the question comes from. It's the reason why you can flip to FOX and see a poll question answered by their viewers have the opposite answer of the same question asked of the viewers of MSNBC. The issue with that though is that sites like metacritic and rottentomatoes have no reviews of their own and as such aren't going to be a vicitim of bias. They post what reviews are available, and give you a percentage based on that. Their own opinions don't mean anything and as such the numbers represented on their sites tend to hold a lot more water.

Unless of course you hold to the reasoning that all of the reviewers whose reviews they've gathered are corrupt by nature of ebing reviewers.

I may not have been clear enough to indicate, in regards to polling, I was discussing the user score you pointed out. As for the reviewers, call me crazy, but I do think some are biased. There has actually been some stories ive read in the gaming industries about the rise in higher review scores lately in comparison to years past. I think some probablly have vested interests in promoting some games, while others simply fear backlash from their communities anytime they criticize a game.

I usualyl frequent gamespot personally. And I have seen many indie type games with huge user socres, and low reviews. The reviews were probablly quite accurate, but the cult followers, being the only ones who cared to get on and make comments, were furious for such a low review being given. Things do happen of this nature.

Again though, I can't stress it enough, I am not tyring to suggest ME2 is a horrible game. I am however suggesting that of late, Bioware seems to be succumbing to a lot of problems or silly decisions. I think ME2 deserves a good score, from what I have seen of it so far, but I was expecting more improvement over ME1. I loved ME1, dont get me wrong. I just thought some of the mistakes would be learned from in better ways.

Thus I see again that my entire perspective may simply be that I viewed the ME franchise, and Bioware, in too great of a light and did not realize their past problems. If anyone would like to refute the "downfall" aspect, I believe this is the only way to do it. To show this is nothing new for Bioware and I have been under a rock. If it is something new, then one must admit that it is at least a temporary setback.

[BaronIveagh]

Sino, you can always select what reviews you want to add to the aggregate to skew the numbers. And I'll admit that the game received a lot of positive reviews. It's a common thing with movies. Critics will rave about a film, and then we all go see it, and think how we've been had.

[sinosleep]

spernus wrote...

Unfortunately,this is what happen with highly rated game. 

You will find more and more Bioware drones on this forum,so be prepared for a massive backlash if you dare speak against it (the same is true when someone or something is highly praised anyway.It's easy to bash a director like McG or Uwe Boll,but try to attack Aldomôvar or Pixar and be ready to be ripped to shred).

I actually find the opposite to be true on forums. Go to a rap forum and everyone hates Jay Z while going on and on
about some clown who has been stuck underground for the last 10 years.

Go to a comic book forum and the comic that will certainly have the most negative threads attached to it is New Avengers. Even though it's been the top selling comic for 5+ years now going at a rate of 100k a month in an industry where selling 50k a month is considered very good and gets consistently good reviews from reviewers.

Essentially popular trends in forums often run contrary to what's actually supported by real world evidence.

Modifié par sinosleep, 27 janvier 2010 - 05:30 .

[Shinobi2u]

WarlordThor wrote...

Are my opinions not constructive criticsm? They are discussing the problem with the game, and how they could be better. Rrmovable helmets, dlc out on the right time, better inventory system. Boom done.

I appreciate the long response, but I feel it was awfully apologetic in nature and counter-productive to constructive criticism.

Also I do not, nor will I ever subscribe to the "if you think you can do it better go do it" method. I do not accept that from a doctor if he diagnoses an illness wrong. I do not accept that from a car wash if my car comes out dirtier than it went in. I do not accept it from a restaurant if my food is cold. When you pay for a service, you expect that service. If I had the time, resources, and desire to make my own games I would. Instead I am paying other for it, and expect it to be well worth the money.

Again, perhaps I am the only one. But these problems seem to be compounding in rapid succession. Maybe its because it just launched and things are stressed. I still don't think its much of an excuse and would like to see better. I will also admit I am heavily bias based on the community structure here, where I see a lot of hostility and such towards warranted criticism. Sadly there are a lot of those who get on here screaming profantities and demanding their money back or whatever, but that does not make others criticisms less credible.

I think you mean good intentions by all means, I just didn't feel the execution what as productive as it could have been in your initial post (though not anywhere close to some of the idiotic ****ing I've seen, which is why I actually responded to yours). I agree with you on those examples you made as well, however, I want to stress we are talking about small aspects of the game, not the entire game itself being a disaster. I also agree Bioware has had a number of mistakes lately in a short amount of time and it could be they have too much on their plate (which then comes down to them needing some better planning/structuring). Maybe they just haven't encounter such a senario like this in their company's history, so it certainly does need to be pointed out. I imagine they will try to learn what they can from it. Don't excuse them, but help them how you can as I imagine they are always striving to be a better company.

Oh, one thing to note that I think has certainly contributed to the rise of issues lately has been the introduction of so many online components into gaming (patches, DLC, etc).

[WarlordThor]

AGogley wrote...

Well Christina Norman put the armor question to rest. The armor was specifically designed that way. Christina said she had the same issue before ship, but the lead artist explained why it needed to be that way. Personally, I think this was a major error in calculation on their part and I would love to have a discussion with the lead artist sometime as to why they felt the need to design it this way.

Yes I saw some discussions onn how they felt it was necessary and was the onyl way they could acheive the awesome look they felt they acheived. Honestly, the Blood Dragon armor is pretty cool. The Terminus armor, well it really isn't the greatest. I would gladly take a drop in quality of the headpiece if it could be removable. Because after all, I probablly would never have it on. At least I get to watch the little light go on and off as my character talks. I'm glad to see someone else is boggled by this.