396 réponses à ce sujet

[Phoe77]

When you explore in DA:I you get nice scenery but little else. There are many people who find that enough, and many who enjoy collecting everything they can, fighting more of the same enemies, reading short notes and the like to be fun. I'm not one of them. I don't consider preferences to be a "problem."

 

The fact is, then, that the scenery is not all you get out of exploration.  It's simply the only thing about exploration that's enjoyable for you (I gather).  That's perfectly fine and valid of course, but I would tend to agree that it's not a problem with the quality of the game as much as it's an example of the game being a poor match for what you're looking for.  Assigning fault in that case seems rather pointless because neither party really did anything wrong.

 

I don't mean for this to seem like I'm calling you out in any way.  I just think that the distinction is important.

[Wulfram]

Yeah, I am sure driving generic planets in Mako collecting crap or scanning planets for eezo would completely ruin the Mass Effect experience...

 

Well, it certainly didn't help it.

[Shadowson]

I had to look this up, but the storm coast has the bandits there that take your guys and kill them. You can make some necklace to get one as an agent. Pretty boring. Why not make that one of the main quest lines for the area? Why not make it more interesting? Where you can hunt them all down to kill the entire gang or you could try to convince them to give them back your guys (instead not killing them)? If you decide to gain their loyalty and trust instead of killing them right off the bat you will be rewarded by getting said agent. That is more satisfying than what we got which was kill them or make some necklace to get one as an agent. Or the ruins in the area. There is a lot of story that could have been told there and yet nothing. That would have been a great main story for that zone. What they should have done is have each zone have 1-2 main stories with some fetch/gather/filler quests sprinkled in. Major settlements should tie into the main story or offer their own quest line.

 

All of the blades become your agents, not just one of them. By defeating their leader in battle you effectively become their new leader.

[Hazegurl]

I don't think that bringing up DAO's fade quest works in favor of DAI.  That is one part of the main storyline and unavoidable.  It certainly doesn't make up a large portion of DAO's content. Yet what are people doing for DAI? Creating cheats to bypass nearly all the side content, exploiting to reduce grinding, and modding the timers off the wartable.

 

I admit that I use the fade skip mod, that part is a nightmarish bore, if it was skippable I'm sure many people would gladly take the option after experiencing it once.  But I don't know of anyone who is trying to skip over half the game.

[r.anger]

DAI wasn't a BAD game.....it just wasn't a GREAT game. So, maybe we have seen the best BW has to offer.....maybe there won't be another ME2 or DAO.....greatness doesn't happen every time out of the gate - maybe we were just lucky to be there and see those rare moments. That said, BW still produces some of the best rpg's out there....their mediocre is still better than MOST everything out there.

I equate BW with Peyton Manning or Tom Brady.....they don't win every game.....but who are you going to put your money on?

Hopefully, before I get too old to hit the keyboard, there will be another BW grand slam....if they keep trying, I'll keep buying

[YouKnowMyName]

I'm probably going to be insulted for saying this, but:

 

Whether a game is great or not depends on your own opinion of that game.

 

Just because some considered DA:O and ME2 great games, doesn't mean everyone thinks that way, just as not everyone dislikes DA2 and ME3.

 

I've seen people here that loves DA2 and/or ME3, and i've also seen people say that ME2 and/or DA:O wasn't as great as everyone claimed. The people who say this are not wrong, they just have a different opinion.

 

My own opinion of DAI is that it's a decent game, with both good and bad parts.

[r.anger]

I wouldn't insult u for your thought but do disagree....there is an existing intangible thing recognized as "greatness" even though there will always be those who would deny or disagree with it.

DAO and ME2 are considered two of the best RPGs made......

DA2 is not...although I liked it well enough

[AWTEW]

Meh, I expected this would happen. I suggest u try pillars of eternity, OP. The degradation of their brand has started.. It will only get worse from here.

[AresKeith]

[AWTEW]

Go home ur drunk Keith.

[Nefla]

The fact is, then, that the scenery is not all you get out of exploration.  It's simply the only thing about exploration that's enjoyable for you (I gather).  That's perfectly fine and valid of course, but I would tend to agree that it's not a problem with the quality of the game as much as it's an example of the game being a poor match for what you're looking for.  Assigning fault in that case seems rather pointless because neither party really did anything wrong.

 

I don't mean for this to seem like I'm calling you out in any way.  I just think that the distinction is important.

What else is there to find when exploring in DA:I? More elfroot and rocks? Shards? Notes on the ground telling me to go take a letter to a tree or go collect bear claws? The very rare dungeon with a generic rift demon as the "boss"? DA:I exploration certainly never gave me powerful and unique gear, let me meet interesting and memorable characters, taught me special abilities, revealed fun and intriguing storylines, or gave me opportunities to roleplay. Those are the things I look for and were included in every other BioWare game I've ever played. DA:I randomly did away with all that stuff and gave large maps that I find empty, lifeless, and boring. I don't enjoy looking at the scenery for the sake of looking at the scenery. The beauty of the maps is often brought up by people who like the exploration and say they are happy looking at all the views and that the shard collecting and druffalo herding give them an excuse to travel around the maps looking at the view. If I want a spectacular view I can look out my window.

 

Do I really have to qualify every single sentence of every single post I make with "this is my personal and subjective opinion?"

[fizzypop]

I don't think that bringing up DAO's fade quest works in favor of DAI.  That is one part of the main storyline and unavoidable.  It certainly doesn't make up a large portion of DAO's content. Yet what are people doing for DAI? Creating cheats to bypass nearly all the side content, exploiting to reduce grinding, and modding the timers off the wartable.

 

I admit that I use the fade skip mod, that part is a nightmarish bore, if it was skippable I'm sure many people would gladly take the option after experiencing it once.  But I don't know of anyone who is trying to skip over half the game.

This is pretty much on point. Regardless when you are trying to skip the majority of the game something isn't right.

[SilentK]

I don't think that bringing up DAO's fade quest works in favor of DAI.  That is one part of the main storyline and unavoidable.  It certainly doesn't make up a large portion of DAO's content. Yet what are people doing for DAI? Creating cheats to bypass nearly all the side content, exploiting to reduce grinding, and modding the timers off the wartable.

 

I admit that I use the fade skip mod, that part is a nightmarish bore, if it was skippable I'm sure many people would gladly take the option after experiencing it once.  But I don't know of anyone who is trying to skip over half the game.

 

 

This is pretty much on point. Regardless when you are trying to skip the majority of the game something isn't right.

 

Hmm... Or for me it is a great thing. One of the things that I count as a real advantage. I like being able to concentrate on a few maps with each Quizzy. So I seak to not engage with large parts of the game each PT because I like exploring something different each time.

 

I have gotten a decent amount of shards on my first one, wanted to see how it was to unlock a few things in the temple. However, the Quizzy that will romance Solas at a later PT she will get them all. I haven't thouched a single cave other than those I had to go into for main quests, because the dwarf that I will play after the current Adaar will be crazy about caves and go into every single one.

 

I really like this way of presenting material, because it suits my way of multiple PT:s with new things to see all the time. There has been a few others who seem to have the same way of gaming in this thread. So presto, at least you know someone who this game suits.

 

Different people like different things, I prefer ME3 to ME2 and feel that DAI really works very well for me. As long as it keeps on delivering good story and a good amount of companion content I will be happy.

[LPPrince]

I don't see how Inquisition isn't story and character driven. You can have both with larger explorable game levels. Besides, Inquisition isn't open world.

[AlanC9]

Meh, I expected this would happen. I suggest u try pillars of eternity, OP. The degradation of their brand has started.. It will only get worse from here.

Is anyone else getting really, really bored with hearing about Pillars of Eternity?

[Nefla]

Is anyone else getting really, really bored with hearing about Pillars of Eternity?

I dunno. The way people are describing it, it sounds really good but I've never been able to get into a game with an isometric camera and the thought of playing an entire game endlessly clicking the screen to move anywhere...ugh I couldn't do it.

[ashwind]

I dunno. The way people are describing it, it sounds really good but I've never been able to get into a game with an isometric camera and the thought of playing an entire game endlessly clicking the screen to move anywhere...ugh I couldn't do it.

 

Same here lol. If Pillars of Eternity is released for iPad... I would probably play it. isometric clicking games sounds perfect for ma iPad.

[KaiserShep]

I dunno. The way people are describing it, it sounds really good but I've never been able to get into a game with an isometric camera and the thought of playing an entire game endlessly clicking the screen to move anywhere...ugh I couldn't do it.

 

Yeah, I'm genuinely curious about the game, even more so because I can play it on my laptop just fine, but the isometric thing is a big hurdle to get over. It's just not a format I'm particularly fond of.

 

Same here lol. If Pillars of Eternity is released for iPad... I would probably play it. isometric clicking games sounds perfect for ma iPad.

 

Heh, that's exactly what I was thinking. If I could get it on my tablet then I'd be much more interested.

[Innsmouth Dweller]

i think there is a certain correlation between people who didn't like hair options in DA:I and people who cannot play games with isometric camera.

 

welp... i enjoy the idea of games becoming more sophisticated software in terms of AI, mechanics and complexity instead of... graphics. to each his/her own, i suppose.

[cotheer]

i think there is a certain correlation between people who didn't like hair options in DA:I and people who cannot play games with isometric camera.

welp... i enjoy the idea of games becoming more sophisticated software in terms of AI, mechanics and complexity instead of... graphics. to each his/her own, i suppose.

Apply cold....

[TheRatPack55]

i think there is a certain correlation between people who didn't like hair options in DA:I and people who cannot play games with isometric camera.

 

welp... i enjoy the idea of games becoming more sophisticated software in terms of AI, mechanics and complexity instead of... graphics. to each his/her own, i suppose.

 

Hmm, I think the hair options in DAI are awful. I'm also currently having fun occasionally playing Syndicate - the 1993 version.

 

Despite being bored to tears of DAI atm I can't say Pillars of Eternity sparked my interest, but I'm also enjoying the sophisticated graphics of Minecraft, so I'm entertained enough, gaming-wise.

[Miggs]

I just kill stuff

[Andraste_Reborn]

I'm really enjoying Pillars of Eternity so far! Only played a couple of hours, though. My nature Godlike dwarf druid is so cute.

[Novos]

I have a lovely daughter who is about to be 7 years old this saturday.

 

Watching her grow was and still is a blast as the nature of my work allowed me to be much more involved with everything about her than an ordinary father. I consider myself pretty much lucky and feel grateful on that regard. Anyways; one thing we have noticed about her was; me and her mother were buying all kinds of state of the art, expensive toys you can think of but yet most of the time she seemed to be enjoying herself as much with the simplest and stupiest things you can imagine like a piece of paper. We came up to the conclusion that it was all about freedom and imagination and acted accordingly to cater those aspects later on... 

 

I think; this also applies pretty much to video games as well. Any good game needs to leave some space for imagination and freedom for the gamer to maneuver with.

 

A good example would be the my first year in vanilla WOW just after its launch :

 

I had a guild which was formed by people all around the world with absolutely no relation to each other. Our guild leader was probably an exceptional role player and probably a good writer as well.  The guild had some actual lore, backround, character, purpose, conflicts to it as well as its members... This was introduced to us in such a seamless way with tales, events and such that it only felt natural to everyone. We were doing all kinds of crazy things like sending scouts to gather intel, behavioral patterns for raids on rival capitals creating distractions, sending regular patrols to secure low level questing against rival faction on every zone, maintaining control in key locations, even doing cross continent long missions and custom tasks while questing, pvping, camping etc. It was like a whole new experience; a game in a game... It is not actually describable. We couldn' t care less about actual end game; the loot, the raids, the grind etc...

 

Now; i also played that game longer on a hardcore level with most of my rl friends as well. But to be honest it felt like a second job, a chore most of the time. It was not even comparable to the experience i got with people i have absolutely no relation to. This is the difference derived from the space of freedom and imagination i am talking about.

 

For story driven rpgs; i believe it comes from freedom of choice and its consequences. From a technical point or a checklist; all three games of DA franchise may not be that different from each other with choices and consequences. But DA:O was on such a balanced state with little touches and nuances here there, it managed to successfully create the experience and illusion of choice which the other two have failed...

 

There are certain aspects in life effecting oneself both phsyically and mentally. It may be an object or a person you are in a relation with. Frankly; anything you can imagine... Even if you don' t seem to use or have access to them or seem to not value or appreciate them; you just feel safe, in comfort or full with their presence. Usually and unfortunately lack of their presence is when you realize and come to your senses...

 

As everything in life gaming has elements smilar to this as well. Telemetry data is useless and can't provide you with that info. I believe this is where Bioware have failed with the last two games. Litlle touches and nuances here and there...In features which does not seem to be cost effective and widely used or considered niche or hardcore...

 

 

[TheChris92]

Yeah im kinda afraid the same can happen to next Mass Effect.

 

But still mass effect is not just RPG, its an action too and cinematic scenes were an important feature there, while dragon age series were always meant to be more of the world itself than just characters and story, so i still have hope that exploration and fetch quests wont make the major part of the game.

That seems kinda redundant since it was that very same aspect people cried out for with the Mass sequels -- Taking away the ability to explore uncharted worlds and the galaxy itself, left the Mass Effect series as just a corridor shooter with the occasional ability to go back to the Normandy to play with your train set. The MAKO and the sense of bigness that should usually follow with a self-proclaimed sci-fi opera such as that was replaced with nothing by the time of ME3 -- Oh, and there were certainly a lot of fetch quests in ME3, if that tells you anything.

 

The way I see it is this -- ME1 & KOTOR were good because they had that sense of bigness when travelling from planet to planet. The worlds themselves weren't too big neither too small, thus every minor odd job like retrieving a runaway droid for some crazy woman, investigating corporate corruption on Noveria, or solving a murder mystery on Dantooine felt less like busy work and more engaging since there were space for more dialogue. Essentially, I can get behind that. I don't dislike Inquisition, however, unlike most recent games that have taken a turn at the whole open world aspect, simply because it can and not necessarily because it's the right direction. Example, I don't think Metal Gear's approach to an open world is what that franchise needs, nor would I think the same for other stealth games that tries to do too much and thus ultimately ending up with nothing but empty space. I kinda liked what Inquisition did a lot. It granted me the option of vast customization that I wanted, and the ability to explore vast terrain and examine the environment here and there to find small stories, tied to the area, ultimately having the story be integrated into the environment itself -- Not necessarily in the same fashion as say... a game like Silent Hill, where atmosphere is key.

 

It wasn't perfect though -- Ultimately a lot of the quests did indeed feel like busy work, which made the game suffer for it altogether and that's a shame. I don't think they should scrap the idea of exploration like you do though, as I feel that's an aspect that made previous BioWare games so good and not just the characters. If it were the characters alone then I'd play the Longest Journey games instead, which are rich in good writing, characters and great lore, while sorely lack in gameplay. That's not what I want from BioWare though. In retrospect, it's always hard to decipher what fans want. If you ask for a game that caters to fans then you get garbage like Silent Hill Origins (for instance) which is no good. The best games are always the ones we never ask for at all.

If I were to ask for anything in future BioWare games then I'd say -- Keep the exploration, keep the vast customization, although keep things to a minimum in terms of scale if that helps building more engaging sub-quests to add layers to the worlds you visit.