398 réponses à ce sujet

[Saphiron123]

I didn't like DAI but I agree with this. There seems to be the idea that if DA make their game just like Pillars it would be great. I don't agree. My problem with DAI was not the graphics, animations, and spoken dialogue. It was the lack of side story content, lack of choices overall, lack of different character types I could outwardly play, generic save the world story, under developed PC, et al.

Right now, Pillars seems to have the generic story and under developed PC thing going on. But once again....I'm not that far in. I think I just finished Act I. So yeah, just as I didn't judge DAI until I was done with it, I can't judge Pillars until I'm done with it.

Anyway, I think BioWare should stick to what they do best while at the same time try new things and improve on the areas that could be great for them. My problem with Bioware is that they just keep removing choices from their game. Reduced classes, reduced side story content, reduced choices overall, reduced combat features, reduced voice acting (neutral toned VOs all around)... and it's all being replaced with nothing. But if that's how they choose to go forward, then more power to them and the fans who love it. It would be up to me to decide if I choose to go forward with the franchise.

However, I won't praise stagnation and claim that if devs just make a game with the exact same game mechanics from the 90's their game will always be good. That's certainly not true.

Agreed. Pillars is an indie title though, perhaps in time it will be DAO style with voice acting and great cinematics.

You nailed the issues with bioware though, they're throwing away the stuff that makes them special to copy mmos.

God I miss tactics. And proper dialogue sequences. And maps that have an impact on the story.

[Ravenmyste]

it's too complicated to play. and you need to read stuff... and combat is slow and boring. besides... isometric view? it's 2015 ffs, hello

lol says you i always have the game running with subtitles and read all the books and papers in the game wouldnt be that hard for player that loves to read

[Han Yolo]

Still, with bioware tossing story and characters aside to make way for fetch quests and simple ai driven combat, I'm hopeful this game will lead to DAO style storytelling in future iterations.

Jaws of Hakkon is an example of how far off course bioware is right now. It's hinterlands 2.0.

I want story, not a single player MMO.

 

I agree about the fetch quests. However, I thought that JoH was an improvement to the main game's zones. The fetch quests in the main game are terribly short most of the time and have minimal dialogue (with no real choices tone or decision-wise), also many of them are obtained through notes (worst thing ever). In the DLC the side quests are fewer, longer, and meatier. Only thing that bugs me about them is that they don't use cutscenes for dialogues.

[Auztin]

DAI's gameplay is not generic ? Oh wait, its a clone and mashup of Diablo, World of Warcraft and Witcher 2.

DAI's art design is not generic ? It is. Its typical high fantasy.

DAI's conversation and environment is a Skyrim / Elder Scrolls rip-off.

DAI is story based and cinematic...Yet DAO has a tighter story, better plot, and you can actually enter cinematic mode when talking to people.

So it is you who should get off your high horse and go home. It is you who have a superiority complex. Check Metacritic and other review sites and see the reviews for Pillars of Eternity vs. Dragon Age Inquisition...

Sigh...Kids these days....

I never said DA:I was unique & then you redirect me to reviews(fancy name for opinion pieces).I said it played to it's strengths & not to it's retro niche gameplay.
Sigh....nostalgia these days....

[Bayonet Hipshot]

Agreed. Pillars is an indie title though, perhaps in time it will be DAO style with voice acting and great cinematics.

You nailed the issues with bioware though, they're throwing away the stuff that makes them special to copy mmos.

God I miss tactics. And proper dialogue sequences. And maps that have an impact on the story.

 

I would not be surprised if they turn DA into an MMO in the future. Everything they have done with this game seems to suggest that they are heading in that direction. Repetitive filler side quests, etc. 

 

The one thing that stood out to me in Pillars of Eternity was how long and how much I thought about it. I was thinking about it all day long. By that I mean how to build my character, what stats should I pick, what skill should I pick, how should I build this character, etc. It was a feeling, a sensation that I have not felt at all for a very long time in playing modern games. 

 

By contrast, for DAI did not give me this sensation. Ever. It was too easy and not engaging in a cerebral manner. It was like you just boot it on and smash a few buttons. 

[Teddie Sage]

Try surviving without guard and barriers, that won't just be button mashing and potions.

[Bioware-Critic]

I would not be surprised if they turn DA into an MMO in the future. Everything they have done with this game seems to suggest that they are heading in that direction. Repetitive filler side quests, etc. 

 

The one thing that stood out to me in Pillars of Eternity was how long and how much I thought about it. I was thinking about it all day long. By that I mean how to build my character, what stats should I pick, what skill should I pick, how should I build this character, etc. It was a feeling, a sensation that I have not felt at all for a very long time in playing modern games. 

 

By contrast, for DAI did not give me this sensation. Ever. It was too easy and not engaging in a cerebral manner. It was like you just boot it on and smash a few buttons. 

 

What you are describing as a sensation, here, Tishen13, is exactly what makes a RPG for me.

 

I have no interest in a ... "button-masher" or a straight forward "hack'n'slash" ... at all. I don't "dig it" - I despise it

When a game forces me to completely turn off my brain - I simply feel insulted! I don't mean like "being in the moment" or to experience "flow" ... but to literally "turn off" my brain, because of the lack of intelligent options. MARY, MOTHER OF CHRIST! I am a human being ... how about the industry, stops torturing me for having a brain by removing the options that offer choice and responsibility like character building and every other half-interesting gameplay-element that really mean something from the RPG genre?

I mean I have memories of it ... I know they are supposed to be in there! Otherwise it is a "Action-Adventure" ...

What they are effectively doing is to remove every replay-value, possible - that's it! The big publishers with their hybris-goals ...

"to conquer the mainstream market with every title"

... are killing the personality and substance of the RPG-genre all together!

 

RPG's are a genre that is about depth, variety and nuance - when it comes to the combat as well as the non-combat actions!

Everything else is an Action-Adventure.

 

DA is a bloody RPG-series - it is supposed to be about character building and choices that DEFINE your playthrough ...

... not about having the "most tight gameplay ever - since SUPER MARIO"!

 

*UGH!*

[Rawgrim]

I never said DA:I was unique & then you redirect me to reviews(fancy name for opinion pieces).I said it played to it's strengths & not to it's retro niche gameplay.
Sigh....nostalgia these days....

 

Its not really nostalgia when many games like that have just been made, and with more to come. Pillars, Numenera, Wasteland 2, Divinity, Blackguards 1-2, Sword Coast Legends, Baldur's Gate Expanison. So yeah...not really retro when games like that are pouring out, is it? Retro is something that isn't being made any longer.

[Rawgrim]

Try surviving without guard and barriers, that won't just be button mashing and potions.

 

Well you can say that about any game. Try surviving a CoD game whit a 6 bullet limit, or try surviving Skyrim without any armour or enchantments. Barrier isn't and exploit or a bug or anything like that. It is a spell the combat design expects you to use. They were marketing the barrier and the guard (what the heck is guard anyway? Does it have any logical explanation?) rather heavily in the gameplay vids before release.

[Teddie Sage]

Guard depletes fast and barriers have cooldown, they're still handful in some situations. 

[Rawgrim]

Guard depletes fast and barriers have cooldown, they're still handful in some situations. 

 

By the time the barrier is gone, the fight is pretty much over anyway, though. Depending on how quick you are at mashing buttons, of course.

[Teddie Sage]

By the time the barrier is gone, the fight is pretty much over anyway, though. Depending on how quick you are at mashing buttons, of course.

So you're telling me you never went on the menus to learn new skills and still finished the game on Nightmare mode... Riiiiiiiiiight.

[Rawgrim]

So you're telling me you never went on the menus to learn new skills and still finished the game on Nightmare mode... Riiiiiiiiiight.

 

I never said I beat the game on nightmare. I never will either. Stop making things up. The combat was tedious enough on normal. I never set up any new spells or skills to the quick keys, though. I just leveled up and picked stuff. If it made it to the menu or not, so be it. I stopped caring when I realised, fairly early, that all it took was the barrier spell and button mashing anyway.

 

You can find vids on yourtube of people beating the game on Nightmare by button mashing, though.

[AlanC9]

I would not be surprised if they turn DA into an MMO in the future. Everything they have done with this game seems to suggest that they are heading in that direction. Repetitive filler side quests, etc. 

This would be very silly. Even if there was room for another MMO, Bio's already got one.

[Rawgrim]

This would be very silly. Even if there was room for another MMO, Bio's already got one.

 

The next one will be an MMO. Mark my words. DA:I was the prototype for it.

[Archerwarden]

@Rawgrim,
been playing POE - having a blast.
really like the depth in character development and dialog choices.

[frostajulie]

THIS IS HOW IT'S DONE!!!!!

 

What a shame that in 2015 a a mishmash of small, independent studios pooled their resources, creativity, dug down deep into their hearts and poured their very being into creating what the EA/Bioware Behemoth could not deliver with all its shock and awe called DAI

 

Pillars of Eternity: Another divinity that will surely cement its place in the pantheon of western RPG classics . Why couldn't DA 3 be like this?? Amazing story, great customization, believable characters, meaningful choices, real tactical combat and a feeling like those who made it actually gave a damn

 

 

Please, Bioware, just sell the DA franchise to people that actually care about those sorts of games you were once admired and praised for!!!!

 

Otherwise,,,,,,, just re brand it "Dragon Age: The RPG-esque Action Game, no Critical Thinking needed"

Question:  I love everything you just said.  Can I play as a female?

[Notker_Biloba]

PoE definitely has the character, combat, and dialog options that many of us know and love from the old days.  My only problem with it (and apparently not a problem for most others) from the demo is that it seems to have a fixed camera angle.  I joined the genre with NWN, so I've always had the luxury of pan-able and movable cameras (or maybe the pan-able cameras started with NWN2?)  I have a distinct recollection of Qara casting a magic missile spell during one of the first fights with some street thugs, and being able to pause the action and then move and pan around the battlefield, seeing spells and arrows and whatnot mid-flight.  I thought that was so cool -- not sure if I can go back to fixed-angle (but movable) camera like PoE.  Maybe will pick it up on discount, if possible, to see if I can get into it.

Now, Sword Coast Legends, that looks awesome.  Already pre-ordered and anxiously awaiting the release!  Not sure yet on Tides of Numenera -- based on previews, is that even squad-based?

 

The sad thing about DA:I, which I think is what the OP was essentially complaining about by bringing up another game for comparison (another very good comparison here http://forum.bioware...actical-camera/), is that there was no reason to jettison the controls that DA:O fans and DA2 fans were used to.  I think DA2 proved that the action-y style and the tactic-y style could live side-by-side with one another, which is awesome, because everyone gets what they want.  Maybe the action-y style of DA2 wasn't action-y enough for the action-RPG players?  And maybe the changes required to make it so, caused the coexistence of the tactic-y style to be too difficult to code?

Modifié par Notker_Biloba, 29 mars 2015 - 12:09 .

[Eelectrica]

Question:  I love everything you just said.  Can I play as a female?

Yes you can play as Male or Female and have 6 different races to choose from - the three standard Human, Elf, Dwarf + 3 other unique races so that's cool.

[Rawgrim]

Yes you can play as Male or Female and have 6 different races to choose from - the three standard Human, Elf, Dwarf + 3 other unique races so that's cool.

 

And you can pick where in the world you come from, and your origin. Both have impact on the game. Tons of various combinations.

[Rawgrim]

PoE definitely has the character, combat, and dialog options that many of us know and love from the old days.  My only problem with it (and apparently not a problem for most others) from the demo is that it seems to have a fixed camera angle.  I joined the genre with NWN, so I've always had the luxury of pan-able and movable cameras (or maybe the pan-able cameras started with NWN2?)  I have a distinct recollection of Qara casting a magic missile spell during one of the first fights with some street thugs, and being able to pause the action and then move and pan around the battlefield, seeing spells and arrows and whatnot mid-flight.  I thought that was so cool -- not sure if I can go back to fixed-angle (but movable) camera like PoE.  Maybe will pick it up on discount, if possible, to see if I can get into it.

Now, Sword Coast Legends, that looks awesome.  Already pre-ordered and anxiously awaiting the release!  Not sure yet on Tides of Numenera -- based on previews, is that even squad-based?

 

The sad thing about DA:I, which I think is what the OP was essentially complaining about by bringing up another game for comparison (another very good comparison here http://forum.bioware...actical-camera/), is that there was no reason to jettison the controls that DA:O fans and DA2 fans were used to.  I think DA2 proved that the action-y style and the tactic-y style could live side-by-side with one another, which is awesome, because everyone gets what they want.  Maybe the action-y style of DA2 wasn't action-y enough for the action-RPG players?  And maybe the changes required to make it so, caused the coexistence of the tactic-y style to be too difficult to code?

 

Numenera is the spiritual sequel to Planescape Torment. And yes, you do get companions in it. It has turn based combat, as well.

[Eelectrica]

And you can pick where in the world you come from, and your origin. Both have impact on the game. Tons of various combinations.

Yeah, I don't think I've seen a character creator with this many options before. It's an actual creator, not a design your characters looks creator.

[Rawgrim]

@Rawgrim,
been playing POE - having a blast.
really like the depth in character development and dialog choices.

 

Same here.

 

Stuff like this shouldn't be anything exceptional in rpgs, though. Seriously. Its what the whole genre is about. It should be something that is standard in rpgs. Sadly it isn't. Some devs believe roleplaying is only about your role during a fight.

[Rawgrim]

Yeah, I don't think I've seen a character creator with this many options before. It's an actual creator, not a design your characters looks creator.

 

True. I was surprised when I saw how many options I actually had. Later on I was surprised again when I saw how often my choices during character creation actually affected the game. I think it has affected, and\or been addressed in, almost every conversation so far.

[CronoDragoon]

Spirit of Baldur's Gate.
Dialogue depth of Planescape Torment.
Gameplay like Neverwinter Nights 2.
 
What's not to like?!

The vocal fanbase, apparently. Here's a tip for the the people calling others idiots in this thread: that's how things stay niche. Nobody has an interest in it except people who already love those games, but others might if the fanbase presented themselves as more welcoming and less douchey.

And yes, I joined in on the name-calling. Yes, you're a douche for calling people who don't like iso cRPGs idiots who can't read.