1428 réponses à ce sujet

[Skemte]

CRISIS1717 wrote...

Biotics are only good for enemies without defenses. On most enemies you can kill them just as fast by shooting them.
Why do you guys even play Adept? you're just making your char weaker and the special teammate biotics are better.

.. That is untrue.. Stuff like push, warp and shockwave can hurt shields.. Furthermore stuff like singularity even to armored guys can still stun them for some 5 to 10 seconds, they just don't float around uselessly..

[Ricardoy]

Im soldier but i find the biotics usefull in many cases..in the case you losse all ammo lol..but still you can get barrier and try to find some ammo..anyways you have companions with biotics so that makes them needed.

[Moogliepie]

Kroniker81 wrote...

Moogliepie wrote...

There is a lot inconsistency in this thread. People are repetitively claiming their only issue is that Biotics are less fun on Insanity because they can't do cool combos, but then these same people keep slipping in comments about how much easier it is to play a soldier or infiltrator. Stop waffling.

Now maybe I'm just not as good as some you at shooters, but after playing as a soldier, then a sentinel on insanity, I was surprised how much easier being a sentinel was. Especially after reading all the whinging about it. As a soldier, I had to burn through clips like crazy and heavily rely on Miranda's warp and overload abilities. Note that for my soldier, I started a second playthough and had all the weapons and more skills whereas my Sentinel was a new ME1 import, yet I still found it easier. The ammo limitations weren't a big deal for my sentinel since I had powers. Using warp/overload in conjunction with Miranda, I was able to strip them down to health, then use Jacob to pull for CC, let my teammates focus fire on him, and move on to the next guy. Granted a Sentinel is not an adept, but the same basic idea that biotics are useless, as the thread title states, is ridiculous.

Even as far as the fun factor goes, well, on Veteran as a Soldier, there was more of a choice between weapons/ammo. On Insanity, choosing the slow sniper rifle was suicide. I felt a lot more restricted in my options, and it felt like I was hitting enemies with a BB gun half the time, whereas with warp/overload spamming at least was more effective. Concussive shot was useless, and Adrenaline is overrated, I mostly used it as a last ditch effort. And because soldiers are so dependent on their party members (especially during Husk levels) biotics for CC, we get just as much, if not more affected than people actually playing those classes.


Anyways, your thread title is misleading. Biotics aren't useless, it's just that Insanity level isn't very fun, regardless of your class.

/sigh
Read the op again please.

/sigh at another troll on the Bioware forums. I read this entire thread, and the childish tantrums of the OP. He needed someone else to clarify the issue on page 5 because he was too busy trolling.  Did you even read MY post? 

[Kroniker81]

Moogliepie wrote...

Kroniker81 wrote...

Moogliepie wrote...

There is a lot inconsistency in this thread. People are repetitively claiming their only issue is that Biotics are less fun on Insanity because they can't do cool combos, but then these same people keep slipping in comments about how much easier it is to play a soldier or infiltrator. Stop waffling.

Now maybe I'm just not as good as some you at shooters, but after playing as a soldier, then a sentinel on insanity, I was surprised how much easier being a sentinel was. Especially after reading all the whinging about it. As a soldier, I had to burn through clips like crazy and heavily rely on Miranda's warp and overload abilities. Note that for my soldier, I started a second playthough and had all the weapons and more skills whereas my Sentinel was a new ME1 import, yet I still found it easier. The ammo limitations weren't a big deal for my sentinel since I had powers. Using warp/overload in conjunction with Miranda, I was able to strip them down to health, then use Jacob to pull for CC, let my teammates focus fire on him, and move on to the next guy. Granted a Sentinel is not an adept, but the same basic idea that biotics are useless, as the thread title states, is ridiculous.

Even as far as the fun factor goes, well, on Veteran as a Soldier, there was more of a choice between weapons/ammo. On Insanity, choosing the slow sniper rifle was suicide. I felt a lot more restricted in my options, and it felt like I was hitting enemies with a BB gun half the time, whereas with warp/overload spamming at least was more effective. Concussive shot was useless, and Adrenaline is overrated, I mostly used it as a last ditch effort. And because soldiers are so dependent on their party members (especially during Husk levels) biotics for CC, we get just as much, if not more affected than people actually playing those classes.


Anyways, your thread title is misleading. Biotics aren't useless, it's just that Insanity level isn't very fun, regardless of your class.

/sigh
Read the op again please.

/sigh at another troll on the Bioware forums. I read this entire thread, and the childish tantrums of the OP. He needed someone else to clarify the issue on page 5 because he was too busy trolling.  Did you even read MY post? 

I did and you totally missed the point using your sentinel as an argument who is one of the better classes not because his biotics are so awesome but firstly because he has access to the two biotics which actually do anything at all times which matters a lot and secondly he actually has an ability which let him deal with shields but Overload is still not a biotic power it is a tech skill which is something completely different plus he isn't totally screwed by it for 50%-80% of a fight being degraded to a second rate soldier in that time frame.
If you would have read and comprehend the thread properly then you would not have made that meaningless post in the first place.
You complain about the OP who is simply fed up by the gazillion people who totally missed the point for about 50 pages now just like you did.
Have a nice evening sir.
Oh and by the way attacking people with an ad hominem doesn't give your arguments any meaning nor do you appear smart using them. Just a little hint.

[Amioran]

Moogliepie wrote...

Now maybe I'm just not as good as some you at shooters, but after playing as a soldier, then a sentinel on insanity, I was surprised how much easier being a sentinel was. Especially after reading all the whinging about it. As a soldier, I had to burn through clips like crazy and heavily rely on Miranda's warp and overload abilities.

Instead I wonder how people as you can compare two completely different things as if they are the same and at the same time think that they are so smart as to even point what's wrong or what isn't in an argument they have understood anything about.

You are talking about the Sentinel class that has, as Biotic skills (apart Throw, never used) Warp, the only one (along Singularity in a minor way) that can be used consistenly on all difficulties, and so they are not affected by the issue the thread is arguing about. The OP also clearly stated that Adepts are good only at "Warp spamming" to be efficient, and yet you come here and say that he is wrong taking as an example a class that has as its primary attack that Biotic skill? Do you understand how imbecile your argument is? If I would say to you that soldier classes sucks apart for the very good Sniper Rifle I'm sure you will tell me that I'm completely wrong because Infiltrators are very strong... Good work on making the figure of the idiot, child.

If you want to make examples on why you think the argument is wrong make them based on the Adept gameplay, that is the class that has the most skills that don't work as they should on higher difficulties, NOT on the Sentinel that has only one of the only two biotic skills that are consistent on all difficulties and so are NOT affected by the issue.

You either said that you have read all posts; good job on not understanding anything at all. Bravo!

P.S.: As an aside note learn how to play a Soldier, since you are clearly missing the point also on that class. 

Modifié par Amioran, 06 février 2010 - 10:33 .

[KadeMisae]

Maybe I just haven't been paying attention, but it seems to me that the 'bonus effects' of combining powers, does in fact, affect armored/shielded enemies.



Near as I can tell, armor, shields, and barriers all act like a physics 'buffer' to a given target, so combining effects is how you get your biotics to do damage, even to shields. Pull affects them, but doesn't always take them right off their feet, the explosion of a follow up warp is almost always enough to pop the shields of anything but heavy mechs. Singularity seems to work fine against enemies, regardless of their defenses. I can understand if you're a vanguard and your biotics dont seem as potent, but that's because you're supposed to use your shotgun in conjunction with them for maximum effect.



My Sentinel was one of the most fun I've ever had, charge in, pistol whip someone until my shields explode, and then just shoot them while they're on the ground, if anyone tried to stand back up, I'd throw them to sit them back down. Everyone has a way to bring down each kind of defense, but sometimes it takes a combination of powers, not just one.

[SDima]

Anyone else wanna confirm KedeMisae? As far as I know nothing happens when you throw/pull a shielded enemy and singularity is so slow to damage stuff (and disappears quickly when in damage mode) its easier to pistol the guy to death.

[Kroniker81]

KadeMisae wrote...

Maybe I just haven't been paying attention, but it seems to me that the 'bonus effects' of combining powers, does in fact, affect armored/shielded enemies.

Near as I can tell, armor, shields, and barriers all act like a physics 'buffer' to a given target, so combining effects is how you get your biotics to do damage, even to shields. Pull affects them, but doesn't always take them right off their feet, the explosion of a follow up warp is almost always enough to pop the shields of anything but heavy mechs. Singularity seems to work fine against enemies, regardless of their defenses. I can understand if you're a vanguard and your biotics dont seem as potent, but that's because you're supposed to use your shotgun in conjunction with them for maximum effect.

My Sentinel was one of the most fun I've ever had, charge in, pistol whip someone until my shields explode, and then just shoot them while they're on the ground, if anyone tried to stand back up, I'd throw them to sit them back down. Everyone has a way to bring down each kind of defense, but sometimes it takes a combination of powers, not just one.

Maybe you should reread the thread and comprehend what we are talking about. Please do so sir.

[flamingdts]

KadeMisae wrote...

Maybe I just haven't been paying attention, but it seems to me that the 'bonus effects' of combining powers, does in fact, affect armored/shielded enemies.

Near as I can tell, armor, shields, and barriers all act like a physics 'buffer' to a given target, so combining effects is how you get your biotics to do damage, even to shields. Pull affects them, but doesn't always take them right off their feet, the explosion of a follow up warp is almost always enough to pop the shields of anything but heavy mechs. Singularity seems to work fine against enemies, regardless of their defenses. I can understand if you're a vanguard and your biotics dont seem as potent, but that's because you're supposed to use your shotgun in conjunction with them for maximum effect.

My Sentinel was one of the most fun I've ever had, charge in, pistol whip someone until my shields explode, and then just shoot them while they're on the ground, if anyone tried to stand back up, I'd throw them to sit them back down. Everyone has a way to bring down each kind of defense, but sometimes it takes a combination of powers, not just one.

Wrong.

Can't people just play the class before making some ridiculous assumption on how wrong others are? 

[Gringbot]

im just about to beat the game with my adept on insanity and really my opinion hasn't really changed, its still pretty boring. definately hard and challenging, but i pulled through mainly to see is adepts got more exciting and effective, and while they do become more effective, they still are BORING, mainly because im most effective just spamming singularity followed with a warp, shooting when my shields are up, with the very occasional pull to which my teammates just finish them off with regular bullets before i can cast anything else on them. that is generally all i do. its very limited in its applications.

the fun attacks, like throw are rarely used, the only time throw does something is if i throw them off a ledge (which is not often enough), if i throw them into a wall, theres a high chance theyll live through it and end up shooting me later after they pick themselves up from hiding behind that wall they were knocked behind, but if i just use maxed out warp, they'll just blow up and its a guaranteed kill, so whats the point? and shockwave? really this thing is terrible, short range, slow, buggy, and only works on non shielded targets, oh and it has a long cooldown, good luck after using shockwave and the guys you used it on are still charging. singularity is the only real CC in our arsenal.

the only times i had fun with my adept was when I purposely kept my enemies alive so that i could toy with their bodies, as that was what made biotics fun to begin with, not just holding people with shields in place with singularities.

i dont care how much math and garbage you spew out at me, im here saying that my experience as an adept in ME2 has been beyond disappointing. i expected nerfs, but they went about the nerfs and changed biotics in ways that dont compliment the original style in ME1. to me, biotics were what made the mass effect franchise, and now that feeling is only barely there.

if they just made force biotics, like pull, throw, shockwave, actually do something more then just tickle shielded enemies, maybe biotics wont be so lame and boring to play as.  give adepts some dimensionality to their gameplay.  again, this is on INSANITY DIFFICULTY, im sure your adept is just fine playing on 'veteran', and even tolerable on 'hardcore'.

and really, can we please get some keybindings for each weapon? how was this not put in? oh right, were PC gamers, we're not allowed to get refined products on PC. I forgot, my bad.

Modifié par Gringbot, 07 février 2010 - 10:40 .

[Flash_in_the_flesh]

Really people should try modding their .ini file.

[Soruyao]

kelsjet wrote...

Warp Specialist – Warp the barriers of 25 enemies

The achievement doesn't count how many times you have used warp in total, just how many times your particular warp has destroyed the barriers (i.e. the biotic ability) of enemies.
I mean seriously, how utterly stupid do you have to be to not be able to read the ****ing description?

Ha.  I read that as defenses.   That might be the biggest mistake I've ever made on a forum.  I will give you that point, good sir.

/sigh
I'm telling you, WoW and facebook have fried the brains of so many people that they cannot function on even the most basic of levels.

The rest of your post is such utter nonsense that I would rather drink broken glass then refute your bullsh!te point by point.

Jesus I really don't understand why there are so many ****ing trolls and retards in this thread that cannot understand such a simple thing.

So because I misread an achievement everything else I said is wrong and I'm a retard?  I use warp only on bosses, (the 10 warps I do have is from telling miranda to warp collector barriers) I use all my abilities consistently on insanity mode and have fun and don't struggle.

What the heck else do you want from a class?

You're insulting people's intelligence and then you resort to petty insults and flames, and your vocabulary is so weak you feel the need to swear multiple times in the same post.  I've gone the whole time I've been on this forum without resorting to this, but DIAF you hypocritical douchebag.

On Insane Difficulty: Adepts cannot use a vast majority of their biotic powers. Not because they 'don't know how'. Not because they don't have 'skill'. Not because they are missing some critical piece of information that somehow all the morons like the fool I quoted seem to think they know.

No. Adepts cannot use the vast majority of their abilities on Insane mode because the ****ing game's mechanics prevent you from doing so.

Why is this fact so difficult for people to understand?

Jesus! There is over 500 people in this thread repeating the exact same statement I have just made for over 50 pages now and people still don't get it. Unbelievable!

It's like the entire world is telling you "You cannot light a match in space since there is no air because the laws of physics prevents it", and an entire death squad of morons are saying "LOLOLO U NUB U NED MOAR SKILZ TO LITE MATCH IN SPAZE LOLZ".

WoW and facebook. I called it. Utterly destroying peoples ability to think.

My teammates take down defenses fast enough that I never have to use a GCD for warp on infantry.  I spend 10-20% of my time shooting things and micromanaging squad abilities and 80% of it throwing people over mountains.

Maybe you need to get out of the rut everyone is in where they do nothing but warp and actually learn how to use the rest of your abilites.

I mean seriously, people max out warp and then wonder why they spend 90% of their time warping.  Just don't do that.  It's not rocket surgery here.  Its like the joke about the guy who goes to the doctor and goes "It hurts when I do this!" and the doctor goes "Well don't do that."  If a strategy is boring then try other strategies.

If the games mechanics have been preventing me from using lift and throw almost constantly then I must be an AMAZING PLAYER because I do it all the time.

People don't get the same thing you've been saying for 50 pages because it's DEAD WRONG.  Adepts might not be the best class, and they might even be the weakest class (read: hardest to play well), but it can be played without warping infantry at all and with a bare minimum of gunplay.  On insanity.   With minimal deaths.  I've been doing it.

I don't think it's a L2P issue because you guys have a (BORING) strategy that does work. (albeit very slowly, from what I'm hearing)  However, I do think it's a L2think outside the box issue. Try using your abilities creatively and you might find that you can actually clear areas faster.


-edit-
The immaturity on these forums is staggering.   Not everyone who disagrees with you is a child or mentally challenged.   Insisting that makes you seem like you are the one who is a child.  (Children tend care WAY more about being older than other children than adults care about being older than anyone.   Have you ever heard anyone older than 20 say "I'm [insert age here].. and a half!"?)

There's a term in psychology called "Projection."  It refers to a redirection of negative thoughts and feelings to other people.  It's a defense mechanism that allows someone to use an insult part of them feels fits them on other people in order to feel better.

Long story short, "NO U."

Modifié par Soruyao, 07 février 2010 - 01:03 .

[Koralis]

By the way the shared cooldowns system is stupid imho. Normally you will use 1-2 abilites only since you always have your full pool of abilites at any given situation.

Yeah... I understand why they moved away from ME1's scheme of completely independant cooldowns (allowed you to unload immediately), but the shared cooldown always means that you use the "best" ability at any given time.





The best system (maybe for ME3) would be a hybrid cooldown system.

1) cooldown on thr triggered ability as normal

2) cooldown on other abilities is 1/2

3) If cooldown is "reapplied" over one that's already on cooldown, take the larger of the two.



This slows down the power usage like ME2, but not as much, and you'll have scenarios where the power you'd like is on cooldown, but other powers are available that are not.

[JohnnySmash]

I agree adept doesn't seem as fun in this game, in ME1 you could just run around in a battlefield throwing people around creating singularities and just causing total chaos.  Maybe at times you could be a little too god-like, but this could have been remedied without making the powers less fun or having a global cooldown.

It's really not just adept though, for shooter classes combat is literally always you hiding behind a short wall shooting at far away enemies that are hiding behind a short wall.  Rinse and repeat until the bad guy dispenser stops dispensing bad guys.  Makes the shotgun pretty bad in ME2 and sniper rifle pretty godly.

Overall I think combat is fun but doesn't capitalize on the potential that ME1 created.

[Flash_in_the_flesh]

I'm currently replaying ME1 as nemesis vanguard, bonus skill singularity. This is objectively one of the most powerfull classes in ME1 yet far from feeling overpowered in any way. Singularity and lift are not offensive powers. They are used to remove threat, not to kill enemies. Same is in ME2 on lower difficulties. Throw occasionaly can be used as offensive ability when enemies are close to an edge but that's it.

Seems weak? Not at all. This is, after all, what biotics are supposed to do - CC. It's not making us kill enemies faster, it's just another form of protection and btw. not the most efficient one. Immunity is still far better protection. Along with damage bonuses, it makes soldier and infiltrator ultimate killing machines. Want a real benchmark of classes in ME1? Try Pinnacle Station. Your adept and vanguard won't beat the last mission with record, soldier will.

Now why I'm saying this? Because in ME2 biotics role is the same, it's still CC, not a godmode like people keep calling it. The only difference is in ME2 biotics doesn't work most of the time.

[Amioran]

Soruyao wrote...

People don't get the same thing you've been saying for 50 pages because it's DEAD WRONG.  Adepts might not be the best class, and they might even be the weakest class (read: hardest to play well), but it can be played without warping infantry at all and with a bare minimum of gunplay.  On insanity.   With minimal deaths.  I've been doing it.

No, people as you don't get it simply because you clearly have not understood what the OP is talking about and yet you continue acting and replying as if you do.

Just the phrase "because it's DEAD WRONG" explain by itself that you have grasped nothing at all of what we are talking about. In fact there's no debate on the fact that what the OP is talking about _cannot_ be "dead wrong" because it is a behaviour of the engine, so its status is not debatable. It is a _fact_ that the majority of Biotics don't work on armored opponents. You cannot contest this, what you can do is only express the opinion (or not) that what you experience is to your liking or not. Yet, instead, you continue debating the usefulness of Biotics to justify something that YOU are making out from the debate, but it's not there and nobody is arguing about it, namely:

a) Difficulty: nobody is talking about the Adepts in concern to an enigmatic gameplay difficulty change. Everybody with a little of skill can play Insanity with an Adept without problems as it is. All this talk about you an others that can play fine on Insanity have _nothing_ to do with what the argument is about and yet you continue of talking about it as if it is a key component of the debate. You talk about it as if the fact that you can play Adepts in Insanity by itself prove that we are wrong, but, yet, nobody ever mentioned increased difficulty as proof of the fact that Biotics don't work as they should. Nobody is concerned about this because it's an issue _you_ created. How you cannot comprehend this simple thing is beyond me, really. 

Use of Biotics: nobody ever said that Pull or Throw cannot be used. I repeated every single time that you can use them. The difference is that the scope of these skills changes in higher difficulties because there's an _external_ imposition that forces you to use them in certain situations only. The fact that you can use squad members to strip defenses to then use the skills don't change this fact. All the examples about how you can use them easily or not, how much you use them and whatever are all arguments good an fine; a shame that they don't have _anything_ to do with the discussion whatsoever. So please stop talking about this things because you are completely missing the point. Can you use them when _you_ want to? No. The rest is only dust in the eyes to justify something that nobody is arguing about, apart you.

c) About "Warp Spamming". Here the fact is that this is a single player game, luckily. I say luckily because this give players the freedom to use skills also if they are not the most effective given the situation. If this game was a PvP you would use only Warp (and maybe Singularity) with an Adept because other Biotics lose completely their role and scope and are, given the aforementioned change, highly ineffective in comparision with Warp. Since Throw, Pull and others become finishing moves more than controlling skills (see my reference on how a _real_ control skill works, i.e. controlling _high treath_ targets _as fast as you can_ and _when YOU want_) they assume another role that its in direct confrontation with the utility of Warp/Reave. It is obvious, however, that these last two are infinitely more powerful as damaging skills than the others (because they are made expressedly for this role), so the most efficient way to play an Adept would be spamming Warp/Reave. The fact that in a Single Player game you have the luxury to be as ineffective as you want doesn't change this fact, i.e. doesn't change the fact that Biotics in higher difficulties changes their role from controlling skills to finishing moves. All this talk of the fact that you can use them and you use them everytime have _nothing_ to do with this, whenever you like it or not.

So, you see, you continue to reply to things that you have not understood, for this people act this way towards you. If you had the humility to first try to _really_ understand what the discussion is about instead of making remarks that concerns other aspects not taken in consideration (because they are not meaningful for the discussion), maybe you would have grasped that what you are talking about it's wrong, not per se, but given the true motivations and arguments of the OP.

You cannot compare Oranges and Lemons thinking they are the same just because they are both fruits and become angry if people tell you that you are missing the point completely. You are, in fact, missing the point completely.

[Graunt]

Flash_in_the_flesh wrote...

I'm currently replaying ME1 as nemesis vanguard, bonus skill singularity. This is objectively one of the most powerfull classes in ME1 yet far from feeling overpowered in any way. Singularity and lift are not offensive powers. They are used to remove threat, not to kill enemies. Same is in ME2 on lower difficulties. Throw occasionaly can be used as offensive ability when enemies are close to an edge but that's it.

Seems weak? Not at all. This is, after all, what biotics are supposed to do - CC. It's not making us kill enemies faster, it's just another form of protection and btw. not the most efficient one. Immunity is still far better protection. Along with damage bonuses, it makes soldier and infiltrator ultimate killing machines. Want a real benchmark of classes in ME1? Try Pinnacle Station. Your adept and vanguard won't beat the last mission with record, soldier will.

Now why I'm saying this? Because in ME2 biotics role is the same, it's still CC, not a godmode like people keep calling it. The only difference is in ME2 biotics doesn't work most of the time.

Maybe we were playing different games, but max lift any normal enemy outside that didn't already have immunity on and it usually died.  And Singularity was both an offensive and defensive ability.  Name another way that was even remotely as good for clumping up a bunch of enemies for an explosive shotgun blast (not that I even used shotguns after my first Vanguard, but it was still good for high explosive sniper shots).  Pull doesn't really have the same effect that lift did, you have to use Slam for a similar effect that's somewhere in between.  The funnest area to do the lift/throw combo in the first game outside of the few mako missions with cliffs was the final fight in the citadel areas.

Also, it's debateable who was actually the strongest class between the Infiltrator and Vanguard, but the Vanguard had the most fun factor involved.

Modifié par Graunt, 07 février 2010 - 08:03 .

[Flash_in_the_flesh]

Graunt wrote...

Maybe we were playing different games, but max lift any normal enemy outside that didn't already have immunity on and it usually died.

That wasn't lift feature but map limitation. When enemy reaches the skybox (map "roof") it dies automatically. And singularity being offensive because it works good with carnage? That's carnage being offensive, not singularity. It's like calling neural shock offensive skill because stunned enemy tends to be an easy target.

Modifié par Flash_in_the_flesh, 07 février 2010 - 08:11 .

[Graunt]

Flash_in_the_flesh wrote...

Graunt wrote...

Maybe we were playing different games, but max lift any normal enemy outside that didn't already have immunity on and it usually died.

That wasn't lift feature but map limitation. When enemy reaches the skybox (map "roof") it dies automatically. And singularity being offensive because it works good with carnage? That's carnage being offensive, not singularity. It's like calling neural shock offensive skill because stunned enemy tends to be an easy target.

Neural shock wasn't anywhere even remotely similar, so it's a terrible comparison.  Clumping up 3-4 enemies with the intent to blow them all up because of that is in no way a defensive move, but offensive.  You can't kill with Singularity, but you can make killing a lot faster with it compared to without.  Hell, are you suggesting that you never used Overload/Warp/Sabotage after intentionally grouping enemies up with Singularity for that purpose?  Are you seriously suggesting that was a defenisve move?

Modifié par Graunt, 07 février 2010 - 08:30 .

[Flash_in_the_flesh]

This way you can call all sleep, fear, stun, hold, paralyse, petrify, freeze, etc. powers in all RPG systems offensive. All of these are CC but yes, incapitated enemies are easier to kill. That's all. They are not damage dealers.

[jpetrey123]

lock this tread already who cares!! biotics are extremely useful. you can either shoot about a clip of ammo or just throw him....hmmm

[Graunt]

Flash_in_the_flesh wrote...

This way you can call all sleep, fear, stun, hold, paralyse, petrify, freeze, etc. powers in all RPG systems offensive. All of these are CC but yes, incapitated enemies are easier to kill. That's all. They are not damage dealers.

And the majority of those only stopped enemies where they were, they didn't group them up even more.  You could sometimes mass sleep/stun/paralyze etc groups that were already close, but it didn't exactly draw them together into one nice little area.  And notice I didn't say Singularity was a "damage dealer", I said it could be used offensively.  What do you not understand about that?  Does admitting such hurt your argument about biotics in ME2 somehow?

Modifié par Graunt, 07 février 2010 - 08:48 .

[Flash_in_the_flesh]

jpetrey123 wrote...

lock this tread already who cares!!
biotics are extremely useful. you can either shoot about a clip of ammo
or just throw him....hmmm

Go on. Go use Throw on insanity. It's plenty of fun and surely it's as effective as a clip of SMG.

Graunt wrote...

And notice I didn't say Singularity was a "damage dealer", I said it could be used offensively.  What do you not understand about that?  Does admitting such hurt your argument about biotics in ME2 somehow?

I agree that singularity can be used offensively in cojunction with offensive skill. That applies to every other CC skill as well and hey, it applies to every existing skill in every game. Feel better?

Modifié par Flash_in_the_flesh, 07 février 2010 - 09:09 .

[Graunt]

Flash_in_the_flesh wrote...
I agree that singularity can be used offensively in cojunction with offensive skill. That applies to every other CC skill as well and hey, it applies to every existing skill in every game. Feel better?

No, but it's a start.

[Kroniker81]

Graunt wrote...

Flash_in_the_flesh wrote...

This way you can call all sleep, fear, stun, hold, paralyse, petrify, freeze, etc. powers in all RPG systems offensive. All of these are CC but yes, incapitated enemies are easier to kill. That's all. They are not damage dealers.

And the majority of those only stopped enemies where they were, they didn't group them up even more.  You could sometimes mass sleep/stun/paralyze etc groups that were already close, but it didn't exactly draw them together into one nice little area.  And notice I didn't say Singularity was a "damage dealer", I said it could be used offensively.  What do you not understand about that?  Does admitting such hurt your argument about biotics in ME2 somehow?

Singularity in ME 1 does not really group up. The enemies fly around in erratic circles and even with Carnage you cannot hit them all most of the time. Lift does not really group up, the enemies fly at a certain velocity straight up. If you are in a room with a low ceiling they tend to even scatter even. Compared to that spells like paralyze or hold person were even better since they nail opponents to the spot so in terms of Mass Effect aiming it would have been easier to wipe the floor. Bastion Stasis Mastery does that in fact but it is not available to all and not all want to choose it for their Sentinels or Adepts.
Heavy enemies like Geth Armatures are affected only slightly by these powers but it can still buy you 2-3 seconds at least so they remain useful. Still Engineers are more effective against them but that is fine.
As I said it's a good concept to make certain classes stronger against certain enemy types and vice versa.

Modifié par Kroniker81, 07 février 2010 - 11:17 .