21 réponses à ce sujet

[NM_Che56]

Preamble (UPDATE):

 

Let's keep in mind ONE thing.  This is science FICTION.  Per the dictionary, science fiction is  "a form of fiction that draws imaginatively on scientific knowledge and speculation in its plot, setting, theme, etc".

 

Imagination...let's not take this too seriously or try to anchor this 100% into known scientific theory.

 

Example: Cordyceps are real.  The fungus affects insects and, according to the BBC documentary, have species specific varieties.  However, none are specific to humans.  The infection does not exist in our species...but don't tell Naughty Dog, cuz two years ago they made a critically acclaimed game using this bit of "science-fiction" as the basis for their game.
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Ok,
 
I know some of us think that the next game could be focused on leaving the galaxy because a good number of people don't think we have a chance at stopping the Reapers and self-imposed exile to another galaxy  may be where we're going.  But I propose an alternative idea (...maybe not new around here):
 
Dark Energy.
 
From the Wikia page:
 
******************************************************************************************************************************************************************
In the years following the Battle of the Citadel, a further interest in dark energy itself has begun to emerge. Quarian studies upon the planet Haestrom reveal that its sun, Dholen, is aging prematurely as a result of the influence of dark energy. In addition, Gianna Parasini of Noveria Internal Affairs mentions that her superiors are worried about the potential issues of their clients' increased dark energy interests.
The manipulation of dark energy also figures into the events of Arrival. The mysterious Object Rho found in the Bahak system's asteroid field utilizes vast amounts of dark energy to maintain itself and the barriers protecting it so that it can continue broadcasting its enigmatic signals. The nearby Alpha Relay, the oldest known mass relay in the galaxy, can also make use of hidden dark energy reserves. When Alpha's control switches are adjusted, the relay taps into an unprecedented amount of dark energy, dramatically extending its range to sixteen other mass relays and even the Citadel.
******************************************************************************************************************************************************************
 
Maybe the "client" is "A.R.K.C.O.N." and their "interests" are The Pathfinder Initiative!
 
Story:
 
A.R.K.C.O.N. took an interest in the aforementioned Quarian studies and have concluded that there is a serious galaxy-wide crisis. The proliferation in the use of mass effect fields and dark energy are causing MULTIPLE stars to age...and go supernova.  The game starts with a big bang: Warnings not headed, a sun in a fairly populated system explodes. Kinda like stress on tectonic plates: The pressure builds and builds until it is released in the form of an earthquake.  
 
The threat isn't just your sun blowing up, but if enough suns continue to do it, it could cause "space problems"...hey, lay off me! I'm not a scientist, but multiple supernovas in relative succession in relatively close proximity can't be good...considering that black holes are the children of supernovas.  Multiple black holes near each other?  What are the chances that space travel could be cut off if this happens in system with Mass Effect relays?  That can't be good...
 
So the solution is to take steps to alleviate things by trying to move a good chunk of the population to another galaxy.  Enter your protagonist: Your mission is to lead an exploration team into the great unknown and to find planets that can sustain life.  Here's where we will encounter new races...who aren't taking aliens landing on their planet with the greatest of graces, as you can imagine.  So the game won't just be about finding habitable planets, but also smoothing things over with the native, space faring races so they don't try to blow everyone to smithereens because they've misinterpreted our exodus as an invasion.
 
Whaddya think?
 
Hey! Maybe we'll get a kiss from Gianna! LOL

[Jaquio]

It would be interesting to see if the newer writers revive the dark energy storyline, though I don't think they will.

 

Ultimately, dark energy as the plot device was Drew Karpyshyn's vehicle.    Drew's vision was that the reapers were harvesting organics to help them (somehow) stop or at least stall the spread of dark energy throughout the universe.  But once Drew... left, then the dark energy storyline was thrown out the airlock, never to reappear.

 

A new team may revive it, and that would be interesting because Haestrom just dangles there as an obviously abandoned plot device.  But as a general rule, new writers want to create their own storylines.

[katamuro]

Give it up already, dark energy plot was dead on arrival. They replaced it with something equally strange but it still means dark energy is not a direction that ME series has gone. 

[NM_Che56]

Give it up already, dark energy plot was dead on arrival. They replaced it with something equally strange but it still means dark energy is not a direction that ME series has gone.

...so because the trilogy didnt take that premise beyond mass effect 2's Tail recruitment mission, Bioware can't revisit it?

[NM_Che56]

It would be interesting to see if the newer writers revive the dark energy storyline, though I don't think they will.

Ultimately, dark energy as the plot device was Drew Karpyshyn's vehicle. Drew's vision was that the reapers were harvesting organics to help them (somehow) stop or at least stall the spread of dark energy throughout the universe. But once Drew... left, then the dark energy storyline was thrown out the airlock, never to reappear.

A new team may revive it, and that would be interesting because Haestrom just dangles there as an obviously abandoned plot device. But as a general rule, new writers want to create their own storylines.

it was dangled with no resolution. so technically that sun is still aging prematurely. no reason to think it resolved itself.

[katamuro]

...so because the trilogy didnt take that premise beyond mass effect 2's Tail recruitment mission, Bioware can't revisit it?

 

Its not a major plot point. It was inserted to be one and then because they changed why reapers were doing what they were doing you cant just take it out of the trashbin and go along with it. 

Plus dark energy doesn't really work like that. The only logical place where something would explode from dark energy would be the relays themselves. 

The whole "using mass effect drives is bad for the galaxy" would rely on the whole thing being a localized effect, only within the galaxy. Then if it depends on the amount of usage of the mass effect then the most used relays would explode first taking out the citadel and probably a few star systems in the asari and turian space, homeworlds most probably. And you can't fight it. The only reasonable way is to stop using ME technology completely. 

That turns it into a disaster movie plot with the worst resolutions ever, the only people who would survive would be the ones on planets without mass relays and then they could never use mass effect technology ever again meaning Everyone is stuck where they last stopped. Which effectively pushes the technology level back to the 21st century or so. Doesnt matter which galaxy, after a while it will still end up the way it started. It would be like you driving a bus until it catches on fire and then leaping onto another bus and so on and so forth. Also mass effect drives are not an effective intergalactic travel mechanism, they would literally gain charge until they started to discharge inside the ships hull killing everyone. THE END. 

 

Also black holes form in a variety of ways, supernovas also are the process by which all elements heavier than hydrogen were created and then deposited in gas clouds for the later formation of planets. Our universe literally is fed by a cycle of destruction, without it there would be only stars and black holes. 

[goishen]

I personally think they'll leave it there if only to explain that there are some things that scientists just don't know.

 

I know that in the idyllic future we know everything that's happening.  That's not the case, and it's one of the reasons why MEU has so much appeal.

[NM_Che56]

science fiction...lol.

[NM_Che56]

Its not a major plot point. It was inserted to be one and then because they changed why reapers were doing what they were doing you cant just take it out of the trashbin and go along with it.
Plus dark energy doesn't really work like that. The only logical place where something would explode from dark energy would be the relays themselves.
The whole "using mass effect drives is bad for the galaxy" would rely on the whole thing being a localized effect, only within the galaxy. Then if it depends on the amount of usage of the mass effect then the most used relays would explode first taking out the citadel and probably a few star systems in the asari and turian space, homeworlds most probably. And you can't fight it. The only reasonable way is to stop using ME technology completely.
That turns it into a disaster movie plot with the worst resolutions ever, the only people who would survive would be the ones on planets without mass relays and then they could never use mass effect technology ever again meaning Everyone is stuck where they last stopped. Which effectively pushes the technology level back to the 21st century or so. Doesnt matter which galaxy, after a while it will still end up the way it started. It would be like you driving a bus until it catches on fire and then leaping onto another bus and so on and so forth. Also mass effect drives are not an effective intergalactic travel mechanism, they would literally gain charge until they started to discharge inside the ships hull killing everyone. THE END.

Also black holes form in a variety of ways, supernovas also are the process by which all elements heavier than hydrogen were created and then deposited in gas clouds for the later formation of planets. Our universe literally is fed by a cycle of destruction, without it there would be only stars and black holes.

I see that PhD in sci-fi cosmology is paying dividends. lulz

[NM_Che56]

I personally think they'll leave it there if only to explain that there are some things that scientists just don't know.

I know that in the idyllic future we know everything that's happening. That's not the case, and it's one of the reasons why MEU has so much appeal.

yep.

never underestimate the ability of writers in science fiction

[katamuro]

I see that PhD in sci-fi cosmology is paying dividends. lulz

 

I dont have a phd in anything. I was just pointing out some information that is easily found. I have of course simplified the method but it didn't seem the place to start explaining how planets and stars form.

[Sion1138]

Dark energy is a large scale thing, you can't have it affect just one galaxy.

[NM_Che56]

Dark energy is a large scale thing, you can't have it affect just one galaxy.

 

...explain how the use of Mass Effect tech in one galaxy affects another that doesn't.

[NM_Che56]

I think it's a good idea for revisit the definition(s) of science-fiction:
 
1) a form of fiction that draws imaginatively on scientific knowledge and speculation in its plot, setting, theme, etc.
 
2) a literary genre that makes imaginative use of scientific knowledge or conjecture
 
3) fiction based on imagined future scientific or technological advances and major social or environmental changes, frequently portraying space or time travel and life on other planets.
 
4)  fiction dealing principally with the impact of actual or imagined science on society or individuals or having a scientific factor as an essential orienting component
 
5) A literary or cinematic genre in which fantasy, typically based on speculative scientific discoveries or developments, environmental changes, space travel, or life on other planets, forms part of the plot or background.
 
6)   literary fantasy involving the imagined impact of science on society

 

 

Do you see a recurring theme?  starts with the letter "i"...lol

[Vazgen]

I'm genuinely interested in why do you think that dark energy idea from ME2 needs to be expanded upon. Personally, I think it should be left buried like it was in ME3

[katamuro]

I'm genuinely interested in why do you think that dark energy idea from ME2 needs to be expanded upon. Personally, I think it should be left buried like it was in ME3

 

Exactly, there is a reason why they decided it was not worth pursuing(a good decision on their part) and also it really creates a different theme. After all if dark energy thing comes from mass effect technology use, the one sane resolution is to stop using it not to attempt to migrate to another galaxy in hopes that that galaxy is not under the same conditions because the inhabitants of that galaxy are also using ME technology. 

After all a different galaxy does not mean a different universe and if there are so many intelligent technologically advanced species in our galaxy what is there to stop from the other galaxy from being exactly the same? Science fiction works best when it bends the rules of currently known physics but doesn't try to stretch them as far as they can get away with. 

Plus crossing between galaxies is a problem, 

A)cant use mass effect drive in between since no place to discharge so that limits it to sublight 

B)because A, the journey is going to take thousands of years 

C)the species in the new galaxy might be really more advanced than us AND xenophobic killing everyone as soon as they detect our approach

D)no one can live for so long so it means either a generation ship/ships or using of cryogenics, and since in between the galaxies you dont have much apart from stray hydrogen atoms(intergalactic space is MUCH MUCH more empty than interstellar which already is quite empty) so you need to bring ALL the resources for thousands of years of travel with you. 

E) A to D make it an incredibly costly and only remotely feasible, building the crucible was hard but mounting that kind of mission in the middle of the war AND coordinating it between various species is just too much. It would be like the soviet union together with the british trying to build a rocket to colonize Mars in 1942 to escape WW2 in faint hope that nothing happens on the way and that when you reach your destination its not going to be worse than what you escaped. 

[NM_Che56]

I'm genuinely interested in why do you think that dark energy idea from ME2 needs to be expanded upon. Personally, I think it should be left buried like it was in ME3

 

Let me take a moment to correct you on the whole idea that I think it NEEDS to be.  I'm not.  I'm just looking for some narrative hooks from the trilogy that leaves a door open for further exposition.  That's an example.  One of a few that are floating around in my head.  

 

It's an idea.  Like it? Great.  Don't? Great.  Trust me when I say this: If this is not the direction that Bioware takes, then, to quote eveyone's favorite character, "so be it".

[NM_Che56]

Exactly, there is a reason why they decided it was not worth pursuing(a good decision on their part) and also it really creates a different theme. After all if dark energy thing comes from mass effect technology use, the one sane resolution is to stop using it not to attempt to migrate to another galaxy in hopes that that galaxy is not under the same conditions because the inhabitants of that galaxy are also using ME technology. 

After all a different galaxy does not mean a different universe and if there are so many intelligent technologically advanced species in our galaxy what is there to stop from the other galaxy from being exactly the same? Science fiction works best when it bends the rules of currently known physics but doesn't try to stretch them as far as they can get away with. 

Plus crossing between galaxies is a problem, 

A)cant use mass effect drive in between since no place to discharge so that limits it to sublight 

B)because A, the journey is going to take thousands of years 

C)the species in the new galaxy might be really more advanced than us AND xenophobic killing everyone as soon as they detect our approach

D)no one can live for so long so it means either a generation ship/ships or using of cryogenics, and since in between the galaxies you dont have much apart from stray hydrogen atoms(intergalactic space is MUCH MUCH more empty than interstellar which already is quite empty) so you need to bring ALL the resources for thousands of years of travel with you. 

E) A to D make it an incredibly costly and only remotely feasible, building the crucible was hard but mounting that kind of mission in the middle of the war AND coordinating it between various species is just too much. It would be like the soviet union together with the british trying to build a rocket to colonize Mars in 1942 to escape WW2 in faint hope that nothing happens on the way and that when you reach your destination its not going to be worse than what you escaped. 

 

You did see the definitions of science fiction, yeah? LOL.

[Vazgen]

Let me take a moment to correct you on the whole idea that I think it NEEDS to be.  I'm not.  I'm just looking for some narrative hooks from the trilogy that leaves a door open for further exposition.  That's an example.  One of a few that are floating around in my head.  

 

It's an idea.  Like it? Great.  Don't? Great.  Trust me when I say this: If this is not the direction that Bioware takes, then, to quote eveyone's favorite character, "so be it".

Ah, I see, I mistook the thread's intention. I don't think Bioware should try to elaborate more on this issue, mostly because I doubt something can be done with it that doesn't seem like space magic and they already had enough space magic in ME3 IMO. Personally, I would've liked for them to explore the relations between the colonies and the Alliance (coming from that guy on Horizon). Having the colonies to form their own government and military might be an interesting setup.

[katamuro]

You did see the definitions of science fiction, yeah? LOL.

 

There is a difference between Science Fiction and Science Fantasy. They might share a lot but they are distinctly different. Science fiction is when something can be justified from within the universe created, something that still seems plausible. Science fantasy can really do whatever the frak it wants. 

And yes science fiction is quite broad in its definition which is why science fantasy like Star wars still is generally classified as scifi. However as with standard fiction there are subgenres. Mass Effect is a space opera/military scifi subgenre(I know a bit confusing, what with all the different classifications) which is based or at least tries to be more science than fantasy. 

SO, it would be quite strange for it to suddenly jump into a different subgenre and world setting. 

[NM_Che56]

Well, when biotics are supported by sound scientific theory and not codex, then let me know. LOL

[katamuro]

Well, when biotics are supported by sound scientific theory and not codex, then let me know. LOL

 

You did read when I said "from withing the universe created". Element zero doesnt exist(as far as we know) and in the universe where it exists its effects on life could be something like biotics. So it is justified from within the universe. 

Sending an expedition that would cost more than the crucible and wouldn't arrive for thousands of years if not longer is not.