29 réponses à ce sujet

[Shaftell]

What lingered in the Temple of Mythal? Was he just keeping quiet about everything? The Dread Wolf statue honoring him... The writing that Morrigan read but kept secret... I felt like he knew, the moment we stepped in, but he just played dumb.
On my second play through I took Solas to the Temple and I was confused how little he knew about anything...

[Reznore57]

Well yeah he probably knew but there's so much "I saw it in the Fade " excuse he can give.

He knows about the Well , otherwise he wouldn't scream "NO , don't ask me again".

[KaiserShep]

Not saying yes, but yes.

 

Well yeah he probably knew but there's so much "I saw it in the Fade " excuse he can give.

He knows about the Well , otherwise he wouldn't scream "NO , don't ask me again".

 

Inq: Solas, how did you know that this artifact would allow us to pass?

 

Solas: I have seen it at work in the Fade, held by the ancients of...a vast empire long forgotten.

 

Inq: Why the hesitation?

 

Solas: Just pondering on matters of the Fade.

 

Inq: OK, so how did you...

 

Solas: The Fade.

[In Exile]

Well yeah he probably knew but there's so much "I saw it in the Fade " excuse he can give.
He knows about the Well , otherwise he wouldn't scream "NO , don't ask me again".

Whenever Solas says "I saw it in the Fade" about ancient elves he tends to mean "I was 100% there and this is my dodge."

He does see things in the Fade. But he's clearly akin to a dreamer since he can forcibly take you into the Fade.

[Uirebhiril]

He does see things in the Fade. But he's clearly akin to a dreamer since he can forcibly take you into the Fade.

 

Am I not remembering when he did that? The Haven dream is the Inquisitor's, and the actual Fade trip is done by the Inquisitor as a hope of saving everyone from plummeting to their death.

 

To the actual question of the post, Solas does speak up when Morrigan flaps her yap about the statue of Fen'Harel, and he does comment about the other elven gods. He just can't come right out and say "well this place sure looks different from the last time I visited my friend Mythal..."

[LostScout61]

'People say he's a dreamer, but he's not the only one.  He'll tear the veil asunder, and the worrrrrllld will burn as one'.  My apologies to John Lennon, but for some reason I felt compelled to write that after reading this thread.  Solas knows a great deal, he just conceals what he knows from everyone else.

[NaclynE]

What lingered in the Temple of Mythal? Was he just keeping quiet about everything? The Dread Wolf statue honoring him... The writing that Morrigan read but kept secret... I felt like he knew, the moment we stepped in, but he just played dumb.
On my second play through I took Solas to the Temple and I was confused how little he knew about anything...

 

After finishing the game a few times and playing a few more characters he's just playing dumb. Here's an obvious hint:

 

Solas: "I am an apostate after all".

 

If you take him along long enough to anywhere I lost track of how many times he says this. I think there was a quote or something saying "the person making themselves the least suspect is actually the main suspect" or "sometimes the weakest people are the greatest enemies because they may hide their true power" or something.

[turuzzusapatuttu]

Always better than Blackwall...

 

Inquisitor: "You said all the Wardens are hearing the Calling. Does that include you? And also you, Blackwall?"

 

Alistair/Loghain/Stroud: "comments about the Calling"

 

Blackwall: "I do not fear the Calling, and worrying about it only gives it power"

 

... Are you even trying, Blackwall?

[In Exile]

Am I not remembering when he did that? The Haven dream is the Inquisitor's, and the actual Fade trip is done by the Inquisitor as a hope of saving everyone from plummeting to their death.

To the actual question of the post, Solas does speak up when Morrigan flaps her yap about the statue of Fen'Harel, and he does comment about the other elven gods. He just can't come right out and say "well this place sure looks different from the last time I visited my friend Mythal..."

There are two usuak ways to go to the Fade: while dreaming or while using lyrium (or blood magic) to take your consciousness there. There is also a way to tear the veil open to go to the Fade. The Inquisitor with the Anchor has that power (to tear the Veil, though we use it to fix it).

The Haven sequence to me looked to be something that Solas did to you. He says that we should talk elsewhere and you're suddenly in Haven.

Even if we imagine what was happening was Solas visiting you while dreaming (not him basically taking your consciousness while awake) that's a power we've only heard that dreamers have.

[In Exile]

Always better than Blackwall...

Inquisitor: "You said all the Wardens are hearing the Calling. Does that include you? And also you, Blackwall?"

Alistair/Loghain/Stroud: "comments about the Calling"

Blackwall: "I do not fear the Calling, and worrying about it only gives it power"

... Are you even trying, Blackwall?

But that stuff that every Warden says. He's probably parroting what the actual Blackwall told him. The GWs in this game are wierdly open with their secrets since we - the players - know them but in-setting this vague gibberish is the Warden MO.

[Uirebhiril]

The Haven sequence to me looked to be something that Solas did to you. He says that we should talk elsewhere and you're suddenly in Haven.

Even if we imagine what was happening was Solas visiting you while dreaming (not him basically taking your consciousness while awake) that's a power we've only heard that dreamers have.

 

I recall a conversation where the Anchor is used as an explanation of how the Inquisitor was able to manipulate the dream to do what they did. Especially interesting in the case of a dwarf inquisitor, and the reason that Solas comments that you continue to surprise him when you ask to speak to him. Ending up in Haven might be a different matter, but forcing them into the Fade is not quite what happened since they were already dreaming to begin with and sought Solas out.

 

There are a few scenes through the game where what happened to and by whom is ambiguous. Unintentionally or otherwise. This certainly seems to be one of them.

[medusa_hair]

i brought him to mythal one of the times and he got pretty ticked off when we stood in front of the statue of dread wolf and morrigan told the legend that she knew of it. Kind of like "how do you know, did you know them personally, typical non-elven jerk" kind of thing.

[Minty Magician]

What lingered in the Temple of Mythal? Was he just keeping quiet about everything? The Dread Wolf statue honoring him... The writing that Morrigan read but kept secret... I felt like he knew, the moment we stepped in, but he just played dumb.
On my second play through I took Solas to the Temple and I was confused how little he knew about anything...

 

He was in a way playing dumb.... though, not really. I've played through a couple of times now. He does comment on a lot...but, we're really barred from interacting with him a lot in this sequence,imo, but this is understandable since it could naturally take you to conversations that would ruin the stinger at the end.

 

When you first enter and are trying to understand the ancient elven text with Morigan he starts up saying "this is what it means...blah blah", but then goes quiet and doesn't elaborate any further. He does tell you about Falon'din's murderous ways and about Andruil (his most favorite goddess EVER! jk) actually being a goddess of sacrifice. Nevertheless, for the most part it's more of the same I-can't-really-tell-you-who-I-am nondescript mask that he wears throughout the game.

[SabreTastic]

Doesn't Solas say at one point that he wasn't sure if any part of Mythal was lingering on? Hoped, yes, but wasn't certain until they were actually there...and then he obviously doesn't want any part of it--who knows what that thing would do to him. What I find odd, and a little frustrating, is that he is adamant the Inquisitor shouldn't use it for some reason...and if the choice is between the Inquisitor and Morrigan...half the time I'm left wishing there was a 'Destroy' or 'Let the Sentinels Decide' option.

 

I just figured Solas was still trying to keep things sort of low-key. When he gets surprised by something--or pretends to be surprised--my impression of him is that he would prefer to take some time to process the situation and prepare a suitable response. So, of course, since he is "not an Ancient Elf," it would be to his benefit to allow Morrigan to read whatever she can and unless it says something like 'stepping on the tiles will cause you to die horribly in the next fifteen seconds,' it's probably in his best interest to just let things play out. Since Corypheus already knows about the Well, he can't just go 'Oh, look, Ancient Elven Ruins guarded by Ancient Elves. We should go.' And, regrettably, Morrigan does have a valid point that the Well is both in danger and a danger if they do not secure it for themselves.

 

Got a little side-tracked here, so...spoiler tags. Whoopsies.

 

Spoiler

I love it when he gets all grumpy about people trying to tell him about 'Ancient Elves and their Traditions.'

 

Still wanted more 'Inception,' though...not even going to pretend I wasn't disappointed.

"Let's talk about this later~!"
*Later...in...Haven (wait, what? Oh well!)*

"How awkward! You found me in the Fade."

Every time there's that conversation with Solas, I can't help but feel that he either 1) got ambushed by the Inquisitor and slapped something together quickly just so he could chuckle about 'Did you really forget that Haven is buried under a mountain of snow? Oh, Inquisitor' while not giving away any of his 'secrety secrets of secretness' or 2) he's just lying again when he says that bit about 'The Mark allows you to dream with such focus...you found me in the Fade! Impressive!'

[Minty Magician]

..... he's just lying again when he says that bit about 'The Mark allows you to dream with such focus...you found me in the Fade! Impressive!'[/spoiler]

 

 

I don't think he is lying in reguards to his surprise. I do think he took you there, but to me it is made clear that he is honestly astounded that a mortal is able to bear an anchor mark/mark of magic. Remember, he tells her/him that they "change everything"...this statement seems to concern what he previously believed was possible and impossible for mortal beings. >.>

[Paragonslustre]

I recall a conversation where the Anchor is used as an explanation of how the Inquisitor was able to manipulate the dream to do what they did. Especially interesting in the case of a dwarf inquisitor, and the reason that Solas comments that you continue to surprise him when you ask to speak to him. Ending up in Haven might be a different matter, but forcing them into the Fade is not quite what happened since they were already dreaming to begin with and sought Solas out.

 

There are a few scenes through the game where what happened to and by whom is ambiguous. Unintentionally or otherwise. This certainly seems to be one of them.

 

Yup, I'm pretty sure that the Inquisitor initiates the dream - I don't recall the exact conversation but solas says something like, 'to visit me here .....'  Hang on youtube is my friend.

 

Spoiler

 

Man, those elfman boobs hurt my eyes.  Yeah, that's how I interpret it anyway.

[Loghain Mac-Tir]

I wish we had the option of calling him out on his blatant BS. He makes the inquisitor and everybody else (particularly Leliana) look dumb!

 

Would've been cool to have an LA Noire style detective quest..

 

The thing is though, The Inquisitor doesn't know **** about the Wardens, sure YOU know, but not your character. So, you'll have to buy whatever bullsh!t he is selling. As for Leilana, she probably relies more on second hand information gathered by her spies rather than face to face conversations.

[Medhia_Nox]

Yes, Solas trolls the Inquisitor with the "in the Fade" crap because he's an arrogant douche who has no respect.  

 

Obtuse supernaturals (including mages) should be expunged with extreme prejudice. I cannot stand the "obscure wise person who is just so smart they've forgotten how to be straightforward and honest."

 

It's about the only thing Jowan was right about:  "What rubbish. Look, I can do it too. 'Woe there will be darkness, but lo' here comes the dawn!" 

[Gervaise]

I have to admit that the more times I play this game, the more Solas annoys me.    First run I was romancing him so missed out on conversations that were so obviously showing he was concealing something.   With my male Lavellan it is really irritating because there are so many times I want to quiz him some more but I'm not allowed to.   

 

The biggest disappointment/annoyance is when you ask him about what he has seen in the Fade, particularly when playing as an elf.    He tells you about some ancient dwarf ruins, some ancient Tevinter ruin, obscure spirits, barbarian tribes going to war and even some Qunari baker and yet never says a thing about ancient elves, beyond his initial assertions at the beginning.    Naturally this is what most interests my Dalish.     Yet he knows the orb is elven, he thinks the anchor could have affected my character and then when we get to the Temple of Mythal, he clearly knows far more about elven history than he has ever revealed to me.    Yet he claims he respects me and admires my wisdom?   

 

To give Solas the benefit of the doubt, I think much of the dialogue of the game was written with a human Inquisitor in mind and appropriate adjustments weren't made when they included all races.    A lot of Dorian's dialogue, particularly about slavery and poverty, make sense with a human noble in mind but are patronising and insulting to other races, especially a elf Inquisitor.      Solas' reluctance to reveal too much to a human Inquisitor is understandable.    His failure to divulge to an elven Inquisitor, particularly his LI, is shameful and makes a mockery of his claim to trust and respect you.  Then after the Temple the writer claims he was going to tell her but chickened out at the last minute; I'm sorry but I really don't get that vibe.    It is also charming that he offers to remove his LI's vallaslin but never even tells you their true meaning if you're not.    That is left to Corypheus at the end; which if you haven't had the conversation with Solas doesn't have the same impact since you think he is just mocking you for the sake of it, rather than it actually being true.

 

The most laughable bit with Solas is the decision over the well.    Essentially he says we ought to preserve/drink from it, clearly hates the idea of Morrigan doing so but refuses to do so himself.   This would lead you to think that by default you should drink and yet you get back to Skyhold and he claims he begged you not to.    Then the writer excuses this by saying he "forgot" to write that dialogue in at the Temple; seems a bit lame to me.    Essentially Solas couldn't tell you exactly why he didn't want you to drink because as with everything else, that might reveal too much of what he really knows.

 

The main thing about Solas is that if he is the Dread Wolf and not simply the spirit of Fen'Harel living in the body of an elf who was originally Solas, then everything he tells you about himself is just part of an elaborate cover story that he invented and why so often the mask slips in something he says and he has to use the "I saw it in the Fade" excuse to deflect your curiosity and if you press him too much you get "Solas disapproves".     If anything he is the embodiment of the Dalish idea of a trickster god, constantly wriggling out of a situation and working to his own agenda entirely.

[Bunny]

The biggest disappointment/annoyance is when you ask him about what he has seen in the Fade, particularly when playing as an elf.    He tells you about some ancient dwarf ruins, some ancient Tevinter ruin, obscure spirits, barbarian tribes going to war and even some Qunari baker and yet never says a thing about ancient elves, beyond his initial assertions at the beginning.    Naturally this is what most interests my Dalish.     Yet he knows the orb is elven, he thinks the anchor could have affected my character and then when we get to the Temple of Mythal, he clearly knows far more about elven history than he has ever revealed to me.    Yet he claims he respects me and admires my wisdom?   

 

This reminds me of those conversations at camp with Alistair in DAO.

 

Spoiler

He shares a lot of private feelings about Eamon, Duncan, and his childhood, but you never find out about his parentage until you go to Redcliffe.

 

Characters with secrets. It can be a gut-punch at first, but on repeat playthroughs, the experience is more pleasurable because they don't know we know.

 

[MaxQuartiroli]

 

Characters with secrets. It can be a gut-punch at first, but on repeat playthroughs, the experience is more pleasurable because they don't know we know.

 

 

For me is right the opposite: on subsequent playtroughs I feel even more dumb for having to play like I don't know when I actually know! xD

[Gervaise]

I get my enjoyment from annoying him without doing enough to really make him hate me.   So he still says how much he respects me and yet doesn't approve when I let the Wardens stay or embrace the whole I'm the Herald thing and start forgiving people in Andraste/the Maker's name.   I almost wish I'd taken him along to the final battle so he could hear me declare "I'm the chosen of the Maker."    I like to think his disapproval is because he knows I don't really mean it or alternatively he knows there is no Maker.  

 

Solas is not a team player; he disapproves if you say you will listen to other people about how to use the Well.  Bloody minded individualism is what he approves of.  Plus if you don't drink the question seems rather irrelevant since the ultimate fate of all that wisdom lies in Morrigan's hands and as I rather suspected, she clears off once Cory is defeated, so it matters not what you intended to do with it.

 

Still he did find you a really nice castle to live in; I'm still waiting to see what the catch is to that particular piece of generosity on his part.

[Bunny]

Do you think he led the Inquisitor to Skyhold with malicious intent? He didn't look happy at the time, but maybe that's just his face.