129 réponses à ce sujet

[cap and gown]

So, after the Rannoch arc is over I go up to the cockpit to talk to EDI and Joker. EDI is all pouty that I sided with the Quarians over the Geth. Then I get another dialogue prompt where EDI goes on to talk about how the Geth were not individuals. That got me to thinking about Legion's talks in ME2 about the Dyson Sphere and the Codex entries on the Geth. Suddenly it occurred to me that if you kill the Geth, you are only killing one individual. Only the Geth Consensus -- all Geth taken together -- can be seen as an individual. None of the separate programs have any individuality. Thus, if you side with the Geth you are destroying 17 million individuals for the survival of just one (before the Reaper code upgrade). Uh, EDI, saving 17 million individuals at the cost of just one seems like a no-brainer to me, organic or no.

[GrandAdmiralThrawn]

The issue with this is that, once they get Reaper code fragments, all Geth would become individuals.  Plus we see them act as individuals when Legion talks about how half his programs want to blow up the Heretics, and half don't.  That would mean you're choosing between 17 million quarians and 500 spagilion geth.

 

The real question is (ME3 Ending SPOILERS): if the geth are doomed to either die or be controlled at the end, you really aren't saving them, just delaying their demise.

[Quarian Master Race]

It is a no brainer. The game is forced to use feels to get you to turn off your brain long enough to even consider software programs to be comparable in value to sapient, sentient beings.

 

I'd save a race of nonsapient animals or even bacteria before artificial creations that can be recreated with relatively little effort, and that before the software programs had continually proven themselves to be a threat to all life in the galaxy on multiple occasions.

[cap and gown]

 

I'd save a race of nonsapient animals or even bacteria before artificial creations that can be recreated with relatively little effort, and that before the software programs had continually proven themselves to be a threat to all life in the galaxy on multiple occasions.

 

That's the thing though, a true AI, at least in the MEU, cannot be recreated. Each AI is unique with its own experiences and own outlook. That's what differentiates the Geth from a true AI. They are not unique and can be recreated. You should read the Codex entry you get on the Geth after Legion talks about the Dyson Sphere in ME2.

[God]

So, after the Rannoch arc is over I go up to the cockpit to talk to EDI and Joker. EDI is all pouty that I sided with the Quarians over the Geth. Then I get another dialogue prompt where EDI goes on to talk about how the Geth were not individuals. That got me to thinking about Legion's talks in ME2 about the Dyson Sphere and the Codex entries on the Geth. Suddenly it occurred to me that if you kill the Geth, you are only killing one individual. Only the Geth Consensus -- all Geth taken together -- can be seen as an individual. None of the separate programs have any individuality. Thus, if you side with the Geth you are destroying 17 million individuals for the survival of just one (before the Reaper code upgrade). Uh, EDI, saving 17 million individuals at the cost of just one seems like a no-brainer to me, organic or no.

 

I think that that one gestalt individual, being hyper advanced and technologically ascendant over its creators, is worth more than 17 million lives. That one individual can wield entire fleets and armies as extensions of its body.

 

To me, that's going to be much more useful than a bunch of crunchy suit people who die if you sneeze on them flying rickety ships that break easy. Especially since most of them aren't built for combat.

[God]

It is a no brainer. The game is forced to use feels to get you to turn off your brain long enough to even consider software programs to be comparable in value to sapient, sentient beings.

 

I'd save a race of nonsapient animals or even bacteria before artificial creations that can be recreated with relatively little effort, and that before the software programs had continually proven themselves to be a threat to all life in the galaxy on multiple occasions.

 

I'd save the thing of greater physical value that has the capacity to provide greater long-term advancement. Over people who may or may not have much utility.

[ImaginaryMatter]

So, after the Rannoch arc is over I go up to the cockpit to talk to EDI and Joker. EDI is all pouty that I sided with the Quarians over the Geth. Then I get another dialogue prompt where EDI goes on to talk about how the Geth were not individuals. That got me to thinking about Legion's talks in ME2 about the Dyson Sphere and the Codex entries on the Geth. Suddenly it occurred to me that if you kill the Geth, you are only killing one individual. Only the Geth Consensus -- all Geth taken together -- can be seen as an individual. None of the separate programs have any individuality. Thus, if you side with the Geth you are destroying 17 million individuals for the survival of just one (before the Reaper code upgrade). Uh, EDI, saving 17 million individuals at the cost of just one seems like a no-brainer to me, organic or no.

 

Either way it's the extinction of an entire race of things that think. I don't value the Quarians over the Geth just because they are closer to my own, it's 17 million vs 1 super individual. As far as the war effort is concerned though the Geth are the better choice (a single Geth dreadnought seems worth more than the entire Quarian fleet). Plus, the Geth seem like the more reliable sort.

[justafan]

Ya, this used to be my main argument whenever a good Geth vs. Quarian debate came up.  Essentially, you have to look at who you will be saving, what they are worth, and what are their sins.  If you want to look at value to the war, Hackett specifically says you need help with logistics.  The Quarians are far better equipped to help in this regard with the largest fleet in the galaxy.  Geth ships don't have life support, so would be useless evacuating civilians and transporting organic matter be it food or people.  However, Geth provide much better warships but without the logistic value.  Since the war assets are basically the same, I'm content in saying both fleets are about equal strength when it comes to the war effort, they just have strengths in different areas.

 

This leaves the ethical question.  On the one hand, you have approximately 17 million Quarian men, women, and children.  None of them have ever specifically tried to kill you, one of them has no regard for your well-being or collateral damage when his species is on the line, and another has most likely been loyally at your side since day one (unless you got her killed).  We can assume that the millions of children are innocent.

 

On the other hand, I would argue that there have only ever been 3 sentient Geth.  There is the consensus, the heretics, and arguably Legion due to his unique situation.  2/3 of all sentient Geth are confirmed to have agreed to help exterminate all organic life, 1/3 needed no prompting.  100% of Geth have participated in genocide, and they have been content to kill every single organic they have met for 300 years with only one exception.  So that really only leaves one Geth individual (and by far the weakest of the three) who can possibly be called an ally, and he spends the entirety of ME3 twisting the truth or telling lies of omission.

 

So ya, the choice for me has always been a no-brainer.  Sure I will give peace a chance if I can.  No species deserves to be destroyed on principle.  But if push comes to shove, I'm on the side of the Quarians.  Also sorry for the long reply, I haven't gotten to go on a Geth vs. Quarian rant in awhile.

[New Kid]

It isn't a no-brainer. You are preventing the injured party from establishing themselves as a true race.

[Vazgen]

No-brainer for sure. Destroy the flashlights without hesitation. 

[God]

No-brainer for sure. Destroy the flashlights without hesitation. 

 

Said flashlights are more useful than the bugs in the suits that die if you sneeze on them. If we're talking about sheer practical rationality, the Geth are leaps and bounds superior to the Quarians in every conceivable way.

[Vazgen]

Said flashlights are more useful than the bugs in the suits that die if you sneeze on them. If we're talking about sheer practical rationality, the Geth are leaps and bounds superior to the Quarians in every conceivable way.

Uh-huh. Even after the said flashlights have allied with the Reapers twice in the past and are susceptible to hacking (which the Reapers happen to be great at). Quarian fleet has a ton of dreadnoughts, comparable to turian numbers. They will not be used for ground warfare. 

[God]

Uh-huh. Even after the said flashlights have allied with the Reapers twice in the past and are susceptible to hacking (which the Reapers happen to be great at). Quarian fleet has a ton of dreadnoughts, comparable to turian numbers. They will not be used for ground warfare. 

 

A very small percentage of the Geth allied with the Reapers the first time. The vast, vast majority rejected the Reapers.

 

As well, the Geth submitted to the Reapers when they had no other choice as the Quarians attacked. What were they supposed to do, sit and die? 

 

And it is explicitly stated (for whatever reason admittedly) that the Geth, post-upgrade, will not be capable of being hacked. 

 

The Quarian fleet does not have a 'ton' of dreadnoughts, nor is the number comparable to the Turian numbers. They are stated as being a fleet made up of outdated, outmoded, and rickety ships that are more or less barely holding together. The biggest ships are described as glass cannons, which pack the firepower of a dreadnought, without actually having the other advantages of such.

 

Meanwhile, the Geth are explicitly mentioned to have a comparable number of dreadnoughts as the Turians, as well as having nearly every piece of technology applicable in a combat environment. 

 

The Geth are also capable of exo-combat and ground combat, and capable at levels beyond what the Quarians are able to do. 

 

Every point you've mentioned is incorrect.

[Quarian Master Race]

That's the thing though, a true AI, at least in the MEU, cannot be recreated. Each AI is unique with its own experiences and own outlook. That's what differentiates the Geth from a true AI. They are not unique and can be recreated. You should read the Codex entry you get on the Geth after Legion talks about the Dyson Sphere in ME2.

Don't patronize, I'm aware of how AI works in the MEU and that's exactly why I didn't refer to them as such. They are nonsentient software programs that can imitate sapience via a process similar to swarm robotics.

 

I think that that one gestalt individual, being hyper advanced and technologically ascendant over its creators, is worth more than 17 million lives. That one individual can wield entire fleets and armies as extensions of its body.

 

To me, that's going to be much more useful than a bunch of crunchy suit people who die if you sneeze on them flying rickety ships that break easy. Especially since most of them aren't built for combat.

Highly debatable and depends upon what point in time in the development of the two civilizations you are using as your frame of reference. Using the timeline of ME3, before getting Reaper upgrades, that civilization consisting of billions of platforms and trillions of programs drawing resources from a huge empire of star systems was being utterly annihilated by a meager population of its creators that wouldn't even fill the modern day New York City metropolitan area, and who appropriate natural resources on a hand to mouth basis. It wasn't even a contest. Han'Gerrel states that within 17 days the geth had been pushed back to the home system.

To make a metaphor using the same scale, that would be like Finland starting WW3 and annihiliting the allied armies of every other nation state on Earth within two weeks. The only explanations would be 1) Finland is on a much higher technological tier or 2) the other nations of Earth are populated by woeful incompetents not even worthy of being called intelligent life.

Now, of course the geth sacrifice their self-determination for Reaper technology and can then stand up on equal terms with a civilization of its creators that is about 1000 times smaller than its own, fair enough. What is to stop the quarians from similarly using Reaper technology to "improve" themselves as Cerberus is able to do with humans? Ultimately, the organics have much greater potential.

 

I'd save the thing of greater physical value that has the capacity to provide greater long-term advancement. Over people who may or may not have much utility.

It depends upon how you define value. The geth (after Reaper upgrades) have a massive advantage in material strength, no doubt, but that is only one aspect of their utility to, in this case, fight a war that cannot be won by conventional means anyway. The geth had already proven themselves in previous conflicts to be a society reliant on brute force of numbers and mass of material to achieve its goals. They are inflexible and not particularly innovative due to the complete dearth of the concept of individuality in their society. In terms of what they have for manpower and resources, they are extremely inefficient at using them, similar to Communist societies in our own history.

The geth's contribution to the war would thus be measured primarily in being more bodies to throw into the meat grinder. Now, if that's what your war effort lacks than they would be quite useful. However, in the context of this conflict conventional forces are a delaying action for completing the crucible. You should already have the krogan as your cannon fodder ground forces, as well as the turian and human fleets. What you really need is the logistical capability to supply these forces, and brilliant minds to work on the Crucible. What would also be useful are forces who are adept at executing strategies of asymmetric warfare against a numerically and materially superior foe.

Given that, I would argue that the quarians are indeed more useful than the geth from a perspective of utility, and the war assets score for the two civilizations agrees with me (provided you make the proper choices during Legion's LM, and during the Xen-Tali and Gerrel-Raan arguments, the quarians end up with a higher score than is achievable by the geth). Of course, being a pragmatist I always get both, because then I can use the geth as tools and discard them when the Reapers are eliminated and they themselves become a threat.

Then there is the subjective quantifier of "greater physical value that has the capacity to provide greater long-term advancement". Why would you rank the geth over the quarians in this? The former civilization has contributed next to nothing to galactic society in its 300 year history and has a policy of isolationism, while the latter literally invented the former and have proven themselves to be extremely resourceful and capable of impressive engineering, cultural and scientific feats while intergrating with the rest of the galaxy at large (until they were artificially prevented from doing so).

It's really not a stretch to assume that a generation or so after the war, the quarians could have simply recreated and improved upon their creations, whereas in the opposite situation that and any other knowledge is pretty much lost forever unless you have millions of years to recreate the conditions for quarian evolution. In return you get the geth, who at best are going to return to isolationism, building their megastructure, and contributing nothing the galaxy at large, and at worst are a massive threat should another group of "heretics" pop up and decide that organic civilization has no right to exist.

 

It isn't a no-brainer. You are preventing the injured party from establishing themselves as a true race.

You have conflict analyzation skill of a 5 year old child who had their toy taken away and uses it a moral justification for lashing out. There is no injured party. The geth made a decision to stop doing what they were designed for and ignored the orders of their creators. Their creators made the decision that their technology malfunctioning this manner was unacceptable. The two were unwilling to acquiesce to the demands of the other, ergo, conflict arises. Anything else is subjective and irrelevant moral blithering.

[Mordokai]

My Shepard saved the geth because they were able to provide better fighting force against the Reapers. At the war for very survival, that counts more than sentiments.

 

I would just like to say I feel dirty for basically agreeing with Massively here.

 

I, the player, destroyed the quarians because, save for Kal'Reegar, there wasn't a single of them that I liked. Quite frankly, they annoyed me greatly. That and Legion was miles better character than Tali was, even if ME3 did a lot to destroy that.

 

So yeah, a meta and in game choice.

[Quarian Master Race]

My Shepard saved the geth because they were able to provide better fighting force against the Reapers. At the war for very survival, that counts more than sentiments.

Except they don't. The two make all but equal contributions to the war effort, albiet in different manners (brawn vs brains, so to speak). As for choosing based on sentiments....

I, the player, destroyed the quarians because, save for Kal'Reegar, there wasn't a single of them that I liked. Quite frankly, they annoyed me greatly. That and Legion was miles better character than Tali was, even if ME3 did a lot to destroy that.

 

^that's pretty much a textbook definition of it. You genocide 17 million people because of the 6 or so you know, you don't like 5 of them. Subjectively, I hate every geth that isn't Legion, because the other however many billion of them ("Heretics" and otherwise) have been trying to kill me for 3 games straight for seemingly no reason and have made allies with the enemy on multiple occasions (though arguably, this is a far more logical than sentimental conclusion) but I recognize this as an opinion.

Note that I'm not criticizing, because making the choices that you want based on a variety of factors both logical and sentimental is the whole point of playing an RPG, but you can't criticize your opponents for being overly sentimental while doing the exact same thing.

[Winterking]

Usually, it's peace between the geths and the quarians. Often with Shepard saying he will let the Geth wipe out the quarians if they don't fall in line.

 

On one playthrough, my Shepard had a hard time trusting AIs so she sold Legion to Cerberus and and supported the Quarian war against the Geth so when it came to choosing between the quarians and the geth it was a no brainer.

 

Plus better play safe than sorry and prevent another synthetic war in future by wiping out the geth. Of course at that moment she had no idea that Crucible would wipe the geth too...

 

 

 

[Kynare]

Well, that's why I saved them both.

 

Edit: Reputation check aside, if left with no choice, my Shepard would have supported the Geth since she gave the Quarians multiple chances to back out of the war that they forced right in the middle of the Reaper invasion. In that particular moment, the Geth would have been acting in self-defense, and they arguably had been since the start of the conflict, even if it was in an instinctual manner.

 

Sorry Tali. But she knew just as well as Shepard that the Admiralty Board brought it on themselves. 300 years after the Morning War, even with evidence that they can adapt to a new way of living, evidence that the Geth were evolved, sentient beings, capable and willing for a diplomatic resolution, and having an offer of peaceful negotiation handed to them on a platter by Tali, they still refused to compromise. Their ancestors couldn't be blamed for what happened to them, but the quarians now could be responsible for their inability to lay down their guns. Among other things.

 

In any case, I don't really care about the value of their assets. It's not like Shepard could put on her tiny glasses, grab a seat and hash out the numbers just as Legion was uploading the Reaper code. It's more of a moral choice than anything. From her experience in the consensus and knowing Legion, she perceived them to be just as deserving of life as any sentient being.

Modifié par Mistral, 09 avril 2015 - 06:31 .

[Vazgen]

A very small percentage of the Geth allied with the Reapers the first time. The vast, vast majority rejected the Reapers.

 

As well, the Geth submitted to the Reapers when they had no other choice as the Quarians attacked. What were they supposed to do, sit and die? 

 

And it is explicitly stated (for whatever reason admittedly) that the Geth, post-upgrade, will not be capable of being hacked. 

 

The Quarian fleet does not have a 'ton' of dreadnoughts, nor is the number comparable to the Turian numbers. They are stated as being a fleet made up of outdated, outmoded, and rickety ships that are more or less barely holding together. The biggest ships are described as glass cannons, which pack the firepower of a dreadnought, without actually having the other advantages of such.

 

Meanwhile, the Geth are explicitly mentioned to have a comparable number of dreadnoughts as the Turians, as well as having nearly every piece of technology applicable in a combat environment. 

 

The Geth are also capable of exo-combat and ground combat, and capable at levels beyond what the Quarians are able to do. 

 

Every point you've mentioned is incorrect.

OK, let's take a look at War Assets.

 

Geth Fleet - Military strength 300

Many geth vessels are built to explore, mine, or provide transport between factories and space stations. But every geth ship, regardless of purpose, is also capable of engaging hostile forces. Unbound by the Treaty of Farixen, the synthetic intelligences built almost as many dreadnoughts as the Turians [sic]. The software running these ships is in the geth themselves. High advanced electronic security measures and cyber warfare suites bolster already formidable firepower.

 

Geth Corps - Military strength 300

Until recently, the geth expected nothing but violence from organics, and designed themselves accordingly. All geth platforms are armed, shielded, and built to withstand combat. When they're on the battlefield, enemy tactics and positions are swapped instantaneously between the AIs. The geth also employ turrets and drones--"expendable" hardware support to keep losses of networked platforms to a minimum. The result is the largest, and perhaps best equipped, infantry in the galaxy.

 

Quarian Heavy Fleet - Military strength 200

Any pirates or mercenaries attempting to prey on the quarian flotilla must contend with the Heavy Fleet's cruisers, frigates, fighters, and carriers. The Heavy Fleet is led by Admiral Han'Gerrel. The admiral firmly believes in the importance of ship maintenance and regular training exercises, and actively encourages those on pilgrimage to seek out technology that will upgrade his fleet's capabilities. As a result, cutting-edge technology is often found in the best of the Heavy Fleet's vessels.

 

Quarian Civilian Fleet - Military strength 200

The Civilian Fleet makes up most of the quarian flotilla. Properly coordinated, the fleet compensates for its lack of dedicated warships with its sheer numbers. Even its smallest crafts are equipped with ship-to-ship weaponry. The civilian liveships, enormous floating gardens that produce food for the quarians, have also been fitted with massive Thanix cannons to provide heavy firepower.

 

Quarian Patrol Fleet - Military strength 200

The Patrol Fleet are scouts, flying ahead of the flotilla on the lookout for mineable bodies and hostile forces. They scan space with VI-systems that pick up heat signatures or other signs of foreign vessels. As the first ships to be targeted in any conflict, some of the quarians' finest engineers monitor and repair the Patrol Fleet's shielding. The fleet's commanding officer, Admiral Shala'Raan, relies on speed and shields during combat.

 

As you can see, the total EMS number is the same for both groups, but if you're looking for more ships, the quarians are a much better choice. If you want more ground troops, sure, geth are a better choice. 

 

They are not susceptible to hacking when upgraded? Take a look at this: Geth serving refreshments. Or maybe Shepard casually hacking them with Sabotage? One hacked Prime in the middle of an Alliance squad can kill that squad, even if it regains control of the platform later on. 

[God]

I'll be honest and state that I really don't see much of a use for the Quarians, nor do I see a utility for them that can't be met by the Geth.

 

The Geth have as much logistical capability as the Quarians, and they are significantly less vulnerable (and flying in much more stable craft). 

 

Post-upgrade, you really have no way to say whether the Geth are incapable or not of independent and innovative capability. 

 

You're not highlighting any particular advantage the Quarians have over the Geth. You're stating a characteristic that the Quarians have and implying that the Geth do not have it, but I'm failing to see the basis for where this is the case.

 

I think you're also mis-stating the value of the Geth. They're a lot more than 'meat for the grinder', especially when compared to the extremely fragile nature of the Quarians in comparison (both in space and planetary combat). You have mechanized, intelligent platforms capable of deploying in hostile environments with maximum efficiency that not even the Krogan or Turians can jump into. Said intelligent platforms are capable of self-repair, and are rather durable. They're also capable of processing information and communicating with each other at light-speed, and capable of coordinating on a level that no organic can match.

 

As for culture, I do indeed throw aside the Quarian culture for the Geth. Because, to repeat sentiments, I question the nature and veracity of your statements about the Quarians achievements, especially in the face of the boon that is possible from what the Geth can offer post-upgrade. And you're failing to account the Quarians own insulated culture, compared to the Geth's rather practical approach to isolationism: They don't believe that anyone will accept them, and they do have history and experience to back them up.

 

As for the Geth's capabilities compared to the response of the Quarians during the opening stage of the war, it's explicitly stated that the Quarians have a specialized EMP device that is capable of blocking and disrupting Geth programming.

 

To counter your Finland/WW3 statement, it would be more akin to the Fins going into each country and releasing a very potent, very virulent airborne disease that utterly debilitates and destroys the entire population of each country. And you're leaving out the element of surprise, where the Geth are focusing their resources elsewhere (like preparing their fleets and armies for war against the Reapers).

 

I think you're also aggrandizing a theory for the future of the Quarians and the Geth. 

[themikefest]

Without the geth allying with the reapers, the Quarians would've defeated them. 

[God]

OK, let's take a look at War Assets.

 

Geth Fleet - Military strength 300

Many geth vessels are built to explore, mine, or provide transport between factories and space stations. But every geth ship, regardless of purpose, is also capable of engaging hostile forces. Unbound by the Treaty of Farixen, the synthetic intelligences built almost as many dreadnoughts as the Turians [sic]. The software running these ships is in the geth themselves. High advanced electronic security measures and cyber warfare suites bolster already formidable firepower.

 

Geth Corps - Military strength 300

Until recently, the geth expected nothing but violence from organics, and designed themselves accordingly. All geth platforms are armed, shielded, and built to withstand combat. When they're on the battlefield, enemy tactics and positions are swapped instantaneously between the AIs. The geth also employ turrets and drones--"expendable" hardware support to keep losses of networked platforms to a minimum. The result is the largest, and perhaps best equipped, infantry in the galaxy.

 

Quarian Heavy Fleet - Military strength 200

Any pirates or mercenaries attempting to prey on the quarian flotilla must contend with the Heavy Fleet's cruisers, frigates, fighters, and carriers. The Heavy Fleet is led by Admiral Han'Gerrel. The admiral firmly believes in the importance of ship maintenance and regular training exercises, and actively encourages those on pilgrimage to seek out technology that will upgrade his fleet's capabilities. As a result, cutting-edge technology is often found in the best of the Heavy Fleet's vessels.

 

Quarian Civilian Fleet - Military strength 200

The Civilian Fleet makes up most of the quarian flotilla. Properly coordinated, the fleet compensates for its lack of dedicated warships with its sheer numbers. Even its smallest crafts are equipped with ship-to-ship weaponry. The civilian liveships, enormous floating gardens that produce food for the quarians, have also been fitted with massive Thanix cannons to provide heavy firepower.

 

Quarian Patrol Fleet - Military strength 200

The Patrol Fleet are scouts, flying ahead of the flotilla on the lookout for mineable bodies and hostile forces. They scan space with VI-systems that pick up heat signatures or other signs of foreign vessels. As the first ships to be targeted in any conflict, some of the quarians' finest engineers monitor and repair the Patrol Fleet's shielding. The fleet's commanding officer, Admiral Shala'Raan, relies on speed and shields during combat.

 

As you can see, the total EMS number is the same for both groups, but if you're looking for more ships, the quarians are a much better choice. If you want more ground troops, sure, geth are a better choice. 

 

They are not susceptible to hacking when upgraded? Take a look at this: Geth serving refreshments. Or maybe Shepard casually hacking them with Sabotage? One hacked Prime in the middle of an Alliance squad can kill that squad, even if it regains control of the platform later on. 

 

As I can see, the Quarians might (might) have a larger number of ships, but I believe I'm going to go with Geth for quality. Same for the troops. 

 

And the Geth at this point have not been upgraded. Quite the difference both pre and post. I don't think you're understanding the difference that the Reaper code does to the Geth. Or being intentionally ignorant. One of the two.

[Winterking]

As I can see, the Quarians might (might) have a larger number of ships, but I believe I'm going to go with Geth for quality. Same for the troops. 

 

And the Geth at this point have not been upgraded. Quite the difference both pre and post. I don't think you're understanding the difference that the Reaper code does to the Geth. Or being intentionally ignorant. One of the two.

I might be mistaken, but I think the Geth war assets appear post Rannoch.  That would imply that Reaper code upgrades are working properly.

 

[God]

I might be mistaken, but I think the Geth war assets appear post Rannoch.  That would imply that Reaper code upgrades are working properly.

 

 

They do. And they make the Geth incapable of being hacked.

[Vazgen]

As I can see, the Quarians might (might) have a larger number of ships, but I believe I'm going to go with Geth for quality. Same for the troops.

And the Geth at this point have not been upgraded. Quite the difference both pre and post. I don't think you're understanding the difference that the Reaper code does to the Geth. Or being intentionally ignorant. One of the two.

Your choice is purely subjective. The numbers are clear - both sides have the same contribution to the war effort. Quarians can actually contribute more if appropriate choices are made.

I understand it quite well. What you don't understand (or pretend not to) is that the geth are already upgraded prior to disabling the signal. The difference is that they are under Reaper control. "This unit still carries the remnants of the Old Machine upgrade code"