547 réponses à ce sujet

[DomeWing333]

Yup you can see pretty well that there is nothing beneath the mud, so both genders have the same treatment when it comes to the upper body. The only thing I see here is that the male avvar are more sexualise than the female NPCs but hey with so much **** female characters get it is an welcome surprise to me.

I would hesitate to even call the male version "sexualized," which implies that it was specifically designed with fan-service-y intentions, when it was actually based off of the concept art for Alamarri. That's just what characters from that culture wear. Even if it is a display of sexuality, it's a display of sexuality for others in that culture and society, not necessarily for the fans. People shouldn't automatically associate nudity with sexuality and sexuality with fan-service. 

[Dreamer]

So which category does this one belong to?

 

Spoiler

 

Not sexualized.

[Panda]

So which category does this one belong to?

 

Spoiler

 

Barbaric warrior would be my guess

 

This one:

 

Spoiler

 

 

 

Is fanservicey in my opinion, but that's ok cause FF is like that with female characters too ^^

[TheRatPack55]

I would hesitate to even call the male version "sexualized," which implies that it was specifically designed with fan-service-y intentions, when it was actually based off of the concept art for Alamarri. That's just what characters from that culture wear. Even if it is a display of sexuality, it's a display of sexuality for others in that culture and society, not necessarily for the fans. People shouldn't automatically associate nudity with sexuality and sexuality with fan-service. 

 

I think this is a bit of an iffy concept when dealing with fiction, because, well, those are not real cultures. Those are things thought up by developers, in this case mostly western people with full awareness of modern standards, who go 'hey, let's design these characters to wear revealing clothing as part of their culture'.

 

I'm not saying it automatically results in something bad, just that the element of fan-service will probably always be present to some extent.

[DomeWing333]

I think this is a bit of an iffy concept when dealing with fiction, because, well, those are not real cultures. Those are things thought up by developers, in this case mostly western people with full awareness of modern standards, who go 'hey, let's design these characters to wear revealing clothing as part of their culture'.

 

I'm not saying it automatically results in something bad, just that the element of fan-service will probably always be present to some extent.

Well they're based on real cultures and, particularly in the case of RPGs with heavy lore, designed to simulate real cultures. I just think it does a disservice to the effort that goes into crafting a fleshed-out fictional world to automatically assume that every display of skin and sexuality in it is always intended to titillate the audience. I don't think Vivienne has a low-cut dress because the devs thought the fans would find that sexy. I think she has a low-cut dress because that's how her character rolls. Because she likes to show off her beauty and elegance to the characters around her, not to the gamer.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

It's times like these I'm so glad I don't really get this sexualization thing.

[Dreamer]

It's times like these I'm so glad I don't really get this sexualization thing.

 

No one does--which is why it's a discussion at all.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

No one does--which is why it's a discussion at all.

The people you are referring to don't get it in the sense they don't understand how it is an issue. I understand how it is an issue, I just don't get it in the sense I literally don't experience the intended reaction the people who do it do it for. 

[Rizilliant]

-Snip-

 

Yea, you definitely live in a fantasy land.. Cass actually looks like a woman.. The thing you linked tyo the right, looked like some kids Anime ****** cartoon.. Its not reall looking in the least, or at all attractive.. Hips, waists, nor breasts look like those in real life, whatsoever!  When you hit puberty, and start meeting "women" you may further understand.. The gi4rls you school with, and the 3rd/5th style body mods you play with in your Skyrims, or whatever, are severely hampering your views on what is real.. 

 

\Full disclosure, i HATE the game, and pretty much everything Bioware/EA has done for atleast 4 releases..

[MyKingdomCold]

I don't know if VIckVeel, "Not Brevnau" lives in a fantasy land or not.  But if he thinks Cassandra looks like a man, I want to see what he, his father, brothers, male friends... look like.  Yeesh

[FKA_Servo]

I don't know if VIckVeel, "Not Brevnau" lives in a fantasy land or not.  But if he thinks Cassandra looks like a man, I want to see what he, his father, brothers, male friends... look like.  Yeesh

 

[In Exile]

But one thing I'd like to note about the picture of the Avvar scout is that her nudity doesn't really sexualize her at all to me. The fact that she's topless isn't titillating or meant to be. It just shows her to be a savage warrior from an exotic culture.

 

Hey, don't judge.  

[The Oracle]

I just hope that Bioware keep making characters that have well thought out designs made to fit the type of person their story casts them as.

 

I mean, take a moment to actually imagine Cassandra looking and dressing like that "example" comparison shot on the first post and being the character she is, saying everything she says.

 

Dragon slayer, devout Andrastian, Left-Hand to the Divine (essentially Thedas's Pope) walking around like her waist might snap in two from a light breeze and wearing so little clothing she'd have frozen solid in Haven before the Inquisitor has had a chance to fall out of the Breach. It's such a ridiculous thought it's hilarious.

 

In fact, I kind of look forward to to when someone mods her into such an impossibly sexualised stereotype. The resulting youtube videos will be comedy gold.

[In Exile]

I just hope that Bioware keep making characters that have well thought out designs made to fit the type of person their story casts them as.

 

I mean, take a moment to actually imagine Cassandra looking and dressing like that "example" comparison shot on the first post and being the character she is, saying everything she says.

 

Dragon slayer, devout Andrastian, Left-Hand to the Divine (essentially Thedas's Pope) walking around like her waist might snap in two from a light breeze and wearing so little clothing she'd have frozen solid in Haven before the Inquisitor has had a chance to fall out of the Breach. It's such a ridiculous thought it's hilarious.

 

In fact, I kind of look forward to to when someone mods her into such an impossibly sexualised stereotype. The resulting youtube videos will be comedy gold.

 

She's obviously so hot the actual temperature can't bother her.  

[Hanako Ikezawa]

I do like how they made it so each character had their our style to their armors, other than the faction armors which were the same on everyone. I hope that continues, with maybe a little more options than just the five or so they had per character. 

 

For the protagonist themselves, I think Bioware should offer outfits that cover the whole spectrum. The outfits of the companions match their personas, so since the PC can e shaped by the player they should have a variety of options.  

[9TailsFox]

Yea, you definitely live in a fantasy land.. Cass actually looks like a woman.. The thing you linked tyo the right, looked like some kids Anime ****** cartoon.. Its not reall looking in the least, or at all attractive.. Hips, waists, nor breasts look like those in real life, whatsoever!  When you hit puberty, and start meeting "women" you may further understand.. The gi4rls you school with, and the 3rd/5th style body mods you play with in your Skyrims, or whatever, are severely hampering your views on what is real.. 

 

\Full disclosure, i HATE the game, and pretty much everything Bioware/EA has done for atleast 4 releases..

Tell to yourself "I am playing video game not looking for wife" No repeat it until you get it.

[Grieving Natashina]

I just hope that Bioware keep making characters that have well thought out designs made to fit the type of person their story casts them as.

 

I mean, take a moment to actually imagine Cassandra looking and dressing like that "example" comparison shot on the first post and being the character she is, saying everything she says.

 

Dragon slayer, devout Andrastian, Left-Hand to the Divine (essentially Thedas's Pope) walking around like her waist might snap in two from a light breeze and wearing so little clothing she'd have frozen solid in Haven before the Inquisitor has had a chance to fall out of the Breach. It's such a ridiculous thought it's hilarious.

 

In fact, I kind of look forward to to when someone mods her into such an impossibly sexualised stereotype. The resulting youtube videos will be comedy gold.

Well, the modders can't create custom meshes, only modify those within the game.  They wouldn't be able to give Cass long hair, although they'd be able to change hair and eye color.  I don't think they can create the scantily clad armor, since that model doesn't exist in the game.  So the most that would happen is Cass would look more or less the same, only with a hair and a possible eye color change.  There's already mods that soften her features some and removes the stupid lip gloss.

 

If the modders can pull off something like what the OP wants, I wouldn't be offended.  I'd be impressed....and then ask the modder if the long hair style was available for the PC.   

[Vanth]

I would hesitate to even call the male version "sexualized,"

 

I would, because it is.

[DomeWing333]

I would, because it is.

Would you also say that the original concept art for the Alamarri is sexualized as well, then? Or the shirtlessness of Movran the Under? 

[9TailsFox]

Would you also say that the original concept art for the Alamarri is sexualized as well, then? Or the shirtlessness of Movran the Under? 

Iron bull is sexualized I din't think someone need convincing to see it, he is male Isabela. Everyone make jokes about it. "ride the bull"

Alamarri are "naked" because they are barbarian. If someone think they are sexualized I dob't it was intended.

[DomeWing333]

Iron bull is sexualized I din't think someone need convincing to see it, he is male Isabela. Everyone make jokes about it. "ride the bull"

Alamarri are "naked" because they are barbarian. If someone think they are sexualized I dob't it was intended.

I wouldn't say that Iron Bull's appearance by itself is inherently sexual (people seem to agree that the concept art I referenced isn't sexualized). The character itself, however, is certainly sexualized but in a way I think is acceptable. Bull and Isabella walk a fine line between overt sexualizaton for the sake of sexualization and sexualization for the sake of character. While they are designed to be characters who are sexually appealing to the player, their sexuality is also interwoven into who they are and how they interact with others. Their sexuality doesn't overtake or clash with their other aspects of their character; rather, it is part of their character. And for me, that's fine.

 

The comparison I like to bring up is the difference between the designs of Zero Suit Samus and Bayonetta. Their costumes are fairly similar in being skin-tight, having tall heels, and crafted to draw the male gaze to all the usual places. But Bayonetta's sexualization is perfectly fine to me whereas I find Samus's sexualization to be very inappropriate. The difference is that Bayonetta is a sexual character: her sex appeal is integral to who she is. Take the sex out of Bayonetta and you take away Bayonetta. Samus's sexualization, on the other hand, is completely tangential to who and what she is as a character. Take away her sex appeal and you still have Samus (and arguably a better Samus). One is a sexual character, the other is a character made sexual.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

The comparison I like to bring up is the difference between the designs of Zero Suit Samus and Bayonetta. Their costumes are fairly similar in being skin-tight, having tall heels, and crafted to draw the male gaze to all the usual places. But Bayonetta's sexualization is perfectly fine to me whereas I find Samus's sexualization to be very inappropriate. The difference is that Bayonetta is a sexual character: her sex appeal is integral to who she is. Take the sex out of Bayonetta and you take away Bayonetta. Samus's sexualization, on the other hand, is completely tangential to who and what she is as a character. Take away her sex appeal and you still have Samus (and arguably a better Samus). One is a sexual character, the other is a character made sexual.

I disagree with you about Zero Suit Samus being sexualized for sexualization, or even sexualized at all. The Zero suit is an under armor that separates yet connects Samus to her power suit. It's a very common thing in science fiction for both genders and is basically a futuristic version of what the knights in medieval times did, wear a layer of clothing between them and their armor, keeping them connected yet separate. So it has a practical purpose and the fact she looks attractive to people in it is just a side effect. Similar to the barbarian people wearing scantily-clad apparel, which you said isn't sexualized. 

 

So in your example, Bayonetta is the more inappropriate because her outfit is designed with the intention to be sexy. Yes, it fits her character but it was still designed for no reason but to look good. 

 

But as long as the character is a promiscuous character, it is fine for them to dress that way? Isn't that just enforcing the stereotype that all people who dress that way are promiscuous? 

[Grieving Natashina]

Ugh, I had finally managed to purge memories of the Other M from my head.  Thanks Dome.  I'm just teasing you, but that game was awful in many different ways.

[DomeWing333]

I disagree with you about Zero Suit Samus being sexualized for sexualization, or even sexualized at all. The Zero suit is an under armor that separates yet connects Samus to her power suit. It's a very common thing in science fiction for both genders and is basically a futuristic version of what the knights in medieval times did, wear a layer of clothing between them and their armor, keeping them connected yet separate. So it has a practical purpose and the fact she looks attractive to people in it is just a side effect. Similar to the barbarian people wearing scantily-clad apparel, which you said isn't sexualized. 

 

So in your example, Bayonetta is the more inappropriate because her outfit is designed with the intention to be sexy. Yes, it fits her character but it was still designed for no reason but to look good. 

 

But as long as the character is a promiscuous character, it is fine for them to dress that way? Isn't that just enforcing the stereotype that people who dress that way are promiscuous? 

You know that showing Samus in the Zero Suit was mainly used in the series as a reward for the player, don't you? And yes, it's supposed to be a suit that goes underneath her armor, so in more recent games why the hell is she shown fighting in that instead her actual battle suit? I honestly didn't think I would have to defend the idea that Zero Suit Samus is sexualized...

 

As long as the character is sexual, it is appropriate for them to be dressed sexually. Bayonetta is designed after a dominatrix. In her speech, in her attitude, in her actions. Everything. So the fact that she's dressed like a dominatrix is no more inappropriate or out of place than a knightly character being dressed in full suit of plate mail.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

You know that showing Samus in the Zero Suit was mainly used in the series as a reward for the player, don't you? And yes, it's supposed to be a suit that goes underneath her armor, so in more recent games why the hell is she shown fighting in that instead her actual battle suit? I honestly didn't think I would have to defend the idea that Zero Suit Samus is sexualized...

 

As long as the character is sexual, it is appropriate for them to be dressed sexually. Bayonetta is designed after a dominatrix. In her speech, in her attitude, in her actions. Everything. So the fact that she's dressed like a dominatrix is no more inappropriate or out of place than a knightly character being dressed in full suit of plate mail.

When you say things like sexualization for sexualization because characters they are for are sexualized, the thing most people have been arguing against game companies doing, is perfectly fine then you shouldn't be surprised to have your views be questioned about this sort of thing.

 

Are the Spartans from Halo inappropriately sexualized for having skintight underarmor on while they are between deployments too?