547 réponses à ce sujet

[Winged Silver]

Like anything, fan service is good in moderation...? I mean, that's part of what made the Citadel DLC so damn enjoyable. Parts were super cheesy, but it was fun.

[Hazegurl]

Every sexual fan service is distracting, the less there is, the more quality the game can have.

Just because you stop playing to tug it every time you see something sexual in game doesn't mean everyone else does.

[DomeWing333]

This statement of yours is an opinion. Checkmate.

Uh...no. It's not. "That's another opinion" is a declaration of objective fact, not a subjective judgement. On the other hand, claiming that sexual fan service negatively affects the quality of an art piece is an opinion. As much as saying that putting ketchup on gourmet fries negatively affects the quality of the fries.

 

Now, I'm actually somewhat in agreement with you in that I do think that sexualization for the sake of fan service does tend to come off as inappropriate and unnatural and that can negatively impact the quality of the art piece. But it's the inappropriateness and unnaturalness that's the problem, not the sexual fan service itself. Putting Cassandra in a chainmail bikini doesn't make DAI worse because it makes people like the OP happy in the pants; it makes DAI worse because it makes Cassandra's character inconsistent.

 

However, there are times when sexual fan service can go hand in hand with the quality of a piece of art. The Aphrodite of Cnidus is a renowned piece of art precisely because it's such a raw display of feminine beauty and sexuality. The sexuality of the piece is integral to its quality. If you take away the sexuality, you take away the art. Same with the sexuality in Bayonetta or sexual aspects of Iron Bull and Isabella.

 

Then there are cases in the middle when sexual fan service doesn't obviously help or hurt the art of a game. These are...tricky and there will no doubt be a lot of debate over whether these are good or bad. An example would be, say, Lulu from FFX. There's nothing in her lore or personality that directly conflicts with her having a...voluptuous figure and wearing an extremely low-cut dress, but her sex appeal also doesn't add anything to her character or interactions. It's completely unremarked upon in-game just like all of the other weird, exotic features often found in Final Fantasy costume designs. It's just sorta...there. Personally, I don't mind it (understatement), but I could see how someone might find it to be an unnecessary distraction. 

[Grieving Natashina]

Uh...no. It's not. "That's another opinion" is a declaration of objective fact, not a subjective judgement. On the other hand, claiming that sexual fan service negatively affects the quality of an art piece is an opinion. As much as saying that putting ketchup on gourmet fries negatively affects the quality of the fries.

 

Now, I'm actually somewhat in agreement with you in that I do think that sexualization for the sake of fan service does tend to come off as inappropriate and unnatural and that can negatively impact the quality of the art piece. But it's the inappropriateness and unnaturalness that's the problem, not the sexual fan service itself. Putting Cassandra in a chainmail bikini doesn't make DAI worse because it makes people like the OP happy in the pants; it makes DAI worse because it makes Cassandra's character inconsistent.

 

However, there are times when sexual fan service can go hand in hand with the quality of a piece of art. The Aphrodite of Cnidus is a renowned piece of art precisely because it's such a raw display of feminine beauty and sexuality. The sexuality of the piece is integral to its quality. If you take away the sexuality, you take away the art. Same with the sexuality in Bayonetta or sexual aspects of Iron Bull and Isabella.

 

Then there are cases in the middle when sexual fan service doesn't obviously help or hurt the art of a game. These are...tricky and there will no doubt but a lot of debate over whether these are good or bad. An example would be, say, Lulu from FFX. There's nothing in her lore or personality that directly conflicts with her having a...voluptuous figure and wearing an extremely low-cut dress, but her sex appeal also doesn't add anything to her character or interactions. It's completely unremarked upon in-game just like all of the other weird, exotic features often found in Final Fantasy costume designs. It's just sorta...there. Personally, I don't mind it (understatement), but I could see how someone might find it to be an unnecessary distraction. 

I owe you a like.

[Menagra]

I disagree with this. I find, also, the point of the argument given the title of the thread somewhat appalling. I respect what the original poster wants in fantasy games, and there are many pornographic games out there where he can get it. However, I disagree that bioware should HAVE follow in this direction because it's what people "want". Not because I am against sex, or fantasy. But, because, the original poster is pushing for the target of the game to be "the male gaze" and that would limit the audience of the game significantly. By over half the population, in fact. Games aren't just about young men anymore, they seemed that way for a long time because that was the target audience for a long time and this was the mistake of the game industry. But mom's, dad's, and the elderly lady next door were also trying out games but finding them unsatisfying since the content and stories were only for a specific sub group. Gaming companies are starting to figure this out, and are expanding their audience to find a large benefit in profits. The explosive success of the Nintendo Wii is a great example of this. It was universal, which isn't exactly what Bioware should go for. They are an RPG and and Action game company. They should aim for an audience that appreciates a more indepth experience, which means there's a large diversion from what a "casual" crowd will want.

 

Returning to the point of the "male gaze" and why not all companies should cater to it I will point to Portal as an example, which is a relatively simple concept as a puzzler that became a huge sensation. So incredibly beloved on the internet, people make care cubes as their wedding cakes. But why was it so embraced? Think of Quantum Conundrum which was created by the same person, very fun and challenging in game play, but not nearly as popular. Spoiler, it was just another puzzler in the eyes of a lot of people. It had a similar story, similar protagonist, antagonist and story of what people have already seen before and the audience that would click with that story structure the most was the young men group. But, many people in the gaming audience are so starved for games that expand their target audience beyond young white men who desire certain tastes, certain idealism expressed - games that diverge from this formula at all almost instantly become a classic. Think of what is like to be really hungry and finally be handed a sandwich. It'll taste like the best sandwich of your life. But to others who are not hungry it would seem like just another sandwich, and would be confusing why it was such a big deal. And that is what we see in some of these games that finally step away from the recycled cliche for a specific audience, and also why we have seen conflict arise from these situations from the typical target audience and the expanded audience. You should not feel threatened if one game is different. There is still going to be games that produce models like in your pictures. Expanding what kinds of games out there is GOOD for you, even if it doesn't seem that way. It means for you, as the buyer, that the market is expanding. That will mean more options for you down the line, more competition and more likelihood that you'll get what you want - even if this other person got what they wanted with something entirely different. However, taking the approach of asking all games to fit into a certain taste and attacking people on youtube or the forums who want differently in large hordes will only starve the market, which is bad. The gaming industry needs more than one leg to stand on, time has proven this.

 

So, yes, I agree that games how you want should exist for your niche - but no, I do not think your niche should be what all games have to please. 

[Vanth]

I think Menagra is missing a a key facet in the argument above. I personally agree with the notion that characters in games should be more rounded and their sexualities and appearance should mesh with that without being exploitative. As such I also agree that there should be a wider variety of games catering to a wider variety of tastes. But, Dragon Age is the third game in a series. It is quite reasonable for the buyer to expect some continuity between the games in terms of tone and gameplay. I think this is what the OP is complaining about. Bioware have taken Dragon Age and changed it quite considerably to conform to a particular political ideal and this has caused disappointment among some fans. 

 

I empathise with this somewhat because I feel the same way. In my case I don't care about the sexuality of the companions (I never do the romances anyway), but in DA:I Bioware has also changed the entire feel of the game away from a tactical fantasy with a tight story and impactful choices, into an MMO-lite with generic characters with weak personalities and weak stories, no meaningful choices and endless filler/fetch quests.  If DA:I wasn't a Dragon Age game, with some other name and some other creator than Bioware, no-one would care. People like the OP would shrug and say oh well, this wasn't for me. But this isn't just some other game - this is the 3rd game in the Dragon Age franchise that people (like me) have been waiting for for years. And to be given DA:I is such a disappointment. I believe that is why these forums see negative threads like this one.  

[xkg]

So, yes, I agree that games how you want should exist for your niche - but no, I do not think your niche should be what all games have to please. 

 

Speaking about "sexual content" liking audience. Number of downloads for various nude/sex mods for Skyrim is bigger than all of the DA games ever sold, and that's just on PC. I wonder now, who is downloading it if it's only for "niche"  .

[Innsmouth Dweller]

^

a f.p material?

[Dreamer]

Uh...no. It's not. "That's another opinion" is a declaration of objective fact, not a subjective judgement. On the other hand, claiming that sexual fan service negatively affects the quality of an art piece is an opinion. As much as saying that putting ketchup on gourmet fries negatively affects the quality of the fries.

 

Now, I'm actually somewhat in agreement with you in that I do think that sexualization for the sake of fan service does tend to come off as inappropriate and unnatural and that can negatively impact the quality of the art piece. But it's the inappropriateness and unnaturalness that's the problem, not the sexual fan service itself. Putting Cassandra in a chainmail bikini doesn't make DAI worse because it makes people like the OP happy in the pants; it makes DAI worse because it makes Cassandra's character inconsistent.

 

However, there are times when sexual fan service can go hand in hand with the quality of a piece of art. The Aphrodite of Cnidus is a renowned piece of art precisely because it's such a raw display of feminine beauty and sexuality. The sexuality of the piece is integral to its quality. If you take away the sexuality, you take away the art. Same with the sexuality in Bayonetta or sexual aspects of Iron Bull and Isabella.

 

Then there are cases in the middle when sexual fan service doesn't obviously help or hurt the art of a game. These are...tricky and there will no doubt be a lot of debate over whether these are good or bad. An example would be, say, Lulu from FFX. There's nothing in her lore or personality that directly conflicts with her having a...voluptuous figure and wearing an extremely low-cut dress, but her sex appeal also doesn't add anything to her character or interactions. It's completely unremarked upon in-game just like all of the other weird, exotic features often found in Final Fantasy costume designs. It's just sorta...there. Personally, I don't mind it (understatement), but I could see how someone might find it to be an unnecessary distraction. 

 

Nailed it.

[Felya87]

Speaking about "sexual content" liking audience. Number of downloads for various nude/sex mods for Skyrim is bigger than all of the DA games ever sold, and that's just on PC. I wonder now, who is downloading it if it's only for "niche"  .

 

And "immersive armours" and non skimpy ones are as much downloaded, if not more 

[Seraphim24]

Now, I'm actually somewhat in agreement with you in that I do think that sexualization for the sake of fan service does tend to come off as inappropriate and unnatural and that can negatively impact the quality of the art piece. But it's the inappropriateness and unnaturalness that's the problem, not the sexual fan service itself. Putting Cassandra in a chainmail bikini doesn't make DAI worse because it makes people like the OP happy in the pants; it makes DAI worse because it makes Cassandra's character inconsistent.

 

Well there's something to be said for wanting more aggressive or dominating kinds of characters in general, along with their uninhibited display of sexuality or sex appeal. Most of the DA:I characters tend towards the frosty side of the equation. Wynne, Cassandra, Merrill, Sten, Aveline (dear god Aveline), Leliana and Varric (IMO), Blackwall, Vivienne.

 

Not to mention whenever there is a more aggressive character it's usually extremely over the top like Isabella, Fenris, or Zevran.

 

People aren't easily categorizable like your either a stiff responsible person who is shy about their sexuality (Cassandra), or a guns blazing aggressive and reckless nympho (Isabella).

 

Some people are both, and that's the kind of representation that no matter how many sexual orientations or genders are represented I don't really see in DA.

 

It's no surprise to me that mold breaking characters that don't fall into either extreme like Sera, Solas, Loghain, and a handful of others tend to be really popular or at least interesting to people. I also remember there being a popular thread about a character that takes initiative and interacts with the PC more directly.

 

Then there are cases in the middle when sexual fan service doesn't obviously help or hurt the art of a game. These are...tricky and there will no doubt be a lot of debate over whether these are good or bad. An example would be, say, Lulu from FFX. There's nothing in her lore or personality that directly conflicts with her having a...voluptuous figure and wearing an extremely low-cut dress, but her sex appeal also doesn't add anything to her character or interactions. It's completely unremarked upon in-game just like all of the other weird, exotic features often found in Final Fantasy costume designs. It's just sorta...there. Personally, I don't mind it (understatement), but I could see how someone might find it to be an unnecessary distraction. 

 

I'm pretty sure the vast majority of people found Lulu fascinating for her careless indifference to displaying her physical body and found it central to her character, in much the same way that Yuna's outfit seemed to reflect her more conservative personality.

 

TDLR: A blazing hot sexy paladin idea seems like a perfectly good concept to me, not that you would force Cassandra to be that way, but as someone else entirely.

[xkg]

And "immersive armours" and non skimpy ones are as much downloaded, if not more 

 

I never said they aren't. And if both types of content are equally popular you shouldn't say one them is just for niche audience.

That was my point, and not that one content is somehow better over the other like some of people try to convince us in this thread. 

[Commander Rpg]

Uh...no. It's not. "That's another opinion" is a declaration of objective fact, not a subjective judgement.

If it's an objective fact, then you must have factual and undoubtable proofs for it.

I have those for my statements, which are facts and not opinions, hence can prove them if you ask me.

 

Fan service is "material in a series which is intentionally added to please the audience".

If it's sexual fanservice, then is "sexual material in a series which is intentionally added to please the audience".

Which means soft-core porn. Porn: "Pornography (often abbreviated as "porn" or "porno" in informal usage) is the portrayal of sexual subject matter for the purpose of sexual arousal."

Porn comes from the ancient Greek "porneia", it's "illicit sexual intercourse", such as mental masturbation is.

And you think it's my opinion (and not a fact) that they are detrimental to any game. Prove it, or good day sir.

[o Ventus]

^ What? Do you know the difference between subjectivity and objectivity? Someone stating "that's an opinion" is itself NOT an opinion. It's a factual truth. The "proof" you want to see is the statement itself. Literally just by looking at it can you tell that it's a true statement.

 

You're free to call it an opinion, but you'd be wrong.

[Menagra]

I think Menagra is missing a a key facet in the argument above. I personally agree with the notion that characters in games should be more rounded and their sexualities and appearance should mesh with that without being exploitative. As such I also agree that there should be a wider variety of games catering to a wider variety of tastes. But, Dragon Age is the third game in a series. It is quite reasonable for the buyer to expect some continuity between the games in terms of tone and gameplay. I think this is what the OP is complaining about. Bioware have taken Dragon Age and changed it quite considerably to conform to a particular political ideal and this has caused disappointment among some fans. 

 

I empathise with this somewhat because I feel the same way. In my case I don't care about the sexuality of the companions (I never do the romances anyway), but in DA:I Bioware has also changed the entire feel of the game away from a tactical fantasy with a tight story and impactful choices, into an MMO-lite with generic characters with weak personalities and weak stories, no meaningful choices and endless filler/fetch quests.  If DA:I wasn't a Dragon Age game, with some other name and some other creator than Bioware, no-one would care. People like the OP would shrug and say oh well, this wasn't for me. But this isn't just some other game - this is the 3rd game in the Dragon Age franchise that people (like me) have been waiting for for years. And to be given DA:I is such a disappointment. I believe that is why these forums see negative threads like this one.  

 

 

I understand your feelings on this entirely, and I respect your opinion. I can honestly see why someone would feel DA:I was a strong deviation from the last games. However, I think many also felt DA:2 was a strong deviation from Origins. The company moves forward, and things change. For Mass Effect this was met with strong frustration because bioware explicitly said they would be creating a 3 game story with decisions that carried over, etc. They weren't given time to deliver on their promises, in my opinion, but I am not inside their studios so I can't entirely say what happened. Dragon Age is very different, however. The developers have stated numerous times that each game is separate from the last, and while they are willing to create some continuity between them it isn't their goal. If you look at what Bioware has done over the last few years, it does make sense why they would have the characters they do in DA, and why to some it is a step in a direction that makes them very happy. Given the awards the game has received, I think it is safe to say that many agree. Mass Effect, for example, had NO females of the alien species (except asari, not entirely female as we know it though). It took them 3 games to finally have this, and many MANY fans to request it before they finally did. The DLC that involves a female turian is actually one of the most beloved experiences in that series. That isn't to say "oh, take away all the sexualized characters" b/c that would pretty much wipe out the asari completely, it simply means that variety isn't going to be met with overwhelming frowns as was initially expected. On the point of the asari, it shows that you can do something very sexual and still present a strong female characters BUT I don't think that means it should be that all female characters conform to this. That is actually a huge problem in gaming, the female characters tend to be tropes. Liara was somewhat different for a couple reasons, though there was still the whole "rescue me" troupe in the first game. Firstly is that, despite the large distracting cleavage, the game explored a relationship between a daughter and a mother. This is very rare in games. Second, Liara became a character who evolved greatly. She went from being the rescued to the rescuer (you see this especially in the 3rd game). Ok, I am not trying to rant about Mass Effect in a DA forum for just shits and giggles. I am trying to point out that Bioware has been evolving as a company, and I think it was their intentions from the start to try to be different. I think even the long standing target audience of games (young white men) are getting bored with what they have, and something different is met with interest. Some get upset, like this guy in this forum, but many do not make forums like this. Many never log into the forums at all, and they buy the game. Play it for a little while, and enjoy that there is something different than the same re-hashed thing they've been playing for years. I honestly think the weak point of this game is the multiplayer, but that is not something we have to go into for this topic.

 

Dragon Age Inquisition does not just have strong characters who rush into battle, but explored strengths in other characters who never fight alongside you (this is true for both male and female). I think Bioware intends to explore this more in the future, because they have mentioned in the past finding it interesting if you are in a scenario where you can decide to have it end if violence or have it end diplomatically. I think, to be frank, they are becoming a company that doesn't want to re-skin the same characters and the same stories over and over again, but make each experience DISTINCT from the last. So it should feel different. Considering the characters of their stories are the most beloved aspect, I think it is fair to say they intend to make a large variety so each is as memorable and interesting as the last. I think they want to actually SAY something with those stories. Which is why the fan base who is so starved for representation get so excited when there seems to be something just a touch different from the cliche such as a very openly gay character. Yes, while it can seem things are unfair b/c the qunari men are uber buff and there's no cleavage to be seen... please remember characters like Isabela and Zevran. They existed, their dynamic was explored in story telling. And even a character like Wynne who is amazing, was not entirely hitting the mark despite seeming to be "different". Having an older woman as a companion even if she can be a troupe at times was an incredible thing. Older women in general are probably the most under represented in the entire entertainment industry, and that somewhat comes from the idea that if it isn't sexualized to please the male gaze than it won't be accepted in our culture. But we see from characters like Betty White that this isn't true. We see from shows like Golden Girls which had a very large following due to the fact many enjoyed the show for the novelty of it. The issue with Wynne, however, is that her body was like a PERFECT body when that isn't entirely realistic for an older woman living in an era that does not have plastic surgery. This was when bioware only had women be "sexualized" as the original poster of this forum discusses. Even a very thin and healthy woman would be somewhat different in shape. This is also true for men, but men of different body types have been represented in gaming for a long time. However, we see from the large loving reception of both Eve and Nyreen from Mass Effect that a female character does not have to be sexualized for the audience to like them. Removing all sexiness, I think, is not the point. The point is, much like I can watch Tommy Boy and laugh without finding all the characters attractive - men can play a game where not every woman has her ****** hanging out and enjoy it still. That they can thoroughly enjoy the experience of interacting with a character they aren't sexually attracted to. I am a bit of a SWTOR player, and I still hear people talking about how amazing Kreia was to them from KOTOR 2. 

 

I will say this, however. I do think bioware shouldn't entirely remove the sexual fantasy from the game. Which they didn't, the cassandra scene is very Wowza. ^^ I think that bioware needed to make more variety in their romance options for the heterosexual male inquisitor. This is actually, I think, where what I am saying and what the original poster is saying becomes parallel. Think of the male characters in the game. They are all very distinct, they are all very interesting, and all great options. This is even true for the homosexual male characters, who seems to offer more variety than the females in the game. For a heterosexual man the options are Josephine and Cassandra. That's it. Both VERY distinct characters, but there SHOULD be more. And that is because women are still under represented. Sera is an AMAZING character too. But look at all the male characters that an inquisitor can romance. Dorian, Blackwall, Iron Bull, Cullen, Solas.... there is SO many. But there is only 3 women companions compared to the 5 men. This is the issue, I think. Cassandra should not have to run around half naked, nor Josephine forced into combat. No, the issue is that there simply needs to be more female characters. So in closing, for me I am glad this game is different. I think Bioware is taking strides forward in a good direction. But, I don't think it is entirely where it needs to be yet. 

[Shechinah]

(to Menagra) Would it be possibly for you to add more space to the text in your post? It'll make it a bit less difficult for some of us to read, my eyes are not very fond of focusing when the text is like this so I'd really appreciate it.

[DomeWing333]

Well there's something to be said for wanting more aggressive or dominating kinds of characters in general, along with their uninhibited display of sexuality or sex appeal. Most of the DA:I characters tend towards the frosty side of the equation. Wynne, Cassandra, Merrill, Sten, Aveline (dear god Aveline), Leliana and Varric (IMO), Blackwall, Vivienne.

You're, uh, gonna have to explain this one.

 

And Vivienne is frosty towards you, but she fully embraces her position as mistress to Duke Bastien. Blackwall has no hangups about sexuality; he has hang-ups about love because he doesn't think he's worthy of it. Then there's Sten's...nuzzling. None of them are exactly "shy" about sexuality, nor are they "nymphos." Same with Morrigan, Anders, Dorian and the "mold-breaking" characters you mentioned (Sera actually strikes me more as leaning towards the more "nympho" extreme). There are plenty of middle-ground examples of DA sexuality; they're just not obvious because, well, that's the point.

I'm pretty sure the vast majority of people found Lulu fascinating for her careless indifference to displaying her physical body and found it central to her character, in much the same way that Yuna's outfit seemed to reflect her more conservative personality.

I won't speak for the "vast majority" of people, but I didn't really find careless indifference to wearing revealing clothes to be a special or noteworthy trait in Spira (or really any of the worlds in FF games). Lulu came from an island village surrounded by people in swimsuits. Yunalesca is a High Summoner wearing a bikini. And on the male side, Seymour's outfit has the deepest v-neck I've ever seen. No one cares. The fact that Lulu's costume is revealing seems about as relevant to the people of Spira as the fact that her skirt is just a series of interlocking belts. I just took it to be be yet another confirmation of the trope that everybody in Final Fantasy has a careless indifference towards what they or anyone else wears. 

[Seraphim24]

You're, uh, gonna have to explain this one.

 

And Vivienne is frosty towards you, but she fully embraces her position as mistress to Duke Bastien. Blackwall has no hangups about sexuality; he has hang-ups about love because he doesn't think he's worthy of it. Then there's Sten's...nuzzling. None of them are exactly "shy" about sexuality, nor are they "nymphos." Same with Morrigan, Anders, Dorian and the "mold-breaking" characters you mentioned (Sera actually strikes me more as leaning towards the more "nympho" extreme). There are plenty of middle-ground examples of DA sexuality; they're just not obvious because, well, that's the point.

 

 

One person's free spirit is another person's frosty iron maiden, and by the standards of for instance the female heroine (if you want to call her that) in the anime Witchblade Cassandra is a bit on the plain side.

 

I won't speak for the "vast majority" of people, but I didn't really find careless indifference to wearing revealing clothes to be a special or noteworthy trait in Spira (or really any of the worlds in FF games). Lulu came from an island village surrounded by people in swimsuits. Yunalesca is a High Summoner wearing a bikini. And on the male side, Seymour's outfit has the deepest v-neck I've ever seen. No one cares. The fact that Lulu's costume is revealing seems about as relevant to the people of Spira as the fact that her skirt is just a series of interlocking belts. I just took it to be be yet another confirmation of the trope that everybody in Final Fantasy has a careless indifference towards what they or anyone else wears. 

 

Yeah it's kinda nice IMO. Anyway I'm just saying it's part of most of the FF series characters charm that they don't really trip out over the human body.

[TheRatPack55]

 

Fan service is "material in a series which is intentionally added to please the audience".

If it's sexual fanservice, then is "sexual material in a series which is intentionally added to please the audience".

Which means soft-core porn. Porn: "Pornography (often abbreviated as "porn" or "porno" in informal usage) is the portrayal of sexual subject matter for the purpose of sexual arousal."

Porn comes from the ancient Greek "porneia", it's "illicit sexual intercourse", such as mental masturbation is.

And you think it's my opinion (and not a fact) that they are detrimental to any game. Prove it, or good day sir.

 

You know, unless you play video games because you want to exercise your finger muscles, isn't the general purpose of a game to 'please the audience'? In that context, how is a sex scene between the characters any more detrimental to the game than Darkspawn slaughter? Both are in there for the player to enjoy.

[Panda]

You know, unless you play video games because you want to exercise your finger muscles, isn't the general purpose of a game to 'please the audience'? In that context, how is a sex scene between the characters any more detrimental to the game than Darkspawn slaughter? Both are in there for the player to enjoy.

 

Fanservice doesn't mean all things that please fans though. I think the term was invented to express unnecessary nudity and sexual stuff especially in the anime's, well that's at least what wikipedia claims on fanservice Fanservice is often something that is not very serious and doesn't often go well with the story or art itself, it's something that is added just for laughs or eye-candy, not something that is important for plot or art. Fanservice can be seen both bad and good thing, depending on how well it's done and does it please the fan who is talking about it. Citadel DLC seems to be good fanservice in viewpoint of fans, in other hand some other fanservice like ass-shots of Miranda have been criticised as bad.

 

I think good fanservice is something that doesn't fight with the characters and story too much and also knows how to laugh to itself, since most fanservice is pretty ridiculous ^^

[TheRatPack55]

@Panda - Yeah, I know. It's just that the definitions given by Commander Rpg seem rather broad, and if one was to go by them the entire game would be one giant orgy of fanservice, since, you know - pretty much everything in a game is supposed to please the audience. I'm not exactly running around murdering Cory's lackeys out of a sense of duty to the virtual land of Thedas.

[9TailsFox]

Fanservice doesn't mean all things that please fans though. I think the term was invented to express unnecessary nudity and sexual stuff especially in the anime's, well that's at least what wikipedia claims on fanservice Fanservice is often something that is not very serious and doesn't often go well with the story or art itself, it's something that is added just for laughs or eye-candy, not something that is important for plot or art. Fanservice can be seen both bad and good thing, depending on how well it's done and does it please the fan who is talking about it. Citadel DLC seems to be good fanservice in viewpoint of fans, in other hand some other fanservice like ass-shots of Miranda have been criticised as bad.

 

I think good fanservice is something that doesn't fight with the characters and story too much and also knows how to laugh to itself, since most fanservice is pretty ridiculous ^^

Well Citadel DLC was great  and it's only fanservice. Something what is only fanservice is still very good.

Spoiler

Spoiler

Spoiler

[Panda]

Well Citadel DLC was great  and it's only fanservice. Something what is only fanservice is still very good.

Spoiler

Spoiler

Spoiler

 

I'd see those examples as bad fan service, but I guess that's because I can't stand ecchi ^^; Too bad you can't really avoid it with animes.

[bEVEsthda]

If anything, Bioware ain't realistic enough.

 

Characters are still great. One of the Bioware-qualities to not only remain, but maybe also make returns.

Cassandra forever. The only unrealistic thing about her is that most real Cassandras, I know of, tend to be lesbians. Interesting twist that she isn't, so is still good.

[SnakeCode]

You know, unless you play video games because you want to exercise your finger muscles, isn't the general purpose of a game to 'please the audience'? In that context, how is a sex scene between the characters any more detrimental to the game than Darkspawn slaughter? Both are in there for the player to enjoy.

 

Yup, videogames as a rule are entertainment artforms (I say as a rule because there are a new wave of indie devs purposely making games that aren't fun- Depression Quest, Papers Please, and I Get This Call Every Day being examples.) 

 

It's a strange argument to argue that fan service is bad because it's unnecessary, because everything in videogames are unnecessary. I think most people mean that it's unnecessary in that it isn't needed to tell the story, but then there are games that don't even have a story. Then we have the pandering argument, which again is bemusing because that's what videogames do by their very nature. In fact I challenge people to find one that doesn't pander to a certain group of people. It's the way marketing works. 

 

It's even stranger that it's constantly used as a derogatory or negative word here on the BSN, pandering is only bad when it's not pandering to you (general you, not aimed at anyone in particular.) It's become a fancy way of saying "this game caters to a group of people who aren't me."

 

There are the idiots saying that the game panders to SJWs and the LGBT community by merely including characters like Dorian and Krem, then you have the people saying that videogames in general pander to straight, cis, white males and that this is offensive and needs to stop.

 

In it's basic form it just means that devs are gearing their content to those that are actually going to buy their product.