62 réponses à ce sujet

[TheKomandorShepard]

He obviously kidnapped her and infected her with the taint for a reason. She won't survive long because she has the taint so you really think he cares about body hopping into her? What's stopping him from sending his darkspawn to kidnapped someone else the infect them with the taint? unless you can provide a reason She was such a valued ally to him when he has numerous allies back at his base. The architect was not trying to start a war he was trying to free all darkspawn his motivate for doing so may or may not be real but that obviously was his plan. Grey wardens have knowledge of the taint and idk if your aware how people gain knowledge but its usually by sharing. by adding what he knew with what the wardens knew he would be closer to his goal. now if he wanted to directly kill the warden order since there his enemy then i can see him trying to do so but clearly there is better things he has planned for darkspawn then just fighting wardens hence why he would never try kill them directly mainly out of self defense. He gave us a olive branch and if we attack is he suppose to just change get his plans because you think its idiotic? he kidnapped a non warden and tainted them instead of kidnapping wardens themselves who he allowed to leave unless you think that was stupid to.

<cries in despair>   Do you even read what im writing or just write random things about architect.Where i have said he would care about her ,where i have even posted that architect carring about her was reason why he wouldn't do that... im so done at this point.Read my post and its actual content and respond to that content .I have said over and over why doing such thing would be idiotic , your post entirely misses everything i have said.

[Heimdall]

A:He says he can't approach her not because any enchantments only because her children protect her (yes those small darkspawn)... ,what in first place wouldn't matter if he was immortal.

Why? Getting killed and forced to seek out a new body still keeps him from killing the Mother.
 

B:Necessary and pointless sacrifice are 2 different things.

Pity you can't seem to distinguish the distinction yourself
 

C:In First place the warden knows about his followers and his plans ,so even if s/he thinks architect is dead hunting still would be there , also the warden and companions present in mother lair were only one who knew what was going on as architect explained that and what he plans to do.Grey wardens know about architect at least for 20 years before daa ,plus there would be no problem at all with faking his death by just leaving his body so yeah see pointless sacrifice part..

The Architect's followers were nearly annihilated in the conflict with the mother and knowing his plans won't matter if they think he's too dead to implement them. That's the point.

You keep saying "He could fake his death by just leaving his body"... What? Putting aside that we don't even know if he could leave his body without getting killed, what the hell would that accomplish? Aside from making the Wardens very suspicious about him randomly keeling over?
 

D:Don't even bother with that ,the warden is his enemy as i said s/he oppose his plans in first place ,so yes the warden is his enemy in that scenario ,unless you want to tell me that person that oppose your plans and killed you is your friend.Wardens knew about architect long before daa in first place ,second simple he could just leave his corpse with same effect , third as i said if he was immortal the mother wouldn't be problem.

The Wardens tried to stop him in the Calling. That didn't stop him from asking for their help in Awakening. Just because they find themselves opposed now, doesn't mean it will always be that way.
 

Also in that scenario he either would be just dead as he wouldn't be able use that ability as he wouldn't know about it ,or if it is automatic (and it rather it isn't) he would just jump into closest warden be it the warden or his companion not "person that trusts him". 
 
Not to mention that there is ton of stuff that show architect don't have abilities that corypheus had ,like for example ability to influence and control grey wardens.

I'm sorry, when did you become an expert in the workings of this ability? Not knowing about it doesn't mean it couldn't trigger upon his death and we don't know how it chooses its targets, or if he can consciously pick them, or how long it takes for him to enter a new body.

Maybe he's just forgotten how over the millennium of subterranean wandering, who knows? Lacking one ability doesn't mean he couldn't have this one.

[TheKomandorShepard]

Why? Getting killed and forced to seek out a new body still keeps him from killing the Mother.
 
Pity you can't seem to distinguish the distinction yourself
 
The Architect's followers were nearly annihilated in the conflict with the mother and knowing his plans won't matter if they think he's too dead to implement them. That's the point.

You keep saying "He could fake his death by just leaving his body"... What? Putting aside that we don't even know if he could leave his body without getting killed, what the hell would that accomplish? Aside from making the Wardens very suspicious about him randomly keeling over?
 
The Wardens tried to stop him in the Calling. That didn't stop him from asking for their help in Awakening. Just because they find themselves opposed now, doesn't mean it will always be that way.
 
I'm sorry, when did you become an expert in the workings of this ability? Not knowing about it doesn't mean it couldn't trigger upon his death and we don't know how it chooses its targets, or if he can consciously pick them, or how long it takes for him to enter a new body.

Maybe he's just forgotten how over the millennium of subterranean wandering, who knows? Lacking one ability doesn't mean he couldn't have this one.

 

1.In first place he can't be killed The mother can no matter how many times the mother would kill him he would just respawn until he kills her.

 

2.As i said you can possess your enemy and off him/her ,or you can possess your ally pointlessly offing your ally when you could off your enemy , if you see that as  necessary sacrifice well...

 

3.They aren't they are still there , there are disciples that warden didn't fought on architect side and even possible mother side one way or another wardens will hunt on them as they are around and possible even may continue his plan.Not to mention as i said grey wardens knew about architect for at least good 20 years it didn't seem bother him too much.

 

4.<Cries> If he could change bodies like corypheus he just could possess the warden when the warden killed him and leave his body there so it either looked as the warden or mother forces killed him , omg architect killing himself... pls as i said guys just use your head it isn't hard.

 

5.Oh god, apart from the that his plan in the calling was completely different to his plan in daa ,we are not talking about wardens we are talking about the warden commander who flat out refused his plan and killed him and outright was threat for his plan...

 

6.Expert no simple logic if his ability isn't automatic he simple dies because he have no idea about it and he can't use it , if his ability is automatic and he has choice .then we come back to simple choice finish off your enemy or finish off your ally .Also corypheus already proved that he could chose his target so it is out of question , also corypheus did that before his death.

 

7.Corypheus could do that even while not being conscious if architect had such ability he would know it as it seems as natural ability not something you learn. 

[ModernAcademic]

I was replaying origins and it hit me! The architect is a magister who unlike Corypheus doesn't remember. 

 

No, he isn't.

 

Read The Calling.

[Heimdall]

1.In first place he can't be killed The mother can no matter how many times the mother would kill him he would just respawn until he kills her.

And she'd just keep spewing out new Darkspawn making that task ever more impossible. That's a stalemate, not a successful plan of action.  Bashing your head against a wall might break it eventually, but its hardly the best way to renovate your living room.
 

2.As i said you can possess your enemy and off him/her ,or you can possess your ally pointlessly offing your ally when you could off your enemy , if you see that as  necessary sacrifice well...

And I've thoroughly explained to you the reasons he might not want to off the Wardens. Screech "enemy" all you like, it isn't that simple just because you say it.
 

3.They aren't they are still there , there are disciples that warden didn't fought on architect side and even possible mother side one way or another wardens will hunt on them as they are around and possible even may continue his plan.Not to mention as i said grey wardens knew about architect for at least good 20 years it didn't seem bother him too much.

We destroyed his base of operation in the silverite mines and every disciple we come across save the messenger is inevitably killed by us or the Mother's forces. Whatever forces he has left at that point are minimal, scattered, and leaderless.  With the Mother and the Architect gone, the threat is considerably reduced.
 

4.<Cries> If he could change bodies like corypheus he just could possess the warden when the warden killed him and leave his body there so it either looked as the warden or mother forces killed him , omg architect killing himself... pls as i said guys just use your head it isn't hard.

I'd ask you to do the same. The Architect can jump bodies when he's killed. He didn't jump into the Wardens because he didn't want to.  He considers them to be in pursuit of the same goal, stopping the Blights.  He doesn't consider them enemies.
 

5.Oh god, apart from the that his plan in the calling was completely different to his plan in daa ,we are not talking about wardens we are talking about the warden commander who flat out refused his plan and killed him and outright was threat for his plan...

 And?  The point is that he clearly doesn't think opposition to his plans make the Wardens his enemies.  He's not driven by vengeance and seems to feel the Grey Warden attitude towards his kind is justified.  He thinks of them being on the same side as him.  They attacked him back then too.  That didn't stop him from reaching out to the Wardens when the Mother went insane and he needed help.
 
And besides, when he's "dead" the Warden Commander ceases to be a threat.because he thinks his plans are dead with him.  They simply go their separate ways, no harm done.

6.Expert no simple logic if his ability isn't automatic he simple dies because he have no idea about it and he can't use it , if his ability is automatic and he has choice .then we come back to simple choice finish off your enemy or finish off your ally .Also corypheus already proved that he could chose his target so it is out of question , also corypheus did that before his death.

 Just because its automatic doesn't mean he can't choose.  He might automatically find himself in a non-corporeal state, between living and death, confused, but not quite dead.  So he follows the taint to the most welcoming presence, Seranni.  Or Utha's corpse if he can.
 
"corypheus did that before his death." what on earth are you talking about?

7.Corypheus could do that even while not being conscious if architect had such ability he would know it as it seems as natural ability not something you learn.

Just because its "natural" doesn't mean he's aware of it. He has no idea what he is, why would this be different?

[TheKomandorShepard]

And she'd just keep spewing out new Darkspawn making that task ever more impossible. That's a stalemate, not a successful plan of action.  Bashing your head against a wall might break it eventually, but its hardly the best way to renovate your living room.
 
And I've thoroughly explained to you the reasons he might not want to off the Wardens. Screech "enemy" all you like, it isn't that simple just because you say it.
 
We destroyed his base of operation in the silverite mines and every disciple we come across save the messenger is inevitably killed by us or the Mother's forces. Whatever forces he has left at that point are minimal, scattered, and leaderless.  With the Mother and the Architect gone, the threat is considerably reduced.
 
I'd ask you to do the same. The Architect can jump bodies when he's killed. He didn't jump into the Wardens because he didn't want to.  He considers them to be in pursuit of the same goal, stopping the Blights.  He doesn't consider them enemies.
 
 And?  The point is that he clearly doesn't think opposition to his plans make the Wardens his enemies.  He's not driven by vengeance and seems to feel the Grey Warden attitude towards his kind is justified.  He thinks of them being on the same side as him.  They attacked him back then too.  That didn't stop him from reaching out to the Wardens when the Mother went insane and he needed help.
 
And besides, when he's "dead" the Warden Commander ceases to be a threat.because he thinks his plans are dead with him.  They simply go their separate ways, no harm done.
 Just because its automatic doesn't mean he can't choose.  He might automatically find himself in a non-corporeal state, between living and death, confused, but not quite dead.  So he follows the taint to the most welcoming presence, Seranni.  Or Utha's corpse if he can.
 
"corypheus did that before his death." what on earth are you talking about?
Just because its "natural" doesn't mean he's aware of it. He has no idea what he is, why would this be different?

1.In first place she can't spawn infinite numbers of darkspawn ,Broodmothers born thousands darkspawn in their whole lifespan and 20-50 at once so it isn't she will born 1 darkspawn on 1 second.

 

2.No you didn't you just have put ridiculous speech as somehow the warden who outright opposes his plans and killed him isn't his enemy...

 

3.No they aren't the seeker isn't out ,also depending on player choices the messenger and the herald are alive .Not to mention possibly other darkspawn we didn't meet ,so in first place they are still disciples there.

 

4.This is is start becoming mega ridiculous it is me practically thrasing your ridiculous claims just to you jump into another ridiculous claims,in first place the warden in that case don't have same goal as architect , architect want to awaken darkspawn and free them and in that case the warden oppose his plan ,so no architect plan isn't just to stop blights but above ,so no they don't have same goals

 

5.Facepalm    in first place the warden wasn't the warden from calling , architect had another plan and fails convince the warden who opposes his plan and by that they friking are their enemy.... god i doubt it will work because logic is as effective as using metal armor to protect yourself from electricity.

 

6. Yes because the warden commander who is head of ferelden wardens ,knows and oppose your plans isn't threat at all completely will remain peacful with them when they will start create awakened darkspawn ,this of course means peace with grey wardens in the future when we have warden commander who is opposing your plan,oh and s/he will inform other wardens about my plans and there are still other awakened darkspawn there that may try continue that.  Facepalm x2 What i have said either it isn't automatic then he dies because he has no idea that he have this ability so he can't use it or it is automatic and he can chose (that he can't is out of question as corypheus could) and again kill your own ally or hostile grey warden... 

 

7.Oh god it hurts.... corypheus possessed warden right before his death not after it possibly the same was in temple of mythal as we can't tell but he definitely did that before hawke killed him. 

 

Oh god if it is natural he would discover it quickly corypheus was f.... using it when he wasn't even conscious so architect wouldn't have problem with discovering natural ability as corypheus didn't in first place.

 

To be honest im done at this point ,i should have give up as soon as you started say as architect corpse would be seen as his suicide.  

[Panda]

No you don't ,if you were thinking logically you wouldn't have said that the warden companions would kill architect ,what if he could possess wardens would be completely irrelevant.

As i said thing you say completly doesn't matter as he can kill the mother as he is immortal in that scenario plain and simple...

 

No as i said 10000 times at this point it is idiotic and completly doesn't make any sense in that scenario he kills his own ally , let his enemy go with knowledge what they did , his plans , what was going on and about his people just to pointlessly fake his own death what he could simple do by leaving his body.Not mention there was no point to fake his death as no one would have any important information about him in first place as i have said he explains everything in mothers lair.

 

And of course killing your enemy and person that oppose your plans ,also have information about you and your plans serves no purpose at all.

 

Architect seems like person who is willing to sacrifice his ally for possibility to achieve something more. Faking his death would mean that enemy walks away thinking job done and Architect can still use his enemy: Warden to kill his other enemy: Mother and then he would be free to continue his plans in peace, without the Mother and without Warden knowing his still alive. So that's my point.

[TheKomandorShepard]

Architect seems like person who is willing to sacrifice his ally for possibility to achieve something more. Faking his death would mean that enemy walks away thinking job done and Architect can still use his enemy: Warden to kill his other enemy: Mother and then he would be free to continue his plans in peace, without the Mother and without Warden knowing his still alive. So that's my point.

And what he achived killed his own ally , let his enemy who oppose his plans go alive with knowledge about his plans just so he could just to fake his own death what he could without sacrificing pointlessly his ally and letting his enemy go , as well in first place if he was immortal the warden help wouldn't be even remotely necessary.So no he didn't achieve something more... . eh i have to repeat that 100 time and this point.

[Panda]

And what he achived killed his own ally , let his enemy who oppose his plans go alive with knowledge about his plans just so he could just to fake his own death what he could without sacrificing pointlessly his ally and lething his enemy go , as well in first place if he was immortal the warden help wouldn't be even remotely necessary.So no he didn't achieve something anything more... . eh i have to repeat that 100 time and this point.

 

It was worthy risk from his point to try to get ally who is much powerful than his ally that he supposedly sacrificed.

 

Again, immortality isn't same as strenght. The Warden help is necessarily and that's why he asks it, he would already killed Mother on his own if he could/wanted.

 

Yep, I'm repeating myself a lot as well..

 

And all this is still hypothetical, since he might be immortal ^^;

[TheKomandorShepard]

It was worthy risk from his point to try to get ally who is much powerful than his ally that he supposedly sacrificed.

 

Again, immortality isn't same as strenght. The Warden help is necessarily and that's why he asks it, he would already killed Mother on his own if he could/wanted.

 

Yep, I'm repeating myself a lot as well..

 

And all this is still hypothetical, since he might be immortal ^^;

facepalm what the hell you are talking about he didn't got the warden as an ally in that scenario the warden in fact opposed his plans and killed him ,after the warden killed him he could possess the warden who was his enemy instead waste life of his ally .

 

He is immortal he can't die , he can kill the mother she can't kill him and he is powerful mage ,so no he didn't need the warden in such scenario.

 

And we are talking about scenario where supposedly architect have same ability that corypheus have and on my part how it doesn't have any sense i he has such ability.

[Panda]

facepalm what the hell you are talking about he didn't got the warden as an ally in that scenario the warden in fact opposed his plans and killed him ,after the warden killed him he could possess the warden who was his enemy instead waste life of his ally .

 

He is immortal he can't die , he can kill the mother she can't kill him and he is powerful mage ,so no he didn't need the warden in such scenario.

 

And we are talking about scenario where supposedly architect have same ability that corypheus have and on my part how it doesn't have any sense i he has such ability.

 

Ok

[Heimdall]

To be honest im done at this point ,i should have give up as soon as you started say as architect corpse would be seen as his suicide.

...When did I ever say that?

[TheKomandorShepard]

...When did I ever say that?

I just humorously pointed (to not said mocked) how you were unable to compreheand (simple concept) that his death would been seen as warden or mother forces doing ,not him "randomly" dying what either could be only death by natural cause or suicide.