812 réponses à ce sujet

[Heimdall]

He is not providing criticism. He is merely making off-topic remarks that are derailing the thread as he clearly has no interest in actually discussing the substantive material. If you read his post, he even admitted he could care less about the thread. He can move elsewhere for that.

Its not off-topic to tell you that your arguments are based on supposition and half the reason this thread has gone on so long is because people keep calling you on it.

[Revan Reborn]

I don't see the difference. I don't know anything about Spartan OPs, but if I substitute ME and DA examples instead, I don't have a real preference for longer over shorter.

Obviously you have different tastes, but this is a completely different argument from the price/performance argument. Wobbling between the two topics isn't a sensible way to make your case. Or rather, cases.

Fair enough. I found most of ME's DLCs to be mediocre or uninteresting. Little short stories that ultimately don't have much of an impact on the story or characters could easily just be side quests in the base game. I'd rather BioWare use their resources more appropriately for DLC or expansion content to make us excited about the future of the game.

 

Expansions, on average, are cheaper than a lot of DLC content. Again, look at Jaws of Hakkon ($14.99) versus The Witcher 3's Expansion Pass ($24.99). The former is allegedly 10 hours of new content while the latter is allegedly 30 hours of new content. Price TW3 expansions separately and they come out to $12.49. TW3 is cheaper and more content. It's a better deal no matter how you look at it. Don't even get me started on the pricing for all the ME2 and ME3 DLC and the fact it's never discounted or included in a bundle...

 

Have you actually played TW3, then? Because you're making a lot of big assumptions. The bolded part is so mind-bogglingly stupid, it makes me wonder how you managed to type the words out without getting a spontaneous nosebleed.

Your reading comprehension is terrible, truly. Read that bolded part again. I'm asking you whether you played TW2, meaning you would know there were a lot of major decisions and they will impact TW3 based on how TW2 ended. We also know quite a bit about the plot in TW3 from the Wild Hunt, Ciri, Yennefer, the final stages of the Nilfgaardian invasion, and much more. You really should learn to comprehend before calling others idiots...

[Giantdeathrobot]

I've seen merry-go-rounds that went in circles less than this ''discussion''.

[Steppenwolf]

Some of the Mass Effect 3 DLC was free for several weeks, soooo...

[o Ventus]

 

Your reading comprehension is terrible, truly. Read that bolded part again. I'm asking you whether you played TW2, meaning you would know there were a lot of major decisions and they will impact TW3 based on how TW2 ended. We also know quite a bit about the plot in TW3 from the Wild Hunt, Ciri, Yennefer, the final stages of the Nilfgaardian invasion, and much more. You really should learn to comprehend before calling others idiots...

 

 

 

TW3, on the other hand, will be entirely different. The choices in TW2 matter a lot (you would know this and not make a ridiculous argument if you actually played the game). I don't even understand why someone who doesn't even know that much about The Witcher is trying to "educate" others about how TW3 will function. Very strange.

 

You make a statement concerning TW3, and close that same statement with another piece on TW3, so in the middle you randomly make a point about TW2 without trying to transition or segue into TW2? Do you know how to English? Please, a blind man can see that you were clearly talking about TW3, and now you're trying to backpedal because you said something stupid, and somebody called you out on it.

[Phoe77]

He is not providing criticism. He is merely making off-topic remarks that are derailing the thread as he clearly has no interest in actually discussing the substantive material. If you read his post, he even admitted he could care less about the thread. He can move elsewhere for that.

 

No, I'm providing criticism.  Notice the part where I mentioned that your arguments are based on assumptions and personal preferences rather than actual evidence?  That was a critique.  

 

I have no problem with how Bioware does its DLC.  I also don't have any problem with them looking to other companies and trying to learn from their successes.  I do have a problem with employing faulty reasoning to further your goal, especially when your goal involves influencing the way a company conducts its business.

 

If you want to have a meaningful discussion of the topic, you need to clearly state your definitions of DLC and expansion because the terms are vague.  You can't dismiss something that a member of one company says as a falsehood while taking the statements of a member of another company on faith without any evidence.  You can't just dismiss opposition by calling them fanboys and pretending that there's no merit behind their disagreement.  You should recognize that you not enjoying an aspect of a game doesn't make that aspect of the game bad.

[o Ventus]

For someone who puts a lot of stock into what the crowd thinks, you'd think that the OP might take a step back and try to understand why so many people are calling him out in this thread.

[LinksOcarina]

I did warn you that this guy is going to demagogue his way through this. 

 

Why are you all even bothering anymore? Let him wallow in his ignorance.

[Revan Reborn]

You make a statement concerning TW3, and close that same statement with another piece on TW3, so in the middle you randomly make a point about TW2 without trying to transition or segue into TW2? Do you know how to English? Please, a blind man can see that you were clearly talking about TW3, and now you're trying to backpeddle because you said something stupid.

Here is what I stated: "The choices in TW2 matter a lot (you would know this and not make a ridiculous argument if you actually played the game)."

 

The Witcher 2 is clearly the subject of the sentence. The statement in parenthesis offers more context with respect to the subject of the sentence, which is The Witcher 2. You can continue using your own inadequacies of the English language as a means of trying to undermind each and every statement I make, but you just look silly doing so.

 

You are looking for a flaw where one does not exist. You are trying so hard to completely unravel this thead, that you, yourself, are unraveling in the process. You are the embodiment of a Greek tragedy percolating into its final act as we speak. Congratulations.

[o Ventus]

I'm still patiently waiting on an answer to these:

 

 

And what, pray tell, is the difference between an expansion and DLC?

 

 

I'm not asking Bioware, I'm asking you. Surely you should know, since you can so casually make the distinction. So how about instead of insulting me, you give me a clear answer?

[Wulfram]

The difference between DLC and expansions is length.

And you'd probably expect a bit more in the way of new talents/increased level cap/other mechanical changes, though I don't think that's so fundamental

[wolfsite]

The difference between DLC and expansions is length.

And you'd probably expect a bit more in the way of new talents/increased level cap/other mechanical changes, though I don't think that's so fundamental

 

But these "Expansions" are only going to be available online so to to get this content you would need to download it, making it Downloadable Content, or DLC.

[Wulfram]

But these "Expansions" are only going to be available online so to to get this content you would need to download it, making it Downloadable Content, or DLC.

Well if you're going to be all literal, then Dragon Age Inquisition itself is downloadable content.

But that's not how the term is used.

[Heimdall]

Well if you're going to be all literal, then Dragon Age Inquisition itself is downloadable content.But that's not how the term is used.

But how the term is used seems to be mostly a matter of arbitrary branding. The OP is utterly convinced that Dragonborn is an expansion, despite the developer never referring to it as such. And at what length does a DLC become an expansion?

The term has nostalgic connotations, but I'm not convinced of its actual usefulness in describing the content it's applied to.

[Wulfram]

But how the term is used seems to be mostly a matter of arbitrary branding. The OP is utterly convinced that Dragonborn is an expansion, despite the developer never referring to it as such. And at what length does a DLC become an expansion?

The term has nostalgic connotations, but I'm not convinced of its actual usefulness in describing the content it's applied to.

At what point does a short story become a novella and a novella become a novel? The lack of a clear dividing line does not make a term invalid.

[Giantdeathrobot]

The difference between DLC and expansions is length.

And you'd probably expect a bit more in the way of new talents/increased level cap/other mechanical changes, though I don't think that's so fundamental

 

I can accept that, but what's the length treshold? Is Dragonborn, which has a lot of content, actually an expansion despite the fact it was called a DLC?

 

If Witcher 3 releases a 10 hour DLC, does it become an expansion? If it's 20 hours, is it an expansion?

 

It just seems so arbitrary to me, and in context as I see it it's mostly used in a expansion = good, DLC = bad way.

[Heimdall]

At what point does a short story become a novella and a novella become a novel? The lack of a clear dividing line does not make a term invalid.

Maybe, if the term itself were applied consistently. But not all companies (Very few these days I think) slap "expansion" on their large content packs.

The issue I have with the terms usage now is that it's primary function is as a marketing buzzword, guaranteed to draw in people like the OP on pure nostalgia without telling you anything meaningful about the content.

(And the OP seems convinced at there's a qualitative rather than mostly a quantitative distinction between the two)

[o Ventus]

The difference between DLC and expansions is length.

And you'd probably expect a bit more in the way of new talents/increased level cap/other mechanical changes, though I don't think that's so fundamental

 

Except that's an arbitrary and meaningless way to distinguish the two. 

 

"Oh, this add-on gives you 5 hours of new quests, characters, weapons, and locations? DLC!" 

 

"This add-on gives you 6 hours of repetition and grinding? Expansion!"

[Shechinah]

(to Wulfram) I believe a short story, novella and a novel are designated by their word count. A short story is this amount of words, a novelletta is this amount of words and so forth.

[Revan Reborn]

Todd Howard (Lead Developer at BGS: TES, Fallout), one of the legends and pioneers of the industry, gives his thoughts on DLC versus an expansion: http://kotaku.com/58...expansion-packs

 

Here is a more in-depth explanation of DLC versus an expansion with regard to TW3: https://noplatform.w...meaning-of-dlc/

 

As you can tell, and what I have stated several times, expansions generally are entirely new experiences. As the article suggests, it's in some ways a sequel to the base game. Whereas DLC merely adds to the base game, extending that original experience. Due to technology and the disfavor of expansions in more modern times (because of costs and the shift to consoles), the term and its meaning has become "arbitrary" because of ignorance of the term and an inability to tell the difference.

[SnakeCode]

I'm not sure why so many people are arguing on what makes dlc/expansions different. An expansion can be a dlc and vise versa, if you have to download it then it's all technically dlc. It's mostly an arbitrary distinction.

 

Having said that I do think that length plays a part in it for many people. An expansion has to be long enough to justifiably put it to disc and release it as completely seperate content, I don't think you could do that with any single Bioware dlc (LoTSB maybe?)

 

Of course in modern times those waters are getting increasingly muddied as we see more and more full length games being released that are as short/shorter than most dlcs, such as The Order: 1886.

[wolfsite]

I'm not sure why so many people are arguing on what makes dlc/expansions different. An expansion can be a dlc and vise versa, if you have to download it then it's all technically dlc. It's mostly an arbitrary distinction.

 

Having said that do think that length plays a part in it for many people. An expansion has to be long enough to justifiably put it to disc and release it as completely seperate content, I don't think you could do that with any single Bioware dlc (LoTSB maybe?)

 

Of course in modern times those waters are getting increasingly muddied as we see more and more full length games being released that are as short/shorter than most dlcs, such as The Order: 1886.

 

I think certain people are just trying to make the word Expansion stand out so they can make one company look superior to another.

[wolfsite]

Todd Howard (Lead Developer at BGS: TES, Fallout), one of the legends and pioneers of the industry, gives his thoughts on DLC versus an expansion: http://kotaku.com/58...expansion-packs

 

Here is a more in-depth explanation of DLC versus an expansion with regard to TW3: https://noplatform.w...meaning-of-dlc/

 

As you can tell, and what I have stated several times, expansions generally are entirely new experiences. As the article suggests, it's in some ways a sequel to the base game. Whereas DLC merely adds to the base game, extending that original experience. Due to technology and the disfavor of expansions in more modern times (because of costs and the shift to consoles), the term and its meaning has become "arbitrary" because of ignorance of the term and an inability to tell the difference.

 

Neither of those are actual articles.  They are prepared Marketing statements made by a PR department for generate buzz for a game followed up by one persons opinion (which may have been bought to help generate more PR.

 

If you linked to articles that involved people in the industry but are not linked to the games in anyway that would be more valid.

[Revan Reborn]

I think certain people are just trying to make the word Expansion stand out so they can make one company look superior to another.

You would miss the entire point of this thread then. I don't care about petty politics nor who thinks which company is better. I care about quality games and developers always striving to make games better. As I've stated, BioWare's DLC policy in recent years has fallen into mediocrity, from my perspective. CDPR is merely offering an alternative that may be a better model than what BioWare is currently endorsing. I'm merely suggesting BioWare needs to be cognizant of its surroundings rather than sit on a pedestal listening to BioWare fanboys tell them how they can do no wrong.

[X Equestris]

I'm not sure why so many people are arguing on what makes dlc/expansions different. An expansion can be a dlc and vise versa, if you have to download it then it's all technically dlc. It's mostly an arbitrary distinction.
 
Having said that I do think that length plays a part in it for many people. An expansion has to be long enough to justifiably put it to disc and release it as completely seperate content, I don't think you could do that with any single Bioware dlc (LoTSB maybe?)
 
Of course in modern times those waters are getting increasingly muddied as we see more and more full length games being released that are as short/shorter than most dlcs, such as The Order: 1886.

Awakening was large enough to put on a separate disc. As a matter of fact, that's the version I have. That's the only Bioware dlc I know of that would be big enough, though.