812 réponses à ce sujet

[Ashen Nedra]

No, that is your interpretation. I suggest you read the books again, they far superior when it comes to social critique and culture and not so much a fantasy satire.

Also putting fanservice all the time could result in wanting to bang the main character daughter, that is ****** sick, Ciri is supposed to be Ellie to Joel in the Last of Us, not the love interest. They failed in that design hard. Just like in any design till now, when it comes to female characters. Well many two or three characters from TW 1 escape that, which is ironic.

I am no gonna to continue this, I can see CDPR faults well, too bad some people always use political correctness has an excuse for valid criticism. Just like using the word expansion for a season pass.

Picking either my interpretation or yours of the books -which are in no way mutally exclusive btw- doesn't really change that the sex cards and Geralt as a womanizer are well established in the books, contrary to your first post on the subject- and not (only) a 'fanservice' towards sex-hungry gamers.

 

I much prefer an adaptation that stays in line with the original than, say, having a female Elven noble fighting in Lord of the Rings (instead of Glorfindel), which is totally in contradiction with Tolkien's work and world, just for the sake of introducing an active female lead.

 

That is also 'fanservice'.

 

And I don't really understand your last point: Ciri is not Geralt's daughter to the best of my knowledge. He's maybe a mentor, if you like. They meet when she is 11 or something.

 

Has it been implied in promotional stuff that a romance can occur between them? That would surprise me.

[SofaJockey]

How much of this "free DLC" content is actually released? Since the game itself isn't out, I'm willing to bet "zero."

 

I don't take issue with people saying that they prefer the Witcher series to Dragon Age. Preferences are preferences (although I do reserve the right to privately question their judgment). I only object when people say "Make X more like Y" and Y is still weeks from release.

 

This is true, it's somewhat premature to compare these pieces of 'additional content' when one is restricted (BW) and the other (CDPR) is unreleased.

As an aside, having finished JoH this evening, it's not the very best DLC BW ever made but it's better than all of the DAO DLCs in my opinion,

and is the most interesting of the regional zones now in the game.

[Ashen Nedra]

I find it funny that people criticise female characters in TW as being overtly sexualised in their design, when they are far less so than many of Biowares characters. It was bad in TW1 yes, but they learned from that, and they improved drastically in TW2 and TW3.

 

I think some people need to learn that there's a difference between attractive/not ugly and overtly sexualised when it comes to female characters. Triss (TW2 onwards,) Yen and Ciri aren't skimpily dressed at all, they look feminine sure, but not impractical. They aren't soldiers or warriors, so it would be odd to see them wearing full plate (which seems is the only attire people are actually content to have female videogame characters wear on the bsn.) 

 

Compare them to the likes of Miranda, Isabella and Liara and they really aren't anywhere near as bad as people make out. 

And they are actually women in power in the Witcher's world, being sorceress and politicians. I don't see how the Witcher is sexist frankly. It was an unfair and mostly uneducated attack in my opinion.

[Mihura]

I find it funny that people criticise female characters in TW as being overtly sexualised in their design, when they are far less so than many of Biowares characters. It was bad in TW1 yes, but they learned from that, and they improved drastically in TW2 and TW3.

 

I think some people need to learn that there's a difference between attractive/not ugly and overtly sexualised when it comes to female characters. Triss (TW2 onwards,) Yen and Ciri aren't skimpily dressed at all, they look feminine sure, but not impractical. They aren't soldiers or warriors, so it would be odd to see them wearing full plate (which seems is the only attire people are actually content to have female videogame characters wear on the bsn.) 

 

Compare them to the likes of Miranda, Isabella and Liara and they really aren't anywhere near as bad as people make out. 

 

Never said Bioware was better but DA:I was a way more equal for everyone, from Vivienne cleavage and Morrigan clothes to IronBull harness and Varric cleavage.

Actually Ciri is a warrior and a sorceress, she was always dressed for combat and in more practical outfits. High-heels are not something she would go for. My problem is that despite Bioware shitty design some female characters dress according to their roles, Aveline, Cassandra, Josephine, Liara, Tali... etc. If you can name one important character from TW 2 that did not get naked or has cleavage I will change my opinion.
Sure fanservice can make sense if is part of their concept, Isabela, Sheala, Succubus and so on but not Saskia nor Phillipa according to the lore. Having some characters with fanservice is great, having all the female character with cleavage or naked is pretty bad. Beside the game need more dicks or male butt shoots but I think the fandom cannot handle that.

[AlanC9]

Yes, without disbursing money. so, delayed delivery (I'm not really interested in discussing semantics ) is fine with me.
 
Delayed delivery and asking for more of my money, I'm not fine with: day-one DLCs such as Shale or From Ashes (it has been proved, has it not?)

Well, Javik's squadmate stuff is present, but the Eden Prime stuff is only in the DLC.

At least day 1 DLC asks for your money. If they're not asking you to pay for the content, that means that you're paying for it whether you want it or not.

[In Exile]

And they are actually women in power in the Witcher's world, being sorceress and politicians. I don't see how the Witcher is sexist frankly. It was an unfair and mostly uneducated attack in my opinion.

Let's not open that can of worms. Can we all agree on that?

[Ashen Nedra]

Never said Bioware was better but DA:I was a way more equal for everyone, from Vivienne cleavage and Morrigan clothes to IronBull harness and Varric cleavage.

Actually Ciri is a warrior and a sorceress, she was always dressed for combat and in more practical outfits. High-heels are not something she would go for. My problem is that despite Bioware shitty design some female characters dress according to their roles, Aveline, Cassandra, Josephine, Liara, Tali... etc. If you can name one important character from TW 2 that did not get naked or has cleavage I will change my opinion.
Sure fanservice can make sense if is part of their concept, Isabela, Sheala, Succubus and so on but not Saskia nor Phillipa according to the lore. Having some characters with fanservice is great, having all the female character with cleavage or naked is pretty bad. Beside the game need more dicks or male butt shoots but I think the fandom cannot handle that.

What would you say if they had adapted another part of the 'lore' you're constantly referring to: namely the meeting with Saskia's father and his two almost naked female Zerrikanian bodyguards, who end up offering Geralt a threesome?

 

Sorceresses are also widely known (and criticized) for using magic to enhance their looks and sex-appeal, and for their sexual wantonness, being unable to conceive in the Witcher 's world.

 

Did we read the same books?

[Ashen Nedra]

Let's not open that can of worms. Can we all agree on that?

Sorry, is it that much of a bad idea? I'll trust you and stop, then

[In Exile]

Sorry, is it that much of a bad idea? I'll trust you and stop, then

We'll just derail the thread and get it locked.

[Hiemoth]

Freudian slip? 

 

Seriously, DLCs are too expensive compared to the price of the game itself in my opinion. Even in the golden era of Bioware (for me, before DAI basically), I found DLCs a rip-off. I always tfelt a little guilty buying them.

 

And the additional Troll Adventure in the Witcher 2 (free) was comparable in content to say...witch hunt. 3 quests 4 hours max of gameplay, reused environments.

 

But, I think what is really different between the two companies and what is really being compared is a commercial attitude, not the products themselves.

 

CDPR is giving away stuff (I see it also as a way to taunt or troll its competitors), while preparing for the first time a significant expansion/big DLC next year, if I understood correctly.

 

On the other hand, Bioware continues to produce minor DLC at half the basic game price.

 

Then don't buy them? And while I find it curious that you use Witch Hunt, seeing that it was probably the weakest of the DAO DLCs and the only one use recycled areas, I am also truly confused that it took you four hours to play through Witcher 2's troll DLC.

 

As for the responses, you have no idea how large those DLCs from CDPR are going to be, although you seem to be completely certain that they will enough of content to match half of the original game, as that is their combined price compared to the original game and that seems to be the only thing that matters. And by the way, Bioware's doesn't cost half of the basic game and what exactly is the decision range of minor DLC here? That's completely arbitrary and again seems to miss the point that they actually produce content for those. You know, the exactly the same thing CDPR is doing and you feel is okay for them to ask money for.

[AlanC9]

Personally, it's good for them in the end, GOG is a much better service than Steam, but CD Projekt Red is in the same boat as BioWare and other AAA teams now. They are not going to be going anywhere for a while unless something catastrophic happens.

Well, not quite the same boat. CDPR still has the advantage of lower salaries, unless something's really changed in the last couple of years.

[wolfhowwl]

Fortunately as a PC gamer I've been able to sidestep any of the issues over "value" of a DLC.

[Mihura]

What would you say if they had adapted another part of the 'lore' you're constantly referring to: namely the meeting with Saskia's father and his two almost naked female Zerrikanian bodyguards, who end up offering Geralt a threesome?

 

Sorceresses are also widely known (and criticized) for using magic to enhance their looks and sex-appeal, and for their sexual wantonness, being unable to conceive in the Witcher 's world.

 

Did we read the same books?

 

I read some of them, so where is the scar that Triss is suppose to have? did you read the part where she said she would not use another low cut dress or reveling clothes. Did you miss the part where Ciri had the scar through the bone of her face and not the silly thing she has now in game or that she was raised by warriors too and dressed for combat according. Or that time where Geralt was full naked in from of Triss with her clothes and so many other things that the devs forget to put in the game.

The only thing I saw was a game that wanted to go it's way to put fanservice only on the female characters and not like the books at all.

[Ashen Nedra]

Then don't buy them? And while I find it curious that you use Witch Hunt, seeing that it was probably the weakest of the DAO DLCs and the only one use recycled areas, I am also truly confused that it took you four hours to play through Witcher 2's troll DLC.

 

As for the responses, you have no idea how large those DLCs from CDPR are going to be, although you seem to be completely certain that they will enough of content to match half of the original game, as that is their combined price compared to the original game and that seems to be the only thing that matters. And by the way, Bioware's doesn't cost half of the basic game and what exactly is the decision range of minor DLC here? That's completely arbitrary and again seems to miss the point that they actually produce content for those. You know, the exactly the same thing CDPR is doing and you feel is okay for them to ask money for.

I think you're missing info there. The 16 'DLCs' are free and are only minor stuff (hair, swords, cosmetic things...) THEN you have two DLC/expansions as you wish coming up later. But don't worry, after DAI I won't preorder any game ever, even the Witcher. So we'll see.

 

I obviously chose Witch Hunt on purpose....because it was the worst DLC for me.

 

 

Also, if you don't like the Witcher and CD Projekt's attitude, then...don't buy the game?

 

Let me turn it this way: what would you say, as a DAI fan, to 16 free DLCs including, let's say ... Qunari Hair options and a mirror of transformation ?

 

Would you complain?

[Ashen Nedra]

I read some of them, so where is the scar that Triss is suppose to have? did you read the part where she said she would not use another low cut dress or reveling clothes. Did you miss the part where Ciri had the scar through the bone of her face and not the silly thing she has now in game or that she was raised by warriors too and dressed for combat according. Or that time where Geralt was full naked in from of Triss with her clothes and so many other things that the devs forget to put in the game.

The only thing I saw was a game that wanted to go it's way to put fanservice only on the female characters and not like the books at all.

Frankly, no and no and no, and another no. My focus was on the stories and Slavic mythology and humor. Not social issues or dress codes.

 

I guess we didn't read the same books after all. Bias and all that.

[KBomb]

I think you're missing info there. The 16 'DLCs' are free and are only minor stuff (hair, swords, cosmetic things...) THEN you have two DLC/expansions as you wish coming up later. But don't worry, after DAI I won't preorder any game ever, even the Witcher. So we'll see.

 

I obviously chose Witch Hunt on purpose....because it was the worst DLC for me.

 

 

Also, if you don't like the Witcher and CD Projekt's attitude, then...don't buy the game?

 

Let me turn it this way: what would you say, as a DAI fan, to 16 free DLCs including, let's say ... Qunari Hair options and a mirror of transformation ?

 

Would you complain?

A great question you'll never get an honest answer to. Even if the 16 free add-ons are items such weapons, hair, armor, etc, I don't see it as a bad thing. I know some will say, "Those things were just removed and given free in a ploy for advertising." My answer is: so? It's better than pulling them from the game and then selling them. Honestly, I don't see how this is a bad thing and I don't see how people can take offense to it because someone suggested  it should be something Bioware consider. I really am genuinely curious as to why people are so angry. 

[Mihura]

Frankly, no and no and no, and another no. My focus was on the stories and Slavic mythology and humor. Not social issues or dress codes.

 

I guess we didn't read the same books after all. Bias and all that.

 

Kinda hilarious because all of that is in the books, wanting to see only what you want, sounds hypocrisy when you are calling my bias. You can focus on whatever pleases you, that does not erase the social aspect of the books, I mean what do you think Nilfgaard is or the whole Ithline's prophecy?

Ya it is best to end this here.

[SnakeCode]

A great question you'll never get an honest answer to. Even if the 16 free add-ons are items such weapons, hair, armor, etc, I don't see it as a bad thing. I know some will say, "Those things were just removed and given free in a ploy for advertising." My answer is: so? It's better than pulling them from the game and then selling them. Honestly, I don't see how this is a bad thing and I don't see how people can take offense to it because someone suggested  it should be something Bioware consider. I really am genuinely curious as to why people are so angry. 

 

It's because the OP brought up The Witcher. If the question had been presented the way Ashen phrased it, we'd likely see none of this ridiculous infighting or petty squabbles. Ther are people who really loathe TW games and CDPR on these boards, so when they are brought up as something that Bioware could learn from or be influenced by, their hackles are immediately raised. 

[Hiemoth]

I think you're missing info there. The 16 'DLCs' are free and are only minor stuff (hair, swords, cosmetic things...) THEN you have two DLC/expansions as you wish coming up later. But don't worry, after DAI I won't preorder any game ever, even the Witcher. So we'll see.

 

I obviously chose Witch Hunt on purpose....because it was the worst DLC for me.

 

 

Also, if you don't like the Witcher and CD Projekt's attitude, then...don't buy the game?

 

Let me turn it this way: what would you say, as a DAI fan, to 16 free DLCs including, let's say ... Qunari Hair options and a mirror of transformation ?

 

Would you complain?

 

No, I wouldn't complain. Do you know what else I wouldn't do? Compare those minor items to actual story DLCs which have a large amount resources invested in to them as an equivalent comparison, since that seems to be what you are doing. And by the way, it is completely valid to compare the DLC you considered the worst to the the only story DLC in Witcher 2, which also happened to be really short.

 

As for CDPR and the Witcher series, I am utterly baffled by your statement as I have not actually complained about the game? My point was that use the free DLC in the Witcher series, which are all really small an minor, while complaining that Bioware charges for their story DLCs which require large investments from the company is misleading and false in so many ways.

[Hiemoth]

A great question you'll never get an honest answer to. Even if the 16 free add-ons are items such weapons, hair, armor, etc, I don't see it as a bad thing. I know some will say, "Those things were just removed and given free in a ploy for advertising." My answer is: so? It's better than pulling them from the game and then selling them. Honestly, I don't see how this is a bad thing and I don't see how people can take offense to it because someone suggested  it should be something Bioware consider. I really am genuinely curious as to why people are so angry. 

 

Because they haven't pulled those from the game and sold them anyway? The whole argument here is built around the statement that Bioware's DLCs are comparable in size and resource use to those free DLC put out by CDPR, which they are not. If the argument was for those free DLCs, then such minor DLCs would be the only things out there as they would never release something like the MotA or LotSB for free. Neither is CDPR.

[KBomb]

It's because the OP brought up The Witcher. If the question had been presented the way Ashen phrased it, we'd likely see none of this ridiculous infighting or petty squabbles. Ther are people who really loathe TW games and CDPR on these boards, so when they are brought up as something that Bioware could learn from or be influenced by, their hackles are immediately raised.

I think you may be right.

[LinksOcarina]

It's because the OP brought up The Witcher. If the question had been presented the way Ashen phrased it, we'd likely see none of this ridiculous infighting or petty squabbles. Ther are people who really loathe TW games and CDPR on these boards, so when they are brought up as something that Bioware could learn from or be influenced by, their hackles are immediately raised. 

 

I am calling BS on this one too.

 

It has more to do with the OP's own dismissive responses regarding any form of critique on The Witcher, over The Witcher itself. 

[KBomb]

I am calling BS on this one too.

It has more to do with the OP's own dismissive responses regarding any form of critique on The Witcher, over The Witcher itself.

To be fair, the same can be said for half the responses in this thread. Just replace your statement with "Bioware" instead of "The Witcher". I get disagreeing and opposing opinions, but the anger and defensiveness is a bit confusing-- and asinine.

He is right that nearly every time TW gets brought up, arguments and "measuring" ensues. It gets like The Outsiders up in here. Ridiculous.

[LinksOcarina]

To be fair, the same can be said for half the responses in this thread. Just replace your statement with "Bioware" instead of "The Witcher". I get disagreeing and opposing opinions, but the anger and defensiveness is a bit confusing-- and asinine.

He is right that nearly every time TW gets brought up, arguments and "measuring" ensues. It gets like The Outsiders up in here. Ridiculous.

 

That is also something that happens everywhere, so i'm not sure if that's really valid as a complaint regarding the whole issue. the Bethesda forums are just as critical and vicious if you badmouth something they love, like Morrowind. And I know Obsidian has their own share of detractors too. Never been to the Witcher forums, not sure if they even have them, but I guarantee there is a section of the population that does the same measuring stick. 

 

Not to mention folks keep bringing up The Witcher to "measure up" against Dragon Age all the time, and in most cases just to stir the pot. So once again, the shoe is always on the other foot. The point though is that this has always been a circular debate regarding semantics. The OP may have a "point", but hes also ignoring holes in his own logic and reasoning, and that's frankly grating.

[Mihura]

That is also something that happens everywhere, so i'm not sure if that's really valid as a complaint regarding the whole issue. the Bethesda forums are just as critical and vicious if you badmouth something they love, like Morrowind. And I know Obsidian has their own share of detractors too. Never been to the Witcher forums, not sure if they even have them, but I guarantee there is a section of the population that does the same measuring stick. 

 

Not to mention folks keep bringing up The Witcher to "measure up" against Dragon Age all the time, and in most cases just to stir the pot. So once again, the shoe is always on the other foot. The point though is that this has always been a circular debate regarding semantics. The OP may have a "point", but hes also ignoring holes in his own logic and reasoning, and that's frankly grating.

 

From calling bioware fans biodrones, to basically feeling superior to them. In my experience it is much, much worse than BSN.

The only time I left BSN was on the ME 3 and DA 2 nerdrage wave, the forum was really toxic at the time. The problem is not talking about the witcher, there are a lot of people that love the game and the universe here, me included. The problem is that all the arguments end up with calling people "social justice warrior" or the "witcher is a sex game" when the other side has good arguments.

The dev team promised gamers that season passes were out of question last year. Now they have one and are telling people that is an expansion pass. this is really bad behavior and should never be imitated, it shows the lack of respect when it comes to customer intelligence. If bioware need to look at someone, go for Paradox and Obisidian.