812 réponses à ce sujet

[wolfhowwl]

I've already connected the dots for you.

 

We know Awakening received overwhelmingly positive reviews. We know how many copies approximately were sold on all platforms. The only evidence to suggest DA:A "underperformed" is Mark Darrah, whose job it is to represent the game and build its image. If EA decides to give BioWare a limited budget that promotes the multiplayer game shop over making an actual expansion, do you really believe Darrah would tell that to the press? No. He's going to spin the story in such a way to justify not making an expansion.

 

In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if the game shop is the exact reason expansions are no longer happening, as there were no microtransactions in DAO. It's much more profitable to have players directly paying money to receive benefits in a never-ending multiplayer grind rather than making an expansion with a lot of content for a one-time purchase.

 

"We know Awakening received overwhelmingly positive reviews"

 

On Metacritic it has 82/80/80 across platforms, hardly anything special for AAA and low for BioWare titles at that time.

 

"We know how many copies approximately were sold on all platforms."

 

Do we, did anyone post a statement from EA or NPD numbers? The only "source" I saw was VGChartz, a site that is not reliable at all. Also as I think you know sales are only one piece of what determines wherever a project was a financial success or not.

 

You state Darrah has an agenda but from this thread you clearly also have one yourself.

[Revan Reborn]

This is the most illogical, inane drivel I've read in a long while.

 

"Quality is subjective, but it's good when it gets high reviews."

 

Do you have any idea how stupid the things you're typing really are?

 

Please, tell me you're aware of how much you're twisting the meaning of the word "subjective" to suit your agenda.

There is nothing illogical about any of my posts. You are merely getting upset and resulting to insults as a means of showing your frustration for my lack of agreement.

 

Quality is subjective. What you failed to understand through my post is that someone's opinion, plus good sales and high reviews, show a positive correlation that would lead one to believe that many see the product as good. On the contrary, your sole opinion with nothing to correlate with it is much weaker in comparison. Thus, while an opinion of a product is still purely subjective, the more positive outlook by the majority is likely to outshine the more negative outlook by the minority. That should be rather simple for you to understand. It's a basic concept.

 

You are resulting to the ever over-used Straw Man for a lack of rebuttals and a yearning to win a "competition" that never existed. If you can not understand the basic meaning of the English language, then you are beyond help. Your opinion really doesn't matter when Awakening did well and Mass Effect 3 did well, regardless of how you feel about either of them.

[Revan Reborn]

"We know Awakening received overwhelmingly positive reviews"

 

On Metacritic it has 82/80/80 across platforms, hardly anything special for AAA and low for BioWare titles at that time.

 

"We know how many copies approximately were sold on all platforms."

 

Do we, did anyone post a statement from EA or NPD numbers? The only "source" I saw was VGChartz, a site that is not reliable at all. Also as I think you know sales are only one piece of what determines wherever a project was a financial success or not.

 

You state Darrah has an agenda but from this thread you clearly also have one yourself.

What is my "agenda" exactly? You posit your statement as if I have some nefarious and deep dark secret that I am withholding from the public. My intentions have always been transparent and clear. I want BioWare to return to making expansions. I want them to give more value to our money rather than short DLCs for $14.99 and a worthless multiplayer cash shop. I want them to look at the competition and see what they are doing in comparison to BioWare. That is my "agenda." Take it as you will.

[SofaJockey]

You know another thing that annoys me is B-Wares choice to release the Black Emporium in May and not in April that one is confusing and irratating as hell.

 

Huh? Surely they are releasing it when they think it is ready?

Reading between the lines it looks like some beta feedback added a little to the release schedule.

 

... worthless multiplayer cash shop. ...

 

More huh? Is your issue with optional platinum purchase or the multiplayer overall? Because if you are asking for play value, the multiplayer offers hundreds of hours of play, ostensibly for free...

[Revan Reborn]

More huh? Is your issue with optional platinum purchase or the multiplayer overall? Because if you are asking for play value, the multiplayer offers hundreds of hours of play, ostensibly for free...

I do not support cash shops or microtransactions. The MP merely exists to perpetuate and encourage purchasing from the cash shop. I do not see "hundreds of hours of play, ostensibly for free" in an experience that is largely redundant and nothing more than a tedious grind. I can play any generic Korean MMO and obtain that same MP experience that ME3 and DAI both offer. I'd hardly call that an equitable use of resources. No, the MP exists purely to generate revenue. It's indisputable that a cash shop MP will always be more profitable than any DLC or expansion.

[SofaJockey]

I do not support cash shops or microtransactions. The MP merely exists to perpetuate and encourage purchasing from the cash shop. I do not see "hundreds of hours of play, ostensibly for free" in an experience that is largely redundant and nothing more than a tedious grind. I can play any generic Korean MMO and obtain that same MP experience that ME3 and DAI both offer. I'd hardly call that an equitable use of resources. No, the MP exists purely to generate revenue. It's indesputable that a cash shop MP will always be more profitable than any DLC or expansion.

 

Ok, this is past funny now. You highlight as yet unseen Witcher DLC as a model for value and dismiss the entertaining MP for ME3 and DAI.

I'm sorry, I can no longer handle the subjective illogic of this thread 

[Andraste_Reborn]

Look at it this way: either Mark Darrah told the truth and Awakening didn't sell enough to justify its production, or he's lying and EA could make money off a DAI expansion but they don't want to make one for whatever reason.

 

Either way, we're not getting an expansion.

[Revan Reborn]

Ok, this is past funny now. You highlight as yet unseen Witcher DLC as a model for value and dismiss the entertaining MP for ME3 and DAI.

I'm sorry, I can no longer handle the subjective illogic of this thread 

I highlight 16 free DLC updates and two expansions for the price of $24.99. Where DAI is offering a cash shop with a tedious grind and one DLC with barely any story and an empty new zone for $14.99.

 

ME3 is a ripoff of Gear of War's Horde Mode and Halo's Firefight Mode. It's hardly entertaining, original, and it's certainly not worthy of my time. It's purely a gimmick to get people to buy into the cash shop or force ME fans to grind their galactic readiness to 100% just so they can beat the game. One of the dumbest things BioWare has ever done.

 

If you enjoy redundant, boring grinds that are built to encourage spending in a cash shop, more power to you bud. Clearly, you and I have differing tastes.

[Revan Reborn]

Look at it this way: either Mark Darrah told the truth and Awakening didn't sell enough to justify its production, or he's lying and EA could make money off a DAI expansion but they don't want to make one for whatever reason.

 

Either way, we're not getting an expansion.

This is true, and a point I sadly made at the very beginning of this thread. It doesn't actually matter in the end whether what Mr. Darrah is saying is true or not. The fact is his words are an excuse for why an expansion won't be present in DAI. Again, this can probably be attributed to EA's new model of adding in redundant MP with a cash shop in BioWare games with the occasional small DLC that is overpriced.

[LonewandererD]

Le Sigh, as with all Witcher/CDPR v DA?Bioware threads this seems to be as productively as expected

 

-D-

[Revan Reborn]

Le Sigh, as with all Witcher/CDPR v DA?Bioware threads this seems to be as productively as expected

 

-D-

Too bad ths isn't a Witcher/CDPR v DA/BioWare thread. That's what the "BioWare diehards" are really trying hard to turn it into.

 

As a long time BioWare fan (probably longer than most here) as well as a hard critic, I believe in tough love and my favorite games and game developers getting better. I've taken issue with BioWare's DLC policy for quite a while since DAO, aside from Awakening. If TW3 does well and its DLC and expansion pass are a resounding success, it's something for BioWare/EA to closely watch and consider. EA loves to monetize everything, hence the MP cash shop that BioWare does in every game now. However, I don't believe that is in the best interest of the fans.

 

This is merely my suggestion to BioWare as I'd like to see them succeed and remain relevant for many years instead of disappearing into mediocrity due to poor business practices.

[Obsidian Gryphon]

 

ME3 is a ripoff of Gear of War's Horde Mode and Halo's Firefight Mode. It's hardly entertaining, original, and it's certainly not worthy of my time. It's purely a gimmick to get people to buy into the cash shop or force ME fans to grind their galactic readiness to 100% just so they can beat the game. One of the dumbest things BioWare has ever done.

 

If you enjoy redundant, boring grinds that are built to encourage spending in a cash shop, more power to you bud. Clearly, you and I have differing tastes.

 

While I agree that the ME MP is hardly innovative save for some interesting effects in biotic skill implementation (it's no where in terms of challenging game play on the level with the timeless and classic UT) and a poor supplementary to the main game play, no ME MP veteran / players worth their salt would bother to spend actual money. I certainly didn't. Any equipment I need to restock came from game credits earned in matches.

[wolfhowwl]

I highlight 16 free DLC updates and two expansions for the price of $24.99. Where DAI is offering a cash shop with a tedious grind and one DLC with barely any story and an empty new zone for $14.99.
 
ME3 is a ripoff of Gear of War's Horde Mode and Halo's Firefight Mode. It's hardly entertaining, original, and it's certainly not worthy of my time. It's purely a gimmick to get people to buy into the cash shop or force ME fans to grind their galactic readiness to 100% just so they can beat the game. One of the dumbest things BioWare has ever done.
 
If you enjoy redundant, boring grinds that are built to encourage spending in a cash shop, more power to you bud. Clearly, you and I have differing tastes.

 
"One of the dumbest things BioWare has ever done." Rofl. It should have been done earlier if only the combat in ME1 and ME2 hadn't been so bad.
 
There is nothing wrong with including a mode entirely focused on the combat in a ****** TPS.  It actually adds value to the product. People get to continue to play the combat they enjoy without having to go through the same old dialogue trees and encounters. It sure sucked getting those free DLCs thanks to lazy whales, oh wait it was great.
 
Fortunately the market disagreed with you and there is going to be multiplayer in the next Mass Effect. Don't worry you can still feel good about how superior your taste is lol. The rest of us will be smashing enemies with our bros.

[Revan Reborn]

 
"One of the dumbest things BioWare has ever done." Rofl. It should have been done earlier if only the combat in ME1 and ME2 hadn't been so bad.
 
There is nothing wrong with including a mode entirely focused on the combat in a ****** TPS.  It actually adds value to the product. People get to continue to play the combat they enjoy without having to go through the same old dialogue trees and encounters. It sure sucked getting those free DLCs thanks to lazy whales, oh wait it was great.
 
Fortunately the market disagreed with you and there is going to be multiplayer in the next Mass Effect. Don't worry you can still feel good about how superior your taste is lol. The rest of us will be smashing enemies with our bros.

Or, how about BioWare actually expand on what it actually does well? You know, the story? Many people criticized ME3's story as being terrible. Perhaps BioWare would have reconsidered it heavily had it not wasted time and resources on MP (yes, I recognize BioWare Montreal, who is now making NME, made the crappy MP).

 

There is little value in ME3's generic and uninteresting MP. I'm more than happy to play through the main story again which is actually good, rather than waste 20 minutes on a boring match of killing waves of mindless NPCs. Great, more characters and more maps for a boring MP system, I'm so lucky BioWare is so considerate...

 

Yea...no. BioWare has not made any affirmative answers with respect to multiplayer. We have no idea what BioWare is going to do at this point. Although, I wouldn't be surprised if they stick to the same crappy MP they've already made. My hope is they will get a clue and actually create more features that compliment and expand on the main experience. Not some inferior spinoff MP gameshop that will only entertain those with the most basic of expectations.

[BobZilla84]

Mass Effect 3 was not that great it had only 2 good parts and thats Tuchanka & Rannoch and the endings were never a problem for me it was everything else. Oh and Citadel was the only good Dlc for that game Omega & Leviathon was garbage.

Also Dragon Age 2 could have been salvaged with the Exalted March Expansion maybe but unfortunately that didnt happen dont get me wrong I understand that in the end they decided it wasnt financially sound but DA2 needed saving and B-Ware chose not to.

[BobZilla84]

Too bad ths isn't a Witcher/CDPR v DA/BioWare thread. That's what the "BioWare diehards" are really trying hard to turn it into.
 
As a long time BioWare fan (probably longer than most here) as well as a hard critic, I believe in tough love and my favorite games and game developers getting better. I've taken issue with BioWare's DLC policy for quite a while since DAO, aside from Awakening. If TW3 does well and its DLC and expansion pass are a resounding success, it's something for BioWare/EA to closely watch and consider. EA loves to monetize everything, hence the MP cash shop that BioWare does in every game now. However, I don't believe that is in the best interest of the fans.
 
This is merely my suggestion to BioWare as I'd like to see them succeed and remain relevant for many years instead of disappearing into mediocrity due to poor business practices.

I am there with you Revan I am a devoted Bioware fan but in truth their Dlc quality has seen better days these are in my opinion these Dlcs are the best B-Ware has released not including Awakening as it was an Expansion.
Origins:Witch Hunt
DA2:Legacy
ME2:Lair of The Shadow Broker
ME3:Citadel

Everything else was ok but not great these were great Dlcs everything else was acceptable.

[KaiserShep]

This idea that Awakening was universally loved by fans is news to me. It was mostly positive in its reception, but it certainly wasn't what I would define as overwhelming or anything like that. I always thought it was pretty sub par, inferior to either of DA2's DLC, or any of Mass Effect's (save Pinnacle Station), despite being much larger than the lot of them. Nowadays just buying the ultimate edition, which is pretty cheap, guarantees you a copy of this thing.

[Shevy]

Awakening was a huge financial success? Where do you get this from? Do you have sales numbers, verified revenue and production cost listings? No? Then all you can do is trust official statements that never indicated aforementionend success.

 

Awakening was universally loved? I know a lot of players who would disagree.

 

While expansion packs are seen in a better light than DLC by a good amount of players, they are a dying off format. Too much development time, too many resources and nowhere near the revenue that DLCs provide. Video game production is business in the first line, although some may don't want to accept this.

[AlexiaRevan]

 

 

 Awakening was absolutely amazing.

I don't think that's the best exemple to use . Awakening wasn't liked by everyone and for some (like me) it was so buggy you couldn't even finish it . And it lacked romance and yada yada . 

 

Heck , I take Witch Hunt and Leliana Song over Awakening . At least those were more interesting and bug free . 

 

But I'm with ya on the expansion part though...

[Wulfram]

While expansion packs are seen in a better light than DLC by a good amount of players, they are a dying off format. Too much development time, too many resources and nowhere near the revenue that DLCs provide. Video game production is business in the first line, although some may don't want to accept this.

With both PoE and TW3 having them, I'd say there's a bit of a revival going on right now. Only relative to their deep decline, of course.

[KaiserShep]

I don't think that's the best exemple to use . Awakening wasn't liked by everyone and for some (like me) it was so buggy you couldn't even finish it . And it lacked romance and yada yada . 

 

The thing that made Awakening super frustrating was how easy it was to break quests. You basically had to plan ahead so that you could do everything. It was like the quests were part of a jenga stack.

[Shevy]

With both PoE and TW3 having them, I'd say there's a bit of a revival going on right now. Only relative to their deep decline, of course.

PoE is a completely different funding structure than AAA, so I can't really compare this. Maybe the crowd funding or indie market still allows for this, but aside from TW 3 and Skyrim back in the days I can't see a revival of big expansion packs. Especially not from the AAA majors.

[AlexiaRevan]

The thing that made Awakening super frustrating was how easy it was to break quests. You basically had to plan ahead so that you could do everything. It was like the quests were part of a jenga stack.

I had a bug at ...hum..Velanna?? that lady elf?? where you chase her around ? she is supposed to show up in a cutscene from some kind of Tree..and the bug make it..the damn cutscene never trigger . 

[Shevy]

I had a bug at ...hum..Velanna?? that lady elf?? where you chase her around ? she is supposed to show up in a cutscene from some kind of Tree..and the bug make it..the damn cutscene never trigger . 

I had to mod in Sigrun's personal quest because it never triggered. I fixed Awakening with more player created content than any other Dragon Age game. This expansion was bugged as hell.

[Patient.Zero]

This is true, and a point I sadly made at the very beginning of this thread. It doesn't actually matter in the end whether what Mr. Darrah is saying is true or not. The fact is his words are an excuse for why an expansion won't be present in DAI. Again, this can probably be attributed to EA's new model of adding in redundant MP with a cash shop in BioWare games with the occasional small DLC that is overpriced.

But that doesn't make sense! The intention of any company is to make money, so if expansions are profitable there would be no reason to discontinue making them as they would be successfully fulfilling their function of bringing in revenue. If you had a lemonade stand that sold pink and yellow lemonade, and the flavour that customers bought the most was pink, why on earth would you decide then to stop making that flavour?