324 réponses à ce sujet

[o Ventus]

"... These one-person spacecrafts [sic]..."

 

As well, if there was no pilot, why would Cerberus go through the effort of building a cockpit on the ship?

 

Also this.

[txgoldrush]

Unless there's a Star Forge beyond said key relay (which may lead to a massive junkyard depending on your choice, so it's not a valid point), there are no means of 'great resilience and rebound' beyond the key relay.

 

The blows in Retribution, while not fatal, are indeed extremely damaging: The only way that Cerberus would be able to bring themselves back from such a setback is by author intervention.

 

And that is exactly what happened in ME3 related media.

 

And it is not good writing. In fact, it's a sign of immature and underdeveloped storytelling.

Yet once again, how bad is the setback? And you know that Invasion is the continuation of Retribution....

[txgoldrush]

"... These one-person spacecrafts [sic]..."

Than its an oversight.

 

Because a pilot would bail the craft if he was turned the wrong way.

[o Ventus]

Than its an oversight.

 

Because a pilot would bail the craft if he was turned the wrong way.

I'm pretty sure it's more you arguing for the sake of arguing.

[txgoldrush]

I'm pretty sure it's more you arguing for the sake of arguing.

Which is what God is doing......he insists my evidence is flimsy, when he brings in "evidence" that doesn't prove his point.

[o Ventus]

Which is what God is doing......he insists my evidence is flimsy, when he brings in "evidence" that doesn't prove his point.

And he's entirely right. Your evidence IS flimsy.

[God]

No, its simply you.

 

You are accusing me of doing what you are now doing with the Retribution novel.

 

And WRONG AGAIN, read the statement I just put in bold in my OP again. Tell me, where is the actual speculation? Its not the build up.

 

Right here ----------------------|

                                                V

Counterterror experts speculate Cerberus may have changed leadership with its recent shift to stockpiling ships, agents, and weapons.

                                                 ^

It's right here --------------------|

 

You're saying no now just to say no. And parroting what I say back at me. Are you for real man? Come on man.

[God]

Yet once again, how bad is the setback? And you know that Invasion is the continuation of Retribution....

 

And it was precisely when the shift in characterization and assets occurred. They must have been working on a gun that tears open dimensions and universes, used the Star Forge, then came back to their home dimension with their new fleet that was magicked into existence.

 

TIM outright states that Cerberus has been dealt a great blow by the attack on his organization.

[God]

Than its an oversight.

 

Because a pilot would bail the craft if he was turned the wrong way.

 

It's not an oversight.

 

@ I love how this guy argues that his interpretation is correct, and when presented with actual evidence that completely counters his claim, he calls it an oversight based on his own personal incredulity to the point.

 

You're wrong dude. Just because you can't see how something is the way it is does not mean that your whacko headcanon is anymore correct. 

[txgoldrush]

Right here ----------------------|

                                                V

Counterterror experts speculate Cerberus may have changed leadership with its recent shift to stockpiling ships, agents, and weapons.

                                                 ^

It's right here --------------------|

 

You're saying no now just to say no. And parroting what I say back at me. Are you for real man? Come on man.

You really need to know a thing or two about sentence structure. What is actually being speculated?

 

Lets examine.

 

What is causing this speculation? The answer is the recent shift to stockpiling ships, agents, and weapons. What is being speculated? A change in leadership.

 

Grammar skills go a long way.

[God]

You really need to know a thing or two about sentence structure. What is actually being speculated?

 

Lets examine.

 

What is causing this speculation? The answer is the recent shift to stockpiling ships, agents, and weapons. What is being speculated? A change in leadership.

 

Grammar skills go a long way.

 

You asked where the speculation was.  You really need to learn a thing or two about irony and exact words.

 

In all, it doesn't answer or create a response to your own speculation. All it does is highlight that you found a line of throwaway media in the codex unsupported, unsubstantiated, and unfounded in every other bit of the game up to that point.

 

Congratulations. You've successfully taken this argument full circle.

 

Given my actual grammar skills thus far, I'm pretty sure I know quite a bit more than you do.

 

And now this has become a grammar fight. Thank you. 

 

Reported.

[txgoldrush]

You asked where the speculation was.  You really need to learn a thing or two about irony and exact words.

 

In all, it doesn't answer or create a response to your own speculation. All it does is highlight that you found a line of throwaway media in the codex unsupported, unsubstantiated, and unfounded in every other bit of the game up to that point.

 

Congratulations. You've successfully taken this argument full circle.

 

Given my actual grammar skills thus far, I'm pretty sure I know quite a bit more than you do.

 

And now this has become a grammar fight. Thank you. 

 

Reported.

No, its you willingness to ignore clear facts to suit your opinion. And or you cannot read the wording of the sentence.

 

And primary codex entries simply put, are not throwaway media, here you go again. Why does Bioware go through the trouble to even voice act it? Its throwaway according to you.

 

If that sentence was worded like this..

 

"Counterterror experts speculate Cerberus may have changed leadership as well as a recent shift to stockpiling ships, agents, and weapons."

 

Then you would be right...but worded in the game, I am right.

 

It says this instead

 

"Counterterror experts speculate Cerberus may have changed leadership with its recent shift to stockpiling ships, agents, and weapons."

[dreamgazer]

"Then you would be right". Then. Dude, if you're gonna rag on folks for their grammar ...

[txgoldrush]

"Then you would be right". Then. Dude, if you're gonna rag on folks for their grammar ...

Not part of this argument. But you got me there.

 

Its the exact wording of a line in the game that is the argument.

 

Although I did have to do several edits to give him an example that would make him "right", 

[StarcloudSWG]

"With its recent shift to stockpiling ships, agents, and weapons, counterterror experts speculate Cerberus may have changed leadership."

 

Remember your lessons on independent and dependent clauses and the elements of a complete sentence.

 

In any case, Cerberus should not have had that large a fleet. Military warship construction is carefully tracked by intelligence agencies, particularly under the terms of the Treaty of Firaxen.

 

Building a cruiser is not like building a freighter. 

 

The only way I can see Cerberus being able to hide ship construction is if they reconditioned ships that were decommissioned from service. In which case said ships would not be cutting edge hulls. And it's certainly not something that can be done in six months. Or even two years and six months.

[txgoldrush]

"With its recent shift to stockpiling ships, agents, and weapons, counterterror experts speculate Cerberus may have changed leadership."

 

Remember your lessons on independent and dependent clauses and what creates a complete sentence.

Independent and dependent clauses can be in any order.

[God]

No, its you willingness to ignore clear facts to suit your opinion. And or you cannot read the wording of the sentence.

 

And primary codex entries simply put, are not throwaway media, here you go again. Why does Bioware go through the trouble to even voice act it? Its throwaway according to you.

 

If that sentence was worded like this..

 

"Counterterror experts speculate Cerberus may have changed leadership as well as a recent shift to stockpiling ships, agents, and weapons."

 

Then you would be right...but worded in the game, I am right.

 

It says this instead

 

"Counterterror experts speculate Cerberus may have changed leadership with its recent shift to stockpiling ships, agents, and weapons."

 

'No, it's you willingness'. 

 

Your.

 

It would be 'your' willingness.

 

Given your problem with grammar and sentence structure, I take it at this point that you're not an educated or native English speaker. As well, as has been pointed out, to support your stance, it would have to be entirely overhauled. As it is, I'm not trying to make a point, I'm discrediting yours.

 

If you have to literally have to resort to grammatical structure to prove your point, then you're making the fallacy of trying to hard. Which is ruining your argument. As it seems, I'm not in the minority here for people getting a bit tired of your antics.

 

You're literally trying to justify improper sentence structure and use it as a point. I in turn say that BW's writing was so bad that even the grammar sucked.

[StarcloudSWG]

Independent and dependent clauses can be in any order.

 

Yes, but in the example given, which one is the independent clause that has a complete meaning, and which one is the dependent clause?

 

What is the subject of the independent clause? What is the verb of the independent clause acting on? 

 

"Experts" is the subject. "Speculate" is the verb. "Cerberus' change in leadership" is the object. "With its recent shift..." is the dependent clause that can be dropped entirely without changing the meaning of the independent clause.

 

The speculation is NOT about "its recent shift". The speculation is about whether there has been a "change in leadership."

[txgoldrush]

'No, it's you willingness'. 

 

Your.

 

It would be 'your' willingness.

 

Given your problem with grammar and sentence structure, I take it at this point that you're not an educated or native English speaker. As well, as has been pointed out, to support your stance, it would have to be entirely overhauled. As it is, I'm not trying to make a point, I'm discrediting yours.

 

If you have to literally have to resort to grammatical structure to prove your point, then you're making the fallacy of trying to hard. Which is ruining your argument. As it seems, I'm not in the minority here for people getting a bit tired of your antics.

 

You're literally trying to justify improper sentence structure and use it as a point. I in turn say that BW's writing was so bad that even the grammar sucked.

First off, I can care less about anyone who is tired of me. Second, you are trying to discredit my argument by ignoring it or whitewashing. Third, even if you are right and it was just speculation, you would still be wrong overall, because speculation can still be foreshadowing.

 

And no, its proper sentence structure, "with" can be a subordinate conjunction.

 

And last, my typos are not part of this argument, which is your interpretation of a sentence.

[txgoldrush]

Yes, but in the example given, which one is the independent clause that has a complete meaning, and which one is the dependent clause?

 

What is the subject of the independent clause? What is the verb of the independent clause acting on? 

 

"Experts" is the subject. "Speculate" is the verb. "Cerberus' change in leadership" is the object. "With its recent shift..." is the dependent clause that can be dropped entirely without changing the meaning of the independent clause.

 

The speculation is NOT about "its recent shift". The speculation is about whether there has been a "change in leadership."

Which is my point exactly, with a primary codex entry basically saying Cerberus was building its navy up before ME2.

 

"With" is being used as the subordinate conjunction here.

 

The recent shift isn't the speculation, it is the cause of it.

[GreyLycanTrope]

Yeah what that quote doesn't mention is the events of Mass Effect: Retribution. Which takes place right about eight months prior to ME3, and has Cerberus weakened to the point of needing to rely on Aria to try and do their dirty work. A sizable chunk of their finances, shell corporations, and man power is depleted to the point that TIM wants thinks he can't afford a war with Aria. They then went from that to big enough fleet/army to take over Omega and than some. Consistent writing this is not.

[Iakus]

which is plausible......see the SR-2

The Normandy was no longer cutting edge by ME 2, as Jacob explains. And it still took Verner us 2 years to build it

[txgoldrush]

Yeah what that quote doesn't mention is the events of Mass Effect: Retribution. Which takes place right about eight months prior to ME3, and has Cerberus weakened to the point of needing to rely on Aria to try and do their dirty work. A sizable chunk of their finances, shell corporations, and man power is depleted to the point that TIM wants thinks he can't afford a war with Aria. They then went from that to big enough fleet/army to take over Omega and than some. Consistent writing this is not.

Yet, this is what they actually avoid (until Shepard that is)....a war with Aria. Instead of an all out attack, Cerberus tricked her into defeat. And in fact in Invasion, Aria does do some of their dirty work.

 

Next, there is not enough evidence to suggest that the Cerberus navy is heavily impacted by the events of the turians attack on them. Its not in the narrative. The story suggests a financial and intelligence blow more than a fleet one.

[txgoldrush]

The Normandy was no longer cutting edge by ME 2, as Jacob explains. And it still took Verner us 2 years to build it

For its role, yes, it is.

 

Also, yet once again, the stockpile of the fleet happens before Shepard is brought back to service in ME2.

[Iakus]

And in that time frame, yes, its indeed possible to build a cruiser. Notice the language in the codex entry....the word "stockpile". Notice that you have this entry in your codex at the start of ME2. Its indeed possible that Cerberus was indeed starting to build up while Shepard was dead.
 
Once again, you simply put, just don't like it.

Believe me I am more than happy to shoot Cerberus goons all day long but that doesn'the mean their presence makes any sense.

Just as a codex entry speculating that they are stockpiling "ships" does not automatically translate to enough full-fledged warships to rival an interstellar fleet