186 réponses à ce sujet

[Steppenwolf]

You don't even know what it is but you've written it off in favor of headcanon. Why not headcanon the Inquisitor into the Warden? Or Sera into Divine?

[Lethaya]

Why, if she's in Solas's body, would she (they?) need to grow anything at all? XD

 

Speaking of Solas future romantic stuff, I do hope our Lavellans aren't just.... swept aside with a line or two in the future games should ah, what did you coin them as, Badonkadonk? Solameth? XD be involved. Could be interesting to say the least. Off topic, though, whoops!

 

As for the notes, even while I consider them accurate, I don't know if I count Flemeth out of the running yet. I mean, she's had fail safes before, and Mythal survived murder. Maybe Flemeth is dead now, but Mythal? Ehhh, I dunno, I find that doubtful. Plus dev notes are usually vague summaries of the scene itself, simple words to get the point of the scene across accurately. That doesn't mean they take all the writing team's future plans into consideration. While that could be what the devs wanted the players to assume was happening or take from what was going on onscreen, that doesn't necessarily mean they won't write themselves out of it next game. They're interesting and they certainly add some weight to the Solas-dominating-Flemeth side of things, but I wouldn't call them irrefutable... yet.

 

You don't even know what it is but you've written it off in favor of headcanon. Why not headcanon the Inquisitor into the Warden? Or Sera into Divine?

 

Playing the devil's advocate here a bit (heh, no offense meant, Roly Voly, of course), buuut I believe what they're saying is that they takes into account what is confirmed in the lore and shown solidly in game. Anyways, nothing wrong with skepticism! So long as you're not making yourself miserable, anyway. ;D

[Beomer]

You do know that Solas is the Dread Wolf, right? He's the trickster God. Outsmarting everyone is sort of his bag.
 

 

And you do know that the Dalish interpretation of the Dread Wolf tricking all the Gods, where this name came from in the first place, is faulty?

[Lethaya]

Heheheh, fair play then. ;D

[tanuki]

And you do know that the Dalish interpretation of the Dread Wolf tricking all the Gods, where this name came from in the first place, is faulty?

Well, we know that he at least did something with elven gods (except Mythal), as they are not around, which probably means he really outsmarted them somehow.

[Dieb]

And you do know that the Dalish interpretation of the Dread Wolf tricking all the Gods, where this name came from in the first place, is faulty?

...which Flemeth of all also didn't catch in his resume for some reason either.

 

 

Well, we know that he at least did something with elven gods (except Mythal), as they are not around, which probably means he really outsmarted them somehow.

We now also know, that Solas and Flemeth/Mythal have some sort of agreement or relationship going which has him inclined to report to her. So we don't know if he managed to do this all by himself. Hell, Abelas even says the Elves effectively erradicated one another more than Tevinter ever did -including the Temple of Mythal- so it might as well just have been a good old fashioned war between all the "gods" and Solas was some sort of general or executor.

 

 

But alas, I was just sharing my interpretation based on how I experienced the characters. Solas is a fallen individual trying to be good, Flemeth is a bad individual pretending to have fallen.

 

I don't discuss to win, either. If it turns out to be the other way round, I'll gladly admit my ignorance with an open mouth, but I chose to see it blow up in my face first. I most certainly do not dismiss any valid points having been made in favour of a different interpretation, there is proof that I may be wrong in the end.

 

On the other hand, datamining was wrong or contextually mislead in most of the cases I experienced since the DAO/ME1 days, so we'll see what happens. I always have a sour taste in my mouth when someone comes up with it, because it kills every decent discussion with vague trap doors the devs may have chosen to keep open. Darth Vader wasn't officially Luke's father until the very end of shooting Empire. It's tricky to tell what should rightfully be taken into account with that kind of stuff, because you also can never tell of which happenstance developers may take advantage to change their mind in the future.

[Beomer]

Well, we know that he at least did something with elven gods (except Mythal), as they are not around, which probably means he really outsmarted them somehow.

 

When Morrigan mentions that theory in the Temple of Mythal, Solas scorns it. IMO saying that he 'outsmarted' the Gods is a very big misinterpretation. For one why would he leave Mythal out? If he really outsmarted everyone, wouldn't he know Mythal was out there despite being murdered or whatever?

The possibilities of what might have happened are so very many that it is impossible to really know who ticked whom and who ended up getting fooled. Solas for one in the game seems to regret the stuff he did. Even if he did trick the Gods into getting trapped behind the Veil or whatever, I doubt he'll be up to his old tricks again (again if at all he did so in the first place).

[In Exile]

And you do know that the Dalish interpretation of the Dread Wolf tricking all the Gods, where this name came from in the first place, is faulty?

We don't know how inexact the characteristics remember by the Dalish are vis-à-vis their "gods". They may remember aspects of their reputation. It's likely Solas DID have a cunning plot that played his fellow "gods" like fiddles to do something as reality altering as we suspect he did, i.e., create (or alter) the Fade and Veil in such a way that he imprisoned (or killed) his contemporaries and stole away the elves immortality.

[Catche Jagger]

Regardless, she not going to be returning as Flemeth after what happened at the end of DAI unless a couple things change. She's either completely dead and gone or now just an aspect of Solas.

[Renessa]

I think news of Flemeth's death might be greatly exaggerated.

 

As with everything she is involved in, it is all rather murky and open to interpretation. I mean, even with the story of her origins, I remember at least two, very different accounts of who betrayed whom and why... 

 

When I first saw the final scene, I believed, Solas killed Flemeth and took her soul, but now I don't think, Flemeth would go out like this. Solas might be the Dread Wolf, but Flemeth plays in a different league all together. I think, she is apologizing to Solas because she forsaw what he was planning and found a way to thwart him. Just as she thwarted Morrigan's plans for her. 

 

Will we see her as the original Flemeth again? I don't know. I sure hope so, because I love Kate Mulgrews interpretation of her. I am fairly certain, however, we will see some kind of reincarnation of her in the next game or perhaps in some Solas centric dlc.

[Beomer]

We don't know how inexact the characteristics remember by the Dalish are vis-à-vis their "gods". They may remember aspects of their reputation. It's likely Solas DID have a cunning plot that played his fellow "gods" like fiddles to do something as reality altering as we suspect he did, i.e., create (or alter) the Fade and Veil in such a way that he imprisoned (or killed) his contemporaries and stole away the elves immortality.

 

I see you've chosen to ignore the fact that he says it in nearly so many words, that the Dalish story about him is absolute crap, to Morrigan, in the Temple of Mythal.

[Beomer]

I think news of Flemeth's death might be greatly exaggerated.

 

As with everything she is involved in, it is all rather murky and open to interpretation. I mean, even with the story of her origins, I remember at least two, very different accounts of who betrayed whom and why... 

 

When I first saw the final scene, I believed, Solas killed Flemeth and took her soul, but now I don't think, Flemeth would go out like this. Solas might be the Dread Wolf, but Flemeth plays in a different league all together. I think, she is apologizing to Solas because she forsaw what he was planning and found a way to thwart him. Just as she thwarted Morrigan's plans for her. 

 

Will we see her as the original Flemeth again? I don't know. I sure hope so, because I love Kate Mulgrews interpretation of her. I am fairly certain, however, we will see some kind of reincarnation of her in the next game or perhaps in some Solas centric dlc.

 

Word.

Kate Mulgrew topped her own performances with Flemeth in DAI. Both her and Claudia Black. The Fade scene is probably the best scene in the entire DA series and I say this as a die hard DAO fan. If anything even comes close to the chills I felt during that scene it would perhaps be Leliana's song in DAO, but that's not the point.

The point is that Flemeth is going to turn up again. I'd bet on it.

[In Exile]

I see you've chosen to ignore the fact that he says it in nearly so many words, that the Dalish story about him is absolute crap, to Morrigan, in the Temple of Mythal.

That's not exactly what he says nor what the codex you get says afterward. His theme is rebellion, and standing up against oppression. Solas very much challenges the notion of a trickster, in the sense that he did it for the lulz or because he coveted anything - but that's not the same as his not being a chess master figure. We have lots of hints - the winter palace being a good example via conversation and his demeanour and dialogue at the end of In Your Heart Shall Burn - that implies he is very much politically adept.

The implication is that Solas did what he did to stop the exploitation of his people by their "gods". That's entirely unlike what the Dalish believe but - in the same way the Chantry wasn't wrong about magisters physically entering the Fade - it doesn't mean he didnt play his fellows.

[Paragonslustre]

Wow I wish I had some of the certainty of you folks.  Que sera sera - I'll deal with what ever is thrown at me because there is no certainty only speculation.  Which .... is fun though.

[Beomer]

Fine you have me there in the fact that he is a chess-master not a trickster.

But that still does not make him superior with any degree of certainty to Flemeth. For one they seem to have a mother /son kind of relationship, and while Solas is certainly far more wily than Morrigan I still don't see him outwitting Flemeth. Secondly she's been around plotting and planning for over a thousand years while he's been asleep since his last great escapade. in fact we don't even know that she does not have a hand in waking him up in the first place.

IMO the only way Flemeth is dead if she planned it to be so, or just could not see a way to help Solas after the orb broke, without sacrificing herself. In which case I'm certain she would have planned some way that Morrigan could assume her place.

[ESTAQ99]

What you think happened is entirely irrelevant because we have facts that prove you wrong. If you want to convince anyone that you're right and the game files are wrong then you need to find evidence. You have none so you're just arguing against reality.

 

What are you talking about? You (yourself or whatever "we" means to you) don't have absolutely anything, except for a bunch of notes left by dev at some point. Those notes don't necessarily reflect what was implemented in the game as a final product or what will be the real plot in a future DA game or DAI DLC.

[In Exile]

I'm not saying he's better than Flemeth. I wouldn't try to speculate there because we know far too little. We don't even know how Mythal died. For all we know Solas was all for elven "gods" exploiting the **** out of commoners until they killed Mythal, his best and only friend. It's all speculation.

All I think is that people shouldn't assume Mythal stands in opposition to Solas. She may have put a plan in place to stop him. But for all we know she was the one who woke him up.

[Lukas Trevelyan]

I'm hoping that they've also said goodbye to Leliana and Morrigan. I really have had enough of those two.

There's no such thing as too much Leliana or Morrigan. 

[jedidotflow]

Gods kill Mythal.

Solas traps gods, goes to sleep.

A surviving part of Mythal finds Flemeth and bonds with her.

Solas awakens and realizes he made a mistake which he seeks to rectify, i.e. release the gods.

Mythal wants the gods released so she can have her vengeance, hence she aids Solas.

She'll be back.

[Kendar Fleetfoot]

Personally, I don't think either of them screwed over the other. I think they both knew the (orbless) Plan B, are working towards a common or similar goal, and are willing to make necessary sacrifices to achieve it, as Flemeth apparently did. Doesn't mean I count her out, though. If anything she may be, ah. Temporarily inconvenienced? XD

 

 

Heh, all the interpretations and headcanoning in this thread! So many of 'em. Too bad we'll all have to wait a while to get any answers out of dear old Bioware. XD Although sometimes, I swear, all Bioware does is give us more to question with each installment...

 

As for the conversation, after the ending if you talk to Cole, he saaays:

 

"I'm sorry, Cole, but with your gift, I fear that you will see the path I now must walk in solitude forever. This fate is mine alone. Indeed, I would not wish it on an enemy, much less someone that I once cared for. Though you reach out in compassion, I must now insist that you forget."

 

At that moment, Cole does indeed seem to forget whatever he was reaching out for, too. Implication here being that he was reaching after Solas and he didn't much care for it, especially as Cole even seems to take on Solas's... tone? manner of speaking? for a bit. Interesting that Solas could do that remotely, by the way.

 

And daw, thanks! :B Hehe.

 

 

In fact, edit! Might as well post this here:

 

 

Who is Solas talking about here: "much less someone that I once cared for"

 

Someone that I once cared for, is he saying Cole's spirit is someone he once cared for??