andy, that's the thing about the setting.
The DN isn't actually a general. They've been made a commander. And often times in a feudal setting, the nobles are made the commanders all the time by virtue of their birth and not necessarily their ability.
But like I said, I got the impression from the dialogue that the DN already does have experience in the field, especially with Bhelen's line on taking our place as our father's second in the field now that we're a commander.
Quoted myself with an emphasis on my point.
While I don't think she has zero experience leading men, I think "General" is too lofty an estimation of her actual ranking. The DN has indeed some experience dealing with darkspawn in the capacity as second to Endrin. Perhaps in army terms a "Captain" or I'd even go with "Major" would be closer to their promotion ranking. While yes, some nepotism could be the reasons for a captain to be in that position, I agree, a general certainly wouldn't.
But I doubt a "general" would be leading a team of 3 other men (the DN's assignment during the mission). She would be leading a full on company of 20 or more (not sure how many men are in dwarven platoons, but I'm certain a general would be leading more than just a handful). In this I think the actual ranking the DN has is akin to an army captain.
Also in terms of overall game balance, i think a general would have a significant more amount of starting experience (like the DN doesn't start the game at level 10) over the other origins, making me think that the actual rank is lower than you're estimating it to be.
I kind of got the impression that the DN was given that side-quest to get the shield because our father obviously favored us and was trying to give us both an easy mission and one that would grant us great glory in front of the assembly, so we were given a small strike team that could move fast.
andy, that's the thing about the setting.
The DN isn't actually a general. They've been made a commander. And often times in a feudal setting, the nobles are made the commanders all the time by virtue of their birth and not necessarily their ability.
But like I said, I got the impression from the dialogue that the DN already does have experience in the field, especially with Bhelen's line on taking our place as our father's second in the field now that we're a commander.
Thank you, I wish I had your gift for expression. This is what I was trying to say. Have a "like" 
Although I think we all can agree, the DN is chock full of 'ability' as well, I always got the feeling there was a little bit of nepotism involved in his promotion as well.
I kind of got the impression that the DN was given that side-quest to get the shield because our father obviously favored us and was trying to give us both an easy mission and one that would grant us great glory in front of the assembly, so we were given a small strike team that could move fast.
Probably.
*Edit* Though, they make such a big to do over the next day's mission (being the one you go on) being the DN's first assignment as commander. Although Endrin may have changed his mind and done something different, it just doesn't match up with the impression I got to what a general would be doing.
I had forgotten it was "commander" and not "general". Still, I stand by what I said. The noble has almost certainly acted as a squad leader at some point, they wouldn't be made a commander straight out of grunthood.
I had forgotten it was "commander" and not "general". Still, I stand by what I said. The noble has almost certainly acted as a squad leader at some point, they wouldn't be made a commander straight out of grunthood.
I think that also has an aspect of roleplay/head canon to it. While one can certainly roleplay your DN as very experienced with leading men (making Trian's comments actually pretty damn stupid), there is enough openness to it to suggest the DN isn't as experienced with hands-on work.
Dialogue supports that he is very well trained, has acted as his father's second in the past and seen at least enough campaigns for his father to see he has merit and charisma and can handle the responsibility of the job. But the dialogue is open enough to allow the player to head canon his DN hasn't as much actual experience leading the men beyond a few small squads. This is certainly his first 'real' assignment. And that Endrin favors the middle child over even Trian (his heir) is evident as well. A player can RP that Endrin is 'pushing' for the PC to be a real rival to Trian (either to up Trian's game) or to actually place the PC in a position to be a more effective ruler than his older brother.
Either way, I don't think either position is a wrong one. There is no 'right or wrong' only how you want to roleplay it.
*Edit* I actually roleplayed my girl as quite the Orzammar princess. A capable warrior and a charismatic/popular leader, but one without a lot of actual leadership responsibility till her promotion happened. This probably did a lot to contribute to my viewpoints on the subject, though someone else could certainly (and just as rightly) roleplay their DN as far more experienced than I did mine.
I think that also has an aspect of roleplay/head canon to it. While one can certainly roleplay your DN as very experienced with leading men (making Trian's comments actually pretty damn stupid), there is enough openness to it to suggest the DN isn't as experienced with hands-on work.
Dialogue supports that he is very well trained, has acted as his father's second in the past and seen at least enough campaigns for his father to see he has merit and charisma and can handle the responsibility of the job. But the dialogue is open enough to allow the player to head canon his DN hasn't as much actual experience leading the men beyond a few small squads. This is certainly his first 'real' assignment. And that Endrin favors the middle child over even Trian (his heir) is evident as well. A player can RP that Endrin is 'pushing' for the PC to be a real rival to Trian (either to up Trian's game) or to actually place the PC in a position to be a more effective ruler than his older brother.
Either way, I don't think either position is a wrong one. There is no 'right or wrong' only how you want to roleplay it.
Small squads was what I meant. Squad leader doesn't have to mean a large squad. I already said that I think they were probably leading units of about 10 soldiers, which isn't large.
"And that Endrin favors the middle child over even Trian (his heir) is evident as well."
Well then he'd be disappointed. My dwarven noble never wanted to be king/queen. They wanted to become the highest ranked commander and lead from the front to take the fight to the spawn and take back their roads, not to get old and fat sitting on a throne all day. They wanted to be out on the front lines, in the thick of battle and leading soldiers against their hated enemy. If the assembly had tried to elect him, he would have declined. Which is funny especially since Trian and Bhelen both thought he was a threat to their respective chances of becoming king, when he was NEVER even considering it. All the moves that everyone else saw as political was actually just on whims, like the proving battle to the death against that one dwarf's son who tried to trick you into giving support to surface dwarves. And in fact, he was going to support Bhelen if he ever tried, since Trian was an entitled pompous ass and Bhelen's own political views were in line with my Warden's. But we know how that ended. Yet in the end he still supported Bhelen as king, he was still the better choice due to his politics still matching his and being the stronger supporter of sending troops to the surface. He put revenge aside for the sake of his people. He still messed with Bhelen's head though, he publicly supported Harrowmont right up until the final moment where you say which the paragon chose. Suddenly picking Bhelen at the last second makes such a priceless reaction! You ever seen Bhelen speechless before? You want to? Be a dwarven noble and support Harrowmont all the way and then pick Bhelen at the last second, he practically stutters 
!
In the end, Bhelen kind of helped him. Bhelen got him away from poison dwarven politics and let him become the commander against the darkspawn he always wanted to be. It just isn't a dwarven commander, but it's still a commander who's job is to kill as many darkspawn as possible. And that's all he ever wanted. King? Who the hell wants to be king, it's boring and mundane. Leading soldiers and putting swords through darkspawn heads, now that is a worthy task. He was never in competition for the throne.
I think there was actually a bit of an element of that cutthroat dwarven politics in the promotion as well, which is why I think Endrin was doing it to up Trian's game or get him iced out.
My girl loved the attention she got as a princess. She loved her people, she loved fighting in the Provings and fighting darkspawn. She would have done well with politics, but disliked them. She was no threat to Bhelen or Trian.
When she spoke to Duncan, heard he was a grey warden she was all "SIGN ME UP!!!"
When she spoke to Duncan, heard he was a grey warden she was all "SIGN ME UP!!!"
Not him. He wanted to be a commander of the dwarven army, fight darkspawn that are more of a direct threat to the dwarven people. Still, it wasn't a bad second option after the first option was revoked by betrayal.
LOL My girl was trying to climb out of the shark tank before she got bit. 
She figured, no one, not even dwarves, are better darkspawn fighters than grey wardens. This will up her game and maybe allow her to get the wardens more involved in what's going on down in the deep roads if she could get in good with them.
And then Bhelen happened and the rest was all she wrote... 
That was his problem, he didn't realize what a shark tank he was in. He never really considered politics in his day-to-day thinking. He thought that if he ignored politics, that politics would leave him alone. He thought that as long as he had no aspirations for the throne and only wanted to be a soldier, that nothing bad would happen. He was so naive to think that. He didn't realize that in dwarven politics, burying your head in the sand just makes it easier for the predators to kill you.
Yes, human noble is pretty damn good. Yet they need lots of help with their mabari and mother and castle guards to go through 48 soldiers, while the city elf only needs her cousin who has never used a weapon in his life to kill 27 soldiers plus 3 mabari. Lesser number of soldiers, but the Cousland has EXTREMELY better help than the city elf. Regardless of the crappier training, they still outperformed the Cousland there.
The situation is not comparable. If anything, Cousland and Tabris switch roles in their Origins.
In Denerim, the Arl would have taken all the best men with him to Ostagar making the ones the CE fights the greenhorns who should have been perfectly capable of controlling a civillian population. In Highever, Howe's whole army is there, elite troops included, there are even apostate mages there.
In Denerim, the CE is the one catching the guards by surprise. In Highever, the Cousland are the ones caught by surprise.
So, in both cases Tabris, circunstances give Tabris an advantage while taking it away from Cousland.
That is not to say what the CE did wasn't impressive. Hell, if I'm being honest, it's more impressive than what HN did. But circunstances do aid and hinder fighters tremendously.
After all, if we just say that the CE can slaugther 27 soldiers nearly by himself/herself, there are fewer than those escorting Vaughan to the wedding and more elves around to help.
Go for it!
I disagree, for good reason. Nobody goes from grunt to general. No one. You have to go up the ranks.
Except if you are the son of the king. Did the DN origin really give you the impression this was a story about an exceptionally skilled young man who rose through the ranks and became a general/commander before he was even 30 years old? Or that of the spare son/duaghter of the king being given a ceremonial position because, not being the obvious heir, it was expected to still be in an elevated position
That is not to say the DN hasn't experience leading men and fighting against Darkspawn but the impression i got from that Origin is that he or she is being given command mostly due to having "Aeducan" as a last name.
The situation is not comparable. If anything, Cousland and Tabris switch roles in their Origins.
In Denerim, the Arl would have taken all the best men with him to Ostagar making the ones the CE fights the greenhorns who should have been perfectly capable of controlling a civillian population. In Highever, Howe's whole army is there, elite troops included, there are even apostate mages there.
In Denerim, the CE is the one catching the guards by surprise. In Highever, the Cousland are the ones caught by surprise.
So, in both cases Tabris, circunstances give Tabris an advantage while taking it away from Cousland.
That is not to say what the CE did wasn't impressive. Hell, if I'm being honest, it's more impressive than what HN did. But circunstances do aid and hinder fighters tremendously.
After all, if we just say that the CE can slaugther 27 soldiers nearly by himself/herself, there are fewer than those escorting Vaughan to the wedding and more elves around to help.
Go for it!
Except if you are the son of the king. Did the DN origin really give you the impression this was a story about an exceptionally skilled young man who rose through the ranks and became a general/commander before he was even 30 years old? Or that of the spare son/duaghter of the king being given a ceremonial position because, not being the obvious heir, it was expected to still be in an elevated position
That is not to say the DN hasn't experience leading men and fighting against Darkspawn but the impression i got from that Origin is that he or she is being given command mostly due to having "Aeducan" as a last name.
A good point, I get the feeling that Arl Urien took his best men with him to Ostagar and the guys left in Denerim were the idiots who didn't measure up. They certainly come off seeming like mooks to me. That they are far too comfortable terrorizing helpless women suggests to me that they too familiar with this situation that they have been accomplice to it more than once, or ones Vaughan picked to stay behind as well, since he knew they wouldn't oppose anything he chose to do (or would blab about his activities to Urien) while Dad was off fighting. "Overpaid bullies" more than "Elite fighting men".
And Howe's men were his full army, including at least one mage--who got the drop on the Couslands. Let's not discount the element of surprise adding to the trouble both fighting forces experience in the situation since they (Howe's army and the CE) were already inside-- and not expected to be a threat initially. I am unsure if Howe even intended to go to Ostagar since he certainly doesn't turn up down there, and intended to cover his actions with some excuse or another.
Quality of opponents would put things somewhat on an even keel there to balance out the disparity of training/skill. I tend to think the CE's best quality being showcased isn't brute force--although a player can roleplay that if they like--but her wits, turning the situation to an advantage.
And YAY another vote for an element of nepotism in the promotion of the DN, I knew I couldn't have been the only one to see it!
I think the disparity of agreement here is coming from a basis of how people roleplayed (or perceived) the way the game played out. Andy seems to like playing badasses who singlehandedly get the job done--and that is a viable viewpoint. But while one can argue that their PC was a total badass, wiping the ground/floor with their opponents and an obvious candidate for recruitment, it can also be roleplayed that the PC has other qualities that would recommend them. Or even that circumstance (an element of luck as it were) plays into the situation as well. Even that they don't want to go at all. As I already said, there is no 'right' or 'wrong' way to play as long as what you are playing is fun.
In the case of my HN, she didn't want to be a Grey Warden, looked forward to proving herself to her family as a capable leader while Bryce and Fergus were away.
My CE was clever, quick on her feet, but not a combat machine, relying heavily on surprise and to a lesser extent, Soris backing her up. No, I didn't roleplay him as a useless lodestone, but actually more skilled than he credits himself with--though not skilled enough for recruitment.
My Dalish protested every step of the way to Tamlen initially and then Duncan's recruitment (and I imagined Duncan having to actually cart her off bodily to Ostagar).
My DN I already explained upthread.
My mage actually assisted Jowan, finding the circle's rules too oppressive and Jowan's fate particularly cruel. And the fact that Duncan seems more impressed with this than that you were doing it for Irving had a little to do with it too.
My DC was a scrappy little thing, but I drugged the other opponents. No way would she not take advantage of that. And the carta...well that was all about killing them before they killed her (and protecting Rica from Baraht). But once she saw Rica was going to be okay, she jumped at the chance to go with Duncan.
I love playing the 'reluctant' or 'unexpected' hero rather than a 'badass'.
I think the disparity of agreement here is coming from a basis of how people roleplayed (or perceived) the way the game played out. Andy seems to like playing badasses who singlehandedly get the job done, and while one can argue that their PC was a total badass, wiping the ground/floor with their opponents and an obvious candidate for recruitment, it can also be roleplayed that the PC has other qualities that would recommend them. Or even that circumstance alone (an element of luck as it were) plays into the situation as well. Even that they don't want to go at all. As I already said, there is no 'right' or 'wrong' way to play as long as what you are playing is fun.
Well that makes me sound immature...
My CE was clever, quick on her feet, but not a combat machine.
My Dalish protested every step of the way to Tamlen initially and then Duncan's recruitment (and I imagined Duncan having to actually cart her off bodily to Ostagar).
My DN I already explained upthread.
My mage actually assisted Jowan, finding the circle's rules too oppressive and Jowan's fate particularly cruel. And the fact that Duncan seems more impressed with this than that you were doing it for Irving had a little to do with it too.
My DC was a scrappy little thing, but I drugged the other opponents. No way would she not take advantage of that. And the carta...well that was all about killing them before they killed her (and protecting Rica from Baraht). But once she saw Rica was going to be okay, she jumped at the chance to go with Duncan.
My CE is both. She fights with wits and stuff, but she's also very good at full-on combat. I imagine her being a dodging-machine, can somehow be completely surrounded yet practically unhittable. Around mid-game, that's actually what she ends up like in gameplay. She's fast enough to literally hit arrows out of the air or dodge them easily by just moving her whole body in a very flexible way. She's practically like liquid in combat, dodging in ways that would make an acrobat green with envy. She makes use of being very small framed. My Dalish is the same way actually, both my elves fight like this in my mind. She didn't want to be a warden, but it was a better option then... Ugh... An arranged marriage 
. My Dalish didn't want to become one either, but they knew that it was either become one or die. Who wants to die?
DN, I also already explained. Fighting style, dual wield warrior. Not much dodging at all like my elves, their style is using 2 longswords at once (rogues only use one sword or 2 daggers) and using a lot of power. I imagine them as being more focused on blocking them on dodging, using the gigantic wrist plates of the heavy and massive human gauntlets to block and deflect attacks and then follow up with counters. They max out the middle dual wield tree which my rogues always ignore, which helps play into the "more power and defense driven" style compared to my dual wield rogues. This fighting style is also my HN's warrior style (dual wield again, it's the only weapon type I can stand in DAO). So while the elves are dodging every which way, my warriors just stand firm and just tank and block and counter every attack thrown at them. Warriors are power and rogues are speed, and my headcanon of how they fight reflects that.
My mage... Changed on the playthrough. Sometimes I help Jowan, sometimes I tell on him and am happy to help him get caught, and sometimes I tell on him but try really hard to wiggle out of what I was ordered to do to get him caught.
DC is always rogue, as I said earlier. They're kind of a mix of my warrior and rogue-elf styles. Them being thicker and more stout and much wider than elves means they can't just dodge everything thrown at them, but not being a warrior means they can't just tank everything either. So they do a bit of both. They do more simple but effective dodging with a mix of some blocking. They can't dodge as well as an elf, but being a dwarf does mean they have more strength to work with and more thickness of arms and arm length to brace themselves which means they can certainly block a hit easier than the elves. However, they block with their daggers unlike my warriors who block with their gauntlets. So they're not as good at dodging as the elves, and not as good at blocking as the warriors thanks to needing to do it with small weapons, but can do better at both dodging and blocking than the other 2 can. I said warriors are power and rogues are speed, well my DC more or less goes 50-50 between both those traits. Simple biology means they can't dodge like a skinny and lithe elf can, but their thicker build also gives them advantages the elves don't have. I imagine them as doing simple backsteps and sidesteps and small body position changes to dodge as opposed to the backflips and somersaults and flips and other crazy stuff my elven rogues do for dodging, mixed with some well timed blocks with their daggers.
Does that sound way too badass to be believable?
The situation is not comparable. If anything, Cousland and Tabris switch roles in their Origins.
In Denerim, the Arl would have taken all the best men with him to Ostagar making the ones the CE fights the greenhorns who should have been perfectly capable of controlling a civillian population. In Highever, Howe's whole army is there, elite troops included, there are even apostate mages there.
In Denerim, the CE is the one catching the guards by surprise. In Highever, the Cousland are the ones caught by surprise.
So, in both cases Tabris, circunstances give Tabris an advantage while taking it away from Cousland.
That is not to say what the CE did wasn't impressive. Hell, if I'm being honest, it's more impressive than what HN did. But circunstances do aid and hinder fighters tremendously.
After all, if we just say that the CE can slaugther 27 soldiers nearly by himself/herself, there are fewer than those escorting Vaughan to the wedding and more elves around to help.
Go for it!
Except if you are the son of the king. Did the DN origin really give you the impression this was a story about an exceptionally skilled young man who rose through the ranks and became a general/commander before he was even 30 years old? Or that of the spare son/duaghter of the king being given a ceremonial position because, not being the obvious heir, it was expected to still be in an elevated position
That is not to say the DN hasn't experience leading men and fighting against Darkspawn but the impression i got from that Origin is that he or she is being given command mostly due to having "Aeducan" as a last name.
Well, good point, you DO catch the guards by surprise. Especially just by being an elf. (tunes into Mordin's way of thinking for a second) Humans, dwarves, qunari, all obvious threats... *sucks in air* Never see an elf coming. And yeah, the REALLY GOOD guards were probably taken to Ostagar. I'm not changing my score though, they still deserve a high one.
I do in fact like to think the DN earned their rank instead of it just being given to them as a freebie. Dwarven society can't afford to put their most promising and untested soldiers against darkspawn without being ABSOLUTELY SURE they're ready for it.
Well that makes me sound immature...
My CE is both. She fights with wits and stuff, but she's also very good at full-on combat. I imagine her being a dodging-machine, can somehow be completely surrounded yet practically unhittable. Around mid-game, that's actually what she ends up like in gameplay. She's fast enough to literally hit arrows out of the air or dodge them easily by just moving her whole body in a very flexible way. She's practically like liquid in combat, dodging in ways that would make an acrobat green with envy. She makes use of being very small framed. My Dalish is the same way actually, both my elves fight like this in my mind. She didn't want to be a warden, but it was a better option then... Ugh... An arranged marriage
DN, I also already explained. Fighting style, dual wield warrior. Not much dodging at all like my elves, their style is using 2 longswords at once (rogues only use one sword or 2 daggers) and using a lot of power. I imagine them as being more focused on blocking them on dodging, using the gigantic wrist plates of the heavy and massive human gauntlets to block and deflect attacks and then follow up with counters. They max out the middle dual wield tree which my rogues always ignore, which helps play into the "more power and defense driven" style compared to my dual wield rogues. This fighting style is also my HN's warrior style (dual wield again, it's the only weapon type I can stand in DAO). So while the elves are dodging every which way, my warriors just stand firm and just tank and block and counter every attack thrown at them. Warriors are power and rogues are speed, and my headcanon of how they fight reflects that.
My mage... Changed on the playthrough. Sometimes I help Jowan, sometimes I tell on him and am happy to help him get caught, and sometimes I tell on him but try really hard to wiggle out of what I was ordered to do to get him caught.
DC is always rogue, as I said earlier. They're kind of a mix of my warrior and rogue-elf styles. Them being thicker and more stout and much wider than elves means they can't just dodge everything thrown at them, but not being a warrior means they can't just tank everything either. So they do a bit of both. They do more simple but effective dodging with a mix of some blocking. They can't dodge as well as an elf, but being a dwarf does mean they have more strength to work with and more thickness of arms and arm length to brace themselves which means they can certainly block a hit easier than the elves. However, they block with their daggers unlike my warriors who block with their gauntlets. So they're not as good at dodging as the elves, and not as good at blocking as the warriors thanks to needing to do it with small weapons, but can do better at both dodging and blocking than the other 2 can. I said warriors are power and rogues are speed, well my DC more or less goes 50-50 between both those traits. Simple biology means they can't dodge like a skinny and lithe elf can, but their thicker build also gives them advantages the elves don't have. I imagine them as doing simple backsteps and sidesteps and small body position changes to dodge as opposed to the backflips and somersaults and flips and other crazy stuff my elven rogues do for dodging, mixed with some well timed blocks with their daggers.
Does that sound way too badass to be believable?
Well, good point, you DO catch the guards by surprise. Especially just by being an elf. (tunes into Mordin's way of thinking for a second) Humans, dwarves, qunari, all obvious threats... *sucks in air* Never see an elf coming. And yeah, the REALLY GOOD guards were probably taken to Ostagar. I'm not changing my score though, they still deserve a high one.
I do in fact like to think the DN earned their rank instead of it just being given to them as a freebie. Dwarven society can't afford to put their most promising and untested soldiers against darkspawn without being ABSOLUTELY SURE they're ready for it.
I'm not comfortable chopping up comments so I will respond to the bolded stuff.
Bolded #1. I'm not trying to say you're immature at all. I think playing your PC as a badass is completely within the game's openness, and I edited it to say it's a viable outlook to the roleplay--though it was edited after you quoted me.
Just saying your roleplay perceives your characters as a little more capable in the combat department than someone else might, and both are viable viewpoints. By your own admission you try to get the killing blows on mobs not just in the origin but in the later parts of the game. You make Soris hold back while your CE cuts a swath through the guards. You enjoy playing a combat machine who gets the job done and fully earned their recruitment via their skill at killing stuff. Just trying to point out that other people may prefer roleplaying their characters differently, or even see other reasons why they may have been recruited, and that this may be causing some of the disparity of agreement here.
Bolded #2 There is no right or wrong way to play. Badass is as viable a viewpoint as any other, and not beyond the bounds of reasonable.
Bolded #3 No one is saying they got the promotion solely on them being Aeducan. Endrin isn't a fool and wouldn't promote someone who has no talent in it at all just because they were his kid. They certainly had the skills, just saying that there was an element of circumstance (being the Dwarven Prince/Princess) to the promotion as well as skill.
*Edit* It's just as viable a viewpoint to say they completely earned the promotion on skill/experience alone, though the dialogue is less supportive of this viewpoint, it is a viable one.
You make Soris hold back while your CE cuts a swath through the guards.
Not from a story standpoint. I don't imagine they actually got every kill. I imagine the ally characters are also fighting separate enemies from me and killing their own opponents too, just... Off screen. So while I kill 30 enemies in the CE origin, I like to think there was more than that and the unseen number were killed by Soris off screen. Or the 48 the human noble kills was actually just 48 of some larger number that actually attacked the HN's group. I do it just for an inflated kill score, but not to think my warden was the sole person to take out every last person by themselves. I still think they got the majority of course, but not 100% of all kills done by the group. So when I reach Duncan in the HN origin, while I did kill 48 people getting to him the overall number of enemies encountered on the way to him was quite higher. Maybe closer to 70 or 80 soldiers, and a true number of about 50 soldiers for the arl of Denerim estate for CE? Can't give anymore examples, I only know the exact enemy count for the HN and CE origin, haven't done a count on the others. I'm thinking I'll do a casteless run too, I'll count then. Even a dwarven noble run, but not for a real playthrough (that one will just be an origin run and only because the origins are connected enough to play through too when I start my casteless).
So I headcanon that a bit. It's ridiculous to think that my lone self did it all, it's just all the kills that weren't mine were just being done where I can't see them. Or something.
Not from a story standpoint. I don't imagine they actually got every kill. I imagine the ally characters are also fighting separate enemies from me and killing their own opponents too, just... Off screen. So while I kill 30 enemies in the CE origin, I like to think there was more than that and the unseen number were killed by Soris off screen. Or the 48 the human noble kills was actually just 48 of some larger number that actually attacked the HN's group. I do it just for an inflated kill score, but not to think my warden was the sole person to take out every last person by themselves. I still think they got the majority of course, but not 100% of all kills done by the group. So when I reach Duncan in the HN origin, while I did kill 48 people getting to him the overall number of enemies encountered on the way to him was quite higher. Maybe closer to 70 or 80 soldiers, and a true number of about 50 soldiers for the arl of Denerim estate for CE? Can't give anymore examples, I only know the exact enemy count for the HN and CE origin, haven't done a count on the others. I'm thinking I'll do a casteless run too, I'll count then. Even a dwarven noble run, but not for a real playthrough (that one will just be an origin run and only because the origins are connected enough to play through too when I start my casteless).
So I headcanon that a bit. It's ridiculous to think that my lone self did it all, it's just all the kills that weren't mine were just being done where I can't see them. Or something.
Hmmm this is not the impression I got from your previous posts, especially since you discount the number/quality of helpers you get in the Origins, placing more emphasis on numbers and personal kills of enemies--this certainly was your argument as to why the Dalish isn't as good, having fewer enemies and Merrill/Fenarel along with them.
Either way, my point is, you have the most fun playing your character as a combat machine (with varying styles to encompass physical limitation/roleplay), with a great deal of skill in using their blades (or bows, or spells). Others may see their characters as less combat oriented and have other qualities that would up their score making recruitment viable, or lowering it in the case of others.
And both are viable viewpoints since the game encompasses a lot of different roleplay aspects. Remember there is no right or wrong way to see it, only what is most fun for the player.
I think I can safely say the only one everyone agrees would be the 'most worthy' is the DN, element of nepotism aside, they have the most experience, skill and knowledge of the enemy they will be fighting as grey wardens. All others will vary widely in 'worthiness' because 1) how the character is perceived by the player and 2) what the player considers worthy qualities for recruitment.
In that, it's completely subjective, and the fun of I've had in this debate is seeing other viewpoints expressed even if I disagree.
In that, it's completely subjective, and the fun of I've had in this debate is seeing other viewpoints expressed even if I disagree.
And that was the point. I knew this topic was going to be fun so long as everyone kept a good head on their shoulders and didn't flame anyone. I've already changed some of my own opinions thanks to it, bumping the Dalish from a pathetic 4 up to a respectable 6 for example. Call me greedy if you need to though, because I want this topic to continue even further than this if it can.
I am glad it's turned out as well as it has so far 
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And that was the point. I knew this topic was going to be fun so long as everyone kept a good head on their shoulders and didn't flame anyone. I've already changed some of my own opinions thanks to it, bumping the Dalish from a pathetic 4 up to a respectable 6 for example. Call me greedy if you need to though, because I want this topic to continue even further than this if it can.
I am glad it's turned out as well as it has so far
And your comments got me to up the DC as higher than I initially thought she should have been because I forgot that sheer weight of "underdog" there is to that origin. Made me kind of wish I still had Origins on my PC so I could go back and replay Brosca (at least through her beginnings).
I do in fact like to think the DN earned their rank instead of it just being given to them as a freebie. Dwarven society can't afford to put their most promising and untested soldiers against darkspawn without being ABSOLUTELY SURE they're ready for it.
Are you sure? Because if Branka had been born Servant Caste, none of her inventions would have seen the light of day.
Human Noble and Dwarf Noble, because money can buy the best training.
Guest_Faerunner_*
Human Noble and Dwarf Noble, because money can buy the best training.
And yet the Dwarf Commoner, who had no money or formal training whatsoever, managed to beat out half a dozen warriors with the best training money can buy... 
And your comments got me to up the DC as higher than I initially thought she should have been because I forgot that sheer weight of "underdog" there is to that origin. Made me kind of wish I still had Origins on my PC so I could go back and replay Brosca (at least through her beginnings).
Why would you delete DAO?! That game's install data pretty much has a permanent presence on my PS3's HDD.
Why would you delete DAO?! That game's install data pretty much has a permanent presence on my PS3's HDD.
Because I have limited hard drive space and already have several games on it, WoW, SWTOR, Sims 2, 3 and 4. I don't play all those but as my PC is the "family" computer, I have to maintain them. Believe me, removing Guild Wars was like pulling teeth without novacaine but I finally got my youngest to agree it had been forever since he played. I was pretty "Origins played out" by the time Inquisition was released. DA2 has also gone bye bye as well. I tend to look forward in episodic stuff like this, but both are still on my Origin account if i ever get a bigger/better HD for my PC and decide I want to play again.
I have been getting chemo since February and haven't the energy to game, just troll the forums so I can't even play the games I do have on my PC for any length of time. If I don't get to play Inquisition enough to satisfy me, I'll have to decide what goes when DA4 is released, but I suspect I will have at least several years to get my fill.
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