136 réponses à ce sujet

[OriginalTibs]

Nope. I was blindsided. I'm not sophisticated, unlike the rest of you whose insight and wisdom is simply amazing.

[In Exile]

I'm ashamed to say this, but I didn't see it coming.

Granted, there were some things about his past that didn't line up, and I thought it was odd that he seemed immune to the false Calling when every other Warden was going crazy (though I just chalked it up to incredible willpower at the time; even Alistair didn't seem that bothered by it in conversation).

I guess I mostly just thought he had some sort of troubled past from before he became a Warden, or terrible secret that mad him decide to hide. I didn't realize that his secret was that he was faking being a Warden in order to hide from his troubled past.

This is not targeted solely at you but I ask since you brought up the point: why do you think Blackwall said he wasn't affected by the Calling? He never actually says that part. He says Corypheus doesn't have a hold over him in response to your inquiry as to the Calling from what I recall. He has some quip about hearing voices which he's wrong about because he has no idea what the calling is but that's not the same as his saying he's unaffected.

Or is this something he says on meet the Warden companion?

[berelinde]

Oh def figured he wasn't an actual warden. He always gave lame answers and often stumbled if caught off guard by warden questions. But he was willing to help and fight for the inquisition and that was good enough for me.

Yeah, that was kinda my take on it. Plus, his hero worship of the Wardens was apparent from hello... but he seemed far too humble to worship a group that he was a member of, if that makes any sense. It's the difference between saying "They're the best!" and saying "We're the best!" Some people will immediately pick up on the wording, but others won't.

 

It's all meta knowledge anyway. *I* knew he wasn't a Warden, but all my inquisitor knows is that he's hiding something. Lots of people hide things. My inquisitor gave him a job: hit things until they die. He did the job. My inquisitor trusted him with things like "Don't let me be gacked by shades." He proved worthy of that trust. After that, if he wanted to be secretive, that was his business. I imagine my Cadash and Varric amused themselves of an evening speculating about what he was hiding, but ultimately, it was his business.

[KonguZya]

Honestly, I just thought that those "hints" about him not feeling the Calling were Bioware's lame writing excuses to cover up plot holes, as they didn't want to have to write extra for Blackwall during that story arc. Same thing for his excuse of "It's hard to say," how many Darkspawn there are; our Wardens didn't have any gameplay mechanic to sense Darkspawn, so Blackwall definitely wouldn't either.

 

As for knowledge about the Joining and Archdemon, those are supposed to be secret, so it makes sense that he would be evasive about that.

[electrifried]

Nope but I wasn't shocked either. His story was pretty boring all round tbh so I really couldn't care less.

[In Exile]

Yeah, that was kinda my take on it. Plus, his hero worship of the Wardens was apparent from hello... but he seemed far too humble to worship a group that he was a member of, if that makes any sense. It's the difference between saying "They're the best!" and saying "We're the best!" Some people will immediately pick up on the wording, but others won't.

 

To be honest I thought the veneration could just be his guilty conscience. Let's say we adopt the POV Blackwall committed some absolutely horrific crime, following which he became a Grey Warden and was offered an opportunity to redeem himself. Even if that order required him to do morally questionable things, I think he'd still end up idolizing it. 

[Phoe77]

I didn't doubt that he was a warden until he told me the truth.  I noticed the inconsistencies in his warden information, but I ascribed that more to a desire not to give away warden secrets rather than a lack of knowledge.  I just assumed that he'd made a command decision as a warden that was weighing heavily on his conscience.  I'd pictured something like the situation that we saw with Crestwood's mayor.

[turuzzusapatuttu]

Nope. I was blindsided. I'm not sophisticated, unlike the rest of you whose insight and wisdom is simply amazing.

 

[Dr. rotinaj]

Honestly, I just thought that those "hints" about him not feeling the Calling were Bioware's lame writing excuses to cover up plot holes, as they didn't want to have to write extra for Blackwall during that story arc. Same thing for his excuse of "It's hard to say," how many Darkspawn there are; our Wardens didn't have any gameplay mechanic to sense Darkspawn, so Blackwall definitely wouldn't either.

 

As for knowledge about the Joining and Archdemon, those are supposed to be secret, so it makes sense that he would be evasive about that.

 

This. It was a cool twist because very little of it is obvious on the first playthrough because there was always another possible justification.

 

Imagine if Blackwall's plot wasn't about him being a fake and that his identity was never revealed. If someone came and posted a "Blackwall isn't a real Warden" conspiracy thread and used all this stuff as evidence, they would be told to take off the tinfoil. People would say Blackwall's evasiveness and reservedness are Warden characteristics. They'd say his inability to sense darkspawn and him being unaffected by the Calling is a result of gameplay-story segregation. The only thing left would be the more obvious stuff like the Nightmare's remark, Cole's dialogue, and Blackwall's hero worshipping. But nobody would accept that as sufficient evidence.

 

Suspicion of something being up makes sense. But accusing him of not being a Warden on that alone is paranoia. I feel that people were only a little suspicious at some of his dialogue and then after the reveal they said "I knew it, it was obvious" and claimed all his odd dialogue as evidence.

 

The reason I liked the twist so much is because of how it isn't obvious the first time through, but it is very obvious the second time through. Knowing Blackwall's identity makes it clear that he's lying through his teeth when you ask about the Wardens. It becomes very easy to put the pieces together on the second run because we only know what the puzzle is supposed to look like after we finish his story.

 

His inability to sense darkspawn or feel the Calling is one of my favourite parts of the twist because it works like Kotor's twist. In Kotor, you go from random amnesiac soldier to super powerful jedi extremely quickly. Normally this would take many years but not for you. This type of thing is just accepted in most RPGs, we're expected to overlook this story inconsistency to allow fun character progression. Bioware took advantage of gameplay-story segregation to make us overlook the most glaring evidence of our character's true identity. They pulled the same thing with Blackwall. Blackwall can't sense darkspawn and he isn't going crazy from the Calling. There has never been a gameplay mechanic of sensing darkspawn and Blackwall going nuts over the Calling would make him useless. So it is natural to overlook these things for the sake of gameplay.

[Vegeta 77]

I forgot about that piece of dialogue!   I immediately was like...

 

 

But I explained it away as he probably didn't want to seem useless to the IQ..

When he said that i was thinking this.

https://youtu.be/7HByZX6PLbI

[Gilsa]

There was a post that didn't tag spoilers properly while I was still on my first PT so that's how I discovered that Blackwall was not a real Grey Warden. (Not upset, I knew better than to read threads before I beat the game so that was my bad.) I didn't know the specifics though, that part remained a surprise for me. I remember banishing the Grey Wardens and being curious if Blackwall would lose his mind back in camp the same way Alistair did if you sacrificed Isolde. It never came, which surprised me.

 

If I hadn't gotten spoiled like that, I can definitely say that I would have realized something was off during WEWH when that noble seemed to recognize Blackwall and Blackwall shrugged it off as mistaken identity. In that same encounter, you can ask him how he got his medal of valor and he'd continue to be evasive.

 

I don't think I would have picked up on the vague Grey Warden answers due to their secretive nature so I probably would have given him the benefit of the doubt and not suspected anything.