So, again, why is it that they seem more straight to you?
It just seems to fit better for them, imo. It's..... hard for me to explain, tbh (kind of like how it's hard for me to explain why I felt that Anders was bi in Awakening). Take that as you will, I guess...
There was lot of talking that Cullen was actually going to be bisexual but devs ran out of time. But regardless if it's true or not, I'm pretty sure that Sera is a lesbian only because they had to make one of female characters gay. In case of Dorian his sexuality really is integrated with his character arc, but as for Sera, well, she could as well be straight or bisexual, in that second situation she wouldn't even need that much of a change in dialogues. There was even a line about marriage in one of final romance conversations with Sera, which was really weird - didn't know there are same-sex marriages in the world of Thedas. Wonder why my lesbian elf in DAO was forced to marry a man then.
And don't even mention Josephine - her whole romance arc is very obviously written for a male character playing that "prince charming" trope, needing serious rewriting and deconstruction to fit if it's going to be about two women, and also to match with game's lore about treatment of homosexuality among nobles - instead, the same lines are just shoehorned for a woman, giving a feeling of romancing straight character via mod like in older Bioware games. As far as I know outside of optional romance with female PC Josie doesn't express any interest in women, while she does in men.
I always thought of Josiphine as similar to Leliana. Leliana is bi, but has a strong preference for woman. Josie is bi, but has a strong preference for men.
I've romanced both Fenris (f!Hawke only, though I've seen videos of m!Hawke/Fenris on YT) and Merrill (f!Hawke once, m!Hawke twice) and, imo, both of their romances feel better suited to being m/f romances rather than m/m or f/f. Isabela was bi back in DA:O and, as I said, I always felt that Anders was bi since Awakening.
Either way, it's just my opinion. Not like it changes anything about the game for you.
I always saw Merrill as demi, but then Gaider shot that out of the sky. Then a year later Allan bumped it from dead to "acceptable headcanon".
I think the line about marriage was a joke.
As for Josephine, I might have said this before, but: Antiva has no prejudice against homosexuality at all. Zevran brings it up in DAO. It's more tolerant in that regard than Ferelden and even Orlais. Though I would be interested to hear what you'd have to say about what would be needed for rewriting/deconstruction otherwise.
It could be read as a joke, but it still feels out of place - after never addressing in romance conversations her sexuality or fact that it's about two women being in relationship, you can say let's marry. I sometimes feel like the writing of queer female characters in this game is like in this joke about people who don't see race - they see everyone as white.
And as for Josephine, game actually clearly states that it's Orlais that treats homosexuality the best, and it's still considered to be "the quirk of character", but also says that nobles tend to be discreet with it. Sorry, but duel on the market of biggest city of Orlais, when the fact it's about two women is never adressed in any way, is extremely far-fetched. Or the fact that Josie herself never adress in private romance conversations this fact - which makes the whole difference, because her romance with a woman according to game's info about homosexuality shoudln't be considered to be any valid obstacle from marrying a man anyway. Why there wasn't discussion about that? She could for example say something like you don't mean less to me than a man and this is exactly the reason why we must end it. But no, that would mean they would have to spend additional money on something only queer female players would appreciate.
It could be read as a joke, but it still feels out of place - after never addressing in romance conversations her sexuality or fact that it's about two women being in relationship, you can say let's marry. I sometimes feel like the writing of queer female characters in this game is like in this joke about people who don't see race - they see everyone as white.
And as for Josephine, game actually clearly states that it's Orlais that treats homosexuality the best, and it's still considered to be "the quirk of character", but also says that nobles tend to be discreet with it. Sorry, but duel on the market of biggest city of Orlais, when the fact it's about two women is never adressed in any way, is extremely far-fetched. Or the fact that Josie herself never adress in private romance conversations this fact - which makes the whole difference, because her romance with a woman according to game's info about homosexuality shoudln't be considered to be any valid obstacle from marrying a man anyway. Why there wasn't discussion about that? She could for example say something like you don't mean less to me than a man and this is exactly the reason why we must end it. But no, that would mean they would have to spend additional money on something only queer female players would appreciate.
I prefer Josephine not agreeing to marry Otranto simply because she loves you than your idea.
I prefer Josephine not agreeing to marry Otranto simply because she loves you than your idea.
I referred to earlier conversation when she tells you that you must end your romance because she's been betrothed.
It could be read as a joke, but it still feels out of place - after never addressing in romance conversations her sexuality or fact that it's about two women being in relationship, you can say let's marry. I sometimes feel like the writing of queer female characters in this game is like in this joke about people who don't see race - they see everyone as white.
Is Sera really the sort of person to talk thoughtfully about sexual orientation and its effects on interpersonal relations?
And as for Josephine, game actually clearly states that it's Orlais that treats homosexuality the best, and it's still considered to be "the quirk of character", but also says that nobles tend to be discreet with it. Sorry, but duel on the market of biggest city of Orlais, when the fact it's about two women is never adressed in any way, is extremely far-fetched. Or the fact that Josie herself never adress in private romance conversations this fact - which makes the whole difference, because her romance with a woman according to game's info about homosexuality shoudln't be considered to be any valid obstacle from marrying a man anyway. Why there wasn't discussion about that? She could for example say something like you don't mean less to me than a man and this is exactly the reason why we must end it. But no, that would mean they would have to spend additional money on something only queer female players would appreciate.
Source on that claim about how Orlais is the best, or "discreet?" There are two obviously gay noblemen arguing in the Winter Palace, and Leliana can be introduced as the consort of the Queen of Ferelden with no hint of embarrassment, and the Sexuality in Thedas codex entry has the "discreet" part be limited to Ferelden, not Orlais, in addition to not saying that Orlais is best; I also don't think that "quirk of character" is intended to have any negative connotations. Also, Otranto himself is just a romantic sort who doesn't want to screw with anyone's true love regardless of orientation.
I won't deny that I have many issues with Josephine's romance, but none of them come from seeing a gay relationship as presented as less valid.
well this thread has been suitably entertaining
Guest_Roly Voly_*
Careful who you do that around! Some of those (and by that I admittedly mean me) crazy Cassie lovers have been trained to respond to that like a pavlovian dog.
EDIT: Serious note here on general discussion, and I hope I don't offend but I figured I'd toss in my rather shallow male perspective. My lesbian friends are mentally placed in my "cousin circle." By that I mean I kind of view them like I would a cousin. Sure, they may be lovely ladies, but big whoop. They're utterly off limits both physically and, ideally, mentally as well, though admittedly some stray thoughts may be entertained... I can expand on the whole circle thing or any other part if someone is upset by it or confused.
Not really sure what direction the thread has gone since, but it was buggin me how I worded that, so I tried my best to explain with pictures my concentric circle concept. I suck at anything artsy fartsy, and that includes basic geometric imagery, so please bear that in mind before you respond about how it's a crappy image. Also, this is from the perspective of a straight male, so bear that in mind as well and adjust accordingly for other situations.
It's more a matter of resources and time. There's only so much of each to go around, and I am quite satisfied with Sera being the only romance option in the game like me. I am happy that Sera was written specifically for us lesbian gamers that have been asking for such specific content for a decade+. I do kinda like Josi's romance but it is overtly obvious it was written primarily to be with a male Inquisitor. Quite honestly, if this was a perfect world and development could have unlimited resources and time, things would be different. But reality is something different and I should think us lucky that all of us got someone dedicated to our own lifestyle and some that go either way.
My best friend played Dragon Age Inquisition unspoiled. She did the Mage quest early and then goofed around at Haven forever because She Wanted To Totally Finish the Hitherlands (I was like 'Go seal the breach! Get your last party member!' and she kept ignoring me and yelling at me not to spoil her). This, of course, led to a lot of time with Dorian before his personal quest, and opportunities to flirt and be playful with him.
So, look, I can understand: when she finally got around to his personal quest and the 'I like men' deal came out (which I had been spoiled on, but probably would have guessed anyway, honestly), she actually called me up wailing about how I hadn't told her (I totally did a 'But I thought you didn't want me to spoil you? :D' routine, which was probably mean of me). You can definitely flirt with Dorian as a female, and while your first flirt as a guy with Sera ends with a 'Pfft! Not even!' I could definitely see how people could take that to be a 'not now' (just like people were confused by Viv).
However... if you're keeping up with them in conversations and the War Table quests involving them (and if you're interested in them, you probably are), both Dorian and Sera's quest take place pretty much right after Skyhold. Both will turn down the people they're not interested in then firmly. There should be plenty of time to switch over to someone interested in you then.
(Actually, the person I have interest with is sadly Cass (who is still one of my favorite characters and romances despite it, mind)- a female can flirt with her constantly throughout the game and think they're on her romance path, and it's not till after her personal quest (which tends to pop up more midgame-y) that she turns a female down. That can be far after the point you can jump on another romance, save for maybe Cullen. Definitely past the time you can move to Josie or Sera, if you're interested in pursuing a female.)
So, I mean... my sympathies, but if you keep up with her, Sera should tell you her preferences pretty early, and she *does* turn down a male character straight in the very first flirt.
The whole 'I should be able to make a lesbian like men by showing her enough devotion' sort of has a creepy tone to it, though. No, the character is not real: but gals who like gals are very much real and in this fandom (and on these boards), and many of us have dealt with enough of that sort of toxicity in real life already. No one is a slot machine: you do not put coins of niceness in till the sex falls out. The less video game characters fall in to that trope the better; I think almost everyone has wanted characters who are more like real people and less like 'Yes, I never take you out in the party, Morg, because you disapprove of everything I do, and when I do you hate me, but HEY SHINY THINGS! Let's fall in love!'.
As that was kind of dumb.
Guest_Faerunner_*
For a moment there I thought this thread was going to be about her anti-mage and anti-elf bigotry, which can alienate a good number of players, or just her general rude, flippant, abrasive personality. But nope. It's another "I wanted to screw her but she doesn't want to screw me" thread.
Honestly? If you want to romance her, play a female character. Lots of ladies who wanted to romance Dorian made a male character to woo him, you can too.
I referred to earlier conversation when she tells you that you must end your romance because she's been betrothed.
No, she tells you they have to put it on hold until she can stop the engagement.
I've come around to bisexual/playersexual, outside of cases like Dorian. A player is simultaneously experiencing and creating the story. If I decide that the Cassandra type is perfect for my f!Cafash or Cullen for a m!qunari, that should be my option.
It should be up to the writers not the players
well this thread has been suitably entertaining
Not the word I'd use given who's in it 
It's not like Sera is only gated romance in DAI though and it's not like Bioware hasn't done lesbian character to romance before. So I'm not sure what to be suprised here, OP.
Really? You didn't get the very clear hint she gives? Are you deaf and/or blind...?
And as for Josephine, game actually clearly states that it's Orlais that treats homosexuality the best, and it's still considered to be "the quirk of character", but also says that nobles tend to be discreet with it. Sorry, but duel on the market of biggest city of Orlais, when the fact it's about two women is never adressed in any way, is extremely far-fetched. Or the fact that Josie herself never adress in private romance conversations this fact - which makes the whole difference, because her romance with a woman according to game's info about homosexuality shoudln't be considered to be any valid obstacle from marrying a man anyway. Why there wasn't discussion about that? She could for example say something like you don't mean less to me than a man and this is exactly the reason why we must end it. But no, that would mean they would have to spend additional money on something only queer female players would appreciate.
There's absolutely no need to address it. Josephine is so far beyond the actual political games of nobles when she's in a relationship with the Inquisitor that the whole notion of noble marriages becomes inane. The Inquisitor is such a trade up from basically any other living being around that could match the, well, match.
The Inquisitor is - by end of the game - probably the single most powerful and influential person in Southern Thedas, potentially being the force behind the Orlesian throne among other things, and not to mention second most divine figure in the Andrastian faith beside Andraste herself. There's absolutely nothing for Josephine to discuss. She has siblings who can succeed her line and breed heirs to her family if necessary, if she's in a relationship with the Inquisitor and sticking around long-term the very fact of her becoming head of her household is a bit in question anyway, and there's literally no better possible political match for her short of the Emperor of Orlais if you crown Gaspard.
Between the butt jokes and nobility hating, Sera rarely ever mentions the fact that she's attracted to women alone. I've seen some videos showing her reaction when you flirt with her as a male Inquisitor and it's mostly subtle. Sera rejects him, but nothing indicates it's because he's a guy.
It was more funny when there was fighting dialogs for the love of the main character (exp. Morrigan -Leliana in DA:O or Merril - Anders in DAII)
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