202 réponses à ce sujet

[Silcron]

If there has to be a link between MP and SP I'd rather it be something secondary. Say, the success of the people working for you has granted you some extra income. The whole EMS thing was poorly handled and I think that DAIMP is an example that they're not going to do it again, or at least I hope so.

As for evolving the mp they could look at the games their mp was inspired from again, mainly halo 4 with Spartan Ops. We could have an storyline in mp that served as a segway into a sequel. I'd still want the old horde mode to be there, it's fun enough for a couple of matches from time to time, maybe even that with spaceships.

[Nitrocuban]

I'd keep storytelling to SP and casual 20min matches without forced story to MP.

 

Using assets from MP for SP like MP maps as N7 missions in SP or the whole MP mode as "Combat Simulator" in SP together with the NPC squadmates is great.

All free MP DLC stuff should be (somehow) available in SP, too. You know, like Collectors and stuff.

If it's not too much work: An option to play SP with two friends as squadmates, difficulty as in MP to balance.

 

And PLEASE add an unlockable option to create a custom SP char with all powers from SP and MP(!) and difficulty above Insanity (like MP Gold or Platinum). Can be OP as hell or almost unplayable, but all the hardcore fan will go nuts about it.

[laudable11]

Mass Effect multiplayer was perfect. Hell, I want to blow the dust off my 360 and play it now.

DAMP on the other hand was a total letdown.

[N7 Shadow 90]

To me, it feels silly for the single-player only camp to say that you don't want MP. We've already dismissed the resources argument, rendering the point that 'MP makes the SP worse' irrelevant, in my eyes. Please counter this is anyone has any other reasons for not wanting MP.

 

If you don't want to play MP, of course that's absolutely fine, but if it is not taking away from the SP experience... surely it's practically like going to a restaurant, ordering the same meal as your friend, and asking for it without salad. And yet then also telling them that they should not have salad with their meal because you don't like it personally. Please address this if you believe I am wrong.

 

Another point I would make is that developing a MP mode improved ME3's SP combat - this is down to opinion, but I recall Bioware employees saying that including an MP mode forced them to make the combat as tight as possible, as well as teaching them things that they hadn't considered before. Of course, this transferred back to the SP. Thus I would offer a guess that the SP combat would not have been as good if not for MP.

[RVallant]

To me, it feels silly for the single-player only camp to say that you don't want MP. We've already dismissed the resources argument, rendering the point that 'MP makes the SP worse' irrelevant, in my eyes. Please counter this is anyone has any other reasons for not wanting MP.

 

If you don't want to play MP, of course that's absolutely fine, but if it is not taking away from the SP experience... surely it's practically like going to a restaurant, ordering the same meal as your friend, and asking for it without salad. And yet then also telling them that they should not have salad with their meal because you don't like it personally. Please address this if you believe I am wrong.

 

Another point I would make is that developing a MP mode improved ME3's SP combat - this is down to opinion, but I recall Bioware employees saying that including an MP mode forced them to make the combat as tight as possible, as well as teaching them things that they hadn't considered before. Of course, this transferred back to the SP. Thus I would offer a guess that the SP combat would not have been as good if not for MP.

 

There's two elements;

 

1) MP affecting the SP campaign in some sort, whether it adjusts the ending or is a timesink pulling people out of the SP campaign in order to achieve whatever the impact required (i.e. the EMS). 

 

That's where people object to it, but also I think because they realise that Bioware aren't going to copy DA:I's model, purely because you can't nickel and dime as much as you can that SP gamer who may well be tempted to blow money on getting an advantage or bypassing something in order to rush the MP element as fast as possible so they can get back to the game they want to play.

 

2) It represents (whether factual or otherwise) a perceived move away from the SP crowd towards the more casual pew pew or hardcore MP nuts, both who usually, but not always, have no investment in the SP in the first place. There's very little SP-MP crossover games that actually work well, on top of that, is the EA exec, you know the one, who never greenlights a game without Multiplayer as it is the 'future'. 

 

So in a way its backlash against that stance and against those people who infringe on the perceived vision of what a Bioware game should be. Single-player epics and none of the casual action mode or MP stuff.

 

On that note;

 

I don't care if MP is included or not, so long as it doesn't detract from the SP campaign and so long as it doesn't interact with the SP campaign in *most* methods. ME's MP was fine, typical map shootouts, that the usual crowd lap up like the next best thing. But I wouldn't have touched it full stop if it wasn't required for the EMS, and beside now you can bypass it by doing that online timer crap where you send out 'ai missions' and they raise the galactic readiness rating for you automatically in a few hours. (Addendum: EA/Bioware never got a cent from me playing MP either, so whether that was a 'success' on their part is open for debate.)

[Malanek]

What do people think about the missions you unlock in SP interacting to some degree with MP?

 

As I understand it based on the leak, there are certain missions in SP that you can

1) Ignore

2) Allocate a strike team to handle it for you in the background (you don't play it but need to spend money to improve strike team)

3) Play as SP with your SP character

4) Play as MP with your MP characters

 

I like the idea but something that concerned me was the line...

 

The more friends you bring, the greater the challenge and the greater the reward.

 

I think the greater reward should only apply to your multiplayer characters only and any SP rewards you get are equivalent whether you complete it with SP or MP. I also thinks it is very important to be able to set the level of challenge to the maximum regardless of how many players there are, soloing in ME3 MP was great fun.

[KaiserShep]

I can take or leave MP, so long as something like the EMS doesn't exist again, but I'd love to see how BioWare could take advantage of the bigger environments in a multiplayer campaign. This is probably not going to happen, but I'd love to see an MP character we use or unlock hanging around in a hub somewhere.

[RoboticWater]

What do people think about the missions you unlock in SP interacting to some degree with MP?

 

As I understand it based on the leak, there are certain missions in SP that you can

1) Ignore

2) Allocate a strike team to handle it for you in the background (you don't play it but need to spend money to improve strike team)

3) Play as SP with your SP character

4) Play as MP with your MP characters

 

I like the idea but something that concerned me was the line...

 

The more friends you bring, the greater the challenge and the greater the reward.

 

I think the greater reward should only apply to your multiplayer characters only and any SP rewards you get are equivalent whether you complete it with SP or MP. I also thinks it is very important to be able to set the level of challenge to the maximum regardless of how many players there are, soloing in ME3 MP was great fun.

I have more than a couple problems with them.

 

1) I've never been completely sold on the whole war table missions. While they're not necessarily bad, they are a trope that become more and more gimmicky every time I see them. 

 

2) I don't trust any developer to balance their game around a MP grind. Not that I'm accusing BioWare of any slimy business (though their association with EA has me worried), but erecting a fair yet challenging economy in a singleplayer game is nigh impossible if the player can just grind for currency in MP.

 

3) I've always despised the way PR people describe quests or missions as "activities," like they did in the leak. It waters down the cohesive universe the developers are crafting for us into quaint fun-house games. Similarly, I don't like the concept of respawning missions. Not only does that impede my sense of progression a little, but I also can't buy into the reality of a universe if the same old goons keep moving into the base I cleared out yesterday. It's game-y to the highest degree.

 

4) I don't want to see it. Hopefully there will be an option to disable all the MP "do you want to play with your friends?" prompts, because I don't want to deal with it.

[Malanek]

I have more than a couple problems with them.

...snip

Thanks for the reply. Can I ask whether you liked ME3 MPer or not?

[KaiserShep]

3) I've always despised the way PR people describe quests or missions as "activities," like they did in the leak. It waters down the cohesive universe the developers are crafting for us into quaint fun-house games. Similarly, I don't like the concept of respawning missions. Not only does that impede my sense of progression a little, but I also can't buy into the reality of a universe if the same old goons keep moving into the base I cleared out yesterday. It's game-y to the highest degree.

 

This is probably one of the biggest issues with multiplayer. Like, in Destiny, Crota, Sepiks Prime or the hive abomination are killed endlessly in repeat strikes, because whatever. In ME3MP, it's pretty much a sh*tshow from a story standpoint, since you have reaper-controlled geth anywhere, even Earth, because why not? The Citadel DLC kind of makes this a tad worse by acknowledging those geth if you listen to ambient dialogue in the casino.

[windsea]

The multiplayer was one of the best gameplay in ME3 for me, AS LONG AS they don't have any dumb SP crossover, i want it in MEnot4.

[AlanC9]

Because it used to work like that.  It still does, somewhat.  And I'm not gonna pretend to know anything about the video game industry to tell you how the business financials of a huge corporation like EA & BioWare work.

Budgeting worked like that? I never heard of any project in any industry being budgeted that way. The closest equivalent I can think of only happens in bureaucratic organizations with no real deliverables or accountability -- government departments, corporate overhead funds, and so forth. This can result in situations where you try to throw away all the money in your budget so the higher-ups don't realize they've been allocating too much money to you. (I remember my office had to throw a really expensive Christmas party one year for exactly this reason.) But I don't think this has any relevance to the game industry, where publishers always fund by project.

[SofaJockey]

As long as there is no crossover content forcing SP-only players to indulge,

the multiplayer as a separately budgeted experience has brought much to the table.

 

The OP's proposal is not unique as there is probably a third of the player base who simply have no interest in it,

but the financial and play value arguments in MP's favour have been established in thread after thread over the years.

 

In short, it's happening.

I hope it's separate.

I hope it's good.

[Andrew Lucas]

I kinda agree with the OP, the MP is very, very generic, nothing special about it.

[DirtySHISN0]

Please, no more MP in BioWare games, they add no value whatsoever and takes away resources.

 

But consoles won't be as limited by space as they were last gen, so why should everyone suffer?

[SofaJockey]

I kinda agree with the OP, the MP is very, very generic, nothing special about it.

 

Are we talking here about the generic, non special ME3 multiplayer that still has an active player community >3 years post launch? 

[Malanek]

I kinda agree with the OP, the MP is very, very generic, nothing special about it.

People say it's generic but I don't think there is any other game with a similar combination of powers and weapons. Horde mode has been done elsewhere (a lot) but that is only a small aspect of the game play.

[goishen]

Budgeting worked like that? I never heard of any project in any industry being budgeted that way. The closest equivalent I can think of only happens in bureaucratic organizations with no real deliverables or accountability -- government departments, corporate overhead funds, and so forth. This can result in situations where you try to throw away all the money in your budget so the higher-ups don't realize they've been allocating too much money to you. (I remember my office had to throw a really expensive Christmas party one year for exactly this reason.) But I don't think this has any relevance to the game industry, where publishers always fund by project.

 

 

Right, but I think you're forgetting where these guys came from.  These people came from neckbeards writing code in their basement all day until somebody said, "Hey, you should publish that."  I'm talking in the '70s - early '80s.  I mean, I don't wanna pick a scab...   But look at Atari.  Not great.

 

The industry has gone through drastic swings and has mostly stabilized now. 

[StealthGamer92]

Are we talking here about the generic, non special ME3 multiplayer that still has an active player community >3 years post launch? 

Yes. It is a shameless GoW hord, Halo firefight ripoff, the fact people still play it only says that kind of lazyness can pay off in modern gaming.

[RoboticWater]

Thanks for the reply. Can I ask whether you liked ME3 MPer or not?

Loved it, except for EMS. Horde mode might not be too inspired, but it was fun.

 

I could totally get behind the idea of strike missions as long as they were just another MP mode. It's difficult to cleanly integrate MP into SP, and I don't want MENext to suffer for it.

[Andrew Lucas]

Are we talking here about the generic, non special ME3 multiplayer that still has an active player community >3 years post launch?

Crysis' is a generic game as a whole, even the MP, and people still are playing it. You may have fun with it, but the truth is that the MP is generic.

You know something similar but well elaborated? Killing Floor 1&2. Basically, Horde Mode, but it's much more complex than anything that ME3's MP has to offer and a lot of AAA games out there.

Most of the time, I only see fans of the series praising it, and that's it.

People say it's generic but I don't think there is any other game with a similar combination of powers and weapons. Horde mode has been done elsewhere (a lot) but that is only a small aspect of the game play.

Like if that was a huge deal, powers combination. Still, each to their own.

[RoboticWater]

Yes. It is a shameless GoW hord, Halo firefight ripoff, the fact people still play it only says that kind of lazyness can pay off in modern gaming.

Games are the one of the few media where someone can blatantly rip off other products and still make a perfectly good product. So long as the developer improves or adds an interesting twist to the formula, it's fair game.

 

ME3MP succeeded because ME3's gameplay is fun and it's progression system is rewarding.

[SofaJockey]

Yes. It is a shameless GoW hord, Halo firefight ripoff, the fact people still play it only says that kind of lazyness can pay off in modern gaming.

 

Never played GoW or Halo so wouldn't know. Pleased that the ME3 multiplayer has paid off as it guarantees more ME multiplayer. Good times  .

[Andrew Lucas]

Yes. It is a shameless GoW hord, Halo firefight ripoff, the fact people still play it only says that kind of lazyness can pay off in modern gaming.

Indeed. I tried to get on it countless times, same old, same old.

[RoboticWater]

Crysis' is a generic game as a whole, even the MP, and people still are playing it. You may have fun with it, but the truth is that the MP is generic.

You know something similar but well elaborated? Killing Floor 1&2. Basically, Horde Mode, but it's much more complex than anything that ME3's MP has to offer and a lot of AAA games out there.

Most of the time, I only see fans of the series praising it, and that's it.

It's hard to compare Killing Floor, a game entirely devoted to horde mode, to ME3MP, a side mode created from an established SP only title. Of course Killing Floor is going to have a more complex horde mode, that's the only thing selling their game. It's amazing that BioWare was even able to flesh out a separate mode as well as they did.

 

Objectively, ME3MP isn't the best thing around, but it is still fun.

 

Also, I've seen it get tons of praise from plenty of sources: reviewers, reddit, gaming pundits, etc.