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[Puzzlewell]

Only vaguely on topic but my heart still hurts over Troika. VTMB is a prime example I would say towards the TLC of the modding community helping a game get the recognition it deserves. Ahh, might just have to go back and finish my yearly replay. Definitely an interesting read though, so thank you, Crusty. I guess it brings some vague amusement since people were giving Obsidian **** for their choices but they are still around afterall and I'm hoping the success of PoE will help keep them afloat, as biased as I am toward their work.

[wolfsite]

I miss Troika, I knew they got screwed over in the contract department with Valve but I never realized it was that bad.

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

Only vaguely on topic but my heart still hurts over Troika. VTMB is a prime example I would say towards the TLC of the modding community helping a game get the recognition it deserves. Ahh, might just have to go back and finish my yearly replay. Definitely an interesting read though, so thank you, Crusty. I guess it brings some vague amusement since people were giving Obsidian **** for their choices but they are still around afterall and I'm hoping the success of PoE will help keep them afloat, as biased as I am toward their work.

It's a similar situation with Obsidian and Alpha Protocol, SEGA delayed the game's release but then refused to pay Obsidian during that extra time. So Obsidian were forced to redirect people to other projects like New Vegas, or risk having to fire them. I'd say that AP was mismanaged to begin with (the original Brian Mitsoda script was scrapped and rewritten by Chris Avellone well into development), but it goes some way to explaining why it was such a broken mess.

I would wager stories like this are surprisingly common, we just don't hear about them because bold, investigate journalism is dead if journalists can't use it as a soapbox for their ideologies.

"It's just games. It's not important like video game women in bikinis AKA sexism AKA misogynistic oppression of the worst kind."

[Puzzlewell]

Going to have to agree with you completely there too. I admit that's one reason I'm rather fond of companies/creators making post-mortems about their games even well after the fact, since it gives gamers the opportunity to see a bit into the industry and the sorts of obstacles faced. Sega's hitch in general has been a frustration point for me regarding the cancellation of the Alien RPG to shift their attention to Colonial Marines, and we all know how that turned out. >___>

[CassandraSaturn's Ring]

Business is business.  You had your free mods for years.

[slimgrin]

Business is business.  You had your free mods for years.

 

Great argument mate. Really. This is like 10/10 material here.

[Eternal Phoenix]

Great argument mate. Really. This is like 10/10 material here.

 

He's called Stone Cold for a reason.

[spirosz]

[Killdren88]

It happened...they took them down from the inside. It was all an elaborate trap!

 

StEAm.

[Eternal Phoenix]

It happened...they took them down from the inside. It was all an elaborate trap!

 

StEAm.

 

Steam has been its own devil for some time.

[ObserverStatus]

Business is business. You had your free mods for years.

Exactly, business is business, and if Steam keeps this up, I'm taking my business elsewhere.

[AlanC9]

This is the SkyUI dev, he plans on making it a paid mod.

Interesting. I wonder what they've got that would make a paid version worth getting?

In general, UI mods strike me as a lousy choice for monetization. There's no real barrier to entry, except maybe coming close enough to some other mod's look that you're vulnerable to a DMCA takedown.

[CassandraSaturn's Ring]

Great argument mate. Really. This is like 10/10 material here.

 

It's that simple.  This is how the world works.  When an opportunity for someone to make money presents itself, someone will take it.  It's not an outrage, it isn't a scandal, it's business.

[AlanC9]

No. But it's still there clogging up the storefront making it harder to find new actually good stuff. This business is very different to a restaurant due to the huge numbers of people making the things.

Is this also a problem for you on Amazon? Or Spotify?

[therealmilkman]

Apologies if this has already been posted, but TotalBiscuit encapsulates the issue pretty well in his recent Content Patch.

 

It's 22 minutes, but well worth it if you have the time.

 

[Elhanan]

Apologies if this has already been posted, but TotalBiscuit encapsulates the issue pretty well in his recent Content Patch.
 
It's 22 minutes, but well worth it if you have the time....

I heard this yesterday, and liked the overall sentiment. However, the details concerning Valve (they are not getting 75%) and wish more would wait and get the facts straight before offering such discussions.

[Cyonan]

All good points. Still, I'd rather see the new opportunities that this might open.

New opportunities, not the opportunity to get paid for every mod. That simply won't happen. It'd sooner be the demise of modding altogether. But I can't see the modding community stand for that. 

 

As for "...involves profit with gaming..." that's nonsensical, because profit is a necessity. Gaming wouldn't exist without it.

I would argue that DLC is still a good idea in theory. Just like DRM. We're just still waiting for someone to implement it as a good idea.

 

DLC is a good idea in theory, but then it ended up being all about making more money to a lot of developers. The thing is that yes you need money to make video games, however pretty much everything that's been a good idea that could be monetized gets exploited to hell. Gaming wouldn't exist without money, but a lot of the money made by a company like Bethesda isn't going to the actual developers and artists to make new games.

 

I'd also argue that DRM is not a good idea in theory, because pirates will always find a way around it and it adds nothing of value to the legitimate customer. It seems more like making the shareholders happy because you can tell them you're doing something about the piracy issue.

 

The biggest concern for new opportunities is what's being taken away by my first point. I feel like if paid mods take off and become big, framework mods are something we're going to see a lot less of. There might not be a SKSE or FNIS anymore, because other people are just taking their mods and making money off it without them getting anything for their hard work.

 

The other alternative is that they also make their mods paid, but then you end up in a situation where a $2 mod requires $15 worth of other mods to work.

 

That and having paid mods that are essentially patching something the developer couldn't be bothered to fix feels like we're 1 step away from companies like EA trying to have paid patches.

[Inquisitor Recon]

Know that right now Gaben is laughing at the cries of the Steam Skyrim discussion boards while eating an entire turkey and not working on HL3.

Why did you believe him?

[Liamv2]

Is this also a problem for you on Amazon? Or Spotify?

 

Nope. Never used spotify so I don't know about that.

[DarkKnightHolmes]

Lol, the drama is so so so entertaining. Seeing the internet turn on Valve is nice too.

[Ryzaki]

Bah, humbug. Like paying for fanfiction.

 

Yep. I wrote fanfiction but I damn sure wouldn't try to sell it. (not unless it was original fiction anyway).

[In Exile]

It's a similar situation with Obsidian and Alpha Protocol, SEGA delayed the game's release but then refused to pay Obsidian during that extra time. So Obsidian were forced to redirect people to other projects like New Vegas, or risk having to fire them. I'd say that AP was mismanaged to begin with (the original Brian Mitsoda script was scrapped and rewritten by Chris Avellone well into development), but it goes some way to explaining why it was such a broken mess.

I would wager stories like this are surprisingly common, we just don't hear about them because bold, investigate journalism is dead if journalists can't use it as a soapbox for their ideologies.

"It's just games. It's not important like video game women in bikinis AKA sexism AKA misogynistic oppression of the worst kind."

 

Or, removing the tinfoil, the actual answer is that gaming journalism is bankrolled entirely by those companies whose practices would be getting exposed. Something hands, feeding and bitting is likely the explanation.

[Enigmatick]

God this thread reeks of memetic language, is off topic always /v/-lite?

[AlanC9]

Nope. Never used spotify so I don't know about that.

OK. Why is lots of crappy stuff a problem on Steam but not on Amazon? Both have tons of crap, don't they?

[AlanC9]

God this thread reeks of memetic language, is off topic always /v/-lite?

Pretty much.

Actually, all I know about /v/ comes from people making fun of it.