404 réponses à ce sujet

[Garryydde]

We should have listened to RMS

[Kaiser Shepard]

[Dermain]

Yup, it's starting to unravel now. Mods made with other mods and modder's resources are so common that no one even think twice about using them and giving a simple credit where due. But now that mods have a price tag, permission and authorship suddenly become an issue, which Valve have neglected set up a system to deal with.

The result is as predictable as it is farcical; a mod recently went on sale, then was promptly withdrawn after the author failed to get proper permission for third-party animation assets. That it was caught and dealt with is not the issue; that Valve seem to expect the community to police their own is. Now that cold, hard currency is on the line, it is more important than ever that issues like this are policed properly, with clear ground rules and a standard arbitration process. Instead, Valve have removed the judge and open a thousand-seat jury to anyone bothering to walk through the door. It's a disaster waiting to happen.

As I said, the idea of paid mods is not inherently a bad one, but Valve's implementation is neglectful and perhaps even naive. This is only the beginning. This could still end well. But between now and then, I expect plenty of painful lessons to be learned.

 

Well, if the paid mods thing continues free mods will become a thing of the past.

 

Why would a modder release something for free when they can sell it? Will Steam go after the Nexus because it hurts their profits? Will modders start suing the Nexus when people place their paid mods on it for free? 

 

As it stands, the Nexus is going to be in a slippery slope of "piracy" if paid mods actually succeeds.

[L. Han]

^There are a fair amount of modders who have stated that their mods will be always be free. But that's the biggest issue in my opinion. Modders have always relied on other modder's resources and assets. Some of the best mods (like Faksarr and many expansive ones) have a lot of modders who worked on it. So when these things start getting money chimed in, there will be conflicts about who gets paid. Is it everyone? Is it the starters? Is it going to be dependant on who puts more effort?

[Degenerate Rakia Time]

well the general opinion on the Nexus is that paid mods will die really fast

[BroBear Berbil]

 

 

Why would a modder release something for free when they can sell it? Will Steam go after the Nexus because it hurts their profits? Will modders start suing the Nexus when people place their paid mods on it for free? 

 

 

And the reverse, what's to stop some scumbag taking a modder's work from a free mod and trying to make a quick buck? If that kind of thing becomes widespread than modders will be almost forced to put a price tag on their mods. Modding, as I've known it since Morrowind, will be dead.

 

I have no particular attachment to the Elder Scrolls series or its lore. I play the games solely because of mods. If Valve and Bethesda are so intent on ****** up the modding scene and this isn't removed, then I suppose I can just swear off TES and FO games.

 

What's been getting me is the people that are arguing in favor of this. The typical argument seems to be "you're not entitled to other people's hard work", but that goes against the very spirit of what modding has always been about. You mod for the sake of creation and for the love of the game and making it better. It's about collaborating with other people and freely sharing work, while giving credit where credit is due.

 

I've used hundreds of mods and they do add value and enjoyment to a game, but the overwhelming majority of them aren't worth money imo. Mods are buggy, conflict with other mods, are frequently abandoned, and get outdated. They're only stable now because Bethesda has stopped patching Skyrim; what is it going to be like in a new Bethesda game? The bugginess could always be overlooked and criticism softened because, "hey it's free". Add money to the equation and that kind of attitude goes out the window - suddenly modders are dealing with customers. And this won't be an avenue to a livable source of income for the overwhelming majority of modders either since they'll be making a pittance from their work. Will a modder even be able to easily walk away from a project while the game is still actively patched?

 

The more I think about paid mods, the more I hate the idea. There are already so many microtransactions, DLCs, and cutting corners in gaming; I honestly cannot afford to be nickel-and-dimed even more. Money perverts everything.

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

It will die if Valve let it die, but I don't think it will die fast enough to prevent the blood spluttering and death gurgles. Painful lessons are ahead between now and then, I fear.

Which would be a shame. Good things can come of this, if only Valve would have a bit more prudence and foresight.

 

All Valve would have to do is facilitate a "pay what you want" system where players could donate money to modders for their work or simply download it for free. It's literally that simple. Yet we get this monstrosity instead.

 

I'm too tied to Steam to completely abandon it, but if this catches on as an industry wide practice, I would have to really consider alternative means of purchasing and playing games on the PC.

[Degenerate Rakia Time]

well while this gets sorted out i guess i'll go dump all my unreleased mods on the nexus

[BroBear Berbil]

That would require it to be about the modders in the first place. That's always been the option on the Nexus, but this paid mod scheme came about because Bethesda and Valve wanted a new revenue stream.

 

Is it too much to hope for that Gaben didn't know about this? That he'll swoop in and save the day like he did when Hatred got pulled from Steam?

[Degenerate Rakia Time]

That would require it to be about the modders in the first place. That's always been the option on the Nexus, but this paid mod scheme came about because Bethesda and Valve wanted a new revenue stream.

 

Is it too much to hope for that Gaben didn't know about this? That he'll swoop in and save the day like he did when Hatred got pulled from Steam?

Hatred not only should have been pulled from Steam, it should be towed out to sea and nuked along with its creators

[Jorina Leto]

The question is: Are they going to disallow free mods with Fallout 4 or The Elder Scrolls VI?

[Bakgrind]

 

That seriously is the most epic thing I have seen. It totally trumps hitler hates mass effect. Bravo!

[L. Han]

^If we are thinking cynically, they might start making the game very hard to mod unless it's done via the DRMified mods on the workshop. I am interested to see how these companies will deal with copyright issues that will soon come barging at them the moment these stuff make a lot of money.

 

Most copyright infringing mods are asking for forgiveness rather than permission. Now money is in the game, I wonder how things will go.

[In Exile]

Yup, it's starting to unravel now. Mods made with other mods and modder's resources are so common that no one even think twice about using them and giving a simple credit where due. But now that mods have a price tag, permission and authorship suddenly become an issue, which Valve have neglected set up a system to deal with.

The result is as predictable as it is farcical; a mod recently went on sale, then was promptly withdrawn after the author failed to get proper permission for third-party animation assets. That it was caught and dealt with is not the issue; that Valve seem to expect the community to police their own is. Now that cold, hard currency is on the line, it is more important than ever that issues like this are policed properly, with clear ground rules and a standard arbitration process. Instead, Valve have removed the judge and open a thousand-seat jury to anyone bothering to walk through the door. It's a disaster waiting to happen.

As I said, the idea of paid mods is not inherently a bad one, but Valve's implementation is neglectful and perhaps even naive. This is only the beginning. This could still end well. But between now and then, I expect plenty of painful lessons to be learned.

 

Depending on how and where the assets come from, this may cause issues down the line for Valve. I'm not sure how sympathetic a larger competitor will be with Valve proper if particular modders start raiding IPs to sell mods on which Steam makes a cut on. That might lead to lawsuits against Valve itself, which seems to not be worth it given the cut they're taking on these mods.

 

It just seems so poorly thought out on their end. 

[Fast Jimmy]

...if they convince Bethesda or other companys to not allow modding unless its through steams service.

[Dunmer of Redoran]

Depending on how and where the assets come from, this may cause issues down the line for Valve. I'm not sure how sympathetic a larger competitor will be with Valve proper if particular modders start raiding IPs to sell mods on which Steam makes a cut on. That might lead to lawsuits against Valve itself, which seems to not be worth it given the cut they're taking on these mods.

 

It just seems so poorly thought out on their end. 

 

Exactly. They're going to make a pittance off of legitimate mods that get uploaded, but will that even be enough to pay for the staff who will have to police for unauthorized/stolen mods and mods that use data from other games?

[L. Han]

^They don't even bother policing their own store. Forget mods.

[Liamv2]

I still think sticking a big old donate button where you can just launch as much money as you want from your steam wallet would be a better option.

[Endurium]

Another reason to not use Steam mods. For most games I use Nexus; I think I use Steam only for Torchlight 2, which only allows a handful of mods anyway.

 

Have avoided "early access" and other gimmicks because I want to play a finished product, not be a paying (rather than paid) quality assurance tester.

[wicked cool]

Will this open mods for consoles as steam/bethesda have more control. Id pay for them

If you are charging will this allow increased quality control and less ctds. Id pay knowing the mod was scrubbed and was kniwn to be compatable with other mods

[Cyonan]

Will this open mods for consoles as steam/bethesda have more control. Id pay for them

If you are charging will this allow increased quality control and less ctds. Id pay knowing the mod was scrubbed and was kniwn to be compatable with other mods

 

Valve has shown in the past they have little to no interest in doing quality control on Steam. If they aren't doing it for the actual games that get put on the platform, I doubt if they're going to do it for mods.

 

The FAQ also states that it's up to the developer of the mod to fix any problems, and if they don't then you're screwed other than a 24 hour period just after purchase where you can get a refund.

 

The only increase in quality will be if the people buying the mods demand it, and don't buy mods that can be unstable.