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"[Elven] 'glory' squats in the woods and smells of halla arse." As opposed to the open sewage of cities?


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#1
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Thedas is based on Medieval Europe, correct? Medieval Europe didn't have indoor plumbing or public garbage disposal. Instead, they threw their waste out the windows into open gutters in the streets (or into cesspits within their own homes if they could afford it), and threw their garbage out the window for rats, dogs, and pigs to feast on (which in turn sh*t it out). Toward the end of the medieval era, most people also didn't believe in bathing since they thought it spread disease. Since this was before deodorant, people REEKED. (Think Con Funk, only much more potent.) Cities and towns smelled like sewage, garbage, unwashed masses, animal droppings, rotting carcasses (human and animal), and more. (While some basic attempts were made to improve sanitation and sewage odor during the 1500's, they weren't significantly reformed until the late 1800's, nor perfected until the 1900's.)

 

Now, does Thedas have indoor plumbing and/or public garbage disposal? Do they have sewage treatment plants and/or landfills to keep said sewage and garbage far out of smell and out of mind?

 

Because unless they do, Thedas cities should REEK, and Sera's constant complaining that Haven "smells of horse arse" or that the Dalish "squat in the woods an smell of halla arse," as though the city somehow smells better, should hold almost no weight.

 

Sera has also become the spokeswoman for anti-Dalish rhetoric, as people like to quote her saying, "[Elven] 'glory' squats in the woods and smells of halla arse." But you know what? Unless Thedas has indoor plumbing and public garbage disposal services to take their sewage and rubbish far out of smell and out of mind of the city, Thedas cities should smell FAR WORSE. A few dozen people occasionally taking a dump in the seclusion of the woods (where it can be buried in a hole and/or decompose naturally) before moving on would be downright FRAGRANT compared to the scent of thousands of unwashed people living in close quarters to each other for generations, dumping their daily waste and rubbish into cesspits and the open streets, and turning local rivers brown and slushy with their collective filth.

 

And you can't explain it with "It's a world of magic, so a mage did it" either because a) Andrastian human society is so mage-phobic that mages get locked up in Circles. b ) In DAO, Wynne complains of the Dog's smell, and if the Warden asks if she can't use use magic to zap the smell away, she gets stern and says something like, "That not how magic works, and you know it."

 

NOTE: I know that how people dispose of their waste isn't what most people want to think about when they fantasize about a medieval setting. I certainly don't. But if you're going to play the "Dalish elves stink because they squat in the woods" card, you better acknowledge that medieval city folk most likely don't have any more sophisticated sewage disposal than that, and that there are thousands of times more people to make the stench that much more unbearable. (Also non-pet animals inhabited medieval cities as much as rural areas; horses for transportation, cattle, pigs, goats, stray dogs, rats, etc. Some of which are seen in the City Elf Origin intro.)


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#2
Steelcan

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man you Dalish fans are almost as angry as the Dalish themselves


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#3
LOLandStuff

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Really? You made a whole post because of some random remark someone made about the Dalish and poop?


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#4
byne

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"The fictional group I identify with stinks?! NO YOU STINK!"

 

Yes, very mature.


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#5
Br3admax

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You guys are all terrible. The OP can't help that they have this much A-N-G-S-T. 


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#6
X Equestris

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I think Sera's point is that the Dalish, who constantly act smug and superior, aren't any better than anyone else.
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#7
trevelyan_shep

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There is a serious lack of human **** and garbage when wandering Thedas. Nor are there any outhouses.
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#8
lynroy

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All this **** over some ****? :huh:


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#9
Steelcan

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There is a serious lack of human **** and garbage when wandering Thedas. Nor are there any outhouses.

because humans are civilized, unlike those filthy Dalish

 

or my favorite argument on these boards "Thedas =/= Medeival Europe so you can't compare them" for all we know the human cities are actually equipped with sanitation systems

 

 

more seriously, I doubt BioWare wanted to waste time on rendering literal ****** and ****


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#10
LOLandStuff

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But the halla are graceful and intelligent animals the Dalish respect and with whom they bond, they should feel flattered. And feel super-extra-special if it's a golden halla poophole.


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#11
Wulfram

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Familiar smells are forgotten, while unusual smells stand out. So it's not unreasonable that Sera would consider rural settings to be smelly.
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#12
Reznore57

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Well Dorian talks about the "privy".

 

Spoiler

 

But anyway err...I still don't get why people are so upset about Sera and the Dalish.

I mean  reading between the line , she thinks she's stupid , she's been told all her life she was ...and people feel threatened by her opinion , why?

Besides I've played Dalish , and got along with her .I mean she calls you "stupid ".You can say "Well since you're stupid , too.I'm in good company!".And she almost high five the Inquisitor , saying opinions and such are useless anyway.


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#13
WildOrchid

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Lmao.


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#14
XEternalXDreamsX

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Anyone has seen a toilet of some sort?

#15
Mirrman70

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if Rome could have a sewage system Denerim can.


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#16
Faded

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I could have sworn a character uses the word "latrine" in the game which is some kind of sewage system...  I think it was in Haven, maybe the Loghain loyalist says something about how there are recruits eager to fight, but what they is really needed of them at this time is to have someone to clean up the latrine.  Someone in Haven may have said this.  For some reason the characters voice stuck in my head and made me look up exactly what a latrine is  :P



#17
jlb524

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#18
Reznore57

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I could have sworn a character uses the word "latrine" in the game which is some kind of sewage system...  I think it was in Haven, maybe the Loghain loyalist says something about how there are recruits eager to fight, but what they is really needed of them at this time is to have someone to clean up the latrine.  Someone in Haven may have said this.  For some reason the characters voice stuck in my head and made me look up exactly what a latrine is  :P

 

I think it's the requisition officer?

If I remember correctly she said "dig up latrines" so I assume it's just a bunch of holes in the ground.



#19
trevelyan_shep

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Latrines are holes in the ground. When I was a scout we had a latrine that was basically a hollowed out tree stump with a toilet sit put on it. It sure stunk up the area around it.
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#20
Aimi

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itt: yet another misinterpretation of "the game devs did not fully take real-world historical analogy into account" as "[thing] in game is thoroughly offensive and hypocritical by real-world historical analogy"
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#21
zambingo

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The idea that humans in the past walked around smelling like and essentially lived in their own **** is a falsehood. Conditions were absolutely different, practices primitive and even dangerous but there was order and standards.

That^ is besides Sera's point however. Sera is talking about ego and pride.
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#22
Krypplingz

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Spoiler

 

1. Merrills bathroom. I wonder if the grate leads down to Darktown. Maybe all the way to Anders clinic? It would explain why he's so mad all the time. 

2. Indoor toilets in Ferelden during the Blight. You can find this one in pretty much every home, whether it belongs to an Elf, Human or a Dwarf. 

3. Hawkes bathroom. The result is probably a smellier enchantment than usual. 

4. The Hero of Ferelden also had to dig his own latrine. 

Couldn't find an obvious toilet in Inquisition, but there were plenty of buckets around. And I think most of the houses had some doors or parts of the house you couldn't enter. And then there is always the rift. Would explain why the demons were so angry all the time.

As for sewers in Thedas. There are closed sewers in Darktown (you go there in Anders act 3 quest) and Asunder also mentions a sewer which seems to be closed tunnel with running water in it. 

 

DA:O also had two types of bathtubs. A large stone one and a small metal one. (The one in Cousland castle even had a little heating device next to it. Very nice.) I think there was one in almost every home you could visit in the game. Didn't find one in DA2. Josephine has a red metal tub in her office and the inquisitor can ask for a marble bath. And then there are tons of little bathing mentions in the game, like scrubbing behind the ears because evil gets stuck there and Isabela wondering if she needs a bath. So I don't think bathing is frowned upon in Thedas. 

There is also a book in Witch Hunt called "Bathing Practices of the Orlesian Monarchy", but no details. But the Masked Empire has this line: "The empress had bathed after the ball- she often did- and changed into a..." and later "smelled roses and honeysuckle -snip- the gentle scents of an empress's bath".

Iron Bull also mentions soaps and bathing scents if you are a Reaver. So I'd assume bathing, soap and bath scents were pretty popular in Orlais (along with perfume) so those probably dampen the city stench. Liselle in DAO, Denerim is also selling Orlesian oils and given that the noble women of Ferelden enjoy Orlesian silks, they might also like the perfumes and oils. And Sera spends most of her time stealing from nobles. So she's probably more used to their perfumed scents. (And I don't think they sell the Halla's arse perfume...but it is Orlais, so there might have been a fad...ewww)

 

So I'm pretty sure that Thedas is more superior in matters of cleanliness than Medieval Europe.

As for Sera. Eh I get where she's coming from and understand why she might feel that way. I think her point was less literal and more of what X Equestris said. And now I want to see a Tevinter public bath house...


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#23
Toasted Llama

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You do realize people can literally grow ignorant of stench, right?


When you've slept in your room with closed doors for an entire night, it REEKS, but you yourself won't smell it most likely, however others DEFINITELY will.


I think the same is for Sera, she's grown so used to the smell of Denerim she "no longer" smells it.



#24
Swaggerjking

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You do realize people can literally grow ignorant of stench, right?


When you've slept in your room with closed doors for an entire night, it REEKS, but you yourself won't smell it most likely, however others DEFINITELY will.


I think the same is for Sera, she's grown so used to the smell of Denerim she "no longer" smells it.

And why that non fereldens thinks ferelden smells like dogs 



#25
turuzzusapatuttu

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And why that non fereldens thinks ferelden smells like dogs 

 

You left out rotting garbage.


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