1591 réponses à ce sujet

[Felya87]

It's fun, so far (I'm about to play some more in a minute), but I say that straightforward comparisons between DAI and TW3 are uncalled for.

 

I mean...sure, comparisons are inevitable, since both are RPGs, but those are still two distinctly different games, both in terms of story structure and overall goal. I'm not saying that either is better or worse (or couldn't be improved or not) - I enjoy both so far - but I still don't understand why so many people on this forum (or else) want to pitch both of those giants against one another.

 

I agree. DAI and The Witcher have very little in common. I can't understand why so many what to compare the two. I don't doubt TW3 is a good game, but is not one I would buy on D1 or full price because I personally don't care for it.

[carlo angelo]

For the part I snipped, fair enough.  

 

If you're asking me personally, then actually talking to some of those doomed NPCs would have given me more of a sense of personal motivation.  BioWare can be excellent at making even smaller NPCs have a lot of character, so that would have been the time to break some of them out.  It would have also given the player a chance to get to know what's going on in general.  If they are going to start the game with the Conclave in any fashion, then I don't see how getting a feel for events is wasted.  

 

This would have been a great time to drop little hints about the past.  I mean, a lot happened in between games and it seemed like the devs had expected everyone to have read the EU.  That's silly.  For instance, I think that Wynne's death should have been mentioned in the game in some fashion.  Leliana was a friend and you'd figure she'd brought it up.  A Conclave prologue would have helped.   I mean, something like this:

 

1) "Did you hear about the White Spire mages?"

2) "I heard Lord Seeker Lambert was murdered.  No one knows who it was."

3) "I heard about a new source of lyrium in Fereldan."

4) "The templars in Kirkwall have gone mad" (This did happen, according to Vicount[ess] Hawke.)

5) "Wynne was yet another causality in this war."

 

 

Or how about little things to flesh out the character.  Maybe talk to other representatives of Dalish clans for an elven PC, for instance.  How about having a dwarven PC talking to one of his/her friends about just surface life in general.  That would have been a great time to develop small details like whether or not a dwarf had been born a surfacer or they had come up with the rest of the Carta to the surface after the Warden cleaned house.  I wouldn't mind this for all races.

 

This is just my opinion and I don't think BioWare did a bad job with their prologue.  I'm just stating the ideas I wouldn't mind for future games.   I know my idea would have added a lot more cost and development time to implement.  Something like this for later would be nice though, when they aren't focusing on 5 platforms and customizing an entire engine.  

 

I so wished something like this happened in the beginning of the game. I didn't personally have much problems with how Inquisition handled their beginning, but I think it maybe could've been a chance to craft out the world in which your player-character came from and how much they had lost in the blast. That players can better empathise with the Inquisitor-to-be because they too went through the events that brought them up to the Conclave and direct aftermath of it.

 

Before Inquisition was released, I was actually under the impression that the Conclave itself was an introductory, playable part of the game, and that it didn't start after the explosion.

 

Great.  More people who insist that all bisexual men must, upon expressing interest in a woman, immediately stand on the highest chair and shout their bisexuality to the world.  Nevermind the fact that Kaidan tells male Shepard that 'losing [him] was like losing a limb".  I can't tell you how many of my straight guy friends have told me the same thing......  I mean, the signs are all there for Kaidan.  But, whatever.

 

And round and round we go on the merry go round, huh?

 

Gosh, daveliam, didn't you know?

 

Bisexual characters. Like bisexual people in real life. Must. Make. Their. Interest. In. Both. Sexes. Apparent. From. The. Very. First. Time. You. Meet. Them.

 

Even if gaming companies are still trying to grasp writing queer characters in general at that time of their games' releases.

 

No. Exceptions.

 

Ugh, didn't they teach you anything in LGBTQ Social Studies?

[BansheeOwnage]

I wonder if they'll make Maevaris a romance, and if she'll be straight or bisexual. She appears to be straight though. My heart wants her to be an option, and it wants Bioware to make her one despite what people will say, but my brain doesn't want to see all the horribleness that will probably ensue. I'm torn. What do you think?

[AresKeith]

I wonder if they'll make Maevaris a romance, and if she'll be straight or bisexual. She appears to be straight though. My heart wants her to be an option, and it wants Bioware to make her one despite what people will say, but my brain doesn't want to see all the horribleness that will probably ensue. I'm torn. What do you think?

 

I don't think Bioware will make her a romance option if she's a companion, Mae as a romance is kind of a big risk and I feel Bioware should slowly ease into it by starting with a trans companion only first

[Grieving Natashina]

I wonder if they'll make Maevaris a romance, and if she'll be straight or bisexual. She appears to be straight though. My heart wants her to be an option, and it wants Bioware to make her one despite what people will say, but my brain doesn't want to see all the horribleness that will probably ensue. I'm torn. What do you think?

Honestly?  I think we're still a few years away from a transgendered romance.  Please bare in mind how of those more vocal minority of guys can't handle having a LI with short hair and more square features.  Some of those can't even handle the fact that Krem exists.  The last thing we'd need is the "trap" slur being thrown around.  To be blunt, I think more of the gaming community needs to grow up more.    I can't see something like that happening until at least DA5 (so around 6-8 years or so,) and it wouldn't be Mae.

 

Also, she's a fairly recent widow of one of Varric's cousins (~2 years ago, according to the timeline.)  Between that and dealing with the any leftover Venatori, I can't conceive of her as a LI.  However, she is a fan favorite, so I could certainly see her as a party member in the next game.  

[BansheeOwnage]

I don't think Bioware will make her a romance option if she's a companion, Mae as a romance is kind of a big risk and I feel Bioware should slowly ease into it by starting with a trans companion only first

Honestly?  I think we're still a few years away from a transgendered romance.  Please bare in mind how of those more vocal minority of guys can't handle having a LI with short hair and more square features.  Some of those can't even handle the fact that Krem exists.  The last thing we'd need is the "trap" slur being thrown around.  To be blunt, I think more of the gaming community needs to grow up more.    I can't see something like that happening until at least DA5, and it wouldn't be Mae.

 

Also, she's a fairly recent widow of one of Varric's cousins (~2 years ago, according to the timeline.)  Between that and dealing with the any leftover Venatori, I can't conceive of her as a LI.  However, she is a fan favorite, so I could certainly see her as a party member in the next game.  

Yeah, she'll probably just be a companion and her being a recent widow is indeed more than enough reason not to be a romance. Still, people depress me. Tongue-in-cheek though, those people might find Mae more feminine than Cass

[daveliam]

I've thought about the Mae as a love interest question before.  I'm pretty sure that she'll end up in whatever game that first takes place in Tevinter.  I think they've already started laying the groundwork for that with her War Table missions and set her up as an ally of Dorian's.  I'm not sure if she'll end up being a companion or not, but I wouldn't be surprised if she was.  Either way, with NPC romances, she could be on the table as an LI.

 

I'm not sure how I feel about it.  On one hand, I'd love to see her as an LI as she's super interesting and popular and I think it would be interesting to see a transwoman as an LI.  On the other hand, I'm not really interested in yet another LI suffering from Carth Syndrome.  Plus, I shudder to think what the reaction would be if one of the LI's for straight men was a transwoman.  People lost minds over the fact that Cassandra has a strong jawline.  I could only imagine what would happen if one of their options was trans. 

 

One solution could be to have her as an 'extra option' (as in, let's say everyone gets 2 options; Mae would be a Sebastian-like 'extra option' for straight guys), but that also doesn't feel right because it feels a bit like marginalizing transwomen as 'other options'. 

 

If it were up to me, I'd like to see Mae show up as a companion in Tevinter and leave it at that.  But, if she were an LI, I would totally break my rule and role a straight male dwarf to romance her.  For sure. 

[carlo angelo]

Laverne Cox to voice Maevaris.

 

And I'd love to see her take on a larger role in the next game, whether as a companion or even as an advisor type NPC like Josephine or Cullen.

 

Just be there, physically present and all.

[BansheeOwnage]

One solution could be to have her as an 'extra option' (as in, let's say everyone gets 2 options; Mae would be a Sebastian-like 'extra option' for straight guys), but that also doesn't feel right because it feels a bit like marginalizing transwomen as 'other options'.

I was just thinking about this, and my thoughts more of less went the same way. They could have 3 options for straight males, but I can't really see a way to do that without coming off as insulting, like you said.

[AresKeith]

Laverne Cox to voice Maevaris.

 

And I'd love to see her take on a larger role in the next game, whether as a companion or even as an advisor type NPC like Josephine or Cullen.

 

Just be there, physically present and all.

 

Well if Mae becomes a major NPC over companion then I vote Calpernia to take her place

[AresKeith]

One solution could be to have her as an 'extra option' (as in, let's say everyone gets 2 options; Mae would be a Sebastian-like 'extra option' for straight guys), but that also doesn't feel right because it feels a bit like marginalizing transwomen as 'other options'. 

 

I was just thinking about this, and my thoughts more of less went the same way. They could have 3 options for straight males, but I can't really see a way to do that without coming off as insulting, like you said.

 

Yea it's pretty much a double edge sword on this part

 

You'd also have complaints about one group having more options than the others..... again

[Grieving Natashina]

I've thought about the Mae as a love interest question before.  I'm pretty sure that she'll end up in whatever game that first takes place in Tevinter.  I think they've already started laying the groundwork for that with her War Table missions and set her up as an ally of Dorian's.  I'm not sure if she'll end up being a companion or not, but I wouldn't be surprised if she was.  Either way, with NPC romances, she could be on the table as an LI.

 

I'm not sure how I feel about it.  On one hand, I'd love to see her as an LI as she's super interesting and popular and I think it would be interesting to see a transwoman as an LI.  On the other hand, I'm not really interested in yet another LI suffering from Carth Syndrome.  Plus, I shudder to think what the reaction would be if one of the LI's for straight men was a transwoman.  People lost minds over the fact that Cassandra has a strong jawline.  I could only imagine what would happen if one of their options was trans. 

 

One solution could be to have her as an 'extra option' (as in, let's say everyone gets 2 options; Mae would be a Sebastian-like 'extra option' for straight guys), but that also doesn't feel right because it feels a bit like marginalizing transwomen as 'other options'. 

 

If it were up to me, I'd like to see Mae show up as a companion in Tevinter and leave it at that.  But, if she were an LI, I would totally break my rule and role a straight male dwarf to romance her.  For sure. 

Why the hell did I run out of likes just now?

 

As always, well said dave.  I should have considered Carth Syndrome as a possible factor.  I agree that a transgendered companion would be interesting, but yeah, the level of disgusting crap that could come out of this is pretty staggering.  Right now, we're living in a tricky place with folks crying "catering" among those that are going, "our money matters too."

 

My problem with having her as an "extra" option is that it still wouldn't change the comments.  You and I both still giggle at the folks that complain about the Anders romance.  You know, the ones that hit all the flirt options and then claimed that Anders "shoved his sexuality down their throat."  I'm also leery of having people show up and make comments like, "I banged Mae.  I'm a real freak."  As far as marginalization, I should have thought of that.  You're right though, and despite the good intentions I know that BioWare would have, it could certainly be seen that way.

 

Personally, I think that Mae is going to be our last "intro" to Tevinter before we go there.  Meaning, I don't think we'll end up in Par Vollen/Tevinter just yet.  I could see the devs focusing on more of the coastal cities, like Rivain and Antiva.  Dorian provided a look into Tevinter culture that didn't neatly fit into to the idea that all Tevinters are evil blood mages.  I think Mae is going to continue that trend, and give us even more insights into the country before we go there in DA5 or later.  That's just my take on it.  I could be right, like I was with Cory or I could be dead wrong, like I was with Blackwall. 

 

My other concern is that, regardless if she's an LI or not, her quest is going to focus around her dead husband.  Since I know it's not too late, writers and developers of the DA team, please don't do this if you decide to include her in the next game. 

[AresKeith]

My other concern is that, regardless if she's an LI or not, her quest is going to focus around her dead husband.  Since I know it's not too late, writers and developers of the DA team, please don't do this if you decide to include her in the next game. 

 

Well they kinda already touch on it in the comic, so I doubt they'll do it all over again

[BansheeOwnage]

 

My other concern is that, regardless if she's an LI or not, her quest is going to focus around her dead husband.  Since I know it's not too late, writers and developers of the DA team, please don't do this if you decide to include her in the next game. 

Just curious, why would that specifically be bad?

[daveliam]

It's just been done to death.  There have been so many of these characters that it has it's own name:  Carth Syndrome.

 

Jaheira, Carth, Sky, Thane, Steve.  I'm ready to take a break from that storyline.

[Grieving Natashina]

Just curious, why would that specifically be bad?

It's overdone by BioWare.  It seems like, if there's a dead wife or husband, the writers are going make that the focus of the quest.  Personally, it doesn't tell me a lot about the person they are now.  Sure, a person's past is a part of them, but I'd rather see what drives them in the present.  I'm also a little sick of playing Therapist Hero.  It was much better in this game than it has been in the past, but usually dead spouse = we have to nurse them through it.  

 

I think it's actually kinda a cheap way to do character development in general.  Widow(ers) aren't always defined by their spouse dying.  For some, that could be a way to move forward.  It's okay if they honor the dead spouse in some small way, but when it's the focus of the personal quest it is too much.

[AresKeith]

Wouldn't it be called the Jaheira Syndrome since she had it first

[Grieving Natashina]

Wouldn't it be called the Jaheira Syndrome since she had it first

Carth Syndrome rolls off of the tongue easier.

 

You did have an excellent point about the comics.  Hopefully with that story resolved in the EU, it won't be the focus of the quest.  However, I'd love to hear Mae talk about her late husband.  Maybe that would help the idea that gender identity and sexual identity aren't linked, at least a little bit.  I take the small victories wherever I can get them.  

[BansheeOwnage]

Thanks, people. I guess that hadn't occurred to me because I've only seen Thane and Steve. I'll concede Steve, but I thought Thane's story had a lot more to do with his son than his wife.

Carth Syndrome rolls off of the tongue easier.

 

You did have an excellent point about the comics.  Hopefully with that story resolved in the EU, it won't be the focus of the quest.  However, I'd love to hear Mae talk about her late husband.  Maybe that would help the idea that gender identity and sexual identity aren't linked, at least a little bit.  I take the small victories wherever I can get them.  

I'll take some small victories too. Hmm, considering making a joke about how that sounds like I'm buying stuff, but eh, I can't think of one.

[Panda]

That isn't true

 

Well isn't that detailed reply with great arguements how it isn't true

 

It sure seems to be true. When Bioware did DAI they seemed to focus full-steam on open world cutting defined PC, story and quests in the process. They took criticism of DA2 in to heart and forgot what was praised in that game. All the open world games I have played haven't had very defined PC's either and have been lacking in story department, since coherent and strong story seems to be hard to implement in the game that has open world.

[AresKeith]

Well isn't that detailed reply with great arguements how it isn't true

 

It sure seems to be true. When Bioware did DAI they seemed to focus full-steam on open world cutting defined PC, story and quests in the process. They took criticism of DA2 in to heart and forgot what was praised in that game. All the open world games I have played haven't had very defined PC's either and have been lacking in story department, since coherent and strong story seems to be hard to implement in the game that has open world.

 

The Witcher 3 disproves this claim that open world causes the story to suffer

 

Bioware's issue was that they stretched themselves too thin from resources to the fact that had make the game work on both next-gen and last-gen (which did hurt them)

[DSiKn355]

Is a character like Nathan Drake. No more, no less. For me, games with a set protagonist aren't RPGs, but adventures with RPG elements in them.

 

Sorry but that makes no sense.

 

Role playing is playing a role. This could be a set role to play "Hi my name is commander Shepard" or it can be a user created role "Hi my name is .... "

But both are still a role that you play.

 

 

It's fun, so far (I'm about to play some more in a minute), but I say that straightforward comparisons between DAI and TW3 are uncalled for.

 

I mean...sure, comparisons are inevitable, since both are RPGs, but those are still two distinctly different games, both in terms of story structure and overall goal. I'm not saying that either is better or worse (or couldn't be improved or not) - I enjoy both so far - but I still don't understand why so many people on this forum (or else) want to pitch both of those giants against one another.

 

Same reason we did.

 

The comparison of an open world game created with  a new engine and the outcome quality of the game.

 

"Why couldn't BioWare do as good?" blah blah blah etc etc etc.

 

 

Gosh, daveliam, didn't you know?

 

Bisexual characters. Like bisexual people in real life. Must. Make. Their. Interest. In. Both. Sexes. Apparent. From. The. Very. First. Time. You. Meet. Them.

 

Even if gaming companies are still trying to grasp writing queer characters in general at that time of their games' releases.

 

No. Exceptions.

 

Ugh, didn't they teach you anything in LGBTQ Social Studies?

 

I preferred the opposite in games lol.

 

But in real life if you are in a relationship with someone shouldn't you tell them? Or will it be your secret for the duration of the relationship?

 

I wonder if they'll make Maevaris a romance, and if she'll be straight or bisexual. She appears to be straight though. My heart wants her to be an option, and it wants Bioware to make her one despite what people will say, but my brain doesn't want to see all the horribleness that will probably ensue. I'm torn. What do you think?

 

No that wouldn't be a good idea as the feedback from players would be disgusting.

 

You players that see yourselves as members of the LGBTQ would flip out at the responses I think.

 

I mean you can see how some feel about BI people "letting their selves be known beforehand" right?

Now imagine the response to a straight guy romancing what he believes to be a female and then it guts to the romance scene and he sees it's a guy....

Ouch.

 

That Jerry Springer moment lol.

 

No it would cause mayhem I think tbh.

[Panda]

The Witcher 3 disproves this claim that open world causes the story to suffer

 

Bioware's issue was that they stretched themselves too thin from resources to the fact that had make the game work on both next-gen and last-gen (which did hurt them)

 

Well if Witcher 3 is some kind of miracle game that makes it happen then good for them. I haven't played it so I wouldn't know. Also it doesn't disaprove it, it just means that someone finally has made it work, not sacrificing either.

 

I really doubt that was the issue since last-gen surely doesn't limit story and defined PC's since those doesn't take much power from the machine to have good story and defined PC. It should have limited open world and graphics. It doesn't seem like it did even that, more like new-gen graphics were slapped to old gen and wondered why there is so much problems with textures. Oh well. I would say that the problem might have been in the starting process though, deciding cross-gen game and then deciding to have open world and nice graphics of cource those drain most resources when you have to make them work cross-gen consoles and then PC's with tons of different hard- and softwares.

[AresKeith]

Well if Witcher 3 is some kind of miracle game that makes it happen then good for them. I haven't played it so I wouldn't know. Also it doesn't disaprove it, it just means that someone finally has made it work, not sacrificing either.

 

...Which disproves it

 

I really doubt that was the issue since last-gen surely doesn't limit story and defined PC's since those doesn't take much power from the machine to have good story and defined PC. It should have limited open world and graphics. It doesn't seem like it did even that, more like new-gen graphics were slapped to old gen and wondered why there is so much problems with textures. Oh well. I would say that the problem might have been in the starting process though, deciding cross-gen game and then deciding to have open world and nice graphics of cource those drain most resources when you have to make them work cross-gen consoles and then PC's with tons of different hard- and softwares.

 

Which is why I said resources and technically, DAI's story was meant to be longer but due to cut content and having to rework the story they stretched their resources too thin

 

Have you see the last-gen graphics compared to new-gen? They are very different and limited, the current state of DAI pushed the last-gen consoles way past their limits and I heard some consoles even died from it

[midnight tea]

Same reason we did.

 

The comparison of an open world game created with  a new engine and the outcome quality of the game.

 

"Why couldn't BioWare do as good?" blah blah blah etc etc etc.

 

 

It's hard to compare things like quality in areas that are hardly comparable, which makes terms like "quality" an empty word if nobody took time to establish what this 'quality' is really about.

 

Graphics or quest design - sure, have at it, but even things like quests have different goals or objectives, overall. I'm not saying that experience can't be improved in DAI, but more than a few times I've seen people misrepresent what was in game entirely, while over-exaggerating how meticulously-crafted quests in Witcher are (a lot of them are really nice, but after doing quite a few myself I already see a recognizable - and relatively predictable - design pattern).

 

I also don't really think graphics are really an issue - both games look stunning, next-gen or no. What really amuses me though is that suddenly all the people who complained that "Inquisition is too bight and colorful" suddenly got silent... possibly because Witcher offers some beautiful vistas and excellent (and vibrant) color palette as well.

 

(though I have to say, I laughed so hard when I finally donned a higher level armor I crafted for Geralt, with what looks frills around the hips from a distance, not to mention an astonishingly red cord accentuating waist and shoulders that at first I took for roses... Geralt, you look a bit like a ballerina! xD)