56 réponses à ce sujet

[GunnersaurusRex]

Was busier with other stuff than I expected this weekend – the remaining male parts are now modelled, but I still need to do the textures.

 

 

Indeed. Xalta'rs is the one I was talking about, and you're correct on Ragnarok's torso as well. I actually have a mix and match anatomy made out of those two as well as some of the models in Q I believe... I think Project Q had rounder, smaller feet for both genders. Sorry I couldn't provide more info on all these pieces and projects, but I am glad you found them. I haven't actually messed or played with NWN in a long time. You could also check some full body models Zwerkules released some time ago. They were naked women. Old Time Radio also shared some naked female bodies, as robes. Hope this helps!

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Using robes as the body and body parts as clothing is an interesting approach and means that you don't get the seams that you do with ordinary body parts. However, as far as I'm aware, it'd likely have clipping issues with all clothing not specifically designed for it (which includes...well, everything), which makes it a bit of a non-starter for what I'm trying to do.

 

 

I'd echo the support for more variation - if that doesn't make the project scope unmanageable.

 

Since most of the less heroic, more varied body shapes are going to be NPCs, perhaps they could be done as clothing?

 

I'm using some custom phenotypes at present, but that approach requires duplicating all the robes etc, which is getting to be a chore.

 

Yeah, variations are something I can look at once the 'base version' is done.

 

What do you mean by doing them 'as clothing'? Since they're PC parts, they essentially are just clothing with model number 001. Or did you mean as opposed to custom phenotypes? If so, yes, I'd do any variation as another PC part on the normal phenotype. Much as custom phenotypes for different heights and body shapes would be fun, I simply don't have time (though I will do a version for the default 'large' phenotype).

 

can we please get a cheesecake free ver?

 

If you mean one wearing something more substantial than underwear, absolutely. Once I've done a base body done for all the races and the large pheno, that's the plan. The screenshot I posted in the 'Small Details' CCC thread showing the books has a character with some trousers I made using these models (and some boots, though I did those before I started). The leather armour she's wearing (at least that's what it's meant to be – I didn't finish the texture) is actually what persuaded me to make this thing. It shows some skin around the neck and shoulders, and I didn't like the way it looked when I just used Bioware's model and texture for those parts. So I made my own to use as a base – the reason the base textures are so bare is so people can use them to make anything they want.

 

I just realized a little detail on the vanilla model or texture: it has fake ambient occlusipn via vertex colors or probably imprinted on the texture, underneath the chin, hair (the whole neck actually), buttcheeks, on the inside of the hand and a bit beneath the breasts. Food for thought?

 

Yeah, it's part of the texture. Mine does have some (on the female, look on the neck under the chin and on the sides of the torso where the arms would be casting shadows), but it's a bit more subtle than on the Bioware versions. It was more pronounced when I first created the textures, but I preferred the look when I toned it down a bit, in part because it allowed for a smoother transition at the seams.

 

Everyone likes it if there is equal representation... you know with display pics like that you guys are making it EXTREMELY HARD not to agree with the feminist movement in regards to body image discrimination.

 

don't make me bring up what happened with finalfantasy game was not really mentioned ? female gamers are finally GIVEN ONE male protagonist in a cute sexy outfit (and its not even that bad if you consider it) and you men have to whine and ruin it.... can we at least agree if your showing off skin alterations it needs to focus on the skin and not a cheesecake on one end and a guy with pants and boots on the other?

 

The image display comes off as sexist on one end a chick in just a skimpy thong bikini (lets be honest no female good aligned priest warrior or ranger would ever be cough dead in vs man in black lather pants and boots? your making it really hard to not see it as sexist to be honest just saying.

 

also I hope Square enix returns the design for the male protagonist back to normal just to say something mean to complainers. they know they have more then enough female fans to make it a success; this doesn't count the male fans with enough manliness not to be effected by a  characters not even very revealing wardrobe.

 

can we just get a better reorientation of how the skins are please and preferably a version where it does not involve canning the original "no armor" appearance on display please and thankyou.

 

Er...did you actually read the thread before posting this? I have already explained that the reason the male has only one screenshot and still has trousers on is because I have not finished the model and texture for his pelvis and legs yet. I will post them when they are complete and don't you worry, he will be wearing underpants. The whole point of the texture is to give an alternative appearance to the skin, which other things can then be built around.

[Jedijax]

Oh no! I didn't mean you checked the system of bodies as robes to replicate it or adopt it. I meant you could check up those body proportions and model to tune-up or get some inspiration, or even break them down.

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[kuronue bloodlust]

YA basically!

You can see the texture difference on the female but the male not so much Also as mentioned before your making it really hard not to see it as sexist with the man in a pair of pants with boots and the lady in a thong bikini.barefoot.

 

It's stunts like this put into the CEP by PRC that made a huge number of female players, builders, and script writers quit. This was suppose to be a game where they could get away form it lets agree that if we do strip-downs for skins the obligation is to try to keep it fair in presentation if only to display the skins properly so the alterations can be seen.

 

and player update (nwnx and CEP) that any additions to the game must be gender equal or gender neutral no favor to male or female preference in nudity and/or outfit sexiness its bad enough lades sexy outfits are called out constantly and nothing is done but one male sexy outfit (form FFXV if I'm not mistaken) gets made and BAM it has to be changed because its too sexy.

 

you saw my links you saw the original on the bottom too the but was covered I WISH WE LADIES GOT THAT CURTSY WITH OUR SEXY GAME REPRESENTATIONS.

 

come on dude your showing off the base skin edits so SHOW US THE GUYS EDITS.

 

or does a male with no cloths on make you unnconfertable? oh poor baby we women have to deal with it daily ON ADS MADE TO ATTRACT OUR SALES NO LESS (not even for underwear btw) get over it!

[Thayan]

Gunner, I'd just like to say that you're doing a great job and to simply ignore the troll. Maybe it's the language barrier, I dunno, but she obviously is not getting what has been written in plain English multiple times. The rest of us do understand that you can't display something that isn't finished. Regardless, the models look very impressive even at this early stage.

[The Mad Poet]

I really like the male body parts. They look fantastic so far. I can't wait to see what you do with the legs. The male NWN body has always looked rather awkward and blocky for me. Especially around the wrists and the ankles/calves. They seriously look too Lincoln Log like to me. Your models actually taper like wrists should.

 

As far as the female body goes are the comparative shots from slightly different angles? I love the arms and legs, they look amazing, but the chest and pelvis look to me like they're at a different angle compared to the original, or perhaps are different in size. EG... breasts look to be at a lower location, the overall size of the chest model seems smaller, and the back part of her pelvis seems to go down lower than the original. That could just be the angle of the pic though, or was that a design decision? Not a complaint at all... just an observation. I'm not a modeler so... take my observations as being as layman as possible.

 

Overall I'm very impressed.

[3RavensMore]

--- Deleted by poster.

[meaglyn]

. EG... breasts look to be at a lower location, the overall size of the chest model seems smaller, and the back part of her pelvis seems to go down lower than the original. That could just be the angle of the pic though, or was that a design decision? Not a complaint at all...

 

 

 

 

None of us are as young as we used to be

[The Mad Poet]

 

 

None of us are as young as we used to be

 

 

LOL... Well considering that NWN is what... 13 years old now shouldn't the models just be hitting puberty?

[Tarot Redhand]

LOL... Well considering that NWN is what... 13 years old now shouldn't the models just be hitting puberty?

 

Using that logic Superman & Batman should be in retirement homes. Speaking of homes Sherlock should have been dust decades ago...

 

TR

[GunnersaurusRex]

I really like the male body parts. They look fantastic so far. I can't wait to see what you do with the legs. The male NWN body has always looked rather awkward and blocky for me. Especially around the wrists and the ankles/calves. They seriously look too Lincoln Log like to me. Your models actually taper like wrists should.

 

As far as the female body goes are the comparative shots from slightly different angles? I love the arms and legs, they look amazing, but the chest and pelvis look to me like they're at a different angle compared to the original, or perhaps are different in size. EG... breasts look to be at a lower location, the overall size of the chest model seems smaller, and the back part of her pelvis seems to go down lower than the original. That could just be the angle of the pic though, or was that a design decision? Not a complaint at all... just an observation. I'm not a modeler so... take my observations as being as layman as possible.

 

Overall I'm very impressed.

 

Didn't notice this comment earlier, sorry.

 

Yeah, the angles of the shots are slightly different. They're screenshots from the creature editor in the toolset, so I had to rotate them by clicking and dragging and as a result the angle isn't exactly as precise as I'd like. I suspect this accounts for most of the size/angle differences you're seeing as the chest and pelvis are pretty much the same size as the Bioware ones. The Bioware models are actually in the mdl as well as my own – they're unrendered, so you don't actually see them in-game, but they do the shadowcasting instead of my models. This is an attempt to limit any performance impact from having a higher-poly mesh (according to the ccg wiki, shadowcasting is quite CPU intense on higher-poly models). However, their presence is also quite useful in scaling the body parts. As for the angle on the chest and pelvis, the models (both mine and Bioware's) are actually completely untilted when in Blender. It's NWN which adds a tilt to the torso and pelvis, so any difference between mine and Bioware's in that respect must be due to the slight differences in the angle at which I positioned the models for the screenshots. The angle/shape of the breast is different – that's a design decision based mainly on the references I was using, in order to try and give the impression of weight/gravity and attempt to get a more natural shape from the extra polygons.

 

 

Gunner, I'd just like to say that you're doing a great job and to simply ignore the troll. Maybe it's the language barrier, I dunno, but she obviously is not getting what has been written in plain English multiple times. The rest of us do understand that you can't display something that isn't finished. Regardless, the models look very impressive even at this early stage.

 

Heh, yeah. Don't know how much more I could clarify that the male wasn't finished and that the underwear is not meant as a replacement for the Bioware one, but to allow the new skin texture to be shown as much as possible. It was drawn in about five minutes and is literally the least important thing there, though I now suspect the comments are part of some sort of (really weird) wind-up than a genuine misunderstanding. But for anyone actually interested, when it comes to actually reworking/making clothes with the models the 001 texture would have something less modern-looking on it than in the screenshots here.

 

 

Anyway, finally got the male human to a semi-complete state. The texturing took me longer than on the female, as I was trying to show more muscle definition (for example, you can see the transition between three muscles of the quadraceps on the male thigh, while the female one is smoother). Was going for a little more subtlety than the Bioware textures – in part because my models have more polygons to share the load. Think I may have gone a little bit too far with that on the male legs (did most of the texturing last night as I stayed up to watch the election results come in, so may have been a little sleep-deprived when I got to the calves) Fortunately, it's quite easy for me to make different parts more prominent on the textures if necessary.

 

 

 

 

 

As well as shrinking down the biceps a little, I made the neck (and the area at the top of the torso it connects to) a little darker, to give the impression of the shadow cast by the head. This also gives less of a disconnect between my neck texture and the top of the Bioware torso texture, should they be used together. Ideally, I'd like to have made the male thighs and shins a little bit larger, but to do so in a way that avoided clipping distorted the shape of the model more than I was happy with, so for the moment it is as you see above.

 

Still need to test a little more thoroughly and possibly fine-tune things a little to minimise clipping with other clothing parts, but once that's done I'll move onto the next stage – adjusting the models for the other races/large phenotype.

[Killmonger]

 

Excellent progress GRex !!!

 

No misunderstandings here.

Your good works in this regard will always be appreciated by the community at large.

 

<applause>

 

 

So, moving forward,

 

Hands. Could we also have a textured open hand002?

Necks. A very muscular man's neck is connected to his torso more massively than average.

            also Eve's neck is different than Adam's (without a lot of words required)

Belts. A sublime opportunity............         

          Fatness or belly could be a belt type.   (Pregnancy too)

          also, there are a few anatomical elements that might be useful, breathing for example...

 

 

What ever you are up for GRex, me too!

Just now, really lookin forward to seeing that 1000 poly geometry go !

 

<returning from mongering, only briefly>

 

 

.....

 

Hey, <just a passing notion, all....

Could facial expressions (or mouth, eyelash movement) be a head oriented vfx?

[henesua]

My recommendations are to nudge the nipples in on the male, and on both male and female textures to add a little more shading (or to work on shading groups on the model) so that there is some definition to the musculature.

 

Even though the old models are blocky, the high contrast shading works well for a cartoony body. Everything reads. I'm not saying for you to use an equally high contrast texture, but a little more shading would really help with the body definition.

[Gruftlord]

Awesome male model! (had you given him a thong, everyone would be happy ). I second what henesua said, and also wouldn't mind some subtle body hair on the male (forearms, legs and maybe slightly chest).

[3RavensMore]

Awesome male model! (had you given him a thong, everyone would be happy ). I second what henesua said, and also wouldn't mind some subtle body hair on the male (forearms, legs and maybe slightly chest).

 

Just so you remember that elves are hairless.  ---blinks---  Or so I've heard. 

[Gruftlord]

this is not an elf though. It would only be a concern, if the two shared the same texture.

[3RavensMore]

this is not an elf though. It would only be a concern, if the two shared the same texture.

 

I was joking, Gruftlord.    That said, I didn't notice the horns until just now.  What you done so far looks great.  . 

[GunnersaurusRex]

Been away for a few days but thanks for the feedback again. I've been working on reducing clipping today. Just a few very small changes to the models. The female shoulder has been lowered slightly, and the male one has been shrunk to avoid clipping with a few of the shoulder parts. The male buttocks have been shrunk to avoid clipping with several belts. Also did a quick bit of testing with some of the CEP stuff – looks promising so far.

 

 

So, moving forward,

 

Hands. Could we also have a textured open hand002?

Necks. A very muscular man's neck is connected to his torso more massively than average.

            also Eve's neck is different than Adam's (without a lot of words required)

Belts. A sublime opportunity............         

          Fatness or belly could be a belt type.   (Pregnancy too)

          also, there are a few anatomical elements that might be useful, breathing for example...

 

 

Yeah, I'll do a couple of model variations for the hands – both open palm and closed fist. Should be useful for monks (and anyone else who wants a bare-knuckle brawl). The reason the fingers are flexed in the shape they are for the model in the screenshot is to allow weapons (or other objects) to be held without clipping or looking silly. The trouble with making lots of variant versions of the models is that when it comes to putting clothing on them, either just the main variant of the model would be used, or another model would be required for each variant (and I think there's a limit of 255 for each body part). However, this isn't so much of an issue with the hands as they're often uncovered anyway.

 

Using the belt model to add a belly is a very good idea for the large phenotype. Since the large phenotype uses the same textures as the normal one, it'd be difficult to avoid appearing slightly ridiculous when modifying the muscular normal torso model to try and look overweight without changing the texture. Having a belt just overlay the belly of the torso would allow a different texture to be used, at the cost of adding an extra seam. Again, it'd not really work when adding clothing, but since the main point of doing it would be the texture, it wouldn't really matter when it was covered up as long as it was pretty much the same size. At least you'd be able to simulate the crowd at a Newcastle match, should you have the inclination (yes, perhaps not the best example for a fantasy RPG, but it was the only scenario I could think of renowned for a large number of fat guys getting together with no shirts on).

 

I'll have another look at the male neck as well.

 

My recommendations are to nudge the nipples in on the male, and on both male and female textures to add a little more shading (or to work on shading groups on the model) so that there is some definition to the musculature.

 

Even though the old models are blocky, the high contrast shading works well for a cartoony body. Everything reads. I'm not saying for you to use an equally high contrast texture, but a little more shading would really help with the body definition.

 

Yeah, good point about the nipple – actually meant to change that earlier but forgot. Will do it now. I'll play around with the contrast and layer opacity as well (at the moment, each texture has a load of different layers of shading each at around 20% opacity) to try and get something that looks a little more defined.

 

Awesome male model! (had you given him a thong, everyone would be happy ).

 

Heh, I had half a mind to put him in a mankini...

 

I second what henesua said, and also wouldn't mind some subtle body hair on the male (forearms, legs and maybe slightly chest).

 

Just so you remember that elves are hairless.  ---blinks---  Or so I've heard. 

 

Joke though it may have been, they actually do use the same texture - I guess Bioware wanted to avoid replicating the textures seven times for each body part. So any racial variations would have to be different body parts (which could be used by any race). Perhaps some hobbit-style feet might be useful.

 

Thanks again for the suggestions and positive comments everyone.

[The Mad Poet]

I say go for the hairy elf look. They need to grow up anyway. 

[Gruftlord]

But you can add different textures for your own models, no need to stick to the limited vanilla texture setup, right?

[GunnersaurusRex]

For the human, sure, but it doesn't seem possible to make textures different for the same body part on other races. For example, the name for the normal male human chest model is pmh0_chest001.mdl, and its corresponding texture is pmh0_chest001.plt. I modify either of these, you get the result in the screenshot above. However, the name for the corresponding elf model is pme0_chest001.mdl. There's no corresponding texture – it just uses pmh0_chest001.plt. If I create a separate texture called pme0_chest001.plt it doesn't override the human one on the elf model – the game just ignores it. Regardless, I'll likely have a go at adding some subtle body hair for the male at some point.

 

Anyway, rescaling to fit the other races is progressing pretty well – I'm reasonably happy with all of them except the gnome. I never really noticed it before but the default gnome has some very odd looking anatomy...

 

 

 

 

Upper legs like a flamingo, then ballooning out below the knee, and arms to match. Will try to use the extra polygons on mine to make the transition a little less stark. Makes one wonder who the original inspiration was...

 

 

 

[Gruftlord]

the texture name can be found somewhere in the mesh (if you open an uncompressed model in a text editor), there you can add a new name, and then generate a custom texture for that model.

[Zwerkules]

the texture name can be found somewhere in the mesh (if you open an uncompressed model in a text editor), there you can add a new name, and then generate a custom texture for that model.

It doesn't work that way for body parts. Gunnersaurus is right, for the chest it's always pmh0_chest001.plt that will be used. You can change the name of the human chest model, but then it won't be an override any more.

There are ways to make the game use an TGA instead of the plt, but that won't help in this case either.

So if you want hairy feet for halflings, they have to be extra models and can't be an override.

[Gruftlord]

i see. thanks for the correction.

[GunnersaurusRex]

Today I played around with the shading a bit. On the left are the Bioware default models, in the middle the ones I posted in the initial screenshots, and on the right the shots taken after I'd made a few adjustments (mainly to try and improve muscle definition).

 

 

 

As you can see, the change is much more significant on the male than the female, in large part as I was less subtle with the light/shadows on the female in the first place. Still, I think that the new female does look better than before, particularly at the arms, knees and feet. The male just looks better all round, and now the body is slightly lighter it fits better with the heads than it did before.

[Tonden_Ockay]

WoW " GunnersaurusRex "really nice work. Do you really know the impact this could have on the game? Character models was the number one complaint I keep hearing about NWN1. The work you are doing sooooo many people will use for years to come.

 

I just want to tank you for all the time and hard work you are putting into this project. I know I for one can't wait to use this. I think I may be able to drag some friends into playing NWN1 with this as well.

 

Keep up the great work.