122 réponses à ce sujet

[Lumix19]

@Sifr
 
I admire your determination.

As do I, it's practically superhuman.

[zestalyn]

I find it hard to imagine the Knight Enchanter specialization being taught to young Circle mages. If there had always been a significant number of Circle mages possessing that kind of immense power, successful rebellions would have happened over and over again cause based on DA:I gameplay, KE > everything including templars

[TheKomandorShepard]

I find it hard to imagine the Knight Enchanter specialization being taught to young Circle mages. If there had always been a significant number of Circle mages possessing that kind of immense power, successful rebellions would have happened over and over again cause based on DA:I gameplay, KE > everything including templars

Well it is doubtful considering that KC fights in direct combat what gives templar edge, then templar takes away KC mana and poor bastard is facing templar in close combat without his tricks.

[Lumix19]

Well it is doubtful considering that KC fights in direct combat what gives templar edge, then templar takes away KC mana and poor bastard is facing templar in close combat without his tricks.

Doubtful.

[TheKomandorShepard]

Doubtful.

Hm ,why?

[Lumix19]

Hm ,why?

.is Templar the powerful how and has Mage the mana much how on depends it ,Mage a of mana the all away take t'can Templar single a Because

[Sifr]

Do you even read what you write?

 

a)It isn't called Knight Enchanter , it is called Arcane Warrior and yes it have same skillset that KC , if he was KC and Arcane warrior would be something different he would be called Knight Enchanter ,not to mention description of that character (and many other things that i pointed in you know which post).  

 

You just called them the same thing.

 

WTH x2? Do you even know what contradiction is? How the heck me saying that Arcane Warriors are the same as Knight Enchanters now ,thus different than they were in dao (what in that scenario means they have changed in current game what what specialization was in previous game ,in other words such thing is called retcon) is contradiction?

 

Of course I know what it means, do you?

 

If the Arcane Warriors are now Knight Enchanters as you claim and different from how they were in Origns, then that's not a retcon. You said earlier that as a retcon, that meant the Arcane Warriors now have always been the same as Knight Enchanters... hence, you have contradicted yourself.

 

Not only me but also game ,unless you want to tell me that "Dalish who's more of a cosplayer than anything else" hacked the game to claim he is arcane warrior and well wiki claims that too   (i know wiki is well questionable ,but it seems that there is another person that claims that as well , so not only me yay!)

 

And you have once again you've missed the point, not that I'm entirely surprised?

 

Cillian doesn't count because while he calls himself an Arcane Warrior and multiplayer refers to him by that title, but he's clearly not one. His backstory makes that abundantly clear, as have I repeatedly, while trying to explain this concept to you?

 

You know how at Disneyland you can meet Mickey Mouse, he's called Mickey Mouse and he's even advertised as such? Well, about that. I hate to be the one to tell you, but it's not really him, it's actually just someone in a costume.

 

Cillian is Mickey in this scenario? Also Galaxy Quest wasn't a historical documentary, no-one is trapped on Gilligan's Island and don't fear, Bruce Willis isn't really a ghost that only Haley Joel Osment can see?

 

[raging_monkey]

Think I'm gonna have a ulcer I lice for convoluted posts but maker this bad

[Sifr]

@Sifr

 

I admire your determination.

 

As do I, it's practically superhuman.

 

I think we all stopped caring a few pages back, it's mostly just bizarre, morbid curiosity at this point? What happens when a determined force means an extremely stubborn object?

 

It's been less about winning the argument (since I might be wrong), than trying to get TKS to (for once) accept that he might be wrong too?

 

[TheKomandorShepard]

.is Templar the powerful how and has Mage the mana much how on depends it ,Mage a of mana the all away take t'can Templar single a Because

It depends , series never explained that profoundly ,but we know there are templars that in fact may drain mage mana very quickly.

 

 

Do you even read what you write?

 

 

You just called them the same thing.

 

 

Of course I know what it means, do you?

 

If the Arcane Warriors are now Knight Enchanters as you claim and different from how they were in Origns, then that's not a retcon. You said earlier that as a retcon, that meant the Arcane Warriors now have always been the same as Knight Enchanters... hence, you have contradicted yourself.

 

 

 

 

And you have once again you've missed the point, not that I'm entirely surprised?

 

Cillian doesn't count because while he calls himself an Arcane Warrior and multiplayer refers to him by that title, but he's clearly not one. His backstory makes that abundantly clear, as have I repeatedly, while trying to explain this concept to you?

 

You know how at Disneyland you can meet Mickey Mouse, he's called Mickey Mouse and he's even advertised as such? Well, about that. I hate to be the one to tell you, but it's not really him, it's actually just someone in a costume.

 

Cillian is Mickey in this scenario? Also Galaxy Quest wasn't a historical documentary, no-one is trapped on Gilligan's Island and don't fear, Bruce Willis isn't really a ghost that only Haley Joel Osment can see?

 

1.Yes ,sadly you don't.

 

2. Where you see there me calling them same thing? Fragments says "no it isn't called knight enchanter , it is called Arance Warrior" no "Aracne warrior is the same thing as knight enchanter". So ass pull...

 

3. Dude you don't know what you are talking about and this and now you have proved.

 

"Retroactive continuity, or retcon for short, is the alteration of previously established facts in the continuity of a fictional work"

If dragon age inquisition have changed what arcane warrior was previously (read in dao) it is retcon , and what you have said doesn't make even remotly sense , i even can't comprehend what you are talking about.

You basically said that i claimed that arcane warrior in dragon age inquisition is the same thing as knight enchanter and not thing it was in dragon age origins (what is correct as far , but then universe exploded in insanity) , then you have claimed i contradicted myself by saying that Arcane warrior has changed in dragon age inquisition and isn't what it was in dao ,this isn't contradiction this is exactly same claim.

 

4. "His backstory makes that abundantly clear, as have I repeatedly, while trying to explain this concept to you?"

 

another ass pull , please show me where his backstory says "Cillian isn't Arcane warrior only Knight Enchanter" , pretty much his backstory says he wanted to learn arcane warrior not Knight Enchanter , what accoring to you is different thing.Also pretty sure his backstory says he spend his time in solitude while knight enchanter is reserved for most trusted by chantry circle mages.  

 

Also game as i said describes him as pretty much as arcane warrior not KC (not only in name but also description under it).

 

5.I skipped rest to avoid permanent brain damage.  
 

.   

[LOLandStuff]

5.I skipped rest to avoid permanent brain damage.  
 

 

This explains everything.

[TheKomandorShepard]

This explains everything.

Yes this explains unlike some people i can still lose something.

[zestalyn]

Well it is doubtful considering that KC fights in direct combat what gives templar edge, then templar takes away KC mana and poor bastard is facing templar in close combat without his tricks.

Yea tell that to the thousands upon thousands of templar bodies that effortlessly fell at the hands of my KE inquisitor

[TheKomandorShepard]

Yea tell that to the thousands upon thousands of templar bodies that effortlessly fell at the hands of my KE inquisitor

Inquisitor , hawke or the warden are poor examples to use ,as pretty much any inquisitor including normal clean mage can own pretty much thousands of templars (as well other kind of enemies), while the warden can solo thing that was capable take over entire castle and village  or even entire tower of such things.

[TEWR]

Pretty much the same thing in that they don't use armour, swords or shields, but instead channel magic into smacking a massive Spirit Blade into people? That's not in any way the same thing, even if they are based on a more martial form of magical combat.

 

A Retcon is when something contradicts some plot element or information that came before it... this doesn't do either?

 

 

A+ gif usage.

 

Also, "retcon" is a term bandied about so readily that it has begun to lose its meaning. A developer might've had the intention to give the player a bit of information only to give them new information later on that the dev had thought of in the beginning, but players would see it as a retcon.

 

That is to say, a story might be crafted with a specific path in mind.

 

*dev says "So here's what we'll give them in Game A, but here's what we'll give them in Game B"

*player receives information in Game A*

*Game B comes out*

*Game B's information is given to the player that relates in some way to Game A*

*Player: RETCON!!!

 

If that makes sense?

[TEWR]

Actually I would say that we have evidence that the templars went to great length in Ferelden to keep them from learning any martial skills. 

 

Well, Ian's not entirely wrong on the matter, but the lore has been rather.... off a bit. In Witch Hunt there are books devoted to teaching mages how to fight with swords and staves.

[TheKomandorShepard]

A+ gif usage.

 

Also, "retcon" is a term bandied about so readily that it has begun to lose its meaning. A developer might've had the intention to give the player a bit of information only to give them new information later on that the dev had thought of in the beginning, but players would see it as a retcon.

 

That is to say, a story might be crafted with a specific path in mind.

 

*dev says "So here's what we'll give them in Game A, but here's what we'll give them in Game B"

*player receives information in Game A*

*Game B comes out*

*Game B's information is given to the player that relates in some way to Game A*

*Player: RETCON!!!

 

If that makes sense?

Except it isn't in case here...

Because it isn't in first place providing an extra information on certain topic ,only changing things that were previously established on topic.

[IanPolaris]

Well, Ian's not entirely wrong on the matter, but the lore has been rather.... off a bit. In Witch Hunt there are books devoted to teaching mages how to fight with swords and staves.

 

Books yes...in witch hunt.  After the circle had nearly been destroyed for lack of people to defend it.  The ability to use those books and practice these techniques?  Not so much......and this is in Fereldan.

[Sifr]

1.Yes ,sadly you don't.

 

I've been reading what you've been writing. It's been nonsensical, but I've read it. It does not seem that you've been willing to do the same.

 

2. Where you see there me calling them same thing? Fragments says "no it isn't called knight enchanter , it is called Arance Warrior" no "Aracne warrior is the same thing as knight enchanter". So ass pull...

 

You just did again, here. You've equated the two quite clearly as being the same thing in your mind, saying that KC are AW in Inquisition. Here's some of what you've said, over the course of this delightful thread?

 

"So now not only every major mage organization have that specialization but also changed how it worked.

 

"KC is pretty much the same thing that AW is now , as we have both classes in the game and it is the same."
 

"So yes it is Retcon because arcane warrior is now the same thing KC is and not what it was in dao , not mention about that being lost specialization."

 

"Execpt yes they do and they are the same , with difference KC is tied to the chantry and AW more to elves and now tevinter , skills are however identical."

 

Then I pointed out that they were two "different fighting styles", which interesting lead to that particular phrase appearing quite frequently from then on in your newfound definitions of what you were talking about, even if it makes little to no sense given the context where you're still insisting they are the same? Not really relevant, just something curious I noticed;

 

Yes i admit dao arcane warrior is totally different fighting style than AW/KC in Dai   (what is pretty much is what i was saying )

 

"Damn, you people should learn how to read and think logically... That i said dao AW and dai AW/KC are 2 different fighting styles  doesn't contradict in any way my previous comment that it was retconed ,and Dai AW is the same thing that KC is and both have exactly the same skillset ,thus arcane warrior isn't what it was in dao and works exactly like KC..."

 

"No, that i have said that Knight Enchanter and Arcane Warrior in dragon age inquisition have the same skillset ,doesn't contradict in any way my statement that Dragon Age origins Arcane Warrior and Dragon age inquisition Arcane Warrior are 2 completely different fighting styles."

 

Don't call me pointing out your own words an ass pull, that's not what that term means either.

 

At this point, should I just keep that Princess Bride gif on permanent standby? It'll cost a pretty penny to pay the metre for it's parking space, but I think you need it's services 24/7?

 

3. Dude you don't know what you are talking about and this and now you have proved.

 

"Retroactive continuity, or retcon for short, is the alteration of previously established facts in the continuity of a fictional work"

If dragon age inquisition have changed what arcane warrior was previously (read in dao) it is retcon , and what you have said doesn't make even remotly sense , i even can't comprehend what you are talking about.

You basically said that i claimed that arcane warrior in dragon age inquisition is the same thing as knight enchanter and not thing it was in dragon age origins (what is correct as far , but then universe exploded in insanity) , then you have claimed i contradicted myself by saying that Arcane warrior has changed in dragon age inquisition and isn't what it was in dao ,this isn't contradiction this is exactly same claim.

 

Did everyone get those quotes from him earlier where he said something quite clearly, explained what he meant, only to then change it and it's definition later on throughout the topic, while claiming that he's always been saying it?

 

 If anyone is retconning stuff, TKS, it's you and the arguments and definitions you've used in the long and tired course of this thread?

 

another ass pull , please show me where his backstory says "Cillian isn't Arcane warrior only Knight Enchanter" , pretty much his backstory says he wanted to learn arcane warrior not Knight Enchanter , what accoring to you is different thing.Also pretty sure his backstory says he spend his time in solitude while knight enchanter is reserved for most trusted by chantry circle mages.  

 

Also game as i said describes him as pretty much as arcane warrior not KC (not only in name but also description under it).

 

*Puts another penny in the parking metre, to keep that gif on standby*

 

Cillian's backstory states clearly that the Arcane Warrior is lost to the Dalish, thus it would be impossible for him to be one. I also never said he was a Knight Enchanter, nor he learned it from them, just that he probably borrowed some of the techniques based upon what they do and meshed it into his own style? That doesn't make him an Knight Enchanter either.

 

5.I skipped rest to avoid permanent brain damage.

 

Which suggests that you have less courtesy to read my posts, while deriding me for not reading your own? That suggests a certain lack of courage to your convictions, that you must TL;DR someone simply because you cannot come up with an adequate rebuttal or counter-argument?

[TheKomandorShepard]

I've been reading what you've been writing. It's been nonsensical, but I've read it. It does not seem that you've been willing to do the same.

 

 

You just did again, here. You've equated the two quite clearly as being the same thing in your mind, saying that KC are AW in Inquisition. Here's some of what you've said, over the course of this delightful thread?

 

 

Then I pointed out that they were two "different fighting styles", which interesting lead to that particular phrase appearing quite frequently from then on in your newfound definitions of what you were talking about, even if it makes little to no sense given the context where you're still insisting they are the same? Not really relevant, just something curious I noticed;

 

 

Don't call me pointing out your own words an ass pull, that's not what that term means either.

 

At this point, should I just keep that Princess Bride gif on permanent standby? It'll cost a pretty penny to pay the metre for it's parking space, but I think you need it's services 24/7?

 

 

Did everyone get those quotes from him earlier where he said something quite clearly, explained what he meant, only to then change it and it's definition later on throughout the topic, while claiming that he's always been saying it?

 

 If anyone is retconning stuff, TKS, it's you and the arguments and definitions you've used in the long and tired course of this thread?

 

 

*Puts another penny in the parking metre, to keep that gif on standby*

 

Cillian's backstory states clearly that the Arcane Warrior is lost to the Dalish, thus it would be impossible for him to be one. I also never said he was a Knight Enchanter, nor he learned it from them, just that he probably borrowed some of the techniques based upon what they do and meshed it into his own style? That doesn't make him an Knight Enchanter either.

 

 

Which suggests that you have less courtesy to read my posts, while deriding me for not reading your own? That suggests a certain lack of courage to your convictions, that you must TL;DR someone simply because you cannot come up with an adequate rebuttal or counter-argument?

 

1.Person that claims that two exactly same things (well in fact one same thing) cotradict each other calls somone nonsensical , sorry but no you have failed again 

 

2aThat is just pathetic you have completly avoided question how the hell   "no it isn't called knight enchanter , it is called Arance Warrior" means "Arcane warrior is the same thing as Knight Enchanter" , and directed it on something else what wasn't topic of that point , is seems it is all you can do after you are humiliated is direct topic onto something else.

 

2b You are only humiliating yourself even further.

Basically i even said earlier my overall point is that KC in dai is the same as Arcane Warrior in dragon age inqusiition  , and if you knew how to read you would know that ,but there was nothing about it in thing you have quoted before there still isn't ,another epic fail.    And yet again how the f.... saying that dao arcane warrior and inquisition KC/AW are different fighting styles contradict that KC/AW in inquiesition are the same fighting styles.

 

2c Haha and what does those quotes have to do with anything? Quotes come from my posts before and not post you were refering that was "no it isn't called knight enchanter , it is called Arance Warrior" what isn't "Knight enchanter and arcane warrior are the same thing" ,and yet somehow for you it is what is ass-pull and it isn't mine ass-pull because you made that idiotic statment not me .

 

3.Omega Facepalm

 

 

It is called recton ,when series started (dao) arcane warrior was lost specialization that very few people knew about.Then later they said screw that it would be cool if tevinter had such mages and then they have decided throw everything before in garbage can and said lets make circle mage know about it too.

 

So now not only every major mage organization have that specialization but also changed how it worked.    

 

 

My first post in that thread and most revelant part "but also changed how it worked"

Have i clamied they have changed how arcane warrior works in dai? Yes 

 

My first post in second page

 

KC is pretty much the same thing that AW is now , as we have both classes in the game and it is the same.

 

So yes it is Retcon.

Have i clamied they have changed how arcane warrior works in dai because arcane warrior is in dai same thing that KC? Yes

 

Nothing has been changed since then ,im saying the same thing on that topic i was saying before you even spoke to me here.

 

4. From wiki his backstory

"Like Neria, Cillian was born to the Ralaferian Clan. In his youth, he lived apart from his people in order to resurrect a lost art, that of the Arcane Warrior. Originally driven by the need to seek glory for his people, Cillian's years of meditation and solitude gave him wisdom and respect for all life. When The Breach opened, he knew his duty was to stand against it, fighting to save all he knows and loves:

 

There is no single thing about it being imposible for him to be one ,in fact it outright states he lived apart from dalish and in solitude in order to learn that specialization , so no he didn't learn his skills from dalish what leaves knowledge in elven ruins and KC is circle magi specialization for trusted mages and as i said apparently said by you diffrent than arcane warrior and he was seeking arcane warrior not KC.

[Lumix19]

You two still haven't given up?

[Master Warder Z_]

Elves!

[Sifr]

1.Person that claims that two exactly same things (well in fact one same thing) cotradict each other calls somone nonsensical , sorry but no you have failed again 

How exactly is it a failure on my part to not see the blatant contradiction of someone who keeps insisting something is the same, but is also different from the thing he says it's the same too?

 

It's not just me, everyone else has no idea what you're talking about either?

 

2aThat is just pathetic you have completly avoided question how the hell   "no it isn't called knight enchanter , it is called Arance Warrior" means "Arcane warrior is the same thing as Knight Enchanter" , and directed it on something else what wasn't topic of that point , is seems it is all you can do after you are humiliated is direct topic onto something else.

 

Because you repeatedly have insisted that they are the same thing and you've been equating the two specs as the same in both games from the start of the topic. Now suddenly you'd decided to change the definitions to mean that it's not the same in Inquisition as Origins, despite what you have previously said, as well as still insisting that it's the same?

 

 

2b You are only humiliating yourself even further.

Basically i even said earlier my overall point is that KC in dai is the same as Arcane Warrior in dragon age inqusiition  , and if you knew how to read you would know that ,but there was nothing about it in thing you have quoted before there still isn't ,another epic fail.    And yet again how the f.... saying that dao arcane warrior and inquisition KC/AW are different fighting styles contradict that KC/AW in inquiesition are the same fighting styles.

 

Once more, Knight Enchanters aren't the same as Arcane Warriors, they weren't in Origins and they aren't in Inquisition either.

 

Cillian is not an Arcane Warrior, nor is he an Knight Enchanter. He's really just a self-taught guy with his own unique spin on fighting, but he's neither one nor the other, even if he calls himself it. He is not proof that anything within the way the spec or the lore, has actually changed whatsoever.

 

 

2c Haha and what does those quotes have to do with anything? Quotes come from my posts before and not post you were refering that was "no it isn't called knight enchanter , it is called Arance Warrior" what isn't "Knight enchanter and arcane warrior are the same thing" ,and yet somehow for you it is what is ass-pull and it isn't mine ass-pull because you made that idiotic statment not me .

 

The quotes are just to highlight that you have a tendency to parrot things you hear back to people, without seemingly any understanding of what they actually mean, since you use them incorrectly and often they actually don't even fit the context of what you're trying to say?

 

My first post in that thread and most revelant part "but also changed how it worked"

Have i clamied they have changed how arcane warrior works in dai? Yes 

 

Have i clamied they have changed how arcane warrior works in dai because arcane warrior is in dai same thing that KC? Yes

 

Nothing has been changed since then ,im saying the same thing on that topic i was saying before you even spoke to me here.

 

And for the umpteenth time, Cillian does not count as evidence that the two of them are the same or that Arcane Warriors have changed since DAO. If you can find another Arcane Warrior that proves that it has, then that'd be great, but show some actual credible evidence that's not a Dalish multiplayer character who was entirely self-taught?

 

Cillian neither proves the two specs have changed, nor that it's been retconned.

 

4. From wiki his backstory

"Like Neria, Cillian was born to the Ralaferian Clan. In his youth, he lived apart from his people in order to resurrect a lost art, that of the Arcane Warrior. Originally driven by the need to seek glory for his people, Cillian's years of meditation and solitude gave him wisdom and respect for all life. When The Breach opened, he knew his duty was to stand against it, fighting to save all he knows and loves:

 

There is no single thing about it being imposible for him to be one ,in fact it outright states he lived apart from dalish and in solitude in order to learn that specialization , so no he didn't learn his skills from dalish what leaves knowledge in elven ruins and KC is circle magi specialization for trusted mages and as i said apparently said by you diffrent than arcane warrior and he was seeking arcane warrior not KC.

 

The background calls it a lost art that he was trying to rediscover. Him going away into the middle of the nowhere to twiddle his thumbs, doesn't mean he can master the technique that really cannot be said to any longer exist, aside from fragmented lore, half-forgotten memories in the Fade and the knowledge acquired by the Warden from a source that was most likely destroyed.

 

Again, no-one is calling him a Knight Enchanter either, nor saying that Cillian learned to become one from the Circle, only you've thus far been saying that? Merely that his skills probably resemble them more than the actual Arcane Warriors that he's touting himself to be.

 

As a final note, kindly refrain from making personal attacks, it's really not becoming of you?

[LOLandStuff]

To anyone else but you, your post make no sense whatsoever. To you, they're pure gold.

 

If I quote you, you won't see anything wrong with your post. People have been doing it and you're completely ignorant to it, or pretend to be. Obviously admitting you are wrong is like having your head chopped off.

 

Wall of text isn't my thing. Others have done it. And me doing it as well won't change anything.

 

So, if I present you evidence of all the nonsense, you'll just brush it off, boast off how very smart you are and how others can't comprehend or are not logical enough.

[TheKomandorShepard]

To anyone else but you, your post make no sense whatsoever. To you, they're pure gold.

 

If I quote you, you won't see anything wrong with your post. People have been doing it and you're completely ignorant to it, or pretend to be. Obviously admitting you are wrong is like having your head chopped off.

 

Wall of text isn't my thing. Others have done it. And me doing it as well won't change anything.

And yet you can't provide example at all... (as i expected)

 

I didn't ask for wall of text i asked for 1 example and you have failed in such simple task.

 

Sorry ,but as far it seems you are only sad person that holds grudge against me and and shouts that my post are "contradictory" ,and yet can't even provide 1 example of that.