50 réponses à ce sujet

[Beregond5]

True. The other part, for me, is that he also looks the most "human." He has the least exaggerated "elfy" features of every other elf in the game, including Merrill.

 

For starters, he has a completely unique male elf body build, so he actually has muscle/mass instead of the anorexic stick-figure bodies literally every other elf has (except maybe Zev, but he looks terrible compared to DAO) and thus, his head doesn't seem huge compared to his body; his eyes are big, but not huge; his ears are pointed, but not a mile long and/or horizontal to the ground; he has long fluffy bangs swept around his eyes so it's not immediately obvious that his forehead dips into the tip of his nose; and he even has a bump in his nose so it looks like he has a nose!

 

You know... I couldn't put my finger on how it seemed the elf redesign seemed to work on Fenris and not so much on the other elves. This actually makes sense.

[Frybread76]

You know... I couldn't put my finger on how it seemed the elf redesign seemed to work on Fenris and not so much on the other elves. This actually makes sense.

 

I imagine it's because he's a possible love interest for the Champion, so they had to make him more appealing than the regular deformed male elves you see throughout DA2.  It's unfortunate the male elf Inquisitor looks so screwed up by comparison.

[springacres]

I imagine it's because he's a possible love interest for the Champion, so they had to make him more appealing than the regular deformed male elves you see throughout DA2.  It's unfortunate the male elf Inquisitor looks so screwed up by comparison.

I suspect his being a more "pampered" ex-slave with badass 2h fighting skills also figured into it.  Otherwise, they should have followed this logic with Merrill, since she too is a potential LI.

 

(And yes, I realize he wasn't exactly pampered as a slave, per se, but as Danarius' personal bodyguard he could presumably expect better treatment than most of Danarius' slaves got.)

Modifié par springacres, 06 mai 2015 - 09:41 .

[Remmirath]

I think they look fine in DA:O for what they are. It's quite easy to make an aesthetically pleasing elf, people seem to often be attracted to slim people with large eyes and a lot of hair, and I don't see anything jarring with the lore. It makes sense for both groups to end up fairly thin; the city elves are impoverished and likely malnourished in general, and the Dalish rarely stop moving and need to hunt for all their food.

DA II's elves made no sense to me with the lore, and I also found them to look rather bad, objectively (Fenris and Merrill being by far the best of a questionable lot). They no longer look as though humans would believably find them attractive, although that's still quite present in the background, and as pointed out above, it changes the elves from being subtly different yet still discriminated against to being highly different and discriminated against -- not that this would be excusable, of course, but it doesn't have quite the same effect. Also, it changes slurs like "knife-ear" from being clearly an exaggeration to being almost literal.

DA:I got it better, since one can certainly make a reasonable looking elf, and most of them don't have the facial features from DA II (although a lot of them do still have that odd nose thing going on), but the body meshes are still odd. I think it would've been much better to just use a scaled down human body mesh for many reasons, not least of which being that they could then have worn the same armour as anyone else.

[Deadly dwarf]

Interesting discussion.  In general, given the limitations of the DAO engine, too many of the characters within a race look too much alike, not just the elves.  In Redcliffe, for example, you see a generic "pretty human girl" model at play.  The blacksmith's daughter that you rescue from Redcliffe castle looks almost identical to the waitress in the bar who complains of being groped by her boss.

 

Regarding elves being thin and scrawny compared to humans, I can understand the game developer's desire to make them distinctive from humans.  (Look at the makeover the Qunari go through from Sten to Iron Bull.)  This characteristic carries on into DAI.  (I discovered the franchise through DAI and am now working on DAO.  I have no idea whether DAII was a step in the wrong direction.)  That said, personally, I'm not a big fan of tattoos and having tattoos all over their faces makes the Dalish a bit of a chore for me. 

 

The way "ancient elves" are described makes them seem rather Tolkeinesque.  Therefore, the city elf/Dalish elf dynamic is Bioware's way of taking things in another direction.  As to whether they're "pretty" or not, in DAI, I found Brialla rather pretty.  Enchantress Fiona also wasn't bad.  The more generic elf female characters not so much and the Dalish were hideous.  As to Sera, I do find her appealing even though her face sometimes looks like she's sucking on a really bitter lemon.  (The voice actress behind Sera really deserves an award for her performance here.)  As to Sera not being scrawny like other female elves, that one has me wondering whether her mysterious origin involves an inter-racial human-elf romance?  (I've also heard the Andruil theory which also makes sense.)

 

Really dumb question for the day, what is it with the barefoot elves of DAI?  Were all the elven cobblers killed during the Exalted Marches?

[Ambivalent]

Umh i don't think i follow these kind of discussions.

 

"This NPC looks ugly"

 

And how is that a problem? Is there a hidden rule that states "Everyone in this world should be beautiful/handsome and sexy"?

 

Let some races, some NPC's, even player characters be unattractive. It brings believability to a "made up" world i think.

 

PS: Seems off topic at first but relevant : http://forums.tripwi...50&postcount=35

 

Summary which applies to here : "And no, not every woman in a video game has to be "hot", or what the average 14 year old boy thinks is "hot". The women in our games go through the same type of design process as the men. We ask ourselves is this an interesting character, and would players want to play AS this character. And we've never gone "hmm, is this male character attractive enough?" So we won't be doing that with the female characters either. If we think the design is interesting to play as, then we'll consider it."

[sjsharp2011]

Yeah I agree Gago in my last playthrough as an Elven mage Inquisitor. She tried to help her people regain some of what they had lost by backing and supportin them where she could. She looked out for elves help3ed the Dalish clan in the Emerald Graves convinced Gaspard to team up with Briala to try to help her Orlesian cousins. She turned out to be quite an influential person to people and those closest to her as well.

[Malfrun]

Possibly just me but I found the elves in Dragon Age 2 strangely attractive, in orgins they are just humans with pointy ears that weren't even that pointy  . Haven't played Inquisition yet because of having no time at all   In 2 they were different enough and I digged it. Just me? Ok 

[Ash Wind]

Ewwwww.... Sera is grotesquely unattractive. Odd features; creepy facial structure, she's a total undead-looking mutant. Shianni, Iona and (what's her name, the Keeper who takes over for Zathrian) own Sera in the looks department. Don't even get me started on the mooks known as DA2 female elves.... notable exception being Merril.

[gnewna]

Pssh, Sera is cute, she's just not boringly, blandly, "pretty". She does look annoyed/like she's smelled something bad a lot of the time, though, and I guess given most video games' female characters don't get to have facial animations beyond "smiling" and "mildly surprised" (I'm looking at you, Skyrim - I pretty much always play women in Skyrim and it wasn't until I was looking at a friend's screenshots of their male Dragonborn that I realised - male PCs actually get to look ANGRY during combat!) that might be offputting to some.

 

As for elves in general, well, in Origins and Inquisition they're not really much more or less attractive than the human characters - in Origins a lot of NPCs of all races look a bit like bruised potatoes, and some NPCs of all races are quite good looking (yes, even the odd Dwarf). I've only played Inquisition on the PS3, so most of the NPCs (especially light-skinned ones) look a bit peculiar because there's this sort of "wearing a clear plastic mask of their own face" look a lot of the time, and the hair is ghastly, but there are good looking and ugly NPCs of most races, I think. As has been said above, while there's a bit of mention of "humans find elves attractive", I don't think elves in the Dragon Age are meant to actually be especially good looking because, well, they've pretty much all grown up in severe poverty or a nomadic lifestyle which is probably not particularly easy.

 

I think the "humans find us beautiful" thing is more a fetishisation thing than necessarily anything about the elves being especially attractive. (I also think it's interesting that in the m!CE origin, the PC's bride is described as much more attractive than Soris's intended, and she's also far more human-looking, her ears are hardly noticeable compared to the other girl's very sticky-out ears, her face is rounder and so on. Not sure if this is intentional or just "the designers think humans look better than elves and didn't mean anything by it", though.)

[viberunner]

In my whole experience in mythology, fairy tales and the such. Elves are supposed to be beautiful, charismatic...

 

You're thinking of faeries. Elves, folklore speaking, were originally dwarfish and malicious. It was around the Middle Ages that they started to become associated with a more noble form, in particular Edmund Spenser. But then he wasn't really writing about faeries he was sucking-up to Queen Elizabeth I.

 

Like a "wight". For thousands of years it literally meant "a living thing", then Tolkien popularised an obscure (and literarilly inaccurate) academic and now it mean the same as wraith.

 

As for Dragon Age elves...

 

[Aren]

this is not Tolkien also, it is alright for Bioware to have their own twist to the Elf concept. DA's Elves are not perfect nor are they meant to be.

elves of LotR are irritating mary sue

[DeathScepter]

elves of LotR are irritating mary sue

 

 

That is a given.

[Qun00]

I couldn't disagree more. They look really good.

It is true that elves are ugly in Inquisition, though. Huge head, anorexic body... *shudders*.

[JJ Likeaprayer]

Human,dwarves,elves...none of them looks like Elizabeth Taylor. Not just elves,all other races has not-so-beautiful NPCs. Some male human guards in Redcliffe looks like Caitlyn Jenner without makeup!

[Qis]

this is not Tolkien also, it is alright for Bioware to have their own twist to the Elf concept. DA's Elves are not perfect nor are they meant to be.

 

I disagree, there are dialogues on how beautiful the Elves are in Origin and DA2...but reality is they are just ugly

 

Even Loghain said City Elf Warden is beutiful

[Ghost Gal]

I think Origins elves would look prettier if they had larger eyes, ears, and fuller cheeks.

Origins elves are supposed to look like humans, only with slimmer, slighter, smaller features. Unfortunately, this includes smaller eyes, smaller ears (even though they're pointed), bony cheeks, etc. Notice Shianni alone has large eyes, ears, a soft nose, and full cheeks, and she looks lovely. Elves that follow the CC look terrible. =/

Still, could be worse. They could look like DA2 elves. (Diseased goat people.)

[Qun00]

Elves that follow the CC look terrible.

You're treading on thin ice here, mister. Speak for yourself.

[straykat]

I never thought they were great looking either. "Beauty' is not exactly important to me though. At this point (DAI), I'd just be happy with "playable" (as far as males go.. females aren't bad).

[sylvanaerie]

I think Origins elves would look prettier if they had larger eyes, ears, and fuller cheeks.

Origins elves are supposed to look like humans, only with slimmer, slighter, smaller features. Unfortunately, this includes smaller eyes, smaller ears (even though they're pointed), bony cheeks, etc. Notice Shianni alone has large eyes, ears, a soft nose, and full cheeks, and she looks lovely. Elves that follow the CC look terrible. =/

Still, could be worse. They could look like DA2 elves. (Diseased goat people.)

 

Actually I had hell in Origins making a decent looking elf until I installed a preset based on Shianni's facial structure in the toolset.  And for making males, well, I wasn't very fortunate, even when someone loaned me their decent looking elf guy, I still wasn't happy with what I turned out of the CC.

 

I never liked the ones in Origins much, because they were too ordinary and human-looking, but, I have to agree, DA2 was just horrid.  With the exception of Marethari who I thought was beautiful, but that had much more to do with her presence than actual physical appearance, I disliked the overall changes they had made, even if it did look like they were trying to tinker them into something unique and not just small humans with pointy ears.  I did enjoy using TMP's DA2 elves mod which combined the best features of the two to make Origins' elves more like DA2's elves, but wasn't satisfied still.

 

With Inquisition, I was finally happy with my lady elf, and my canon Inquisitor turned out (in my mind) gorgeous.  Just the hair was horrid.  Bioware just needs to work on their depiction of hair (something sorely lacking in all three games imo).  

 

And I still can't make a decent looking male elf, though my youngest (who played on the PS4) was able to make a really cute elf guy. So it may be just me.

[luna1124]

[Ghost Gal]

You're treading on thin ice here, mister. Speak for yourself.

 

Ooh, scary. What'cha gonna do? Say something rude? Nothing new there. 

 

Actually I had hell in Origins making a decent looking elf until I installed a preset based on Shianni's facial structure in the toolset.  

 

Yeah, that's what prompted my comment. I had a heck of a time imagining a decent-looking elf until I saw the "Shianni facial structure" mod.

 

Then I found a Youtube tutorial on how to make a decent-looking female elf without mods (didn't follow it to the letter, but it had some decent general advice), and it hit me: the secret is making their eyes bigger than average, their cheeks as round and full as possible, and making a decently shaped nose. Before, I kept wondering, "Why's it so easy to make a pretty female human but not female elf?" Then I realized the human women tend to have big eyes, smooth nose shapes, and pleassantly smooth, plump, round faces. In the CC, elven women tend to have tiny eyes, weirdly shaped noses (either too big/full or too lumpy), and sunk-in cheeks, and harsh, pointy, bony faces. (Shianni and Nessa and Iona have softer and rounder features, and I think they look much prettier.)

 

I never liked the ones in Origins much, because they were too ordinary and human-looking, but, I have to agree, DA2 was just horrid.  With the exception of Marethari who I thought was beautiful, but that had much more to do with her presence than actual physical appearance, I disliked the overall changes they had made, even if it did look like they were trying to tinker them into something unique and not just small humans with pointy ears.  I did enjoy using TMP's DA2 elves mod which combined the best features of the two to make Origins' elves more like DA2's elves, but wasn't satisfied still.

 

With Inquisition, I was finally happy with my lady elf, and my canon Inquisitor turned out (in my mind) gorgeous.  Just the hair was horrid.  Bioware just needs to work on their depiction of hair (something sorely lacking in all three games imo).  

 

Yeah. I personally didn't mind DAO elves looking a little ordinary, but I thought the devs went way overboard trying to make them look "zOMG SO EXOTIC AND UNEEK!!!" in DA2. They were just so alien and bizarre. I really like the middle ground they took with DAI: more stylized than DAO, but not quite so freakishly exaggerated as in DA2. It was definitely nice having an Elven PC I found rather pretty in DAI, without having to struggle so much like in DAO.

 

(But yeah, BioWare always has trouble with the hair.)

[sylvanaerie]

 

Yeah. I personally didn't mind DAO elves looking a little ordinary, but I thought the devs went way overboard trying to make them look "zOMG SO EXOTIC AND UNEEK!!!" in DA2. They were just so alien and bizarre. I really like the middle ground they took with DAI: more stylized than DAO, but not quite so freakishly exaggerated as in DA2. It was definitely nice having an Elven PC I found rather pretty in DAI, without having to struggle so much like in DAO.

 

(But yeah, BioWare always has trouble with the hair.)

Yea that's why I liked TMP's mod, that made them look a little less alien, a little less human and balanced well with the CC for Origins.  I prefer fuller cheeks, larger eyes, (I always went with that) but was never satisfied till I tinkered with Shianni's facial structure and got a preset I liked.  I installed it into my chargenmorph and never had to bother with CC much after that, just change hair, eye color, maybe tinkered a bit with facial structure to make each of my elf heroines with her own style.  It helps that I played on PC and was able to use mods.

 

And Inquisition was just what I was hoping they'd do with elves.  And my elf girls do come out with larger eyes and uniquely colored eyes, fuller cheeks, red hair and lots of freckles.  I also like the larger, more pronounced ears, making them similar to Elfquest elves, a series I really enjoyed in my youth.

 

[sjsharp2011]

You think Shianni... Is unattractive? And you think Sera is better looking than her? Your tastes in attractiveness are objectively awful.

 

 

Yeah I actually thought Shianni was quiet attractive in fact whereas I find Sera a bit ugly  by comparison. I'm not saying all elves are ugly in DAI as Solas isn't bad looking and I've created a few cute looking Lavellans in the CC. In fact I'm running with one of them now in my Topal Lavellan