60 réponses à ce sujet

[KaiserShep]

Out of curiosity, what are people's thoughts on the timing of seeing the effects of our decisions? Inquisition makes me think of ME2, where the impact of most of our major decisions aren't really seen until ME3 (e.g. whether or not you tell Mordin to save the info for the krogan cure, you don't see a major impact for that decision until a game later)

 

Do you think it works in a DA game to have the major impact of a decision show up in the next game? Does it work if we have a different PC each time, or only when we keep the same PC across games (like in ME)? Or should we at least see an inkling of the 'impact' of a decision show up within the game the decision is made? (this might be something big, like extra cutscenes, or small, like seeing certain changes in the environment reflect the decisions)

 

I suspect that the one decision that may have some kind of effect later is the Well of Sorrows. I have the feeling that the leader of Orlais and the Divine will probably just be something referenced in the background, but won't be the Big Thing that will amount to something in whatever endgame the series is possibly moving toward.

[Dreamer]

Out of curiosity, what are people's thoughts on the timing of seeing the effects of our decisions? Inquisition makes me think of ME2, where the impact of most of our major decisions aren't really seen until ME3 (e.g. whether or not you tell Mordin to save the info for the krogan cure, you don't see a major impact for that decision until a game later)

 

Do you think it works in a DA game to have the major impact of a decision show up in the next game? Does it work if we have a different PC each time, or only when we keep the same PC across games (like in ME)? Or should we at least see an inkling of the 'impact' of a decision show up within the game the decision is made? (this might be something big, like extra cutscenes, or small, like seeing certain changes in the environment reflect the decisions)

 

Fantastic question!

 

I feel as though distance (space and time) from consequences blunts their meaningfulness. In order to feel like a decision has consequences, there needs to be an immediate impact--physically or emotionally. Again, I reference the old Crestwood; a small village in the countryside isn't uniquely important to an organization like the Inquisition, but when you witness the deaths of people because of a decision you make, suddenly those consequences carry weight they might otherwise have not had.

[Kantr]

Fantastic question!

 

I feel as though distance (space and time) from consequences blunts their meaningfulness. In order to feel like a decision has consequences, there needs to be an immediate impact--physically or emotionally. Again, I reference the old Crestwood; a small village in the countryside isn't uniquely important to an organization like the Inquisition, but when you witness the deaths of people because of a decision you make, suddenly those consequences carry weight they might otherwise have not had.

Seeing that was what hooked me onto DA:I. And then it never happened.

 

Or do you mean the flooding of old crestwood?

[Dreamer]

Seeing that was what hooked me onto DA:I. And then it never happened.

 

Or do you mean the flooding of old crestwood?

 

The PAX-East demo.

[Sylvius the Mad]

What would having our choices matter look like?

No world state import. That's what.

Without the world state import, we'd be able to make bigger choices that make a bigger difference.

[Fireheart]

Well, with such things, this is a case of "it depends". Of course, I'd want (what I assumed to be) big decisions to play out on screen in front of my eyes, smaller things can be relegated to codex or hearing from other people. Example, choosing Bhelen or Harrowmont, I'd like to go to Orzammar and see the dwarves at their most prosperous, Dust Town isn't as dirty or full of bums, or see them at their worst, with casteless corpses littering the street because relations between caste and casteless have become their worst ever because of Harrowmont's conservatism. Something small like a past companion, this was well handled, I think, in DAI. Varric tells you about what happened to everybody. Of course, my favorites Fenris and Merrill, I'd love to be able to go seek them out.

 

All in all, having our choices matter show up in game could take a lot of time, money, work, and maybe designers just overlook something as insignificant, what we thought as pretty important.

[Winged Silver]

I suspect that the one decision that may have some kind of effect later is the Well of Sorrows. I have the feeling that the leader of Orlais and the Divine will probably just be something referenced in the background, but won't be the Big Thing that will amount to something in whatever endgame the series is possibly moving toward.

 

I feel like it's something that could go either way...depends on the direction for the game I suppose. If we are moving north, then it's definitely true that we wouldn't really need to see the ruler of Orlais. I'd be quite surprised if we didn't hear at least something from the Grey Wardens though XD

[Winged Silver]

Fantastic question!

 

I feel as though distance (space and time) from consequences blunts their meaningfulness. In order to feel like a decision has consequences, there needs to be an immediate impact--physically or emotionally. Again, I reference the old Crestwood; a small village in the countryside isn't uniquely important to an organization like the Inquisition, but when you witness the deaths of people because of a decision you make, suddenly those consequences carry weight they might otherwise have not had.

 

It was a shame they couldn't keep that in. I hope they can include stuff like that in the future games, as I too thought it looked very intriguing

[KaiserShep]

I feel like it's something that could go either way...depends on the direction for the game I suppose. If we are moving north, then it's definitely true that we wouldn't really need to see the ruler of Orlais. I'd be quite surprised if we didn't hear at least something from the Grey Wardens though XD

Regarding the Grey Wardens, I feel it's easier here because whether or not you keep them around doesn't stop whatevers going on at Weisshaupt. There would probably just be some alternate dialogue to reflect exile or alliance but nothing more.

[Lightpanda]

Out of curiosity, what are people's thoughts on the timing of seeing the effects of our decisions? Inquisition makes me think of ME2, where the impact of most of our major decisions aren't really seen until ME3 (e.g. whether or not you tell Mordin to save the info for the krogan cure, you don't see a major impact for that decision until a game later)

 

Do you think it works in a DA game to have the major impact of a decision show up in the next game? Does it work if we have a different PC each time, or only when we keep the same PC across games (like in ME)? Or should we at least see an inkling of the 'impact' of a decision show up within the game the decision is made? (this might be something big, like extra cutscenes, or small, like seeing certain changes in the environment reflect the decisions)

 

Lovely questions!

 

It seems to me there are (should be?) 4 levels. To borrow from IT parlance, there are: major, minor, "build", "version".

• Major would impact the whole franchise (ex. OGB? Well of Sorrows?)
• Minor would impact the whole in-game universe (ex. Ruler of Orlais?)
• "Build" would impact the next game (ex. Side with werewolves = get a side quest)
• "Version" would impact the current game (ex. Friend/Rival paths of DAII)

The way I see it, if they continue give us a new character each game, that doesn't negate the actions of the previous PC. The world will still be different because someone (PC!Me) made a choice that resulted in X happening and now someone else (PC2!Me) has to deal with the fallout of Q (which precipitated from X). So, yes, having at least ^"build" impacts should happen the next game, regardless of New!PC vs. Recycled!PC. Maybe communicating ^minor impacts are what the epilogue slides are intended for?

 

Also, somewhat related: ...I personally like having a different PC each time so I don't feel unfaithful to my LI from the previous game.

[Lightpanda]

*snip*

 

I feel as though distance (space and time) from consequences blunts their meaningfulness. In order to feel like a decision has consequences, there needs to be an immediate impact--physically or emotionally.

 

*snip*

 

Hmmm...good point. Maybe one of these per "act"?

 

I feel like Vivienne's wanted to be something like this but I didn't connect with her enough as a character for it to resonate beyond the "well...****" response of the Inky...
 

[evelynwarden]

4-I want to SEE how the world has changed as a result of my actions / learn about my party members' character

[Lightpanda]

*snip*

 

Of course, I'd want (what I assumed to be) big decisions to play out on screen in front of my eyes, smaller things can be relegated to codex or hearing from other people.

 

*snip*

 

Can you like ("vote up") Option 1, Option 3, and Option 4 please? Thanks!

[Lightpanda]

4-I want to SEE how the world has changed as a result of my actions / learn about my party members' character

Great! Can you like ("vote up) Option 4 please? Appreciate the feedback!

[Lightpanda]

So far...

 

Option 1 - READ: 6

Option 2 - HEAR: 10

Option 3 - TALK: 11

Option 4 - SEE: 16

[Winged Silver]

Lovely questions!

 

It seems to me there are (should be?) 4 levels. To borrow from IT parlance, there are: major, minor, "build", "version".

• Major would impact the whole franchise (ex. OGB? Well of Sorrows?)
• Minor would impact the whole in-game universe (ex. Ruler of Orlais?)
• "Build" would impact the next game (ex. Side with werewolves = get a side quest)
• "Version" would impact the current game (ex. Friend/Rival paths of DAII)

The way I see it, if they continue give us a new character each game, that doesn't negate the actions of the previous PC. The world will still be different because someone (PC!Me) made a choice that resulted in X happening and now someone else (PC2!Me) has to deal with the fallout of Q (which precipitated from X). So, yes, having at least ^"build" impacts should happen the next game, regardless of New!PC vs. Recycled!PC. Maybe communicating ^minor impacts are what the epilogue slides are intended for?

 

Also, somewhat related: ...I personally like having a different PC each time so I don't feel unfaithful to my LI from the previous game.

 

I like the way you've broken it down! Seems like a good sort of reference/check list to have, when making games like these. And I totally understand what you mean about the staying faithful part XD

[PhroXenGold]

I want genuinely different content based on my decsisions. Not just "you're on the other side of this fight", or "a different guy talks to you but ends up doing the same stuff", but completely different content. DA:I did it right once (which is once more than either of it's predeccesors) with the Champions of the Just vs In Hushed Whispers. When you made your choice there, you didn't just have a single fight and a bit of dialogue being different, you had a completely different quest, in a completely different place against completely different enemies, and there was no way to do the stuff you missed. That is the impact my choices should have. Unfortunately, they didn't follow up on it that well, as after that part of the game, everything went back to your choices having no impact on the course of the game. The game should have branching paths based on my choices, not the same path with cosmetic variations.

 

Or to put it isn't a quick summary as per the OPs categories, I want to experience the effect of my choices. Not read about it, not hear about it, not see it, but actually have different choices lead to a different experience.

 

(and yes, I know this would be a lot of effort, but I'd happily trade 1/3 of the content in the game to make another 1/3 of it completely different the second time I play through)

[eyezonlyii]

I also think the magnitude of the choice should dictate the manner in which it is presented, as has been stated a few times already. Some choices should remain relatively small and relegated to a codex, other choices need to be talked about.
But one thing I hope for is never to have an impact as large as the mark/inquisition again. It's the same too big/too fast problem that plagued Mass Effect in the end (ha). Especially for one game in a series that changes protagonists every installment. How can you top a person who can rip open the Fade any time they feel like it? Who also is leader of a massive third party military force?
Choice matters, but so does impact, and I'd rather have believable and meaningful impact along with my choices.

[Lightpanda]

I want genuinely different content based on my decsisions. Not just "you're on the other side of this fight", or "a different guy talks to you but ends up doing the same stuff", but completely different content. DA:I did it right once (which is once more than either of it's predeccesors) with the Champions of the Just vs In Hushed Whispers. When you made your choice there, you didn't just have a single fight and a bit of dialogue being different, you had a completely different quest, in a completely different place against completely different enemies, and there was no way to do the stuff you missed. That is the impact my choices should have. Unfortunately, they didn't follow up on it that well, as after that part of the game, everything went back to your choices having no impact on the course of the game. The game should have branching paths based on my choices, not the same path with cosmetic variations.

 

Or to put it isn't a quick summary as per the OPs categories, I want to experience the effect of my choices. Not read about it, not hear about it, not see it, but actually have different choices lead to a different experience.

 

(and yes, I know this would be a lot of effort, but I'd happily trade 1/3 of the content in the game to make another 1/3 of it completely different the second time I play through)

Aha! (Were you a Choose Your Own Adventure kid? )

 

I'll post "Option 5" in a moment and update the OP.

[Lightpanda]

5-I want to EXPERIENCE how the world has changed as a result of my actions / learn about my party members' character (example: branching paths based on my choices where different play-throughs have mutually exclusive quests in completely different places against completely different enemies with no way to do the stuff I missed.)

[Lightpanda]

I also think the magnitude of the choice should dictate the manner in which it is presented, as has been stated a few times already. Some choices should remain relatively small and relegated to a codex, other choices need to be talked about.
But one thing I hope for is never to have an impact as large as the mark/inquisition again. It's the same too big/too fast problem that plagued Mass Effect in the end (ha). Especially for one game in a series that changes protagonists every installment. How can you top a person who can rip open the Fade any time they feel like it? Who also is leader of a massive third party military force?
Choice matters, but so does impact, and I'd rather have believable and meaningful impact along with my choices.

Can you provide an example from another game that has executed this well? Or a concrete, thought bubble "if you ruled the zoo" example? Like...game 1 = saving family from X, game 2 = saving town from X, game 3 = saving region from X, etc.?

[eyezonlyii]

I think it's more simple than that. What happens to many writers if a series is the unfortunate power creep trope. Anime in particular is guilty of this, but as we know, games suffer as well.
The fact that Dragon Age changes protagonists every installment allows for greater freedom from this problem.
DA:O=Ferelden Wardens against the blight
DA:2= Hawke and co in Kirkwall, and the beginning of the mage rebellion
DA:I

Spoiler

should have equaled the beginning of the inquisition in a more meaningful way. By the end of DA:2 (or beginning considering it's a framed story), we have the mage/Templar war and the Orlesian civil war. That is enough right there to fill a game with a few writing tweaks. Eliminate Cory and the breach. Have the divine assassinated later in the game; have the PC be a rank and file inquisition soldier who rises through the ranks. Even have the inquisition begun by someone not affiliated with the Chantry (maybe even Hawke).
Rewrite Redcliffe so that Alexius goes there because he heard that the leader of the rebel mages is there and she has been cured of the blight. Fold Dorian and Felix into one person (and as much as I love Dorian, keep Felix and the sickness, but give him Dorian's daddy issues).

There's much more than that, but I'll stop for now.

[Dubya75]

"What would "having our choices matter" look like in-game?"

 

No idea. Never seen it happen in a Dragon Age game.

[SnakeCode]

I see through your sublte attempt to get your like count up OP.  

[TevinterSupremacist]

Rule of thumb, if the choice doesn't cause problems to the writers when they try to start writing the next installment in the series, that choice didn't really matter.