64 réponses à ce sujet

[Texasmotiv]

That's because you have no idea how many archers are on the castle map

Ogod.

[yarpenthemad21]

CL can be interrupted early on until you get Mind over matter, and without many promotions any interruption usually brings the AW closer to death so FS makes up for this issue. Replacing SB for CL is a better safety net if things go wrong once you have the necessary passives. Stone fist detonation works but only on the main target it hits, the aoe doesn't detonate other combos. Static charge + stone fist = discharge all day every day if you manage to aim it on the proper target.

I have paralyze passive for it and I'm not always start with CL. Depending on party (and how much detonator they have) I change to Pota + cl is there is nobody to detonate sleep. I just can't ignore CL and this 6x300% damage with simple requirement, 2 targets+.

Stone fist detonation dealed zero damage. Do they fixed it? It's not about detonation text, visual and even medals. It's about damage. Frozen + stone fist (there should be ice damage done) or sleep + stone fist (some rupture with Dot damage). If patch fixed it give us some info about it.

[DrKilledbyDeath]

Is sleep then stone fist supposed to do something? I use stone fist to put shocked enemies to sleep

[Kalas Magnus]

no

 

if anything id remove spirit blade. 

 

they nerfed it to hell. 

[Wavebend]

Is sleep then stone fist supposed to do something? I use stone fist to put shocked enemies to sleep

 

It just puts them to sleep even longer.

[Wavebend]

no

 

if anything id remove spirit blade. 

 

they nerfed it to hell. 

 

Thread derail attempt #1..

[DrKilledbyDeath]

Thread derail attempt #1..

He isn't the first one in here to say don't use SB. The true AW knows it is not a good skill.

[yarpenthemad21]

Is sleep then stone fist supposed to do something? I use stone fist to put shocked enemies to sleep

In theory stone fist is impact detonator (warrior class like mighty blow)
sleep + impact detonator = rupture. rupture = damage over time ignoring armor.

I don't have kits in multiplayer to test after patch stone fist. My AW is level 1, ele is 19, so all I can do for now is testing it on SP (bugs like this are in both multi and sp).
And it still does not work. Frozen + stone fist = shattered without any damage, sleep with stone fist = rupture without any damage, paralyze + stone fist = lots of visual but lack of damage from combo.
So it looks like stone fist is still bugged (like for 90%, I've tested in SP)

[Wavebend]

He isn't the first one in here to say don't use SB. The true AW knows it is not a good skill.

 

You guys have no idea. SB is one, if not the best skill for AW. It repels arrows, is AOE, deals 300% per hit and can be cast at a frequency of 1 swing/second, and even faster should you cancel every 3rd swing with FS/FC/SF. Its raw, effective DPS far surpasses any alternative.

[Texasmotiv]

I'm pretty sure a recent post from St Luke said that Stone Fist is n.ot detonating, but he has that on his radar for a bug fix

[Drasca]

You guys have no idea. SB is one, if not the best skill for AW. It repels arrows, is AOE, deals 300% per hit and can be cast at a frequency of 1 swing/second, and even faster should you cancel every 3rd swing with FS/FC/SF. Its raw, effective DPS far surpasses any alternative.

 

We've been over this WB. SB is 4s total when holding down SB for 3x swings. There's the chance to cancel with FC but that timing cannot be relied upon. It can also be blocked. The arrow repel requires timing / luck, which slows down the swing dps. It is short range and only hits what's in front of the AW in a small arc.

 

Gathering storm + Staff basic attack is better DPS on single target than SB is. Anything that is blocked by SB, is better served with spells.

 

I didn't know about the extra hidden bonus damage on SB when upgraded before, which I am glad is gone now.

[Wavebend]

We've been over this WB. SB is 4s total when holding down SB for 3x swings. There's the chance to cancel with FC but that timing cannot be relied upon. It can also be blocked. The arrow repel requires timing / luck, which slows down the swing dps. It is short range and only hits what's in front of the AW in a small arc.

 

Gathering storm + Staff basic attack is better DPS on single target than SB is. Anything that is blocked by SB, is better served with spells.

 

I didn't know about the extra hidden bonus damage on SB when upgraded before, which I am glad is gone now.

 

Arrow repelling isn't something that you actively need to take care of. It just happens as you fight through groups and occurs fairly often.

I don't think 150+ degrees is what I'd consider a "small arc", tbh. Good positioning and facing the archers at all time works wonders and is a super effective DPS dealer.

 

GS + basic attack is comparable, but not better. Either way, this build (from OP) doesn't exclude this combo and you're still free to use it. On top of that, your build relies heavily on the sleep combo. Sleep =/= weakened, so the Twisted Veil (extra 15% dmg) passive doesn't apply either.

 

Look, I prefer this build for soloing and I've tested your build a few times. Yours is great, but stop trashing SB. I'd be eager to see you solo the dragon on perilous with your build, as I don't think that could ever happen.

[yarpenthemad21]

We've been over this WB. SB is 4s total when holding down SB for 3x swings. There's the chance to cancel with FC but that timing cannot be relied upon. It can also be blocked. The arrow repel requires timing / luck, which slows down the swing dps. It is short range and only hits what's in front of the AW in a small arc.
 
Gathering storm + Staff basic attack is better DPS on single target than SB is. Anything that is blocked by SB, is better served with spells.
 
I didn't know about the extra hidden bonus damage on SB when upgraded before, which I am glad is gone now.

You have some math for it?
Time to kill on matches prove the opposite.

[Drasca]

You have some math for it?
Time to kill on matches prove the opposite.

 

1v1 Thunderdome time!

 

If you feel like you're outgunned and disadvantaged, that's because you are

[Drasca]

Look, I prefer this build for soloing and I've tested your build a few times. Yours is great, but stop trashing SB. I'd be eager to see you solo the dragon on perilous with your build, as I don't think that could ever happen.

 

Yeah, because you keep on refusing to join my games! That's why. LOL

[Piffle]

Wave, I think you overestimate some people...  but ty for the build 

[Sulaco_7]

I have it recorded actually, but can't show it because NDA

 

And also, arcane warrior isn't the best for solo. Duelist can do it extremely easily, unfortunately...

 

So the Duelist will replace AW as the new overpowered kit?  Will she also be the easiest to solo the dragon with?  (i.e. 4 duelists can easily run through the castle and take out the dragon?)

[yarpenthemad21]

1v1 Thunderdome time!
 
If you feel like you're outgunned and disadvantaged, that's because you are

Should I laugh? Err...whatever
I've tested it.

For me on 1 level AW auto attack is around 100 damage (without rune)
Spirit blade is 300 (without rune). 3 attacks is 1200. I need ~12 attacks for it. Your time data is wrong. Auto attack chain is around 4 second (8 hits) and 3 swings is around 3s (close to 2,5s really but still it's faster)
so it's 800 damage vs 900-1200 in 4 seconds.
Rune damage does not matter, it's scales on SB. (~33 auto, ~100 sb)
So why you state that "auto attack has higher single target dps"?

[Drasca]

I've tested it.

 

Incomplete test.

 

We do Gathering Storm + Fade Cloak vs Spirit Blade + Fade Cloak. Gathering storm reduces FC cd, enabling faster FC vs SB. Not even calculating reducing the cd of the other spells involved that also add dps.

 

Sustained SB is actually 4s. 3s for 3 swings then a 1s downtime in between where you cannot do anything without cancelling this time. The exact timings of swing 1, 2, and 3 are listed on the single player forum's combat mechanic here:

 

http://forum.bioware...mbat-mechanics/

 

The GS - Auto attack can open with FC, but the SB swinger is much less likely to.

 

You can add other spells into the equation, but it favors GS auto-attack due to reduced cooldown on all vs SB'ing.

 

SB requires multiple enemies that cannot block in order to be favored vs GS basic attacks. Even then, it is not dominant due to the massive damage spells can do, especially when combo'ing Pota --> FC whereas you cannot hit more than 2-3 targets non-pota vs hitting 10+ targets with Pota/FC

[llandwynwyn]

I'll not argue on numbers or damage but from a lore perspective...To have the Arcane Warrior, the only since DAO, reduced to a non melee build is very sad.

I've never really, seriously played one because it bored me. KE was my biggest mistake for my canon Inquisition, for the same reason. Boring.

But it's sad, man.

Goodnight, sweet prince.

[Sulaco_7]

I'll not argue on numbers or damage but from a lore perspective...To have the Arcane Warrior, the only since DAO, reduced to a non melee build is very sad.

I've never really, seriously played one because it bored me. KE was my biggest mistake for my canon Inquisition, for the same reason. Boring.

But it's sad, man.

Goodnight, sweet prince.

 

So true.  Why even call him a warrior anymore.  They should just rename him to "Elementalist 2" in the damp screen.

[nibyl]

DA:O AW was so great it can never be topped. I wish they would've made the class more or less the same in inquisition, meaning you could use melee weapons and heavy armor and so on.

[Wavebend]

So the Duelist will replace AW as the new overpowered kit?  Will she also be the easiest to solo the dragon with?  (i.e. 4 duelists can easily run through the castle and take out the dragon?)

 

1) Not really 2) Yes

 

Duelist is extremely good at keeping itself alive and dealing absurd amounts of damage when there are few enemies around, say 7 or less.

 

The worst scenario is when enemies are scattered, in large numbers (7+), and most of them are archers. Then I'd say AW > Duelist in those scenarios, and it's not even a fair comparison tbh.

[Wavebend]

Incomplete test.

 

We do Gathering Storm + Fade Cloak vs Spirit Blade + Fade Cloak. Gathering storm reduces FC cd, enabling faster FC vs SB. Not even calculating reducing the cd of the other spells involved that also add dps.

 

Sustained SB is actually 4s. 3s for 3 swings then a 1s downtime in between where you cannot do anything without cancelling this time. The exact timings of swing 1, 2, and 3 are listed on the single player forum's combat mechanic here:

 

http://forum.bioware...mbat-mechanics/

 

The GS - Auto attack can open with FC, but the SB swinger is much less likely to.

 

You can add other spells into the equation, but it favors GS auto-attack due to reduced cooldown on all vs SB'ing.

 

SB requires multiple enemies that cannot block in order to be favored vs GS basic attacks. Even then, it is not dominant due to the massive damage spells can do, especially when combo'ing Pota --> FC whereas you cannot hit more than 2-3 targets non-pota vs hitting 10+ targets with Pota/FC

 

Not this again, lol.

 

You know, if you really, really want to make sure the math is right, then maybe we could take a hour someday, get some samples and really do the math properly, but for now it seems we're both doing politician math that isn't really conclusive

[yarpenthemad21]

Incomplete test.
 
We do Gathering Storm + Fade Cloak vs Spirit Blade + Fade Cloak. Gathering storm reduces FC cd, enabling faster FC vs SB. Not even calculating reducing the cd of the other spells involved that also add dps.

Not incomplete. There wasn't anything about Fade cloak in your "statement".
Also:
Gathering storm cooldown reduction is not every swing. Still whatever.

Sustained SB is actually 4s.

I've taken stopwatch and calculated it. 3 swing 3 seconds, 6 swings 6 seconds etc. Holding down button.

3s for 3 swings then a 1s downtime in between where you cannot do anything without cancelling this time. The exact timings of swing 1, 2, and 3 are listed on the single player forum's combat mechanic here:
 
http://forum.bioware...mbat-mechanics/
 

The GS - Auto attack can open with FC, but the SB swinger is much less likely to.

Why? It's normal. Because of blocking mobs if you want to kill some running alone mob you just fire fade cloak, first and after that just spam SB do death.

 

You can add other spells into the equation, but it favors GS auto-attack due to reduced cooldown on all vs SB'ing.
 
SB requires multiple enemies that cannot block in order to be favored vs GS basic attacks. Even then, it is not dominant due to the massive damage spells can do, especially when combo'ing Pota --> FC whereas you cannot hit more than 2-3 targets non-pota vs hitting 10+ targets with Pota/FC

So the whole statement is that on single target because of cooldown reduction auto attack + spells are better then SB + spells.

But where are the assumption for it?

Firstly you need to take very very long fight.
Whatever SB have downtime or not 3 swings are faster then whole auto attack combo.
3 swings deal more damage.
Now about gathering storm

Grants a 0.5-second cooldown reduction every time the first attack (attack_1) in the staff attack sequence is made.
It is not necessary to run through the entire staff attack sequence to trigger the cooldown reduction. The cooldown reduction will still be triggered on every instance of attack_1 if, for example, the attack sequence is interrupted after attack_1 and a new sequence is started, beginning with attack_1 again.
Only attacks targeted at enemies trigger the cooldown reduction.
Spirit Blade attacks do not trigger the cooldown reduction.

So you need to cancel animation for better result, still at most it's 8 attacks in 4 seconds with plenty of shiftmashing, still SB wins damage wise.

After that you need long fight enough for it to matter. Fade cloak and 3 swings pretty much kill everything on perilous (and we talk about single target) so only bosses are really the target of it.
So all this math and statements works only if:
1) mage cancel animation of auto attack
2) fight boss alone, no other mobs in range
3) fight is long enough.


So I can add that this pretty much never happens. There are always mobs around, I have PotA for it (and cl to get aggro), even bosses spawn mobs and you would fight most of the time with other mobs around.

Adding to it that normal group clearing looks pretty much PotA->get inside -> blow them up with fade cloak and SB. I don't need second fade cloak, mobs should be dead.

And canceling auto is tedious and cheap. It's cheating, looks stupid and it's annoying. I should have fun playing the game not mash button like idiot to get some skill 2 seconds faster.

So yes, if next time I would tank some lonely boss for a long time I would use auto attack. This would happen probably on some solo perilous run. At the end of wave 5. Great advise.