402 réponses à ce sujet

[leaguer of one]

Yet they are different even between vallaslin designs?

At this point you're just shaking your head and going 'nuh-uh' instead of providing valid arguments.

So, they are still extremely similar.

[xPez]

nope...

go to 6:28.

 

They clearly state "pocket in the fade."

 

Sorry but no. The Inquisitor describes it as a "pocket in the fade", who has literally just arrived there for the first time ever. Morrigan doesn't confirm that.

 

Regardless, it being a "pocket in the fade" would actually mean that it isn't in the fade.

 

Secondly, how very disingenuous of you. The very same video that you have posted confirms what the poster before you said. At 7:07 Morrigan says the exact words, "This... is not the Fade, but it is very close".

[Lethaya]

Different eyes see things differently, yes?

 

Also, this thread moves too quickly, I can't.

 

Stated by whom? In game characters? if so that is hardly compelling evidence, since they weren't around back then to know. It was pure speculation on Bartrands part. So it's not recorded in The Memories? I suspect A LOT of crap is missing from The Memories, some perhaps intentionally. So it lacks Paragon Statues? That can be explained as the survivors abandoning the Paragons to worship The Blight, since it proved it's absolute power by destroying the Empire.  

 

True, all very true, of course.

 

And bah, my last minute edits weren't quick enough for the speed of this thread, it seems. Ah well. XD

 

nope...

<snip>

go to 6:28.

 

They clearly state "pocket in the fade."

 

And yet... "This is not the Fade, but it is very close." What you quoted was the Inquisitor's guess. Regardless, robertthebard was correct in his original assumption, no?

 

 

You're missing my point. If there's more than ONE official version of vallaslin, people can't just pick one design at random and claim "look, it lines up so well!" (even though it doesn't).

 

Really, the only thing those things have in common is that they both have a bow in there. It's too little of a connection.

 

Factoring in that you have to turn the vallaslin upside down for it to work doesn't really help matters, either. XD
 

 

Apparently Skyhold is full of gods but poor of any memorable characters

 

Hilarious, dear. And original, to be sure. ;D

 

Spoiler

 

EDIT: The worst of the ninjas! The ones with the same content as you! D:

[midnight tea]

So, they are still extremely similar.

 

You're just trolling at this point.

[leaguer of one]

, "This... is not the Fade, but it is very close".

That means they are not physically in the fade. It still is a pocket int the fade. A world in the fade.

[TheRevanchist]

It's proves everything. the dwarven shaperate is super detail about it's history. They are not going to forget about a thag. And they did have detail about Caradin, just not his fate or how to make his Golems but that's only because that info was not given to them. they are super detail not all seeing. thag are a completely different thing being that they are place to live in and foundations of noblehood.

 

No, it really proves nothing. Go back and listen to the Shaper again "We never had any real data about Caradin or his Golems". They didn't even have the names of the Volunteers. For something supposedly so detail oriented they surely missed a lot there. It is absolutely possible they missed a Thaig somewhere. If Kal Sharok still has a Shaper of Memories I would believe that over Orzammar's any day of the week. Kal Sharok was the first Captial, and thus much older data is stored there. Orzammar was a lowly Trading town for Surfacers back then. The Memories lacking data about Bartrands Folly proves nothing, except that the Memories are not as detailed as you seem to think they are. 

[midnight tea]

 

Factoring in that you have to turn the vallaslin upside down for it to work doesn't really help matters, either. XD
 

 

Doesn't it? And those who want to claim 'butbutbut... the romance card!' have to face the fact that both the bow has a different shape, it's not drawn and the arrow lies horizontally to the bow, not vertically...

[leaguer of one]

 

 

And yet... "This is not the Fade, but it is very close." What you quoted was the Inquisitor's guess. Regardless, robertthebard was correct in his original assumption, no?

 

 

 

 

As i just said that means they are not physically in the fade. Like say you're sailing on a boat and not  in the ocean. You in a bubble that's in the fade.

[MrMrPendragon]

That means they are not physically in the fade. It still is a pocket int the fade. A world in the fade.

 

"This is not the fade" means they're not in the fade.

 

You are correct when you say that they're not physically in the fade, because they're not in the Fade at all.

 

I see it as  a world sandwiched between the physical plane and the Fade. An in-between world, because maybe I'm assuming even the elves couldn't tear through (or don't want to tear through) the Veil.

[Lethaya]

That means they are not physically in the fade. It still is a pocket int the fade. A world in the fade.

 

They are physically in the Crossroads, though. And if the Crossroads is, in fact, inside the Fade, being physically in the Crossroads would make one physically in the Fade. That's like saying "No, I'm in Indianapolis, not Indiana."

 

Arguing technicalities, here. Semantics.
 

[midnight tea]

Well yes, but isn't it again something that's just... redundant? We know, for example, that Fade is everywhere in Thedas, but it is Veiled - doesn't that technically mean that Thedas itself lies in the Fade as well?

 

Point is that Crossroads is some sort of construct that distinguishes one from another.

[robertthebard]

nope...

go to 6:28.
 
They clearly state "pocket in the fade."

...and then at 7:09 "This is not the Fade..."

[xPez]

That means they are not physically in the fade. It still is a pocket int the fade. A world in the fade.

 

But not a part of the actual Fade. Literally, from Morrigan's own mouth, the Crossroads is not in the Fade.

 

The place that the Envy demon takes us is a world within the Fade, as is the various areas we go to during the Circle Tower quest in DA:O, and the marsh in DA:A. The Crossroads isn't though.

[leaguer of one]

"This is not the fade" means they're not in the fade.

 

You are correct when you say that they're not physically in the fade, because they're not in the Fade at all.

 

It's like a world sandwiched between the physical plane and the Fade. An in-between world.

they are not in the fade because they are in the pocket in the fade. Note that she says they are very close to the fade , closer the you can be then the real world. If you on a boat sail, you're on a boat and not in the ocean but if you put a hole in that boat and sink it then your in the ocean.

[ModernAcademic]

Frankly, I don't even understand the fascination some part of the fanbase has for elves.

They don't build anything, they are anorexic, they don't even know their own History and complain all the time about being persecuted.

 

Do we see surface dwarves complain about anything? Or do they WORK to build a life for themselves?

 

Sorry, but elves are not even a handsome people. Compare the human and dwarven ladies with the elven ones. They even look like aliens in DA2.

Where's the elven physical superiority? I'd prefer a human or dwarven Inquisitor anyday. 

[leaguer of one]

They are physically in the Crossroads, though. And if the Crossroads is, in fact, inside the Fade, being physically in the Crossroads would make one physically in the Fade. That's like saying "No, I'm in Indianapolis, not Indiana."

 

Arguing technicalities, here. Semantics.
 

if we're on a boat in the ocean do we say we are in a boat or in the ocean?

Earth is in space but don't say we are in space when we say we are on earth.

[midnight tea]

Yet boat ain't the same as the ocean.

[leaguer of one]

But not a part of the actual Fade. Literally, from Morrigan's own mouth, the Crossroads is not in the Fade.

 

The place that the Envy demon takes us is a world within the Fade, as is the various areas we go to during the Circle Tower quest in DA:O, and the marsh in DA:A. The Crossroads isn't though.

they are not in the fade because they are in the pocket in the fade. Note that she says they are very close to the fade , closer the you can be then the real world. If you on a boat sail, you're on a boat and not in the ocean but if you put a hole in that boat and sink it then your in the ocean. Te place they are in is built in the fade but it's not the fade it self.

[xPez]

if we're on a boat in the ocean do we say we are in a boat or in the ocean?

 

In a boat. The boat is in the ocean, but the passengers of the boat are in the boat.

 

...I've lost sight of this argument now, I'm not even sure which side I'm backing

 

 

Regardless of whether the Crossroads is part of the Fade or just in the Fade; how is it evidence that the Old Gods are the Elvehen Gods?

[leaguer of one]

Yet boat ain't the same as the ocean.

I never said the cross road are literally the same as the fade. i said the crossroad are "in the the fade" not "is that fade".

[leaguer of one]

In a boat. The boat is in the ocean, but the passengers of the boat are in the boat.

 

...I've lost sight of this argument now, I'm not even sure which side I'm backing

 

 

Regardless of whether the Crossroads is part of the Fade or just in the Fade; how is it evidence that the Old Gods are the Elvehen Gods?

 I never said it was part of the fade I just said it was in it. moving on it proof the elve of old can build  pockets and structures in the fade. The would mean that Arlathal may of been build in a pocket in the fade and it the fabled golden city in the fade.

[midnight tea]

I never said the cross road are literally the same as the fade. i said the crossroad are "in the the fade" not "is that fade".

 

Like I said before - isn't it the same for Thedas as well?

[xPez]

 I never said it was part of the fade I just said it was in it.

 

Sure, fine, but regardless of whether it is in the Fade or part of the Fade or actually a secret chamber at the heart of the Crucible; how does the existence of the Crossroads prove that the Old Gods are the Elvhen Gods?

[Lethaya]

they are not in the fade because they are in the pocket in the fade. Note that she says they are very close to the fade , closer the you can be then the real world. If you on a boat sail, you're on a boat and not in the ocean but if you put a hole in that boat and sink it then your in the ocean.

 

Morrigan says that it isn't the Fade and that it is somewhere in between, presumably in between their world and the Fade. A bit of both, perhaps, but not the Fade itself. And regardless, robertthebard was still originally correct. Also, being closer to something is rather different than being in it.

 

This is getting silly. XD Ha, implying that it wasn't already...

 

@midnight_tea: Ah, but doesn't the Veil keep the Fade separate from the mortal plane (or whatever the heck it'd be called)? Perhaps they were one and the same once, but for now at least, they are... tenuously separated.

[MrMrPendragon]

In a boat. The boat is in the ocean, but the passengers of the boat are in the boat.

 

...I've lost sight of this argument now, I'm not even sure which side I'm backing

 

 

Regardless of whether the Crossroads is part of the Fade or just in the Fade; how is it evidence that the Old Gods are the Elvehen Gods?

 

It proves that the elves created their own little sanctuary, which we all knew already.

 

But I don't exactly know how we can jump from that, to saying that Old Gods are Elven Gods.

 

If anything that just tells me that Fade was already there before the elves even had a civilization and it was Veiled, and given that Yavana says dragons ruled the skies before the Veil was even there, then I suppose we can assume that the Old God dragons existed long before the Elven Gods.