278 réponses à ce sujet

[PatrickBateman]

Are you even listening to yourself? You're gushing over a slow "tactic" that takes forever to do and now you complain that Bronze/Silver takes too long?

Juggernaut doesn't speed up anything, ever. Just the opposite, really.

Agree with you but not 100% When played correctly, he can do nice damage, sure not GI damage though. The point is more as we all agree that just going around platinum "tanking" everything is plain out silly. I can't either for the life of me understand how anyone can find it entertaining to sit in the box of shame for 45-50 minutes, might as well watch new paint dry on a wall or something instead. The Juggernaut can do so much more.

[Kenny Bania]

This has nothing to do with elites or pugs. This is about logic. Box of shame draws out missions to ~45min with a fairly high risk of wiping during object waves because the players never learned how to do those. Properly playing a Gold mission instead will take half the time, so in 45min you'll get more of everything: credits, exp, challenges... and you get better at the game.

 

You're assuming those who box of shame it can complete a gold game normally.

[DaemionMoadrin]

You're assuming those who box of shame it can complete a gold game normally.

 

Even repeatedly failing to complete a gold game would be faster for gaining credits and exp. And if that's too hard, there's always Bronze and Silver. Camping on Plat is inefficient and I don't see how it makes one a better player.

 

@PatrickBateman: Sure, my Juggernaut is more about damage than tanking... but even with AM3 it is slower than every other kit. In a good team, the Juggernaut will be last to arrive at a spawn and won't be able to contribute much. It doesn't speed things up, it's more an insurance for completion (if competent).

[Kenny Bania]

Even repeatedly failing to complete a gold game would be faster for gaining credits and exp. And if that's too hard, there's always Bronze and Silver.

 

Yeah, I'm not so sure. There's a reason they do it.

[PatrickBateman]

Even repeatedly failing to complete a gold game would be faster for gaining credits and exp. And if that's too hard, there's always Bronze and Silver. Camping on Plat is inefficient and I don't see how it makes one a better player.

@PatrickBateman: Sure, my Juggernaut is more about damage than tanking... but even with AM3 it is slower than every other kit. In a good team, the Juggernaut will be last to arrive at a spawn and won't be able to contribute much. It doesn't speed things up, it's more an insurance for completion (if competent).

Yeah, Condor is painfull with him, but on a map as Glacier with a lol-Reegar he can top score even in a good team.

[NuclearTech76]

Or a possessed abomination that "someone" happened to kite into the box 

Lolkite. Try lash into the box. 

[NuclearTech76]

You're assuming those who box of shame it can complete a gold game normally.

I don't even understand the purpose of farming those credits like that. I'm going to play Platinum to farm credits for weapons that I'll never understand how to use because I'm a goddamn fucktard that likes to play in a box. 

[Kenny Bania]

I don't even understand the purpose of farming those credits like that. I'm going to play Platinum to farm credits for weapons that I'll never understand how to use because I'm a goddamn fucktard that likes to play in a box. 

 

Me neither. I've never farmed anything, and I never will. I'd rather have fun.

[capn233]

The Jugg came up over in the DAI forum.  Apparently the way to trivialize Platinum is to put one on the team and shoot in their general direction while they tank everything.

 

Also, I farmed a lot of credits and am not ashamed of that.  Pretty much the best way to unlock a manifest legitimately.  But that is rocket farming Glacier, not trying to torture yourself on Rio.

[Miniditka77]

Even repeatedly failing to complete a gold game would be faster for gaining credits and exp. And if that's too hard, there's always Bronze and Silver. Camping on Plat is inefficient and I don't see how it makes one a better player.

 

@PatrickBateman: Sure, my Juggernaut is more about damage than tanking... but even with AM3 it is slower than every other kit. In a good team, the Juggernaut will be last to arrive at a spawn and won't be able to contribute much. It doesn't speed things up, it's more an insurance for completion (if competent).

 

If they are actually extracting reliably on Platinum, they are being pretty credit-efficient.  Even by breezing through Silver, the best you can do without a skilled player on the team is probably a little over 100k credits an hour.  If you take 45-50 minutes to beat Platinum using the Box, you're coming out ahead.  It's possible repeated Wave 6 Gold wipes could be more efficient I guess, but these people may not even be able to clear Wave 6 Gold reliably.

 

And your second paragraph is pretty right on.  For most PUGs, where people aren't spawn-rushing, the offensive Adrenaline Mod Jugg can do really, really well.  But if you're playing with good players who are rushing and destroying spawns quickly, the Jugg is going to get left in the dust.

[DaemionMoadrin]

If they are actually extracting reliably on Platinum, they are being pretty credit-efficient.  Even by breezing through Silver, the best you can do without a skilled player on the team is probably a little over 100k credits an hour.  If you take 45-50 minutes to beat Platinum using the Box, you're coming out ahead.  It's possible repeated Wave 6 Gold wipes could be more efficient I guess, but these people may not even be able to clear Wave 6 Gold reliably.

 

And your second paragraph is pretty right on.  For most PUGs, where people aren't spawn-rushing, the offensive Adrenaline Mod Jugg can do really, really well.  But if you're playing with good players who are rushing and destroying spawns quickly, the Jugg is going to get left in the dust.

 

That assumes they do not wipe on object waves on Plat. If they are so bad they have to camp in the box, then I'm pretty sure they don't extract each mission. I was talking about more than credits... actually playing the game benefits you in more than one area. At least you should get better at it. Someone who got a maxed manifest by hiding in the box of shame will still be a complete noob by the time they think they are ready for the other maps.

[Quarian Master Race]

Nobody uses this any more.

I'm doing quite a bit of plat pugging due to starting a new account recently. Rio and lolgiant presets with puggernauts as host dwarf all other combinations.

 

You a cod player are you? "holding a position and bottlenecking the enemy" is, indeed, a tactic.  a textbook one, in fact.

 

There's no "leeching" or "bad players" here.  Its just a strategy for those who hate constantly running around.  That's all.  Running around may be more fun FOR YOU, but not for everyone. I get bored out of my mind and eventually just find a spot and stay, letting the enemies come to me, then relocating if they flank me. I'd rather draw them out than hunt them down.

No it isn't. You're abusing what is essentially an enemy AI pathing/map design exploit wherein sync units can't reach you and ranged units are too stupid to react with even as simple a change in strategy as keeping distance from the clusterfuck centered around the puggernaut. Even proning under a desk in the corner and aiming at a doorway in CoD takes more intelligence, because at least the enemies are thinking individuals who can react to you and do something other than walking right into your bullets (most of the time). You insult the CoD playerbase of dudebros and racist 12 year olds by comparing their intelligence to box of shamers. 

It is leeching done exclusively by bad players. If you just wanted to camp you can easily do that on Rio, for example by RHAing at either end of the map and aiming at the two walkways because of the way spawns are designed and ammo boxes are positioned, but typical box of shamers are too bad to actually kill the enemies and avoid sync kills while doing this.

 

Oh, if you weren't around for their last exploits, you have no idea yet...

Juggernaut isn't a Soldier. It's a mage healer with a life drain spell.

[Swan Killer]

 You insult the CoD playerbase of dudebros and racist 12 year olds by comparing their intelligence to box of shamers. 

 

 

         

[Catastrophy]

[...]

 

Juggernaut isn't a Soldier. It's a mage healer with a life drain spell.

I spec out of turret, my Juggs is a dark biotic girl-Sith. But that's all show to obscure that the platform never figured out to compute coordinates for biotic charges.

[Miniditka77]

That assumes they do not wipe on object waves on Plat. If they are so bad they have to camp in the box, then I'm pretty sure they don't extract each mission. I was talking about more than credits... actually playing the game benefits you in more than one area. At least you should get better at it. Someone who got a maxed manifest by hiding in the box of shame will still be a complete noob by the time they think they are ready for the other maps.

 

That's true - I just assumed that if they were actually doing the Box of Shame, they had a good reason for doing it (i.e., they extract most of the time).  If that's not the case, then that just adds an extra layer of stupidity.  

 

I guess there is a reason why I see players come into Gold lobbies with Level X UR weapons and contribute nothing.  They can't all be obscenely drunk, right?

[capn233]

I guess there is a reason why I see players come into Gold lobbies with Level X UR weapons and contribute nothing.  They can't all be obscenely drunk, right?

 

Challenge accepted.

[NuclearTech76]

I mean what do you consider obscenely drunk? 

[Silvair]

 

Are you even listening to yourself? You're gushing over a slow "tactic" that takes forever to do and now you complain that Bronze/Silver takes too long? 

 

Juggernaut doesn't speed up anything, ever. Just the opposite, really.

No, I mean it'd take forever to get credits through bronze and silver, and I can speed up my credit making by going Jug in Platinum and Gold (I can do gold, but I'm mostly utility because I don't have great guns yet), as that's the only "good" class I have unlocked so far that doesn't require good weapons.

 

 

This has nothing to do with elites or pugs. This is about logic. Box of shame draws out missions to ~45min with a fairly high risk of wiping during object waves because the players never learned how to do those. Properly playing a Gold mission instead will take half the time, so in 45min you'll get more of everything: credits, exp, challenges... and you get better at the game.

Why the hell does it take you 45 minutes?!  Shouldn't take more than around 15 doing that, tops.

 

 

Also, as I said...REPEATEDLY now, I was just using that as the go-to example of Jug tanking the entire wave together for the rest of the team to wipe out in one go.

 

And where are you getting "players never learned how to do object waves" from?

 

Do you even listen to yourself, or just drift in and out as you talk crap?

 

 

Agree with you but not 100% When played correctly, he can do nice damage, sure not GI damage though. The point is more as we all agree that just going around platinum "tanking" everything is plain out silly. I can't either for the life of me understand how anyone can find it entertaining to sit in the box of shame for 45-50 minutes, might as well watch new paint dry on a wall or something instead. The Juggernaut can do so much more.

I love the adrenaline rush of getting literally dogpiled by a full platinum wave but still coming out on top

 

 

 

 

Yeah I'm not gonna try that crap with a bad team but when see everyone automatically coordinate, see that they know what they are doing, hell yeah I'm doing it. 

 

 

Why do you guys just make up trash to talk instead of thinking for a few seconds?

[DaemionMoadrin]

Why do you guys just make up trash to talk instead of thinking for a few seconds?

 

 

Only responding to your posts. You know... perhaps the matter doesn't lie with all of us, maybe it is you...

 

So, box of shame on Plat in 15min? Including object waves? Go on...

[Quarian Master Race]

So, box of shame on Plat in 15min? Including object waves? Go on...

Lol, I want to see this now. I'm not even sure 15 mins would be possible with 3 quite skilled AC5 rocket farmers currying the puggernaut and not even letting enemies reach the box, unless they got very favourable objectives instead of cross map escorts or whatever. Nevermind a team actually waiting in the box for the enemies to take a minute and a half traversing the map at the start of every wave.

OP could you post video or screenshots of your amazing strategic acumen with the Puggernaut?
 

[capn233]

Hmmm Rio in the box in 15 minutes...

 

The main problem with camping Rio (at either end really), is that typically it takes a while for the units to trickle towards you.  Granted, that is partly the point of the tactic with regards to completing games, but it is relatively counter productive for faster times.

 

Not sure what composition would be great for this, probably Demo, Valkyrie, Jugg and maybe GTS with some Reegar IA action thrown in.  At least if you are talking near pure box camping.

 

If box is mainly last resort, then you could throw in a Javelin character I suppose.

 

In any case, it is the objectives that suck on Rio.  Jugg partially exacerbates this since it takes too long to get to objectives at the other side of the map, so hack or escort progress is going to be slower than it should.  Hack in the "power station" near the box all 3 times wouldn't be too horrible time wise I guess.  Targets potentially come to you, but potentially require tracking them down depending on spawns (so you don't go below the time limit).

 

From my experience in Rio pugs from way back when this map was practically the only platinum map you landed in outside private lobbies, the issue is most of the players have a lot of difficulty doing the cross map escorts, some hacks, and devices without dropping.  Cross map escort is very difficult to hero/solo, since the movement speed is so low and the railing isn't great cover.

 

And finally, gold pugs are fairly unlikely to actually be 15 minute games.  Rio platinum pug in 15 minutes just seems like a tall order.

 

In any case, if someone wants to play Rio, it doesn't bother me.  I would recommend a different map if they asked for my advice though.

[RustyBuckets02]

Lol, I want to see this now. I'm not even sure 15 mins would be possible with 3 quite skilled AC5 rocket farmers currying the puggernaut
 

 

The average lobby is capable of wiping in far less time than that.

[Silvair]

Hmmm Rio in the box in 15 minutes...

 

The main problem with camping Rio (at either end really), is that typically it takes a while for the units to trickle towards you.  Granted, that is partly the point of the tactic with regards to completing games, but it is relatively counter productive for faster times.

 

Not sure what composition would be great for this, probably Demo, Valkyrie, Jugg and maybe GTS with some Reegar IA action thrown in.  At least if you are talking near pure box camping.

 

If box is mainly last resort, then you could throw in a Javelin character I suppose.

 

In any case, it is the objectives that suck on Rio.  Jugg partially exacerbates this since it takes too long to get to objectives at the other side of the map, so hack or escort progress is going to be slower than it should.  Hack in the "power station" near the box all 3 times wouldn't be too horrible time wise I guess.  Targets potentially come to you, but potentially require tracking them down depending on spawns (so you don't go below the time limit).

 

From my experience in Rio pugs from way back when this map was practically the only platinum map you landed in outside private lobbies, the issue is most of the players have a lot of difficulty doing the cross map escorts, some hacks, and devices without dropping.  Cross map escort is very difficult to hero/solo, since the movement speed is so low and the railing isn't great cover.

 

And finally, gold pugs are fairly unlikely to actually be 15 minute games.  Rio platinum pug in 15 minutes just seems like a tall order.

 

In any case, if someone wants to play Rio, it doesn't bother me.  I would recommend a different map if they asked for my advice though.

Going off memory, generally it was "Jug stays outside box, right side (facing box) tanking most if not all of the wave, rest of the team nukes bunches around Jug, takes care of any stragglers that go around the other side, and takes out long range units that aren't/are taking too long to approach"  Granted these were mostly maxed manifests lol.  I couldn't pull that off now, until I get a little better gear so I'm not going to try that on Plat for a while (Right now, I'll just go QI and leech by stealthing most of the time and pulling distractions.  I CAN jug on plat but I won' tbe as good as I was before until I regain all my gear.)

 

I don't really care what map, just in Rio, that's the go to strategy.  Like I said, when I go Jugg, I'm gonna tank.  It's fun.

 

15 maybe an exaggeration (off memory) but so is 45 minutes, holy crap.

 

 

I generally had good pug teams back on 360, so pugging rioplat was never really an issue.

[NuclearTech76]

Hmmm Rio in the box in 15 minutes...

The main problem with camping Rio (at either end really), is that typically it takes a while for the units to trickle towards you. Granted, that is partly the point of the tactic with regards to completing games, but it is relatively counter productive for faster times.

Not sure what composition would be great for this, probably Demo, Valkyrie, Jugg and maybe GTS with some Reegar IA action thrown in. At least if you are talking near pure box camping.

If box is mainly last resort, then you could throw in a Javelin character I suppose.

In any case, it is the objectives that suck on Rio. Jugg partially exacerbates this since it takes too long to get to objectives at the other side of the map, so hack or escort progress is going to be slower than it should. Hack in the "power station" near the box all 3 times wouldn't be too horrible time wise I guess. Targets potentially come to you, but potentially require tracking them down depending on spawns (so you don't go below the time limit).

From my experience in Rio pugs from way back when this map was practically the only platinum map you landed in outside private lobbies, the issue is most of the players have a lot of difficulty doing the cross map escorts, some hacks, and devices without dropping. Cross map escort is very difficult to hero/solo, since the movement speed is so low and the railing isn't great cover.

And finally, gold pugs are fairly unlikely to actually be 15 minute games. Rio platinum pug in 15 minutes just seems like a tall order.

In any case, if someone wants to play Rio, it doesn't bother me. I would recommend a different map if they asked for my advice though.

Javelin GI with drill maybe? Arc nades also can be rained across the map but u might need a spotter. If just in the box though idk javelin GI is probably the best choice. Maybe a drell with recon mine

[capn233]

I thought I remembered being able to hit through the center portion just with dual piercing and phasics, but it has been a while.