200 réponses à ce sujet

[Silvair]

It's been 3 years.

 

Orange means hacked.

Hacked means on our side.

On our side means FOCUS ON THE OTHERS FIRST.

 

I can understand if its a Turret or Prime, and we need to drop it quick, but like...I see a spawn mob of Geth.  I sab the Flamer in the middle.  It starts to torch the entire mob for us but NOPE pug teammate targets JUST THAT ONE FIRST.  DEAR GOD WHY MAN.  I'm not marking him for you!  Or like when I hack a turret that is just being laid down.  So it can immediately mow down the entire Cerby unit surrounding it.  But NOPE teammate targets the turret first.  WHYYYYYYY.  Or even when there's two Primes. I hack the furthest one so the front one will put its back to us to face it, disabling both of them as a threat for a few seconds.  So instead...teammates target the orange one.  You eediots.

 

And the tech vulnerability isn't even an excuse because a) Notice how I'm not following it up with anything tech related, and take the hint that I didn't go with that talent, and THEY ARENT EITHER.  Just shooting or using biotics or whatever, so obviously they weren't even thinking of that.

 

Forgot how frustrating it can be to play with randoms sometimes....

 

 

Anyone else still come across people not cooperating as a team like that?

[JGDD]

"Anyone else still come across people not cooperating as a team like that?"  < Guilty as charged.

 

Ain't got time to watch rock' em sock 'em robots.

[Silvair]

"Anyone else still come across people not cooperating as a team like that?"  < Guilty as charged.

 

Ain't got time to watch rock' em sock 'em robots.

but...but...TARGET THE HOSTILES!  Not the allied unit!

[HamleticTortoise]

1) trigger finger reflex at seeing turret/pyro/hunter in line of sight. We have all been downed too many times by those to stop and think

 

2) the hacked machine is standing still, out in the open, not firing at players. How can one ignore such a juicy target in the heat of the battle?

 

I agree that shooting hacked Atlases, esp. when another one is present, is pretty inefficient, though I am often guilty of the same offense.

 

I suggest a twofold solution: hack less aggravating targets (troopers, out-of-sight primes, bombers), and change your expectations on the result of using sabotage :  you can now act as a fireteam leader, directing firepower wherever you desire; also, you are helping going through the wave budget faster

Finally, I think the actual fight-for-you part of sabotaging is pretty underwhelming in practice, but I am no expert on the matter, and will leave more experienced players to actually explain this.

[Aetika]

IMO, the difference hacked units do is so small, it doesn´t matter in the end. Sabotage is usefull for saving others from being downed by hunter or pyro, definitely life saver when used on turrets, good for staggering, but by the time they turn to attack enemies, it almost wears off and if they do manage to attack something, they can create only small, short and limited distraction. It´s almost safer to shoot hacked units when they can´t fight back and just rid of them. Maybe if sabotage lasted longer, they could create some chaos in enemy ranks, I don´t know.

[MajorStupidity]

Hacked units only actually assist you for a few seconds at best, and they generally don't accomplish too much. They are not going to suddenly go and wipe out the other enemies in the 5 seconds they are hacked fully. So it is in my best interest to kill this unit which is hacked before it becomes unhacked and hostile to me. I would rather just kill all the enemies and have the game end sometime soon rather than wait pointlessly for sabotage. Doesn't help that enemies gain immunity to sabotage after a couple of casts.

[DaemionMoadrin]

IMO, the difference hacked units do is so small, it doesn´t matter in the end. Sabotage is usefull for saving others from being downed by hunter or pyro, definitely life saver when used on turrets, good for staggering, but by the time they turn to attack enemies, it almost wears off and if they do manage to attack something, they can create only small, short and limited distraction. It´s almost safer to shoot hacked units when they can´t fight back and just rid of them. Maybe if sabotage lasted longer, they could create some chaos in enemy ranks, I don´t know.

 

I don't know what happened but a few days ago my Sabotage lasted for at least 30sec, which surprised me a lot because usually it's only ~5sec. I sabotaged a Trooper who walked around the corner out of sight in that moment, so I switched targets. 20sec later there was a kill message, the trooper took down another. I went back there to look and it was still hacked, huddling in hard cover, shooting at other Geth.

 

I asked the host if the game was modded but didn't receive an answer. It was fun though. TC, Sabotage target 1, snipe target 2, get 2+ kills. A Prime or Pyro in the middle of a spawn ... hahaha.

 

I should look if I can replicate this behaviour, it was too much fun.

[Silvair]

IMO, the difference hacked units do is so small, it doesn´t matter in the end. Sabotage is usefull for saving others from being downed by hunter or pyro, definitely life saver when used on turrets, good for staggering, but by the time they turn to attack enemies, it almost wears off and if they do manage to attack something, they can create only small, short and limited distraction. It´s almost safer to shoot hacked units when they can´t fight back and just rid of them. Maybe if sabotage lasted longer, they could create some chaos in enemy ranks, I don´t know.

 

Hacked units only actually assist you for a few seconds at best, and they generally don't accomplish too much. They are not going to suddenly go and wipe out the other enemies in the 5 seconds they are hacked fully. So it is in my best interest to kill this unit which is hacked before it becomes unhacked and hostile to me. I would rather just kill all the enemies and have the game end sometime soon rather than wait pointlessly for sabotage. Doesn't help that enemies gain immunity to sabotage after a couple of casts.

I have mine set to last for longer (like ten seconds or something) plus increased fire rate, movement, and damage.   So when I hack a rocket or flame geth, they usually immediately turn around and annihilate a fellow geth or two, short of a Prime.

 

Primes are silly because sometimes they'll waste time summoning a drone or turret, only to then destroy said drone or turret because they are shooting back at it lol.

 

Same with Turrets.  I've seen em mow down 2-3 enemies within seconds.

 

it does depend on when you hack them though.  If you get them in mid attack animation, they'll finish, then there's a pause as the game recalculates their targeting, THEN they'll turn around to face.  But if you say, hack the Flamer in the back of a group, already facing the rest? He'll immediately start torching them all.

 

 

 

Either way, I don't see the point of taking out the hacked target BEFORE the unhacked one.  Seems a better plan to wipe out the still attacking enemy, then just mop up the hacked one after.

 

 

 

Also related, I wish people would stop focusing on Pyros after you see their tank leaking.  Unless they are within range to attack you, you can go ahead  and focus on other enemies instead now, that ones gonna be dead in a few seconds anyway...

[JGDD]

but...but...TARGET THE HOSTILES!  Not the allied unit!

That allied unit, he turns on you in about 5 seconds. If it's a large and dangerous 'allied' unit then all the more reason to snuff it from existence ASAP.

[Turian Master Race]

Silvair is correct in this case. If you spec for duration and berserker hacked enemies can do nice damage. Also, as he said enemies will always carry out the attack they started, so hacking them mid attack is a kind of pointless (from hacking point of view) since they will finish that attack anyway, shortening the time they will fight for you.

[JGDD]

This is like a trip back to 2012. When the forums of old were awash with QFI players bemoaning this very same thing.

 

Then the nerfbat took a mighty swing at Sabotage in all its forms. Knocked it out of the park along with any sane reason to continue using it to hack robutts.

[Turian Master Race]

This is like a trip back to 2012. When the forums of old were awash with QFI players bemoaning this very same thing.

 

Then the nerfbat took a mighty swing at Sabotage in all its forms. Knocked it out of the park along with any sane reason to continue using it to hack robutts.

There are at least two sane reasons:

 

- aggro dump

- kill help

 

Just because most of the bsn-ers have maxed out manifest and play with the best UR guns (and thus can kill enemies in seconds), it does not mean everyone plays like that or have to play like that.

[DaemionMoadrin]

Thing is, my Sabotage is specced for Backfire, Explosive Hack and Tech Vulnerability... and it still lasted ~30sec. Which was so much fun...

[Learn To Love Yourself]

Can flamer take down an unshielded unit in one cast?

[JGDD]

Correct. They don't have to play like that. Then again, the random users you play with don't have to wait for your kitschy power to run its course before unloading on whatever their crosshairs fall upon. In the line of fire == diediedie! Orange or not.

[HamleticTortoise]

Silvair is correct in this case. If you spec for duration and berserker hacked enemies can do nice damage. Also, as he said enemies will always carry out the attack they started, so hacking them mid attack is a kind of pointless (from hacking point of view) since they will finish that attack anyway, shortening the time they will fight for you.

 

Your points are valid, but I would like to point out that OP mentions speccing into Tech Vulnerability, so part of that damage does not materialize. I do spec fully into sabotage on most kits, but mostly for the other advantages it grants, and certainly do not expect other players to ignore the hacked unit.

Very good point on the mid-attack bit (both from you and the OP!) though, I had not considered it so far, but certainly will from now on!

[Turian Master Race]

Correct. They don't have to play like that. Then again, the random users you play with don't have to wait for your kitschy power to run its course before unloading on whatever their crosshairs fall upon. In the line of fire == diediedie! Orange or not.

They don't have to but it benefits them. Just like you don't have to avoid a target with biotic primer when you have distruptor ammo, but avoiding it will benefit the primer and thus the team on the long run.

 

The question is whether you want to play a team game and give at least a minimal effort to synergize with the others, or do you treat your "allies" at best as decoys or at worst obstacles in your way of killing everything.

[Clips7]

Hmmm...idk....everything can be so frantic at times. Hacked enemies, enemies in general all get waxed...especially geth. I can see maybe avoiding hitting big targets like Atlas's  or Primes, since they can deal heavy damage, but like others have mentioned, they do very little damage before they turn around and start unloading on you again, furthermore that power is glitched to no end...sometimes it doesn't even work.

[Aetika]

Either way, I don't see the point of taking out the hacked target BEFORE the unhacked one.  Seems a better plan to wipe out the still attacking enemy, then just mop up the hacked one after.

 

 

The point is that you know it´s dead and done for, no longer a threat, while if you leave it, you have to be now aware there is unit around that will in next few seconds turn hostile, which can be dangerous at times.

I am not going to prioritize hacked units over another ones though. I think in this case it simply is instinct to shoot them as they light up. You can see the same with biotics. Once targets start glowing blue they are immediatelly targeted because they stand out.

[FuriousFelicia]

IMO, the difference hacked units do is so small, it doesn´t matter in the end. Sabotage is usefull for saving others from being downed by hunter or pyro, definitely life saver when used on turrets, good for staggering, but by the time they turn to attack enemies, it almost wears off and if they do manage to attack something, they can create only small, short and limited distraction. It´s almost safer to shoot hacked units when they can´t fight back and just rid of them. Maybe if sabotage lasted longer, they could create some chaos in enemy ranks, I don´t know.

Hacking a pyro or a trooper near a fallen mate is not helpful. They are going to want to stop them anyway. Hacked robots sometimes don't act hacked, that is they'll just continue to shoot at you or your mates.

But on the other hand, I can clear first 2 waves of Geth by simply hacking the right targets in right scenarios. 90% AI hacking, 10% gun. The trick is to be out of sight at all times and you need to flock the enemy. Recently I had a RT drop 6 enemies before first Jack wore down.

[JGDD]

The question is whether you want to play a team game and give at least a minimal effort to synergize with the others, or do you treat your "allies" at best as decoys or at worst obstacles in your way of killing everything.

I tend to pay heed to biotics when present.

 

I will not go out of my way to avoid taking down a hacked anything, though. This is a game about war. Making your enemies do a little jig is cute and all, but the main thing you do in a war game is kill enemies. Someone bitching about shooting at an enemy that is going to perish sooner or later needs to take a look at the larger picture.

[GruntKitterhand]

Atlases, Pyros and Turrets are the only 'orange' enemies I ever hesitate over.  Everything else just gets killed.  I always spec for exploding hack, so it's often worth it for collateral damage.  Sabotage is the most frustrating power in the game where pugs in general are concerned, if you take it seriously.  Better to just accept that if the enemies are dying, it's all good.  My QFI only uses Sabotage to set up her melee, my Quarksman specs out of it, and my TSab hasn't gone into battle in a very very long time.

 

QMR achieved a state of Nirvana last night by hacking an Atlas which killed a Phantom - this is something everyone should always be on the lookout for, like a Tech Armour Killstreak.

[FuriousFelicia]

You can get a sabotage kill streaks too, even when using a Widow.

OP you and I should get a duo going sometime. I'm aking to do a hacking duo vs Geth with someone. It's a game of tactics and patience mostly but it can get pretty hilarious.

[Silvair]

 

Hacking a pyro or a trooper near a fallen mate is not helpful. They are going to want to stop them anyway. Hacked robots sometimes don't act hacked, that is they'll just continue to shoot at you or your mates.

But on the other hand, I can clear first 2 waves of Geth by simply hacking the right targets in right scenarios. 90% AI hacking, 10% gun. The trick is to be out of sight at all times and you need to flock the enemy. Recently I had a RT drop 6 enemies before first Jack wore down.

On the "don't act hacked", as I mentioned before, the trick is to hack ones that are in the back of a group, not attacking yet.  If you try to hack one that is already engaging, it will finish its attack first, then pause, then turn around, and that's half your hack time gone right there.  HOWEVER, if you hack one that hasn't engaged you yet, it will immediately attack its brethren, because it doesn't have to "back out" of attacking you first.  THere's a slight delay if its already performing an action.

 

 

I tend to pay heed to biotics when present.

 

I will not go out of my way to avoid taking down a hacked anything, though. This is a game about war. Making your enemies do a little jig is cute and all, but the main thing you do in a war game is kill enemies. Someone bitching about shooting at an enemy that is going to perish sooner or later needs to take a look at the larger picture.

If you really believed that, then you would be more efficient and attack the non hacked ones first, instead of being redundant and attacking the allied unit.  Its one thing if thats the only unity around, but its honestly kinda stupid to specifically target the hacked unit when there's others around that need to be dropped first.

 

Its you that's not looking at the larger picture, no offense intended.  When an ally disables an enemy, that leaves you free to focus on the ones still remaining, not waste time, ammo, and effort focusing on the disabled enemy that's currently aiding you.

 

Besides, one of two things will happen: The hacked unit will destroy the others, or the others will destroy the hacked unit.  Either way, all enemies distracted, leaving players free to focus fire.  The smart thing would be to focus on the NOT orange units, because if you destroy the orange first, they all go back to focusing fire on the players again.  But if you focus on the NOT orange enemies, then you have the players plus the hacked unit attacking the remaining enemies, dropping everything that much faster.

 

 

Can flamer take down an unshielded unit in one cast?

 

Usually, yes.  Especially if Berserked.

 

 

 

You can get a sabotage kill streaks too, even when using a Widow.

OP you and I should get a duo going sometime. I'm aking to do a hacking duo vs Geth with someone. It's a game of tactics and patience mostly but it can get pretty hilarious.

I'm all for it.  I'm outta work at the moment so i'm either doing applications or playing mass effect lol.  I do need to stick to silver (i can do gold but...i won't do much direct damage, just focus on Sab), because I'm starting fresh on PC.  Though fair warning, I'm laid back and couldn't care less about topping the scoreboard (it's a team game, why would I care?).  And I don't have a mic for pc lol.

[Aetika]

Hacking a pyro or a trooper near a fallen mate is not helpful. They are going to want to stop them anyway. Hacked robots sometimes don't act hacked, that is they'll just continue to shoot at you or your mates.

But on the other hand, I can clear first 2 waves of Geth by simply hacking the right targets in right scenarios. 90% AI hacking, 10% gun. The trick is to be out of sight at all times and you need to flock the enemy. Recently I had a RT drop 6 enemies before first Jack wore down.

 

I maybe worded it bad. I meant it will save them from going down, not from bleeding out. It´s true, enemies will stomp despite being sabotaged. Pyros especially don´t care.