327 réponses à ce sujet

[TheOgre]

I don't think Dragon Age was ever Dark Fantasy. It's always had more in common with Lord of the Rings than it has with ASOIAF (sorry Laidlaw, but it's true.) The Witcher games have kind of had a monopoly on Dark Fantasy for the last few years. Dragon age went in a different direction much like each Saints Row game becomes so much more drastically different to GTA than the last.

 

That's not to say Dragon Age doesn't have dark elements, it does. It's the execution that's lacking. It breaks the "show, don't tell" rule constantly. It's incredibly cheesy and cartoony, breaks the fourth wall too often with pop culture references/jokes and nods to the fanbase. It's like a dark, adult story that's been condensed to be made into an epidode of Scooby-Doo (yes I say that a lot, but it's what it reminds me of most)

 

Dragon Age: Origins is somewhat exempt from this due to a number of reasons. It shows a lot more of whats happening in addition to reading about it, the art style, colour scheme etc. was a lot more dark/gritty. It was also before the writers became obsessed with adding a tidal wave of corny jokes/humour into every conversation, so the atmosphere wasn't constantly being broken. 

 

This... I admit I didn't read much of the codex's when I came across it. I experienced a lot more of the 'grimdark' setting from actually seeing it. So my perception was a bit cloudier. I may just find if I read the codex's it'll be the same in terms of 'dark' but, reading isn't what I take too immersion in sadly.

[WildOrchid]

Origins? Dark fantasy?

 

 

 

*insert jonahlaugh.jpg here*

 

 

 

Dear god, ppl do praise origins way too much than it's worth.. but ofc it's all about which game people prefer. I personally prefer Inquisition way more than origins, even with it's flaws... but honestly let's not pretend origin didn't had flaws.

 

 

Edit: though to be fair, i was hoping DAI would be very dark and not 'don't show, tell' mentality.... well, hopefully in DA4.

[TheOgre]

Origins? Dark fantasy?

 

 

 

*insert jonahlaugh.jpg here*

 

 

 

Dear god, ppl do praise origins way too much than it's worth.. but ofc it's all about which game people prefer. I personally prefer Inquisition way more than origins, even with it's flaws... but honestly let's not pretend origin didn't had flaws.

 

And I think you use too much hyperbole to get a point across. "Dear god ppl" "insert jonalaugh.jpg here". You practically admitted that DAI was much more preferable for yourself. Maybe you praise DAI too much?

 

Difference in opinions. That's all.

[GreyLycanTrope]

I always considered DA to have elements of dark fantasy instead of just being straight up dark fantasy myself. Good dark fantasy tends to make your choices somewhat more morally ambiguous than what DA offered with most of it's choices. The mage/templar war was the closest DA ever got to that, past that issues seem largely black and white.

[WildOrchid]

And I think you use too much hyperbole to get a point across. "Dear god ppl" "insert jonalaugh.jpg here". You practically admitted that DAI was much more preferable for yourself. Maybe you praise DAI too much?

 

Difference in opinions. That's all.

 

You know what's the difference between me and some other fans who praise Origins? That i don't go around, constantly making threads about how "origins was awesome, better than dai". It gets tiresome after thread and thread.

 

I like inquisition, not to the point of calling it "the greatest game of the year". It was good, that's all.

[Shechinah]

I couldn't help but find it a little amusing that the article's author said it was offensive to him as a person of color that "Bioware thinks black people will call them racist if they don't make a world with us in it".

Wait, the author actually says this? I... what? What does it subtract from the game, it's setting and lore to have people of a variety of colors in it?

[TheOgre]

You know what's the difference between me and some other fans who praise Origins? That i don't go around, constantly making threads about how "origins was awesome, better than dai". It gets tiresome after thread and thread.

 

I like inquisition, not to the point of calling it "the greatest game of the year". It was good, that's all.

 

Did they say why they were making threads like that? Did they make lists? It sounds like they are saying its better without constructive criticism which is understandably frustrating. I stated why I believe DAI did not satisfy my own tastes, lore, combat, and other elements over and over again. It gets old repeating why.

[Rawgrim]

The lore went right out the window as soon as they gave every class magical abilities for the sake of kewl.

[philippe willaume]

Well

I would agree with  wildorchid,  despite finding  DA:0 better than DA:i, i don't think DA:0 was that much dark either. 

I though DA:I was good (better than DA:2 in my opinion.)

 

I think l that DA:0 felt darker because the way decisions affect the game/game play and playing Underpowered character it made fight a bit more "grim".

If we want to be fair, the attack on heaven had more elements to give the game a dark undertone than you can find in DA:0. 

May be it does not work as well in DA:I because to go somewhere,  you  have to zap the same re-spawning drones each time you need to go a given way and you kind of have to farm on the way. 

 

you know kind of yes i have to go to save the world from a grim evil at great personal and emotional cost, but nonetheless i have time to blast critters and pick up rocks and  carrots on the way

 

phil

[Hazegurl]

I agree that DAO was not much of a dark fantasy but it was grittier.  I think DAO's theme was darker, much of the violence was shown instead of told which made a bigger impact on the player.  The choices were a bit harder and darker depending.  Like the choice to kill a little boy, finding that kid's mom who was killed, allowing demons to possess people in exchange for whatever, The choices to kill a bunch of cursed wolves or rampage the elves, allow people to be taken and made into Golems et al.  Then there were the brothels, desire demons, and the creepy broodmother plot in the deep roads.

 

DAI comes across a bit more Disney, much of the violence is filtered through notes, It's told but not really shown, most of the choices are gone and with that goes darker choices.  The only one I can think of is letting Celene die but that's more political. Aside from the attack on Haven Cory is more of a laughing stock than a true villain.  And I agree that fighting the same old respawning monsters while farming ore doesn't help. lol!

 

As for POC, I'm not seeing what that has to do with DAI being high fantasy.  There were always POC in Fereldan, Rivaini, Antiva.  I find it odd that he implies offense at all POC being from one piece of land while being okay with all white people coming from Fereldan.  I would say his first mistake is comparing every country in Thedas to IRL countries in the past, except that in the past, POC were all over Europe, including England.  So this is simply a case of the writer, believing that Europe was an all white continent and showing POC actually existing there is thus unrealistic.   Someone needs to point him in the direction of a history book about the Silk Road.

[Gwydden]

If Origins were like DA:I, we would have read about the wounded guy we find in the Korcari wilds in a codex entry. They seem to move ever more to a "tell, don't show" approach of storytelling and reactivity. 

 

While I found DA:I's writing definitely entertaining, especially the companions, I couldn't help but feel that it was sanitized, driven by a near paralyzing fear to offend anyone.

Well, they failed. If only for the simple reason you will always offend someone somewhere for some reason no matter what you do. That's why something being considered 'offensive' or not should have no effect on its inclusion.

 

All they managed to do was make DAI more squickly clean than any other DA game to date. No, DAO and DA2 weren't very 'dark', on the whole, but they had their moments. DAI feels increasingly less like a pseudo-medieval setting and more like a 21st century Renaissance faire. I will give DAI this, however: at least they let go of those 'save A, save B, or save A and B with no consequence' type choices that riled me up to no end.

[dsl08002]

I whole heartily agree with this article, It was a really define story in DAO where it could have taken place in medieval Europe and the same kind of politics as it was then.

Given what has happened in the world the past years, politically, racism, sexuall orientation, equality between men and women etc. I guess Bioware want to bring this things out in a positive way and reach the public as a civil right movement for today, BUT by doing this they havnt been professional and looking at this thing at another perspective like:

What was it back then? How was it back then in the 13th century?

DAI is a fantasy game with present day ideals and that just felt strange and off. which is why I think off DAI as a stand alone game, Nothing really connects DAI to the previous games other than it wears the dragon age name as well has lore in it.

AS an example is this with the character Krem, if bioware would have followed the same kind of medieval sensation with same kind of ideals this would be very Tabu and that secret have to be kept otherwise krem would have turned up dead wither by chantry or by a mob.

[Gwydden]

I think what they attempted to do is progress the world. We went from a dangerous Blight to political turmoil and advancing technology (like the Surgeon tells you), so with that goes that darker times of the past. We can't always live in constant dark times, but the threat does remain even if it's not as bad as it once was. However with rumors of a Deep Roads DLC and most likely another Blight to still come (not all the OG are gone) we might see it change again.

Thedas may be going through its own Renaissance, but the actual Renaissance was indistinguishable from the late Middle Ages for most of the population. Heck, DAI might have been set in a pseudo-Victorian era or even the first half of the 20th century and still be way too out of place.

 

Maybe it's just that I'm a bit of a history buff, but I'd genuinely love it if DA4 made an effort to actually make you live the times. Especially since these particular times come with extra dragons, demons, darkspawn, and mages. That should make it more dangerous, not less.

 

Given what has happened in the world the past years, politically, racism, sexuall orientation, equality between men etc. I guess Bioware want to bring this things out in a positive way and reach the public as a civil right movement for today, BUT by doing this they havnt been professional and looking at this thing at another perspective like:

It's not that dealing with civil rights issues is out of place. It's the way they deal with them. You don't get civil rights movements, as we understand them, at least until the late 19th century. Most don't gain traction until halfway through the 20th. These issues were dealt with very differently in Ye Olde Days.

 

I'm guessing Bioware was trying to appease the kind of people who think Game of Thrones is actually a wistful patriarchal callback to the time straight white men ruled the world, the kind of people who cannot conceive of fiction that's not escapist, which sadly do exist.

[Gwydden]

It's advancing pretty fast, no doubt about that. I think they feared dragging out too much of the same old thing and tried something new. As you said though, the timing is off by quite a few centuries, since it's only been 10 years in the game.

 

I could be wrong, but DAI was possibly just a break and to introduce and conclude characters from the novels and old games. We basically finished up in Southern Thedas. It's done now in my opinion, and from what we've learned and what we expect, it will probably become darker as we get to the heart of the story now. If we head to Tevinter or the Anderfels or any where like that, it will not be a cute game. They can't make Tevinter into a nice place with just minor corruption and minor rebels. Even Dorian warned it's not like that. Orlais was the pretty place.

I hope you're right. I have nightmares were magisters sing Kumbaya with their slaves and punish them by sending them to bed without their supper. Meanwhile the qunari give out free candy to Rivaini kids and campaign for gay marriage in the streets of Antiva. The crows fight with water balloons 

[SnakeCode]

I hope you're right. I have nightmares were magisters sing Kumbaya with their slaves and punish them by sending them to bed without their supper. Meanwhile the qunari give out free candy to Rivaini kids and campaign for gay marriage in the streets of Antiva. The crows fight with water balloons 

Well, the Qunari are already halfway there. It wouldn't shock me to see Tevinter being filled with Krems and Dorians, with Danarius and his ilk being the exceptions.

[Gileadan]

Well, the Qunari are already halfway there. It wouldn't shock me to see Tevinter being filled with Krems and Dorians, with Danarius and his ilk being the exceptions.

Then all that's left to do is add more pop culture references to the characters' dialogue, and the feeling that I'm talking to present day western cosplayers instead of people from a fantasy setting will be complete.

[Gwydden]

Then all that's left to do is add more pop culture references to the characters' dialogue, and the feeling that I'm talking to present day western cosplayers instead of people from a fantasy setting will be complete.

I think this is actually an advantage Mass Effect has over Dragon Age. Bioware's signature modernism and their particular brand of humor don't feel so out of place in a science fiction setting.

 

In general, ME takes itself a lot less seriously than DA, which I appreciate. Sometimes I think DA has an entirely too high opinion of itself.

[Sartoz]

http://tay.kotaku.co...fant-1662330835

 

I just read this article and sadly its very true


Apart from the short story and terrible open world this bugged me the most about DA:I

Its just not DA anymore, just another generic high fantasy franchise

 

Anyone else here agree? I doubt DA4 will be better but I still hope Bioware goes back to DA:O

 

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This washed and scrubbed DA is better for marketing the game to a broader audience, like the casual gamer and possible mobile market. EA is here to make money and not to appease to the "purists".  Which is why I now play the free Path of Exile MMO... a true old style RPG which is dark... has zombies from Diablo, dungeons from Diablo, body parts exploding... etc..

[andy6915]

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