44 Antworten in diesem Thema

[Laughing_Man]

As for the council being dumb, It has been stated in the codex that the reapers were a myth to many primitive civilizations and that's why the council didn't believe it. As for the continued disbelief of the reapers,  It's just that they're in denial, Just like those conservatives who won't admit that the Earth is dying and that global warming is real.

 

Well, I have stated in my reply above why the narrative style was changed. As for the Council trying not to try new things, It's fear of the unknown, Specially after the Rachni war. They just became reluctant to trying new things. And I've also stated in the above comment the other two reasons why the council denied the reaper threat. Anyways, This photo is appropriate:

 

That's simply not good enough. The council has under them some of the best and the brightest in the galaxy just waiting in line to do the hard thinking for them. They should have thought about various doomsday scenarios especially after the Rachni war, but even before the war they had enough time to wonder about things and try to understand the relics that seemingly just sat around for 2000 years, until Dude!Shepard came along.

 

My previous points still stand, this is difficult to explain without a liberal use of the Idiot's Ball.

[Laughing_Man]

Pretty sure the same thing could be said about the US government. Yet still, They're denying climate change. Cynicism and wanting to stick to what's familiar kicks in naturally to some people. You just can't help it. Shepard just happened to be the one who first discovered a rather obvious evidence of a reaper invasion. And it kinda rubbed me the wrong way when Shepard just went "REAPERS ARE COMING" ever since the first time he heard about them. The concept needed to be analyzed to assess all the possible scenarios first. But that's besides the point.

 

The US government is not the only one on earth. There are a lot of political problems that stand in the way of a global effort to combat climate change.(if it's even possible) The council on the other hand, has access to practically unlimited funds, spectres that treat the law as a joke if it stands in the way, and access to the best scientists in the galaxy - all for a period of about 2000 years.

 

Your political disagreements with the US government aside, there is quite a bit of difference.

[GriffithBlight]

This is actually one of the things in ME that really bothers me, and I don't mean like the physics nitpicking I usually do. No, this is something that actually bothers me about the MEU. Humans are driven by their curiosity, we always want to know more, no matter if that knowledge is actually useful or not. You're trying to tell me that the entire galaxy is dependent on technology that nobody understands? That nobody is even trying to understand? The codex tells us that eezo is naturally created during supernovaes. That tells me that it forms during high energy particle collisions, which means it can be created in a powerful enough particle accelerator. Your telling me that nobody has ever done that? That nobody is trying to see at which energy levels, through which interaction it gets created? When it decays? Through what forces it interacts? Does it need a special gauge boson to have it's mass changing effects? The notion that everyone in the galaxy has been using a ressource, for thousands of years in some cases, that they have no idea about what it is or how it works, drives my inner hobby particle physicist insane. Of course I don't expect some poor BW intern to make a page one rewrite of quantum field theory. I don't care how eezo works, but the people in the MEU should and they're not even trying. The same of course applies to the mass relays and the citadel. You have been living on a station for thousands of years and never bothered to fully explore it? And then you suddenly act all surprised when an advanced alien species shows up, that you already knew existed, because you were using the evidence all the time, but never bothered to actually look at. Especially considering the Asari were chosen by the protheans and had a prothean beacon on their homeworld giving them acces to advanced technology for almost 3000 years. Humanity gets a pass for beeing the new guy, but Asari are truly the most retarded of the lot.

 

If the informations about ME4 are reliable and it will really happen in another galaxy, then we must have some development in building mass relays. There is no point in using a mass relay built by Reapers to run away from them, because they would know sooner or later. And I agree with Asari dumbness in this point if they had all this information at their noses.

 

You see, And i mean no offense here, You just look at the MEU in a scientific point of view. Not a storytelling point of view. I am aware that Eezo is forged during supernova, But not much of it is known, How it's created. BUT, There were some attempts to create FTL travel by the alliance near a station near Pluto. Or something like that,  Don't really remember well. Before they discovered the ruins. Point is, There are a lot of unknowns. It's like, Someone threw Einstein's photo electric papers or Planck's law papers or many other scientific research that led to the invention of the laser, Away to you for free and you don't know what or who that is. But you keep experimenting the technology trying to make use of it and trying to understand it. It's the same case with Eezo but on a larger scale. Remember when they said in ME1 that the Prothean were so close to understanding and solving the mystery of the mass relay network? Anyways, I think that Eezo, Dark Energy, Space-Time Dilation and many other concepts were originally intended to be parts of the trilogy's ending as Drew K have stated in an interview. It'd have been a grand finale to the trilogy that would explain a whole lot of things about Mass Effect. A gigantic mass effect 1-like twist that would leave you absolutely stunned. Point is, The mysteries were there for reason, Not because BioWare was lazy. At least i think so.

 

ME3 ending's are just a decoy, BW and EA are telling us that they don't want do reveal anything for now because it will sell more later if they reveal something - as little it can be - later. And so on, a bit in ME4, some more ME5, creating more questions in the process. The doubts they create in our heads are the business machine, not the answers.

 

As for the council being dumb, It has been stated in the codex that the reapers were a myth to many primitive civilizations and that's why the council didn't believe it. As for the continued disbelief of the reapers,  It's just that they're in denial, Just like those conservatives who won't admit that the Earth is dying and that global warming is real.

 

I 

I don't think the council are dumb, neither in denial, they just don't want to reveal their actions as Shepard was working with Cerberus in ME2, and in ME3 **** just happened too fast for a plan. They can't accept Reaper existence to the general public too: "hey people, there are some motafuqing machines coming from dark space as ships with length of 2km that can destroy a dreadnought with one shot, but don't worry, keep living and working while the end of world aproachs". Anything had to be done in the shadows, panic of the unknow wouldn't help the cause.

Again, if ME4 happens in Andromeda Galaxy, the council must have a hand on it.

[Laughing_Man]

If the informations about ME4 are reliable and it will really happen in another galaxy...

 

...Again, if ME4 happens in Andromeda Galaxy, the council must have a hand on it.

 

Is there any kind of source for this? If ME4 will be in another galaxy, it will be one of the most obvious cases of cop out in gaming history.

[Laughing_Man]

There are many theories to why ME3's ending was THAT terrible. But unfortunately, None of them are confirmed. As for ME4, I have already predicted before the leak that they are going to use a plot element that would allow them to softly reboot the franchise. And that option was the Andromeda Galaxy if the leak turns out to be true. As for the reapers, That as well is a reason why the council isn't budging. But still, They were denying the reapers' existence entirely and i think it was pretty obvious that they just didn't want it to happen.

 

The nasty memories from ME3's ending added to the blatant cop-out that this "soft re-boot" feels like, may cause me to simply ignore ME4, which would be a shame.

[Laughing_Man]

Yes, I did see it that way at first as well. But after they have shown the concept art of the new game and after the game was rumored and then leaked to be set in the Andromeda galaxy; As I have always wanted, But i wanted them to go for a Milky Way-Andromeda storyline and only AFTER they fix Shepard's story, I kinda started to get interested to see how things will play out. I have always known and predicted that it will be a soft reboot, But it might be a good soft reboot and an original take on the mass effect material. The interesting thing is, Most of the people who worked on ME3, And were the cause of the new narrative style has been highly promoted. For example, Mac Walters is now the head of everything, The Creative Director. But when it comes to people who originally created the series and were the primary cause of the first narrative style, Like Casey Hudson for example, They departed BioWare. Very few are have worked on all 4 mass effect games. And now that it has a new setting, A new premise, This style might actually work. The reason it has failed in ME3 is that they were trying to implement a new narrative style, A new storytelling style in the third act of the trilogy where the narrative style has been strictly defined already. But this time, It really might work. I'd say that BioWare has my curiosity for the next game, But not my full attention though.

 

Forgive me if I choose to remain skeptical. I mean, DA:I looked amazing enough in the demos and videos to cause me to actually pre-order it despite my initial misgivings. I may not actually regret buying it because I had the cash to spare, but I don't consider DA:I to be anything more than an average game.

 

What I really did come to appreciate is the power of marketing, half-truth, and white lies on my brain. I feel like a blind man that is suddenly able to see clearly for the first time in many years.

 

So stuff like pre-ordering? Now I do that only if I really like the company, and think that they have a good history of pro-consumer attitude.

Someone like CD Project Red for example. I don't delude myself that they don't do marketing shenanigans, but as far as I can tell they are not quite as cynical about it as others.

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

In Mass Effect universe its said that experience is a biological marker, Javik shows clearly that he can reveal a good amount of information about anyone just by touch.

When Shepard meets Leviathan, it only gives some answers after looking in to Shepard's mind - the moment when Shepard has a nosebleed - saying that he must understand why the Reapers perceive him as a treat and that Shepard is an anomaly. Leviathan also said that "the intelligence has one purpose: preservation of life. That purpose has not been fulfilled." and that the harvest will continue while this solution is not found.

If Reapers draws physical data from living beings to provide the necessary data for it's solution - as said Leviathan - each Reaper is an amalgama of all experience's biological markers of an entire species, providing it with an unique way for processing data, yet the solution is still unknow.

This line makes me believe that the Reapers interest in Shepard is linked with the solution, that our hero has some kind of biological marker, engraved in DNA by his/her life and her/his choices, that could provide a solution for the problem, and that's why they studied her/him in Arrival DLC, instead of killing him when they had the chance (and they sure had).

 

I came up with this after thinking about why they just don't kill Shepard in Arrival? Or Ranoch? Or Earth?

 

Shepard was Space Jesus. The Shepard. And the way they did the DNA markers was like total BS. Javik's abilities seriously stretched my suspension of disbelief. Fortunately I had some good bud to see me through that.

 

And the bold above includes the experience and biological marker of each individual being stuck in a sound proof tube and rendered (liquified) alive. In other words, the most powerful marker on the DNA is being terrified. Yeah, this really works well, but we'll overlook this problem.

 

I guess what makes them so interested in Shepard is that he/she killed one of them, died, and got better.

 

Anyway, they can easily get out of the ending problem. The entire Shepard trilogy was just a story told by an old man to his great grandchild. The mass relays really were built by the Protheans, and they're still around but their empire collapsed into a small corner of the galaxy kind of like Byzantium. The seat of the main galactic government is the Citadel: a marvel of ancient Prothean technology. There we go. Problem solved.

[SuperJogi]

Anyway, they can easily get out of the ending problem. The entire Shepard trilogy was just a story told by an old man to his great grandchild. The mass relays really were built by the Protheans, and they're still around but their empire collapsed into a small corner of the galaxy kind of like Byzantium. The seat of the main galactic government is the Citadel: a marvel of ancient Prothean technology. There we go. Problem solved.

 

That would be the lamest cop out in gaming history, even worse than the "we just go to a different galaxy" thing.

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

But it solves the "I want my ending to be canon" problem. Especially given the original purpose of the ending was so that there were no more Mass Effect games written.

[GriffithBlight]

But it solves the "I want my ending to be canon" problem. Especially given the original purpose of the ending was so that there were no more Mass Effect games written.

 

No more ME games written? We are talking about money, ME is a product, why would you stop selling it?

Lore discussion aside, the series are good, MEU is deep and the writters can solve any problems posted here with some good old space magic. What is important is that we continue to discuss and dwell in its universe, while this happens the money still goes to EA bank account someway.

 

The biological markers can be put in the "things not well explained in the game" list, a very long list. The bigger this list for us to discuss, bigger the profit for them.

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

No more ME games written? We are talking about money, ME is a product, why would you stop selling it?

Lore discussion aside, the series are good, MEU is deep and the writters can solve any problems posted here with some good old space magic. What is important is that we continue to discuss and dwell in its universe, while this happens the money still goes to EA bank account someway.

 

The biological markers can be put in the "things not well explained in the game" list, a very long list. The bigger this list for us to discuss, bigger the profit for them.

 

Mac Walters and Casey Hudson did the "torch the franchise" with the original ending. It's listed under TV Tropes - Video Games just follow that link.

 

We were left with nothing but questions. See when you load the game on your PC the extended cut automatically downloads now. Those of you who are relatively new to the series never saw the original ending, and it doesn't have the same impact if you've seen the extended cut.

 

Catalyst: "Releasing the energy of the Crucible will destroy the mass relays...." - this was for all three endings. There was no refuse ending. All the endings were exactly the same except for the color of the explosion on your screen. A child could have done a better job writing the ending.

 

The galaxy had not discovered mass relay technology. How was everyone going to get home? Would the Quarians and Turians starve? Was anyone even alive?

 

So this was the end. This was it. Shepard might be alive but would never see Liara or Tali again.

 

At this point, the planned DLC was Omega and possibly one on the Citadel involving Admiral Xen - the latter had dialogue written on the game disks. Then they decided to do the Extended Cut and added Leviathan and further push the biological marker BS to it. The purpose of Leviathan was to justify the existence of the Catalyst, and that DLC, really stretched my suspension of disbelief.

 

I'd rather have them solve the problems with some good writing than good old space magic this time.

[Laughing_Man]

Mac Walters and Casey Hudson did the "torch the franchise" with the original ending. It's listed under TV Tropes - Video Games just follow that link.

 

We were left with nothing but questions. See when you load the game on your PC the extended cut automatically downloads now. Those of you who are relatively new to the series never saw the original ending, and it doesn't have the same impact if you've seen the extended cut.

 

Catalyst: "Releasing the energy of the Crucible will destroy the mass relays...." - this was for all three endings. There was no refuse ending. All the endings were exactly the same except for the color of the explosion on your screen. A child could have done a better job writing the ending.

 

The galaxy had not discovered mass relay technology. How was everyone going to get home? Would the Quarians and Turians starve? Was anyone even alive?

 

So this was the end. This was it. Shepard might be alive but would never see Liara or Tali again.

 

At this point, the planned DLC was Omega and possibly one on the Citadel involving Admiral Xen - the latter had dialogue written on the game disks. Then they decided to do the Extended Cut and added Leviathan and further push the biological marker BS to it. The purpose of Leviathan was to justify the existence of the Catalyst, and that DLC, really stretched my suspension of disbelief.

 

I'd rather have them solve the problems with some good writing than good old space magic this time.

 

To be honest, I never bothered playing through and watching the "Extended Cut" as part of the game.

 

I may have looked it up on youtube at some point, but it really did nothing to change the disgust and disappointment I felt after the original ending.

 

In some cases, it's all about first impressions. The cop out that comes after doesn't really have the same impact.

 

The condescending attitude on the part of the developers ("Artistic Integrity". Right, like you never retcon when it suits you.), and certain "gaming"-websites ("entitled gamers"), only helped to spill more fuel on the fire, and helped cement the general disatisfaction bitterness and suspicion towards game development companies and established gaming websites - that to some degree revealed their true agenda and loyalty in their haste to defend their benefactors.

 

The whole fiasco was a real shame, but also an important lesson to everyone involved.

[Arisugawa]

Mac Walters and Casey Hudson did the "torch the franchise" with the original ending. It's listed under TV Tropes - Video Games just follow that link.

 

We were left with nothing but questions. See when you load the game on your PC the extended cut automatically downloads now. Those of you who are relatively new to the series never saw the original ending, and it doesn't have the same impact if you've seen the extended cut.

 

Catalyst: "Releasing the energy of the Crucible will destroy the mass relays...." - this was for all three endings. There was no refuse ending. All the endings were exactly the same except for the color of the explosion on your screen. A child could have done a better job writing the ending.

 

The galaxy had not discovered mass relay technology. How was everyone going to get home? Would the Quarians and Turians starve? Was anyone even alive?

 

So this was the end. This was it. Shepard might be alive but would never see Liara or Tali again.

 

At this point, the planned DLC was Omega and possibly one on the Citadel involving Admiral Xen - the latter had dialogue written on the game disks. Then they decided to do the Extended Cut and added Leviathan and further push the biological marker BS to it. The purpose of Leviathan was to justify the existence of the Catalyst, and that DLC, really stretched my suspension of disbelief.

 

I'd rather have them solve the problems with some good writing than good old space magic this time.

 

 

This isn't entirely true, the original endings had some variation.

1. Low EMS Destroy still showed the energy wave torching the planet.
2. High EMS Destroy showed the Reapers collapsing and the soldiers on earth celebrating.
3. Control still showed the Citadel closing, and did not show the Citadel blowing up or the Relay explosions like Destroy or Synthesis.
4. In low EMS Control and Destroy - nobody exits the Normandy on the garden world.

A few other slight variations exist. The point I'm making is that the original endings were not exactly the same just with a different color scheme. They were, however, similar enough especially in the High EMS endings, that everyone getting the High EMS endings (pretty much everyone on their first playthrough) got pretty much the same thing, especially once the energy wave hit earth. High Control still had the Citadel closing and the did not show the relay explosions, High Destroy still showed the Reapers collapsing instead of flying away, etc. These were differences, minor as they were.

 

The bigger problem is that original endings had no emotional variation.

 

They all came out of nowhere.

They all punched you in the gut.

They all left you reeling with no sense of catharsis or denouement.

 

And since the visual difference were so minor in scope, they might as well have been the exact same thing.

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

This isn't entirely true, the original endings had some variation.

1. Low EMS Destroy still showed the energy wave torching the planet.
2. High EMS Destroy showed the Reapers collapsing and the soldiers on earth celebrating.
3. Control still showed the Citadel closing, and did not show the Citadel blowing up or the Relay explosions like Destroy or Synthesis.
4. In low EMS Control and Destroy - nobody exits the Normandy on the garden world.

A few other slight variations exist. The point I'm making is that the original endings were not exactly the same just with a different color scheme. They were, however, similar enough especially in the High EMS endings, that everyone getting the High EMS endings (pretty much everyone on their first playthrough) got pretty much the same thing, especially once the energy wave hit earth. High Control still had the Citadel closing and the did not show the relay explosions, High Destroy still showed the Reapers collapsing instead of flying away, etc. These were differences, minor as they were.

 

The bigger problem is that original endings had no emotional variation.

 

They all came out of nowhere.

They all punched you in the gut.

They all left you reeling with no sense of catharsis or denouement.

 

And since the visual difference were so minor in scope, they might as well have been the exact same thing.

 

Okay, they were nearly identical in the end effect. But thank you for verifying that the low EMS Control ending also had no one exiting the Normandy in the Original Ending. It seems no one believes me. That Youtube video is now gone.

 

We are at the point of "Did all that really happen?" "Yes, but many of the details have been lost with time. It all happened so long ago."

[leaguer of one]

Op,they want to use Shepard.