15838 réponses à ce sujet

[AresKeith]

Since we've already seen how DA3 looked, are we even sure there will/should be a DA4? I have my doubts. If the game was deemed a success, Bioware will figure "great, let's make the next one similar". If the game was a failure, maybe they'll just give up. But since Inquisition was such a monstrosity and I so approve of CDPR's philosophies of delaying release to increase quality and free DLC and not desperately trying to be three different kinds of games, I still argue that this thread is valid pre-witched 3 release.

 

Well considering how they already said there's gonna be more DA after Inquisition, and by then Bioware will be more familiar with Frostbite 3 

 

You keep bringing up free DLC but you do know that you'll have to pay for the Season Pass/Expansions right?

[In Exile]

Since we've already seen how DA3 looked, are we even sure there will/should be a DA4? I have my doubts. If the game was deemed a success, Bioware will figure "great, let's make the next one similar". If the game was a failure, maybe they'll just give up. But since Inquisition was such a monstrosity and I so approve of CDPR's philosophies of delaying release to increase quality and free DLC and not desperately trying to be three different kinds of games, I still argue that this thread is valid pre-witched 3 release.

What we've seen pre-release is CDPR preparating a graphical downgrade, introducing a season pass for paid DLC that will apparently not involve new areas, and otherwise praise themselves for how magnanimous they are to gamers. It hasn't been all sunshine.

More to the point as ME1-3 show, Bioware is quick to fundamentally alter their design regardless of success. Even if DAI was a success, all it takes is TW3 being a bigger success for Bioware to borrow from it.

[Spectre Impersonator]

I think when people say they want DA to be more like Witcher, I think that refers to side quests and more dialogue choices during them. I'm replaying Pillars of Eternity, I feel the side quests in that were adequate. They had there own little story, we got to roleplay them pretty much how we wished, getting some XP, gold and perhaps increasing our character traits in the process.

 

One thing I don't want DA to take from the Witcher is a fixed companion or removal of the party system, I want to have my choice to play as a human or dwarf etc.

Hell if given the choice I'd play as an elf or dwarf in the Witcher games, I think that could be interesting.

 Thanks for posting constructively in this thread instead of trying to derail it with discussions about "SJWs" (only just learned what this stood for thanks to this thread).

[Spectre Impersonator]

Well considering how they already said there's gonna be more DA after Inquisition, and by then Bioware will be more familiar with Frostbite 3 

This is an incomplete thought but I get what you were going for. If Inquisition flopped financially (I trust it didn't, though I haven't done the research), Bioware wouldn't have made another one. Being familiar with the engine will make the story better, will it?

You keep bringing up free DLC but you do know that you'll have to pay for the Season Pass/Expansions right?

Yep, already bought it.   The game with the expansions was cheaper than the Special Edition of DAI (lol) and the 2 paid DLCs are actual story additions.

[KBomb]

What we've seen pre-release is CDPR preparating a graphical downgrade, introducing a season pass for paid DLC that will apparently not involve new areas, and otherwise praise themselves for how magnanimous they are to gamers. It hasn't been all sunshine.

More to the point as ME1-3 show, Bioware is quick to fundamentally alter their design regardless of success. Even if DAI was a success, all it takes is TW3 being a bigger success for Bioware to borrow from it.

New areas are great, but not necessary. If the story is intriguing and you walk away with some extra items, I am good with that. The season pass is paid, yes, but it's thirty hours of gameplay and with the quality I am used to with The Witcher series, I feel confidant it will be worth it. Is that a gaurantee? Absolutely not.

As I said before, all we know of the sixteen DLC's is four of them-- consisting of new armor that increases inventory, new hair and beard styles, a new look for Yennifer and a complete mission. Those four things alone sound awesome to me and it's twelve more to go. You don't need the season pass for those either.

[Spectre Impersonator]

New areas are great, but not necessary. If the story is intriguing and you walk away with some extra items, I am good with that. The season pass is paid, yes, but it's thirty hours of gameplay and with the quality I am used to with The Witcher series, I feel confidant it will be worth it. Is that a gaurantee? Absolutely not.

As I said before, all we know of the sixteen DLC's is four of them-- consisting of new armor that increases inventory, new hair and beard styles, a new look for Yennifer and a complete mission. Those four things alone sound awesome to me and it's twelve more to go. You don't need the season pass for those either.

More logic.  Sums up my feelings on the extra content quite well.

[RINNZ]

This cannot be said enough. I don't care about this flaming match between the fanbases. I also wouldn't care to read "my game is better than yours," with no constructive feedback. I mean, if TW3 has some good elements that would work well for BioWare, I'm all about it. I'm not so attached to my love of one company that I'm going to automatically invalidate the good things another one does. I'm looking forward to TW fans telling me about their experiences and why they feel that CDPR did an aspect of their game better. I've heard some articulate suggestions and great ideas that have come from fans of TW. One fan has almost convinced me to give the series another try, despite how dull I find Geralt.

Sadly, there is a very small very loud minority of TW fans that keep going, "But yeah well...boobies and real sex," or "They are free from SJWs." That doesn't present a compelling argument for me at all, and I'm much more inclined to react with condescension. I swear, give it a few years and SJW as an insult will be as overall meaningless as calling someone an emo kid is today.

If only I could post a gif via mobile.

Not to sound creepy or anything, but I love it when you speak about something in an unbiased and educated way. Makes me believe that the BSN isn't hopeless.

[Hazegurl]

If someone invokes SJW (whether to criticize them or otherwise) they are a SJW (at least a little bit). Heck, everyone probably has some SJW in them somewhere, the more important question is who has the right message anyway.

 

As far as themes and overall messages go I do find Witcher series generally superior, it's not just because they're like "real sex yeah" it's just the characters seem more trustworthy or something, less self-critical, more confident, or something, while still fitting into the same basic fantasy mold and all that entails. Oftentimes they're just nicer (certainly not Loredo though) DA is not necessarily that far behind because of Origins, but also Inquisition kinda, although 2 I thought was problematic for all kinds of reasons and really diminished my opinion of the franchise.

What I like about The Witcher is their fearlessness to delve into the mindset of how things probably would be back in the middle ages if our world was filled with magic and monsters et al.  People don't just praise Geralt for existing and doing some good deeds, well some do but most fear him and think he's a freak even though he may most likely save their lives.  They need him and detest him at the same time.  It's a complex relationship between Geralt and the world around him.  I really wanted that with the IQ in DAI but I found that BioWare was just...fearful of putting their foot in the water, they dipped a toe or two but never seemed to be willing to go all the way there.

 

When I think of it, this seems to be how Bioware deals with the tough subject matter of the DA verse.  You see how bad things could get or could be but a certain amount of restraint is there that keeps it from going wild.  I would say that DA2 was the only game that sort of took it there at the end of the third act with Meredith invoking the ROA. That scene gave me some chills, just like the scenes of the Sorcerers and Sorceresses in The Witcher getting burned and impaled.  I guess I'm a sucker for chaos in a story.  But overall I like a story that isn't afraid to be what it is regardless of the offense people will have because of it.  Sure CDPR changed certain things due to criticism but within reason that worked for them and it shows. 

 

Bioware, imo, doesn't have the same confidence as CDPR, they want to make everyone happy with their game so we ended up with a sanitized world where Dwarves now have magical powers and can cross into the Fade, where humans are willing to bow to a Qunari mercs, Dwarves, Elves, and Mages as their leader, and where an elf was a leader of a human centric religious organization.  Yep I take issue with all of that because it doesn't ring true to the world that was presented to us. 

 

In other words, I can trust the world of The Witcher moreso than I can DA. If that makes any sense. 

[Han Shot First]

The Witcher series is better at portraying a crapsack world than the DA series

[Hazegurl]

The Witcher series is better at portraying a crapsack world than the DA series

Pretty much. lol!

[In Exile]

The Witcher series is better at portraying a crapsack world than the DA series

The main reason for that being that DA doesn't want to portray a crap sack world despite some fans thinking it did.

[Steelcan]

The Witcher series is better at portraying a crapsack world than the DA series

which is a shame because Thedas should be much worse than it is presented as in game based on the lore

[Steelcan]

The main reason for that being that DA doesn't want to portray a crap sack world despite some fans thinking it did.

*looks at DA:O marketing material*

 

yeah there's a reason people went in expecting that

[In Exile]

*looks at DA:O marketing material*

 

yeah there's a reason people went in expecting that

 

*looks at the actual content of DA:O*

 

There's absolutely no justification for thinking that if they've played the game. The whole game is about heroic heroes who hero like no one's ever heroed before. Just look at the introductory cinematic in DA:O. where Duncan narrates about the Blight. 

[Steelcan]

*looks at the actual content of DA:O*

 

There's absolutely no justification for thinking that if they've played the game. The whole game is about heroic heroes who hero like no one's ever heroed before. Just look at the introductory cinematic in DA:O. where Duncan narrates about the Blight. 

its still hard to shake preconceptions, DA:O was advertised as the darker fantasy series, in opposition to something more "high" fantasy like TES or LotR.  And there are certainly parts of the story that try to play up this.  The horror aesthetic in the fallen Circle tower, the Deep Roads, and the treatment of the city elves all come to mind.

[KaiserShep]

I remember wondering why the Circle was littered with fleshy sacks. I guess the demons and abominations started secreting ectoplasmic goop all over the place.

[Hazegurl]

It's not just the marketing material, the game content and books also suggests a much darker world.

 

Mages are locked in towers and getting abused and raped

ROA can be called on Mages in worst case circumstances and sometimes have even before the worst happens

Dwarves don't understand the human world, only a few that live on the surface do and even then I don't see them leading anything but Merchant guilds.

People hate and fear the Qunari "oxmen" but use them as mercs

The Qunari want everyone to convert and don't think women should fight

City Elves are kept in the ghetto or they are woodland nomads who kill humans on sight

Nobles can get away with almost anything, including raping city elves at will.

Grey wardens don't give a shyt if you're innocent, they won't save you if you're useless.

 

The problem with DA (for me) is that while this is presented as how the world is there is a bit too much leeway for the player (hero) to ride in and just change everything.  The world sort of bends to the will of the player a bit too much...at least in Origins. 

 

"Sure we'll let you pick the ruler of our country...just because you say so." Yeah right, okay. lol!  I only think the options to pick a ruler would have been for Dwarves (Orzamarr) and Couslands (Denerim).

 

In DA2, the world was more established as the shythole it was and Hawke couldn't change everyone by just walking into the room. Sadly, because players were too used to bending everyone's will they complained about having no power.  When really the problem was Bioware not giving us the power to decide what Hawke himself would do. At least, that was my issue with DA2.  Having a more neutral path at the end could have helped.

 

DAI is the absolute worst of them all, they take their entire lore and established world and just toss it upside down and pour bleach on it.  Now I'm supposed to believe that an Elf was the first IQ, that a Dalish elf can be the current IQ, Non Mages will bow to mages when even in the books a group of peasants tried to kill them the first chance they got.  A dwarf is running around with a magic hand that connects him to the fade even though the game presented Dwarves as unable to wield magic or have a fade connection to the point of not having dreams,  humans will now consider a big Qunari Merc as their religious leader?

 

 If anyone think that is the world DA presented to us all along then I have no words. 

[AresKeith]

To clear things up, the elf wasn't the first IQ he was the last one before they became part of the Chantry

[Fiery Phoenix]

These "ZOMG ya gotta be like Witcher!" threads are the worst. And I say that as someone who can't wait to get his hands on Witcher 3 in a matter of days.

[SofaJockey]

Bioware has nothing to worry about as long as they go back to Origins, instead of trying to be both a tactical party-based RPG of old and an action game but failing miserably at both.

 

That ship has sailed, and if that's your view of DAI, ok, but DA4 will be DAI+ not DAO'2'.

[AresKeith]

That ship has sailed, and if that's your view of DAI, ok, but DA4 will be DAI+ not DAO'2'.

 

It probably won't even be DAI+ also

[SofaJockey]

These "ZOMG ya gotta be like Witcher!" threads are the worst. And I say that as someone who can't wait get his hands on Witcher 3 in a matter of days.

 

If you look at the scenery in TW3 it doesn't look that dissimilar to DAI - and TW forums have folk complaining it looks too much like DAI.

The combat in TW3 is said to be clunky and TW3s weakest feature, I don't know yet, but DAI was a mile ahead of TW2 combat.

Both DAI and TW3 contain side quests/fetch quests.

Both games have had dumb, 'you lied BioWare/CDPR' arguments

 

In short, the two games are more alike than they are unalike but to proponents on either side, such suggestions are heresy 

 

Wonderful fantasy RPGs don't come along every day (let alone every year) so I'm making the most of 2014/15...

 

It probably won't even be DAI+ also

 

Perhaps. We'll see in 2017/18, hardly worth the debate now about how the DAI model will expand, alter or whether it won't,

(but I know for sure we won't be revisiting DAO  )

[Torgette]

If you look at the scenery in TW3 it doesn't look that dissimilar to DAI - and TW forums have folk complaining it looks too much like DAI.

The combat in TW3 is said to be clunky and TW3s weakest feature, I don't know yet, but DAI was a mile ahead of TW2 combat.

Both DAI and TW3 contain side quests/fetch quests.

Both games have had dumb, 'you lied BioWare/CDPR' arguments

 

In short, the two games are more alike than they are unalike but to proponents on either side, such suggestions are heresy 

 

Wonderful fantasy RPGs don't come along every day (let alone every year) so I'm making the most of 2014/15...

 

What's funny to me is I enjoy both franchises and have played every installment from both (obviously not 3 as it isn't out yet). The whole bickering thing and people using one as ammunition against the other is dumb, especially in this day and age when AAA games are getting rarer and rarer.

[KBomb]

What's funny to me is I enjoy both franchises and have played every installment from both (obviously not 3 as it isn't out yet). The whole bickering thing and people using one as ammunition against the other is dumb, especially in this day and age when AAA games are getting rarer and rarer.

I agree with this. Insults and bickering are useless. Both companies have brought me much enjoyment and both games could use some improvements. So could some of the fans on both sides.

[AresKeith]

I agree with this. Insults and bickering are useless. Both companies have brought me much enjoyment and both games could use some improvements. So could some of the fans on both sides.

 

Quoted and bolded for truth