15814 réponses à ce sujet

[AllThatJazz]

I love things about both franchises. I'm very excited for Tuesday and diving back into TW, and also looking forward to the next bit of DAI dlc.

I also think both franchises could learn something from each other perhaps, but I love that I get different experiences from them. Both are very rich worlds, tons of lore etc. Both are populated with well realised characters, though I find that Dragon Age has more characters that I actually like and enjoy spending time with. Characters in TW are grim people in a grim environment, which is appropriate to the setting, but I don't find them as much fun and I don't develop as much affection for them. I find always playing Geralt a bit boring, much prefer a non pre-set protagonist, and I prefer the party dynamic and gameplay of Bioware games to TW's more action oriented and solo approach. TW's setting is pretty grimdark, which I do enjoy but I prefer a certain amount of levity, and DA provides the right mix for me. I'd like to see CDPR try a game with a character creator and a party of companions.

That said, CDPR are masters of quest design, and of making the world feel lived in and alive. Both previous Witcher titles have had some fantastic and quite involved side quests, and cities/villages with great atmosphere.

Great time to be a CRPG fan, though. So much goodness! X

[Grieving Natashina]

I love things about both franchises. I'm very excited for Tuesday and diving back into TW, and also looking forward to the next bit of DAI dlc.

I also think both franchises could learn something from each other perhaps, but I love that I get different experiences from them. Both are very rich worlds, tons of lore etc. Both are populated with well realised characters, though I find that Dragon Age has more characters that I actually like and enjoy spending time with. Characters in TW are grim people in a grim environment, which is appropriate to the setting, but I don't find them as much fun and I don't develop as much affection for them. I find always playing Geralt a bit boring, much prefer a non pre-set protagonist, and I prefer the party dynamic and gameplay of Bioware games to TW's more action oriented and solo approach. TW's setting is pretty grimdark, which I do enjoy but I prefer a certain amount of levity, and DA provides the right mix for me. I'd like to see CDPR try a game with a character creator and a party of companions.

That said, CDPR are masters of quest design, and of making the world feel lived in and alive. Both previous Witcher titles have had some fantastic and quite involved side quests, and cities/villages with great atmosphere.

Great time to be a CRPG fan, though. So much goodness! X

I'm sorry I don't have any likes to give, but thank you.  This is the kind of feedback between fanbases I love to see and what I hope from threads like this.  This gives me more of a good comparison to start with.  You rock.  

[BabyPuncher]

DAI is the absolute worst of them all, they take their entire lore and established world and just toss it upside down and pour bleach on it. Now I'm supposed to believe that an Elf was the first IQ, that a Dalish elf can be the current IQ, Non Mages will bow to mages when even in the books a group of peasants tried to kill them the first chance they got. A dwarf is running around with a magic hand that connects him to the fade even though the game presented Dwarves as unable to wield magic or have a fade connection to the point of not having dreams, humans will now consider a big Qunari Merc as their religious leader?

Are you putting forth any effort at all to differentiate between "We don't want to do this because it would make our players feel bad" and "We'd like to do this, but we don't have the resources to rewrite the entire goddamn plot to cater towards players being a certain race/class/gender?"

[AllThatJazz]

I'm sorry I don't have any likes to give, but thank you.  This is the kind of feedback between fanbases I love to see and what I hope from threads like this.  This gives me more of a good comparison to start with.  You rock.  

Thank you! For the record, I always enjoy reading your posts. You always come across as really level headed and kind

[SharpWalkers]

I love things about both franchises. I'm very excited for Tuesday and diving back into TW, and also looking forward to the next bit of DAI dlc.

I also think both franchises could learn something from each other perhaps, but I love that I get different experiences from them. Both are very rich worlds, tons of lore etc. Both are populated with well realised characters, though I find that Dragon Age has more characters that I actually like and enjoy spending time with. Characters in TW are grim people in a grim environment, which is appropriate to the setting, but I don't find them as much fun and I don't develop as much affection for them. I find always playing Geralt a bit boring, much prefer a non pre-set protagonist, and I prefer the party dynamic and gameplay of Bioware games to TW's more action oriented and solo approach. TW's setting is pretty grimdark, which I do enjoy but I prefer a certain amount of levity, and DA provides the right mix for me. I'd like to see CDPR try a game with a character creator and a party of companions.

That said, CDPR are masters of quest design, and of making the world feel lived in and alive. Both previous Witcher titles have had some fantastic and quite involved side quests, and cities/villages with great atmosphere.

Great time to be a CRPG fan, though. So much goodness! X

 

 

Stop that! Being all reasonable and ****...

[Spectre Impersonator]

*looks at the actual content of DA:O*

 

There's absolutely no justification for thinking that if they've played the game. The whole game is about heroic heroes who hero like no one's ever heroed before. Just look at the introductory cinematic in DA:O. where Duncan narrates about the Blight. 

Nonsense. Heroes have heroed way more impressively than that silly little band in DA: O.

[Grieving Natashina]

Thank you! For the record, I always enjoy reading your posts. You always come across as really level headed and kind

You're welcome and thanks for the compliment.  I try to come across as level headed when I post.  I don't always succeed, but it's a goal of mine.  

[Han Shot First]

The main reason for that being that DA doesn't want to portray a crap sack world despite some fans thinking it did.

 

Except they did. A Song of Ice and Fire was cited by the devs as a major influence for DA:O and the game was advertised more as a dark fantasy than high fantasy. The state of the world in game is also a lot more grim than what you'd find in a typical high fantasy setting. The nobles and monarchs are selfish scheming jerks and the knights sometimes murderers and rapists, the common people are racially and religiously intolerant, there are oppressed underclasses, religious wars, slavery in some places, occasional plague outbreaks, magic can result in the user being possessed by a demon and turned into a monstrosity, and the first game's heroes (Grey Wardens) conscript people against their will, even though it is a death sentence, and are renowned for be willing to do anything to defeat the Blight.

 

DA does have a crapsack world. The difference between the Witcher series and Thedas however, is that DA is crapsack light. 

[In Exile]

Except they did. A Song of Ice and Fire was cited by the devs as a major influence for DA:O and the game was advertised more as a dark fantasy than high fantasy. The state of the world in game is also a lot more grim than what you'd find in a typical high fantasy setting. The nobles and monarchs are selfish scheming jerks and the knights sometimes murderers and rapists, the common people are racially and religiously intolerant, there are oppressed underclasses, religious wars, slavery in some places, occasional plague outbreaks, magic can result in the user being possessed by a demon and turned into a monstrosity, and the first game's heroes (Grey Wardens) conscript people against their will, even though it is a death sentence, and are renowned for be willing to do anything to defeat the Blight.

 

DA does have a crapsack world. The difference between the Witcher series and Thedas however, is that DA is crapsack light. 

 

I will have to be sadly brief in this post - but ASOIAF doesn't portray a crapsack world. It's a deconstruction of Tolkien fantasy, which is really different. But that's besides the point.

 

DA doesn't have a crapsack world. It has a world that's leagues advanced beyond the medieval period, with greater rights of self-determination and a standard of living inconceivable to most medieval peasants. And that's ignoring the fact that the entire story of our heroes is one victory after another. The only mild source of darkess comes in the origin and then only if you choose not to have a resounding victory.
 

Crapsack light is TW2 Act II with Iorverth. DAO is light and soft by comparison. 

 

What you list is what LOTR has, or even something like Dragonlance. What makes a world crapsack is not the content but the narrative. 

[animedreamer]

Quests and decisions that have consequences, a proper open world, much less pointless harvesting and looting, and much better gameplay. Also CD Projekt Red is giving out Free DLC specifically to divert from the greedy norm. Putting this game to shame.

Who's reading  the audio book in your tagline? Dan Green? or Little Koriboh? 

[Namea]

I always thought of Dragon Age as being pretty closely ripped from the Forgotten Realms/Dragonlance D&D setting. The Tevinter imperium is the red wizards of Thay. The Dwarves are kind of 1 to 1 there, being tradition bound, living underground, appearance wise, like everything. The Blight and all that is more closely Tolkien I suppose with the great mythos of clashing evil and good, but you can easily see them as a legion of bad orcs and trolls or something to the south, along with dragons being malicious. Plus all the classes and basic archetypes follow most of the D&D elements.

 

The only differences are kind of the inter-political intrigue from Game of Thrones with the rival houses and stuff (but which kind of goes in the background a bit).

 

This is true but Tar Valon, Par Vollon...Berelain....The great game of houses and the great game in general which is often played with masks involved and traditions of mannerism...

 

Not to mention that the Wheel of Time series predates the Game of thrones crap. It doesn't predate tolkien but honestly almost any fantasy anything has something inspired by tolkien or ripped directly from. As terrible of a writer as Tolkien was, he crafted an unforgettable world from which all fantasy tropes are descended. 

[PsychoBlonde]

For example, CDPR could learn a few things from Bioware on crafting an appealing protagonist.

 

Yes.  Couldn't pay me enough to play The Witcher games.  Geralt sets my teeth on edge.

 

My housemate bought the first one and got about 80% through when he gave up due to boredom.  Granted, I'm not sure he's really enjoyed a single-player RPG since KotOR.  Maybe Mass Effect, but like me he couldn't be bothered with the sequels.

[Steelcan]

I will have to be sadly brief in this post - but ASOIAF doesn't portray a crapsack world. It's a deconstruction of Tolkien fantasy, which is really different. But that's besides the point.

 

DA doesn't have a crapsack world. It has a world that's leagues advanced beyond the medieval period, with greater rights of self-determination and a standard of living inconceivable to most medieval peasants. And that's ignoring the fact that the entire story of our heroes is one victory after another. The only mild source of darkess comes in the origin and then only if you choose not to have a resounding victory.
 

Crapsack light is TW2 Act II with Iorverth. DAO is light and soft by comparison. 

 

What you list is what LOTR has, or even something like Dragonlance. What makes a world crapsack is not the content but the narrative. 

I'm gonna have to disagree with you on ASoIaF being a deconstruction of Tolkien.

 

There are too many parallels and similarities for me to think that its a deconstruction

[Saphiron123]

I will have to be sadly brief in this post - but ASOIAF doesn't portray a crapsack world. It's a deconstruction of Tolkien fantasy, which is really different. But that's besides the point.

 

DA doesn't have a crapsack world. It has a world that's leagues advanced beyond the medieval period, with greater rights of self-determination and a standard of living inconceivable to most medieval peasants. And that's ignoring the fact that the entire story of our heroes is one victory after another. The only mild source of darkess comes in the origin and then only if you choose not to have a resounding victory.
 

Crapsack light is TW2 Act II with Iorverth. DAO is light and soft by comparison. 

 

What you list is what LOTR has, or even something like Dragonlance. What makes a world crapsack is not the content but the narrative. 

I haven't seen enough day to day peasant life in dragon age to say they have a happier standard of living... I mean DAI is was bubblegum happy and didn't even bother to address stuff like burning the alienage etc, but I get the feeling in origins anyway, being a peasant wasn't awesome. DAI it probably is, but then in DAI even the Qun is super inclusive. I bet in the DA world with Gaider as head writer, kings of nations bring food to the people by hand and make long winded speeches about how everyone belongs no matter who they are.

DAI purposely backed off from anything serious and complex. The tones of racism etc weren't even touched on almost, Celene burned down an alienage and I'm an elf? Nah, no need to touch on that... it's cool. There were so few things with real emotional impact or difficult decisions. It's just watered down.

Anyway, who wants to play in an ideal world where everyone is accepted anyway. A game without conflict or emotional impact is just boring, and DAI, was sadly boring. The story it did have was good but it was light, like daytime TV light (minus the boobs).

I know we're never going to agree, that you felt in DAO like you were some kind of superhero right off the bat and there was nothing dark about it... just can't agree on those points. Every single main mission in origins had darker options then anything in DAI, from helping the werewolves once you learned what the elves did, to creating golems after the broodmother, or defiling the urn for greater power. DAI has nothing like that, it's all morally white, just like the narrative.

[Dutch]

22 more hours till the witcher 3 releases. When i get my good share of game hours and a feel of the quests and the storytelling i'll be posting a thread here about how witcher3 did what bioware couldnt.

[KBomb]

22 more hours till the witcher 3 releases. When i get my good share of game hours and a feel of the quests and the storytelling i'll be posting a thread here about how witcher3 did what bioware couldnt.

It's posts like this that leads to people not taking suggestions seriously. It shouldn't be about competition. It should be about taking something from a game you love and applying it to another game you love to improve it and make it better. All companies should pay close attention to what works and doesn't work for other companies. It's good for the games and the gamers. Once you draw it into a competition, though; people get defensive and pugnacious and that gets nowhere. As gamers, we should want Bioware to improve, not call for their demise. Two great RPG's is better than one. 

[Seraphim24]

What I like about The Witcher is their fearlessness to delve into the mindset of how things probably would be back in the middle ages if our world was filled with magic and monsters et al.  People don't just praise Geralt for existing and doing some good deeds, well some do but most fear him and think he's a freak even though he may most likely save their lives.  They need him and detest him at the same time.  It's a complex relationship between Geralt and the world around him.  I really wanted that with the IQ in DAI but I found that BioWare was just...fearful of putting their foot in the water, they dipped a toe or two but never seemed to be willing to go all the way there.

 

When I think of it, this seems to be how Bioware deals with the tough subject matter of the DA verse.  You see how bad things could get or could be but a certain amount of restraint is there that keeps it from going wild.  I would say that DA2 was the only game that sort of took it there at the end of the third act with Meredith invoking the ROA. That scene gave me some chills, just like the scenes of the Sorcerers and Sorceresses in The Witcher getting burned and impaled.  I guess I'm a sucker for chaos in a story.  But overall I like a story that isn't afraid to be what it is regardless of the offense people will have because of it.  Sure CDPR changed certain things due to criticism but within reason that worked for them and it shows. 

 

Bioware, imo, doesn't have the same confidence as CDPR, they want to make everyone happy with their game so we ended up with a sanitized world where Dwarves now have magical powers and can cross into the Fade, where humans are willing to bow to a Qunari mercs, Dwarves, Elves, and Mages as their leader, and where an elf was a leader of a human centric religious organization.  Yep I take issue with all of that because it doesn't ring true to the world that was presented to us. 

 

In other words, I can trust the world of The Witcher moreso than I can DA. If that makes any sense. 

 

Yeah no that pretty much makes sense to me.

[Grieving Natashina]

It's posts like this that leads to people not taking suggestions seriously. It shouldn't be about competition. It should be about taking something from a game you love and applying it to another game you love to improve it and make it better. All companies should pay close attention to what works and doesn't work for other companies. It's good for the games and the gamers. Once you draw it into a competition, though; people get defensive and pugnacious and that gets nowhere. As gamers, we should want Bioware to improve, not call for their demise. Two great RPG's is better than one. 

In before, "But they suck now!  CDPR is so much better, so BioWare deserves to crash and burn!  Only true RPG fans like anything but DA:I!  If you like DA:I, you must not really like RPGS!"  

 

[DragonKingReborn]

In before, "But they suck now!  CDPR is so much better, so BioWare deserves to crash and burn!  Only true RPG fans like anything but DA:I!  If you like DA:I, you must not really like RPGS!"  

 

 

I'm so confused.  I like Inquisition.  I like DA2.  I love Origins.  I like Pillars of Eternity, although differently to DA2/Inquisition.  I even kind liked the Witcher 2, although more for the detail in the world and story, rather than any particularly engaging gameplay.

 

I...I want to hate Inquisition...honestly!  I don't want to be a casual gamer!  I need help.  Is it possible to pray away...whatever liking Inquisition is...?

[Grieving Natashina]

I'm so confused.  I like Inquisition.  I like DA2.  I love Origins.  I like Pillars of Eternity, although differently to DA2/Inquisition.  I even kind liked the Witcher 2, although more for the detail in the world and story, rather than any particularly engaging gameplay.

 

I...I want to hate Inquisition...honestly!  I don't want to be a casual gamer!  I need help.  Is it possible to pray away...whatever liking Inquisition is...?

 

I'm afraid you're stuck with this horrible condition of liking more than one RPG or game company.  I'm also afraid you suffer from, "I Love Some Games Despite Its Flaws" syndrome.  Side effects include: Attempting to see both sides of a debate, enjoying the pros and cons of different series, as well as extreme enjoyment from a love of diverse games.

 

Don't fret!  There is help:  We have support groups for people like you.  I should know, I'm a member.  Together, we can get through this.  

[DragonKingReborn]

 

I'm afraid you're stuck with this horrible condition of liking more than one RPG or game company.  I'm also afraid you suffer from, "I Love Some Games Despite Its Flaws" syndrome.  Side effects include: Attempting to see both sides of a debate, enjoying the pros and cons of different series, as well as extreme enjoyment from a love of diverse games.

 

Don't fret!  There is help:  We have support groups for people like you.  I should know, I'm a member.  Together, we can get through this.  

 

I'm so nervous about telling my parents, my wife...oh no...how will I be able to look my sons in the eye again?!!

 

Do you have links to these support groups???  I feel so alone right now!

[KBomb]

I'm afraid you're stuck with this horrible condition of liking more than one RPG or game company. I'm also afraid you suffer from, "I Love Some Games Despite Its Flaws" syndrome. Side effects include: Attempting to see both sides of a debate, enjoying the pros and cons of different series, as well as extreme enjoyment from a love of diverse games.

Don't fret! There is help: We have support groups for people like you. I should know, I'm a member. Together, we can get through this.

I got down with the sickness. I regret nothing!

[Grieving Natashina]

I'm so nervous about telling my parents, my wife...oh no...how will I be able to look my sons in the eye again?!!

 

Do you have links to these support groups???  I feel so alone right now!

Do your parents play many video games?  If not, you should be okay, because they don't the get the culture.  You don't have to tell them.   For your wife, well, as long as she really loves you.  For your sons, I cannot help you there.  Alas, I am not a parent and I am far out of my league.  Perhaps you should buy as many samey and cloned games as possible, to set the best example.

 

Relax my friend.  The character fan threads tend to be places to go to get help.  Due to my desire to avoid offending delicate sensibilities, I can only direct you to the Story and Lore forums.  Many of us suffer from the same condition and from what I've found, there is no cure.  We take comfort in knowing we're not alone.  We decide instead to laugh and enjoy our games.  We're making do.  

[CronoDragoon]

[Grieving Natashina]

Edit: I'll stop being a sarcastic smartass and leave this open to get back on topic.  I have been hanging out for feedback, but my mockery of some of the attitude ended up coming out.  For derailing, I do sincerely apologize.