15883 réponses à ce sujet

[Eelectrica]

I remember when ME3 came out and not long after (not sure if it was this forum or another forum, seems like it was this one) and some guy said he had already spent $300.00 on MP after only a couple of weeks. With people like him it's no wonder microtransactions are a staple anymore.

Yesterday I read the for the non existant game 'Star Citizen', they're now selling $400 dollars ships.
So people can now spend $400 for ships that don't exist for a game that doesn't exist.
I'm all for crowd funding, and have backed a couple of games myself but that smacks of 'Alms for the rich'

They said that with DAI and it did end up being a detriment to the SP game. Should be no MP at all.

I think CDPR have earned the benefit of the doubt. Looking forward to more info on Cyberpunk before passing judgement.

[London]

My point about the rake is that it physically wouldn't fit in the container it was in, breaking immersion. I don't care that there are crafting items to loot - but they should be more realistically placed.

I'm also not arguing that Witcher 3s peasants don't more closely mirror reality, it is just a setting I do not enjoy being in for hours on end. This is not a thread about being a Witcher fan, it's a thread about what DA could/should take from it. For me, the exact level of grit in the setting is not one of them.

About the ?s, it's not only inconsistent people who commented on them. I found them overwhelming and distracting to immersion. I at the same time have never argued to just skip content - I'm an advocate of better content that makes you want to complete it. When I logged out of Velen, I had 99 ?s according to my map. Geralt, in such a hurry to find Ciri, would not spend weeks helping every peasant he ran across like you are encouraged to in Witcher 3. It's a trade off between ones need to hit ?s or stay in character - there is just no reason Geralt would be spending days diving in a lake just in case something is there - he wouldn't be there to begin with.

A lot of the ?s also seem to be nests or bandit huts. I would have been fine with those being in the world but not highlighted on the map as a point of interest to hit up. If the solution is to turn off quest markers and then likely miss 80% of the content, then that content failed.

[TheOgre]

Poverty does turn people into animals, at least it did in those days. The greater majority of peasants were uneducated and illiterate, so they based their knowledge on superstition--which meant they rarely bathed. They bathed about once a year or so because they believed washing off the dirt left them open for sickness, washing in the winter meant certain death and that if you were too clean, you disturbed the humors in your body. They would also sleep with their best animals in the house. A good milking cow or expensive hog was too risky to be left out for thieves or cold weather, so in the house they'd go, bunkering down with the family. Their clothing would have been completely filthy. Most peasants owned only a few clothes and despite everyone always washing clothes in TW3, peasants rarely washed their clothes. Washing clothes in those days was very hard on fabric. In most cases lye was used to cleanse the clothes and it could cause your hands to because raw and burned and it was known to even cause blindness--so you can imagine how it would wear on cloth. Fabric and thread were too expensive. In fact, royalty and nobles never washed their heavy velvets and silk gowns. They would brush them and freshen them with herbs, only linen and underclothes were washed and carried pomades to stifle the stench of themselves and others.

 

Manners would have been a useless trait and in the days where even nobles pissed in fireplaces and belched at the whim, it isn't something peasants would have put any priority to. 

 

I love that there is a social and economic difference that is noticeable. It's kind of off-putting to me to have peasants speaking with a posh accent. I like seeing the downtrodden be actually downtrodden. Those refugees in the Hinterlands were too happy and clean given their situation. They seemed to have it pretty good, actually. To me, that's not immersive.

 

It does boil down to personal preference though. Just what people like to and don't like.

 

 

 

+10000

 

I remember reading about how executions became a primary source of entertainment for peasants because someone was being shown a worse end than they. Not quite related but sort of is. Willing to sell you out or cheat you by erhrm, trying to kill you after a desperate job from a witcher, that sounds exactly what humans would have done if they never intended to pay for a 'job' in the first place.

 

I don't like my 100% fairy tale stories to have primarily good endings, I want them to be unexpected. 

[TheOgre]

My point about the rake is that it physically wouldn't fit in the container it was in, breaking immersion. I don't care that there are crafting items to loot - but they should be more realistically placed.

I'm also not arguing that Witcher 3s peasants don't more closely mirror reality, it is just a setting I do not enjoy being in for hours on end. This is not a thread about being a Witcher fan, it's a thread about what DA could/should take from it. For me, the exact level of grit in the setting is not one of them.

About the ?s, it's not only inconsistent people who commented on them. I found them overwhelming and distracting to immersion. I at the same time have never argued to just skip content - I'm an advocate of better content that makes you want to complete it. When I logged out of Velen, I had 99 ?s according to my map. Geralt, in such a hurry to find Ciri, would not spend weeks helping every peasant he ran across like you are encouraged to in Witcher 3. It's a trade off between ones need to hit ?s or stay in character - there is just no reason Geralt would be spending days diving in a lake just in case something is there - he wouldn't be there to begin with.

A lot of the ?s also seem to be nests or bandit huts. I would have been fine with those being in the world but not highlighted on the map as a point of interest to hit up. If the solution is to turn off quest markers and then likely miss 80% of the content, then that content failed.

 

The selected line, why you gotta be like that?

[London]

Be like what?

[TheOgre]

Your comment came off to me as if kbomb was only questioning your post because she was a witcher fan

[London]

Oh sorry - no Kbomb has been extremely patient and thoughtful in this thread; I actually agree with most of her posts.

I didn't mean for that to come off that way.

I may not be a Witcher fan myself, but there are a lot of things it did that I wish Dragon Age would do. But there are still some differences, many of which is why I was a DA fan to begin with.

I'm glad Witcher raised the bar, but there is just something about it that prevents me from wanting to play it.

[TheOgre]

Have you played DAO by chance? I think it was a good medium 

 

the problem being it came off as really brown wherever you went almost when it came to backgrounds/environments. I don't recall the peasants being as err filthy or cuss heavy.

[London]

I actually started a DAO play through today. I completed the Human Noble origin, and I have to applaud Mother Couslands performance - her reactions to the events were heart wrenching. And DAO didn't shy away from sometimes forbidden territory when it comes to children.

That scene is of the type that DAI completely failed in recreating - seeing a tragedy that you cannot prevent as it happens and really caring about the characters involved.

[TheOgre]

I actually started a DAO play through today. I completed the Human Noble origin, and I have to applaud Mother Couslands performance - her reactions to the events were heart wrenching. And DAO didn't shy away from sometimes forbidden territory when it comes to children.

That scene is of the type that DAI completely failed in recreating - seeing a tragedy that you cannot prevent as it happens and really caring about the characters involved.

 

If I could choose anything, I'd like them to go back to DAO style questing but keep the open world environments and continue with their combat. I'm not a fan of the combat but I realize a lot of people are. I'd like them to go back to the DAO AI scripts so that I can choose when Ex. Uses Ex ability as DAI encourages actually playing your character or other players for an extended period. DAO had really good side quests, so I know they can write them if they had more emphasis on them.

 

Bring back healing, preferably gradual healing to go hand and hand with the guard system/barrier, and make grenades hit harder. 

 

I betray some of my witcher feels when I ask this, but your right they don't have to be like the witcher, DAO had some good direction.. The mechanics I said above would work really well together in DA4

 

Oh and the beautiful coloring and design of DAI was what kept me going along with the character companions.

[London]

I agree with this - I miss healing spells. They were more enjoyable than only having barrier.

I also miss the DAO quest design. And tone of the world - so many things happened that turned up the feels - like Loghains betrayal. DAI just lacked these typeset scenes. The closest they came was the attack on Haven, but even then you can save all the NPCs that had dialogue so the loss of nameless NPCs had no impact. I think DAOs level of darkness with Witchers ideas of world design and immersion and side quests would hit the sweet spot for me. Oh, and colorful, beautiful scenery to enjoy. Not a fan of brown.

I also forgot to add that Witchers unpredictability was also a plus for me - there were quests that really made me question if the people who I thought I was helping would have been better off if I stayed out of it.

[Magdalena11]

It took quite a bit of adjusting to, but it's possible to play without needing much healing.  I don't play on nightmare, and I take my time leveling up, so I usually have more than enough abilities and passives to nearly ignore the healing potions.  There are extra potions available as a perk, and companions have abilities that can heal.  Some materials provide heal on kill, heal if taking no damage, or even heal per hit.  When a balanced party starts buffing and targeting offensively, combat is usually over before anyone needs healing.  I didn't even bother taking the focus last time I played a KE, and never missed it. 

[RINNZ]

I am throwing you a like and a +1 because this is pretty much how I feel-- except my little warden from DAO is probably my favorite female protagonist, followed by my Shepard from ME1 and Jill Valentine and Claire Redfield and Lara Croft.

I have played some fantastic males though and as a woman, it didn't seem lacking at all. Geralt, Nathan Drake and Soap MacTavish, Joel from TLoU, Norman Jayden, FBI from Heavy Rain, John Marston from RDR and Cole Phelps from L.A. Niore are all very high on my list of great male protagonists and have brought me many, many hours of great gaming. There are many more, too. I have seen a lot of people say they refuse to play a game that doesn't allow them to be female and I think it is kind of sad, because there are so many stellar games out there that they're missing out on.

Fixed dat fo' ya, fam.

[KBomb]

My point about the rake is that it physically wouldn't fit in the container it was in, breaking immersion. I don't care that there are crafting items to loot - but they should be more realistically placed.

I'm also not arguing that Witcher 3s peasants don't more closely mirror reality, it is just a setting I do not enjoy being in for hours on end. This is not a thread about being a Witcher fan, it's a thread about what DA could/should take from it. For me, the exact level of grit in the setting is not one of them.

 

I get that. I have a friend who refuses to play a game unless it ends in a good manner. She isn't a "Disney" type of girl either and doesn't expect everything to be rainbows, but she just likes walking away with a good feeling. I find it really interesting the differences that we, as gamers, have. I like to hear why other people make the decisions they make, or why they choose to play a certain moral path or what they want in a game. Immersion is different for each gamer. Personally, if I am playing a game such as Modern Warfare, I want it to be realistic (Well, you know. As realistic as in a level of believability for the era and circumstance), in fantasy games, I like a little of both. Some want one or the other. One thing I think we all want is a good game. I found that in TW3, I am glad some found that in DAI. As for the bolded, I didn't mean to imply that this thread is for accolades only by disagreeing with you, it never occurred to me that you were being critical in a "bad way". I was just rambling on about nonsense really. I have a minor degree in Historical Arts and it's completely useless. I have all these inutile facts and sometimes they just spew out. I have to use them somewhere!

 

 

 

About the ?s, it's not only inconsistent people who commented on them. I found them overwhelming and distracting to immersion. I at the same time have never argued to just skip content - I'm an advocate of better content that makes you want to complete it. When I logged out of Velen, I had 99 ?s according to my map. Geralt, in such a hurry to find Ciri, would not spend weeks helping every peasant he ran across like you are encouraged to in Witcher 3. It's a trade off between ones need to hit ?s or stay in character - there is just no reason Geralt would be spending days diving in a lake just in case something is there - he wouldn't be there to begin with.

 

I wasn't referring to you personally in my reply about the "?" quests. I really like them and did them all my first go round. I will most likely do them for my next and then just leave them when I get tired of them, but with the upcoming storage chest update, I don't know. I am a collector by heart. I didn't like DAI's loot system and I loathe the RNG. I didn't enjoy collecting and exploring and fighting high level enemies because I didn't feel there was a payoff. So, I know where you're coming from. 

 

RINNZ, on 04 Jul 2015 - 10:34 PM, said:

Fixed dat fo' ya, fam.

 

How could I forget Norman? That cute little addict was a charmer with his accent and super shades. 

[London]

Sorry again about the bolded sentence - that came out very wrong.

I actually think you have the patience of a saint, especially with some posters . I haven't seen you outright dismiss anything posted here, which I respect.

I don't really care for DAIs RNG loot system at all. I think objects should have their place - without exploits I'm not even sure there are enough chests to get all the crafting diagrams which hurts anyone who has their heart set on crafting certain items unless they can buy it. Going to the store though isn't as fun as a real treasure hunt though.

Witcher could benefit a lot from a chest - armor is heavy and there are some outfits I want to keep. For example, I looted all the outfits before meeting the Emporer and they are permanent drains on my weight limit lol.

[chrstnmonks]

Sorry again about the bolded sentence - that came out very wrong.

I actually think you have the patience of a saint, especially with some posters . I haven't seen you outright dismiss anything posted here, which I respect.

I don't really care for DAIs RNG loot system at all. I think objects should have their place - without exploits I'm not even sure there are enough chests to get all the crafting diagrams which hurts anyone who has their heart set on crafting certain items unless they can buy it. Going to the store though isn't as fun as a real treasure hunt though.

Witcher could benefit a lot from a chest - armor is heavy and there are some outfits I want to keep. For example, I looted all the outfits before meeting the Emporer and they are permanent drains on my weight limit lol.

I think they are adding s storage chest in soon. I hope so. There are runes swords and armour I really want to keep.

[KBomb]

Sorry again about the bolded sentence - that came out very wrong.

I actually think you have the patience of a saint, especially with some posters . I haven't seen you outright dismiss anything posted here, which I respect.

I don't really care for DAIs RNG loot system at all. I think objects should have their place - without exploits I'm not even sure there are enough chests to get all the crafting diagrams which hurts anyone who has their heart set on crafting certain items unless they can buy it. Going to the store though isn't as fun as a real treasure hunt though.

Witcher could benefit a lot from a chest - armor is heavy and there are some outfits I want to keep. For example, I looted all the outfits before meeting the Emporer and they are permanent drains on my weight limit lol.

Thank you. I don't know if that's true, some may disagree with you. But thank you all the same.

 

CDPR is going to be adding a storage chest in an update and I am happy to hear it, between trophies and crafting materials, my inventory is loaded. I hate selling trophies. I worked for them, I want to keep them. I like keeping different sets of armor, too. As well as different swords. I am surprised both CDPR and Bioware omitted storage chests, especially when they were previously in the earlier games. What were they thinking?

[panzerwzh]

Completely agree with point that Witcher series' lore perfectly demonstrates human's behaviors and reactions to poverty,racism social class and other mature social/historical themes within a mature, consistent and believable context. While DA series fails to keep its own lore consistent in that regards. DAO has provide a solid foundation of a grim "medieval"-ish fantasy setting while DA2 and DAI failed to explore such setting. Instead, DA2 and DAI's world is just a beautiful "medieval-sh" facade of a 21 century core value system. Those inconsistencies castrates DA series' depth and complexity to address maturate issues in a believable way.

 

A very good discussion of Witcher's world and realism in RPG games:

[Cantina]

My point about the rake is that it physically wouldn't fit in the container it was in, breaking immersion. I don't care that there are crafting items to loot - but they should be more realistically placed.

 

 

W

T

F

 

Yes. Everytime I loot I stop and think, "Man, there is no way that broken rake can fit in there. Hmm...better be sure, I'll get my tape measure," Its loot its not meant to be that realisitc. Hell, I think walking into a fishermans hut and finding fishing gear to be good enough.

 

<shakes head>

 

 

About the ?s, it's not only inconsistent people who commented on them. I found them overwhelming and distracting to immersion. I at the same time have never argued to just skip content - I'm an advocate of better content that makes you want to complete it. When I logged out of Velen, I had 99 ?s according to my map. Geralt, in such a hurry to find Ciri, would not spend weeks helping every peasant he ran across like you are encouraged to in Witcher 3. It's a trade off between ones need to hit ?s or stay in character - there is just no reason Geralt would be spending days diving in a lake just in case something is there - he wouldn't be there to begin with.

A lot of the ?s also seem to be nests or bandit huts. I would have been fine with those being in the world but not highlighted on the map as a point of interest to hit up. If the solution is to turn off quest markers and then likely miss 80% of the content, then that content failed.

 

Right. As there is no reason for the Dragonborn to delve into a four hour dungeon killing Falmar and looting when he/she should be going after the big bad. Why do people seek places of intrest yet complain about how they are implimented in the game? There is no diffrence between going to a "?" on the map or just randomly looking up on Google for a map of the locations.

 

So to summerize: You want to explore the map without being shown points of interest, yet at same time beleive that for realisum sakes Mr. G would never do this because finding Ciri is more important. No offense but that is a clustered mess of f'ed up logic.

[Sasie]

W

T

F

 

Yes. Everytime I loot I stop and think, "Man, there is no way that broken rake can fit in there. Hmm...better be sure, I'll get my tape measure," Its loot its not meant to be that realisitc. Hell, I think walking into a fishermans hut and finding fishing gear to be good enough.

 

<shakes head>

 

 

 

Right. As there is no reason for the Dragonborn to delve into a four hour dungeon killing Falmar and looting when he/she should be going after the big bad. Why do people seek places of intrest yet complain about how they are implimented in the game? There is no diffrence between going to a "?" on the map or just randomly looking up on Google for a map of the locations.

 

So to summerize: You want to explore the map without being shown points of interest, yet at same time beleive that for realisum sakes Mr. G would never do this because finding Ciri is more important. No offense but that is a clustered mess of f'ed up logic.

It's very possible to make a story that encourage exploration while having a separate goal in mind. It just has to either not be a pressing goal to do right now! (like the Ciri plot since she is in danger and need help) or the story can just make it clear the player is not good enough to solve the problem on their own and they need gold/allies/equipment to get there, also not something Witcher 3 does. Geralt seems more or less fine on his own without doing all the witcher contracts.

 

Just going to use an old example but think Baldur's gate 2. The player was in a rush to get to Imoen to get her out of the Cowled Wizard's prison before something bad happened but since the player lacked the means to get there and free her they had to do other things first to raise gold and prepare themselves for a prison break. Dragon Age Origins also had a pressing goal to fight back the darkspawn but the player didn't have the means to address it and as such had to gather allies to fight the blight.

With Ciri however you are several days/weeks behind her track and she is in constant danger so as long as Geralt knows where the next clue is there is no logical reason he would take off in the other direction to help some peasants with their problems unless it's to raise the bare minimal gold needed for food/housing for the night. Witcher 3's plot fits terribly with the open world they put it in.

[Xetykins]

Ciri however you are several days/weeks behind her track and she is in constant danger so as long as Geralt knows where the next clue is there is no logical reason he would take off in the other direction to help some peasants with their problems unless it's to raise the bare minimal gold needed for food/housing for the night. Witcher 3's plot fits terribly with the open world they put it in.

If I understand correctly, Geralt has no idea where Ciri is, so he's doing odd jobs for every scrap of information anyone can give him on her whereabouts. If he knows exactly where she was then the game would be very short indeed.

[London]

He doesn't have no idea where to look - the story leads you from place to place to learn more. The point is not to spend what would be a significant amount of time doing pointless tasks that you know results in no information. This is misdirecting the issue and her response and my point entirely. The plot was poorly written into the world.

Also Cantina I'm sorry my critique of both games as far as more immersive looting goes results in exasperated disbelief. You could just say that it doesn't bother you to find a rake in a container that obviously wouldn't be able to hold it and that improving the logic behind loot isn't something you think needs more thought put into. Skyrim did do this, and I actually enjoyed that things were put in logical places and figured I would like that in other games also.

In regards to Skyrim - Skyrim wasn't presented as a plot heavy game and the series never was a plot heavy series. Witcher was and still supposedly is. Skyrim also doesn't clutter up your map they way Witcher does. There is no way my Geralt knew that there were 99 unexplored points of interest from anything he was told, found, or overheard. And since you played the game you should know that 99 is not a hyperbole and Velen probably has even more that auto-reveal as you level more. Skyrim at least gave you a destination after you were told about it or read something about it. It's a bit more organic. Hell now that I think of it, DAI did this too for the most part. Organic exploration is just not well done in Witcher 3. Also I still think that bandit camps and monster nests shouldn't be PoIs at all unless you are told they are specific problems. Just running into them while working on other objectives works have been fine. They aren't even interesting enough to be a point of interest IMO.

As much as people are accused of desperately defending DA, it happens here for Witcher as though it were the messiah of gaming. There were a lot of things I thought Witcher 3 did well, and even listed them in this thread. I just don't think it's perfect and there are reasons I find it a chore to play.

[TheOgre]

I still believe dao is my messiah.. I just want the dai graphics, coloring, witcher 3 dynamic npcs and life.. Improved ai and ai script commands of dao..

Okay I want a lot of things.

[Torgette]

If I understand correctly, Geralt has no idea where Ciri is, so he's doing odd jobs for every scrap of information anyone can give him on her whereabouts. If he knows exactly where she was then the game would be very short indeed.

 

They do a good job of running quests parallel to Geralt's pursuit of Ciri, so you're at least somewhat invested in the side stuff even if the game doesn't force you to come back and finish said quests. Technically you can get away with completing very few side quests if your main concern is Ciri, there's also huge swaths of the maps with nothing main-quest related. I think the nice thing about TW3 is that when you do feel like wasting your time with side stuff, it's easy to do and rewarding.

[Xetykins]

He doesn't have no idea where to look - the story leads you from place to place to learn more. The point is not to spend what would be a significant amount of time doing pointless tasks that you know results in no information. This is misdirecting the issue and her response and my point entirely. The plot was poorly written into the world.
Also Cantina I'm sorry my critique of both games as far as more immersive looting goes results in exasperated disbelief. You could just say that it doesn't bother you to find a rake in a container that obviously wouldn't be able to hold it and that improving the logic behind loot isn't something you think needs more thought put into. Skyrim did do this, and I actually enjoyed that things were put in logical places and figured I would like that in other games also.
In regards to Skyrim - Skyrim wasn't presented as a plot heavy game and the series never was a plot heavy series. Witcher was and still supposedly is. Skyrim also doesn't clutter up your map they way Witcher does. There is no way my Geralt knew that there were 99 unexplored points of interest from anything he was told, found, or overheard. And since you played the game you should know that 99 is not a hyperbole and Velen probably has even more that auto-reveal as you level more. Skyrim at least gave you a destination after you were told about it or read something about it. It's a bit more organic. Hell now that I think of it, DAI did this too for the most part. Organic exploration is just not well done in Witcher 3. Also I still think that bandit camps and monster nests shouldn't be PoIs at all unless you are told they are specific problems. Just running into them while working on other objectives works have been fine. They aren't even interesting enough to be a point of interest IMO.
As much as people are accused of desperately defending DA, it happens here for Witcher as though it were the messiah of gaming. There were a lot of things I thought Witcher 3 did well, and even listed them in this thread. I just don't think it's perfect and there are reasons I find it a chore to play.

From what I saw most of the side quests is connected one way or the other to the main quests. I haven't played the game yet, hopefully after Tuesday I'll have a bit more to add to what I saw on the LPs.

For all you know, I might be in the same boat as you.

Also you have stated that you uninstalled the game after just "15 hours", I'm wondering if that was even enough to comment on the appropriateness ( is appropriateness even a word? :-p) of the plot to the open world.

On that note, I hope I can survive more than just 15 hrs when i finally get to play.