15882 réponses à ce sujet

[Akrabra]

Your point? I didn't read that and I am sure some others did, but beyond that--my point still stands. You shouldn't have to pay for a main game's conclusions. I liked Trespasser and I don't regret buying/playing it, that doesn't alter my opinion. If TW3's expansions do the same, I won't like that either. It's not really fair to have to pay for an epilogue/conclusion. 

Your point? Inquisition did have an ending, and epilogue slides to go with it. If Trespasser hadn't been released then it would have been fleshed out in the next Dragon Age game. A game that will cost money to purchase, so an expansion that does the same is a problem? Not seeing the logic. It would be like saying that Mass Effect 3 shouldn't cost money because at the end of ME2 we didn't get the conclusion to the story. The Witcher 3 expansions will be before post game, unfornately. 

[KBomb]

Your point? Inquisition did have an ending, and epilogue slides to go with it. If Trespasser hadn't been released then it would have been fleshed out in the next Dragon Age game. A game that will cost money to purchase, so an expansion that does the same is a problem? Not seeing the logic. It would be like saying that Mass Effect 3 shouldn't cost money because at the end of ME2 we didn't get the conclusion to the story. The Witcher 3 expansions will be before post game, unfornately. 

Where did I say that the Inquisition didn't have an ending or an epilogue? The situation with Solas and Iron Bull should have been in the main game, or fleshed out in the next game. It's ridiculous to compare purchasing a dlc to purchasing an entire game and a next installment. Really, I am not sure why you and a couple of others are having such a difficult time with my opinion. You don't have to agree with it, but please stop putting words into my mouth. It's happened a couple of times already and it isn't like you do to that. 

 

If I purchase a game, I want to finish it during the main game. DLC should add to the gaming experience and story, but it shouldn't include content that would wrap up any crucial story lines. Had Solas's story been told in the main game and the dlc was just tracking him down, then okay---but there were a few big bombshells dropped and if you're in a romantic relationship with him, you had to pay in order to have that final "meeting" with him. You think that's fair? I mean, honestly? If you romanced Iron Bull or maybe felt like your Inquisitor was his dearest friend, don't you think the events that occurred during the dlc would have been pretty significant? If you think all of that is acceptable, then okay. Your opinion and your right to them. I just disagree. If TW3's expansions happen during the game and adds to it without any significant bombs dropping, then wonderful. Once again they've impressed me. 

[panzerwzh]

I don't even know what this means, tbh.
 
 

Your point? I didn't read that and I am sure some others did, but beyond that--my point still stands. You shouldn't have to pay for a main game's conclusions. I liked Trespasser and I don't regret buying/playing it, that doesn't alter my opinion. If TW3's expansions do the same, I won't like that either. It's not really fair to have to pay for an epilogue/conclusion.

Not to mention players on xbox 360 and PS3 doesn't even have the option to pay for it. It is mega sadness combined with horrible business decision.

[Akrabra]

Where did I say that the Inquisition didn't have an ending or an epilogue? The situation with Solas and Iron Bull should have been in the main game, or fleshed out in the next game. It's ridiculous to compare purchasing a dlc to purchasing an entire game and a next installment. Really, I am not sure why you and a couple of others are having such a difficult time with my opinion. You don't have to agree with it, but please stop putting words into my mouth. It's happened a couple of times already and it isn't like you do to that. 

 

If I purchase a game, I want to finish it during the main game. DLC should add to the gaming experience and story, but it shouldn't include content that would wrap up any crucial story lines. Had Solas's story been told in the main game and the dlc was just tracking him down, then okay---but there were a few big bombshells dropped and if you're in a romantic relationship with him, you had to pay in order to have that final "meeting" with him. You think that's fair? I mean, honestly? If you romanced Iron Bull or maybe felt like your Inquisitor was his dearest friend, don't you think the events that occurred during the dlc would have been pretty significant? If you think all of that is acceptable, then okay. Your opinion and your right to them. I just disagree. If TW3's expansions happen during the game and adds to it without any significant bombs dropping, then wonderful. Once again they've impressed me. 

So Witch Hunter for Dragon Age Origins is the same then? Seeing as what we learn from Morrigan in DA:O's main story is in no way the whole picture, and we need the DLC + Dragon Age Inquisition to close that arc. Solas was set up as a villain after DA:I, and they didn't need to do anything more with it before the next game. Same with Iron Bull situation, there wasn't any reason for it to be more of it in the main story of the game. Trespasser came and they choose to include it, wisely i might add. I don't understand the difference between the expansion doing this and a new game doing it, why does this matter?

 

I am not having a difficult time with your opinion, i just don't get what you mean by it. Seems like you are so passionate about it, that paying for Trespasser goes against any argument you bring to this discussion. I am just trying to understand. I apologize for poking and prodding, i am just curious as to the reasoning behind your logic. 

[KBomb]

So Witch Hunter for Dragon Age Origins is the same then? Seeing as what we learn from Morrigan in DA:O's main story is in no way the whole picture, and we need the DLC + Dragon Age Inquisition to close that arc. Solas was set up as a villain after DA:I, and they didn't need to do anything more with it before the next game. Same with Iron Bull situation, there wasn't any reason for it to be more of it in the main story of the game. Trespasser came and they choose to include it, wisely i might add. I don't understand the difference between the expansion doing this and a new game doing it, why does this matter?

 

I am not having a difficult time with your opinion, i just don't get what you mean by it. Seems like you are so passionate about it, that paying for Trespasser goes against any argument you bring to this discussion. I am just trying to understand. I apologize for poking and prodding, i am just curious as to the reasoning behind your logic. 

Again, I don't see having a story carry over to the next game the same as putting it into a dlc after the fact and iirc, there were no huge revelations in Witch Hunt. 

 

As for the bolded, yeah. The revelations with Solas and Bull came after the main story, but most certainly had important ties to the main story, especially Bull's, since the result of his arc based on the decision you made in the main game, which means anyone who made that decision would be denied the results of it unless they pay for and play the dlc. Maybe it doesn't matter if you don't care for him, but some did. And the whole Solas thing is pretty impactful if you're in a romance with him.

 

As for being passionate, I wouldn't say that. I made one comment about it and the rest of the time discussing it has been defending my opinion on it and correcting statements that weren't even said by me. I never even brought it up until another poster made a comment--not even in my review of it. And yeah, knowing what I know now, I would have still bought Trespasser, mainly because I want to see the ending of my story and because I have enough "take a stand" moments concerning EA/Bioware.Not everything you disapprove of has to turn into a huge boycott/protest/rally. I simply think it should have been done differently. I have other complaints about Inquisition, should the fact that I bought it and started a new playthrough invalidate any of those complaints, too?

[Elhanan]

I don't even know what this means, tbh. 
 
Your point? I didn't read that and I am sure some others did, but beyond that--my point still stands. You shouldn't have to pay for a main game's conclusions. I liked Trespasser and I don't regret buying/playing it, that doesn't alter my opinion. If TW3's expansions do the same, I won't like that either. It's not really fair to have to pay for an epilogue/conclusion.

Considering that Trespasser is mostly compared to The Citadel DLC, and by myself to Leviathan, it would seem that many want these types of interactions. The conclusion still resides in the Vanilla game with the confrontation with Cory; this is an epilogue that occurs two years afterwards to say some goodbyes.

P.S. You thanked me for posting this on Aug 29th.

[pdusen]

Where did I say that the Inquisition didn't have an ending or an epilogue? The situation with Solas and Iron Bull should have been in the main game, or fleshed out in the next game. It's ridiculous to compare purchasing a dlc to purchasing an entire game and a next installment. Really, I am not sure why you and a couple of others are having such a difficult time with my opinion. You don't have to agree with it, but please stop putting words into my mouth. It's happened a couple of times already and it isn't like you do to that.

If I purchase a game, I want to finish it during the main game. DLC should add to the gaming experience and story, but it shouldn't include content that would wrap up any crucial story lines. Had Solas's story been told in the main game and the dlc was just tracking him down, then okay---but there were a few big bombshells dropped and if you're in a romantic relationship with him, you had to pay in order to have that final "meeting" with him. You think that's fair? I mean, honestly? If you romanced Iron Bull or maybe felt like your Inquisitor was his dearest friend, don't you think the events that occurred during the dlc would have been pretty significant? If you think all of that is acceptable, then okay. Your opinion and your right to them. I just disagree. If TW3's expansions happen during the game and adds to it without any significant bombs dropping, then wonderful. Once again they've impressed me.

I've got to say, I am having trouble telli g what you wanted them to do. They couldn't have put it in the main game, because they either didn't have time or it just flat out hadn't been written yet. You don't want it released as DLC, because you feel buying the base game entitled you to those plot points. Presumably you wouldn't want them in DA4 for the same reason, since to think otherwise would be completely contradictory, and I assume you operate logically.

These leaves me with only two possible conclusions; you didn't want those plot points touched at all ever again, or you have no bloody idea what you want and you're just here raising a fuss about it because you find doing so cathartic.

[KBomb]

Considering that Trespasser is mostly compared to The Citadel DLC, and by myself to Leviathan, it would seem that many want these types of interactions. The conclusion still resides in the Vanilla game with the confrontation with Cory; this is an epilogue that occurs two years afterwards to say some goodbyes.

P.S. You thanked me for posting this on Aug 29th.

You know, I did, Elhanan and I will admit that I didn't read the last part--or if I did, I don't remember it. I was more excited about the Nug and clothes for Skyhold. I should have read it, though. However, it still doesn't change my viewpoint. It still stands and as I said, I would buy it again with the knowledge I now have. Not every little complaint has to be validated, justified and protested.

I've got to say, I am having trouble telli g what you wanted them to do. They couldn't have put it in the main game, because they either didn't have time or it just flat out hadn't been written yet. You don't want it released as DLC, because you feel buying the base game entitled you to those plot points. Presumably you wouldn't want them in DA4 for the same reason, since to think otherwise would be completely contradictory, and I assume you operate logically.

These leaves me with only two possible conclusions; you didn't want those plot points touched at all ever again, or you have no bloody idea what you want and you're just here raising a fuss about it because you find doing so cathartic.

Entitled? Oh boy, here we go.

I will say this once again and then no more. I don't see dlc and future installments of the main game as being in the same category, so of course I don't mind plot points carrying over to the next game. They aren't the same thing and they're not in the same class of purchase. I certainly wouldn't buy a dlc for a game without buying the actual game. It's ridiculous to equate the two and say, "Oh, you don't want major plot points to be handled in a dlc, I guess that means you don't want to play the main game either because it isn't free!" People are reading too much into one statement. It just leaves a sour taste when you beat a game, then play a paid dlc and feel like that was the real ending.

I don't think it's wise or fair to conclude main story arcs or companion fates in a dlc. I think they should be in the main game or a future installment. I don't think stories should be piecemealed out. It is my opinion only. I wasn't even dogging Bioware for it, it was brought up because Elhanan stated that DAI was concluded in a DLC and I said, "Too bad you have for pay for those conclusions." So, what fuss am I making? Because I stated my opinion? Because a couple of people misinterpreted a reply and I corrected them on it? Because you're of the opinion it's good business to conclude important things in dlc and I disagree? I just want to know because if I am to gain some catharsis from this discussion, it's best to define the terms for it.

[FKA_Servo]

I dunno. I think this is fair game. That said, I like expansions, and DLC is the form they take these days, for better or for worse. If I really like a game, I'd love a minor continuation of the story, and I think that meaty story content or companion content is the very thing that would make it worthwhile. Lair of the Shadow Broker always pops up when I think of this. The DLC was basically the only way to continue Liara's romance in ME2... well, it was a selling point for me, but it was also just a terrific storyline with a bunch of really fun moments and terrific scenery. One of the best content packs Bioware has ever released, and it was undoubtedly worth it. That's the vibe I'm getting from Trespasser, and while I haven't played it yet (I hope to start tonight, actually) I think there's probably enough extra content in there to justify its separate release and its price tag (subjective, of course. I think DAI's item packs are a shameful rip off, but I think that the story content DLCs we've gotten have been enjoyable and worthwhile).

 

And for what its worth, this wasn't stuff intentionally held out of the game (I mean, maybe it was story boarded). They're on the record as saying they started development on it after they finished up Jaws of Hakkon - I guess we can believe or disbelieve them as we will. I think the only unpalatable aspect of it all is the fact that old gen players got burned. DAI's whole development cycle was just a weird mess though, and hopefully it will be a little less hectic in the future.

[Wolven_Soul]

So Witch Hunter for Dragon Age Origins is the same then? Seeing as what we learn from Morrigan in DA:O's main story is in no way the whole picture, and we need the DLC + Dragon Age Inquisition to close that arc. Solas was set up as a villain after DA:I, and they didn't need to do anything more with it before the next game. Same with Iron Bull situation, there wasn't any reason for it to be more of it in the main story of the game. Trespasser came and they choose to include it, wisely i might add. I don't understand the difference between the expansion doing this and a new game doing it, why does this matter?

 

I am not having a difficult time with your opinion, i just don't get what you mean by it. Seems like you are so passionate about it, that paying for Trespasser goes against any argument you bring to this discussion. I am just trying to understand. I apologize for poking and prodding, i am just curious as to the reasoning behind your logic. 

 

I never felt that we actually needed Morrigan's DLC, not really.  The conclusion we got for her was fairly satisfactory at the end of DA:O in my opinion.  Yes, we knew that there was going to be more eventually from her because of her child, but I was perfectly okay with paying for another full game to get that.  It was that big of a deal.  Which...ultimately I kinda feel they dropped the ball on that in DA:I.  I really expected more out of that kid's story arc.  

 

Anyway, back to my point, Morrigan's DLC really didn't tell us anything.  It just gave us a good adventure and we find out that the kid is alive and well.  Don't know what happens if we opt not to let her have the kid, I don't think I have ever actually gone that route come to think of it.  But anyway, it really doesn't tell us much, we just get to see our Warden walk into the Eluvian with her if we romanced her.  Other than that, it was not necessary for any kind of closure.  

 

I would agree with you about Solas except for one thing.  He was a romance option.  That means any one who romances him should really get a little more out that story in the main game than what they do.  I know everyone sees it is a great story, bittersweet ending and all that, but I agree with Kbomb in people who romanced him should not have had to pay for DLC to get that final closure with him.  If they had not made him a romance option and were setting something up for him in a future game, then by all means leave the ending to his story arc a blank slate.  

 

As for Bull, they really should have given us more of what happens to him in the main game.  He makes a pretty danged toughed decision...or rather...we make it for him...and we do not find out anything about him at all in the ending to the main game.  Or any of our characters, some of that stuff was really important to me, and I felt really, really let down when we learned absolutely nothing about any of them, except for whoever we choose as divine.  

 

Don't get me wrong, I like the idea of an epilogue, but that epilogue should expand on the ending, not actually be the ending itself.  Because the ending we got was incomplete, and I hate to keep beating a dead horse but it almost feels like EA cut out a part of the main game to sell it to us as DLC....again.

 

Granted, this is all from someone who has not yet played Trespasser, so feel free to take anything I say with a grain of salt or two.

[Wolven_Soul]

I dunno. I think this is fair game. That said, I like expansions, and DLC is the form they take these days, for better or for worse. If I really like a game, I'd love a minor continuation of the story, and I think that meaty story content or companion content is the very thing that would make it worthwhile. Lair of the Shadow Broker always pops up when I think of this. The DLC was basically the only way to continue Liara's romance in ME2... well, it was a selling point for me, but it was also just a terrific storyline with a bunch of really fun moments and terrific scenery. One of the best content packs Bioware has ever released, and it was undoubtedly worth it. That's the vibe I'm getting from Trespasser, and while I haven't played it yet (I hope to start tonight, actually) I think there's probably enough extra content in there to justify its separate release and its price tag (subjective, of course. I think DAI's item packs are a shameful rip off, but I think that the story content DLCs we've gotten have been enjoyable and worthwhile).

 

And for what its worth, this wasn't stuff intentionally held out of the game (I mean, maybe it was story boarded). They're on the record as saying they started development on it after they finished up Jaws of Hakkon - I guess we can believe or disbelieve them as we will. I think the only unpalatable aspect of it all is the fact that old gen players got burned. DAI's whole development cycle was just a weird mess though, and hopefully it will be a little less hectic in the future.

 

When it comes to EA I tend to disbelieve everything they say.  That way the only surprises I get from them are good ones.  This is the same company after all that left out a playable prothean character in ME3, keeping it out to make us pay for it as DLC.  

 

As for Lair of the Shadow Broker, as much as I enjoyed it, and I did, greatly, I remember thinking at the time that it felt kinda crappy that I had to pay extra money to get any kind of romantic interaction with Liara in ME2.  It was really something that we should have gotten more of in the main game.  That was probably my biggest disappointment in the entire ME series until the ending of 3.

[Xetykins]

Lets all chill and bask on:

Spoiler

the glory of TW3 timelapse on a very high end pc.

[Akrabra]

I never felt that we actually needed Morrigan's DLC, not really.  The conclusion we got for her was fairly satisfactory at the end of DA:O in my opinion.  Yes, we knew that there was going to be more eventually from her because of her child, but I was perfectly okay with paying for another full game to get that.  It was that big of a deal.  Which...ultimately I kinda feel they dropped the ball on that in DA:I.  I really expected more out of that kid's story arc.  

 

Anyway, back to my point, Morrigan's DLC really didn't tell us anything.  It just gave us a good adventure and we find out that the kid is alive and well.  Don't know what happens if we opt not to let her have the kid, I don't think I have ever actually gone that route come to think of it.  But anyway, it really doesn't tell us much, we just get to see our Warden walk into the Eluvian with her if we romanced her.  Other than that, it was not necessary for any kind of closure.  

 

I would agree with you about Solas except for one thing.  He was a romance option.  That means any one who romances him should really get a little more out that story in the main game than what they do.  I know everyone sees it is a great story, bittersweet ending and all that, but I agree with Kbomb in people who romanced him should not have had to pay for DLC to get that final closure with him.  If they had not made him a romance option and were setting something up for him in a future game, then by all means leave the ending to his story arc a blank slate.  

So her just leaving and you not knowing what became of your kid is just a good ending then? The Morrigan and Solas romance arcs play out the same until its conclusion. They both join you with ulterior motives, they both bond with you and even love you, they both leave regardless of what happens in the game. Both come back in a DLC/Expansion to close the romance arc for said game. And Witch Hunt is an exception to the "we shouldn't have to pay for the ending" because it was part of DA:O? It is exactly the same thing. I've said my piece, over and over and so i am done. Take care and have fun in this thread.

[Elhanan]

Do not believe there was a Companion DLC for DAI; nor Day 1 DLC either. Perhaps EA was not looking too close and Bioware got it past them....
 

[FKA_Servo]

When it comes to EA I tend to disbelieve everything they say.  That way the only surprises I get from them are good ones.  This is the same company after all that left out a playable prothean character in ME3, keeping it out to make us pay for it as DLC.  

 

Do not believe there was a Companion DLC for DAI; nor Day 1 DLC either. Perhaps EA was not looking too close and Bioware got it past them....
 

 

Circa like... 2009-2012, gamers have good cause to be jaded. EA (of course they were not alone, most devs seem to have done it) used and abused all sorts predatory DLC schemes and Day 1 carve outs. It took long enough, but I like to think they got the message from all the anger and outcry that built up. They didn't do it in DAI - that's pretty telling, and I'm not going to get caught up in them doing the right thing for the wrong reasons.

 

Besides, I think the MP is a bit of a gamechanger in that regard. Enough people are willing to sink real money into the RMTs in there that it's likely a lot more lucrative than any other DLC scheme they hatched in the past, and I foresee it being the primary source of post-release profits going forward. Provided that it keeps its grubby tendrils out of the SP (which remains to be seen, obviously, we only have two examples), the game will benefit from the larger budget assigned due to MP (they share assets), and they'll hopefully continue to eschew the crappier DLC schemes. I can live with that.

 

Even better, they'll maybe follow CDPR's example - they're able to look out for their bottom line without coming across as cynical cash monsters.

[Cz-99]

I'm not sure if this is true for other PS4 themes, but the Witcher 3 one that you get if you buy the season pass/expansions plays music while you're not in a game. Wonderful music at that.

 

That's a quality theme right there.

[Akrabra]

Circa like... 2009-2012, gamers have good cause to be jaded. EA (of course they were not alone, most devs seem to have done it) used and abused all sorts predatory DLC schemes and Day 1 carve outs. It took long enough, but I like to think they got the message from all the anger and outcry that built up. They didn't do it in DAI - that's pretty telling, and I'm not going to get caught up in them doing the right thing for the wrong reasons.

To be fair EA has had a crappy DLC policy for awhile, even back in DA:O. You needed to pre-order to get Shale for instance, same with Sebastian in DA:II. Also the DLC for both games was short and pricy. Inquisition has had the best DLC policy so far, good length, content, price and no day 1 DLC that was cut from the main game. If Mass Effect and the new IP follow the pattern they used for Inquisition, i will be very happy. 

[KBomb]

Lets all chill and bask on:

Spoiler

the glory of TW3 timelapse on a very high end pc.
http://youtu.be/V6NM9T7ARoA

Sounds good to me!

Edit: Watching this video reminds me how freaking gorgeous this game is. I can't wait for the new patch to come out so I can jump back in.

[TmTapani]

Sounds good to me!

Edit: Watching this video reminds me how freaking gorgeous this game is. I can't wait for the new patch to come out so I can jump back in.

Lucky you. I still have to wait around 6 months to play my first full playthrough. Bought the game on day 1, played it for a bit (100 hours) to satiate my hype and quit before Skellige. Will play for realsies when both of the expansions have come out, but by the gods the experience will then be GLORIOUS. The wait is killing me though.

[Xetykins]

Lucky you. I still have to wait around 6 months to play my first full playthrough. Bought the game on day 1, played it for a bit (100 hours) to satiate my hype and quit before Skellige. Will play for realsies when both of the expansions have come out, but by the gods the experience will then be GLORIOUS. The wait is killing me though.

Why did you quit btw, you got bored?

[TmTapani]

Why did you quit btw, you got bored?

Nah, just wanted to get the best experience possible. Loved my 100 hours with it but decided to wait a bit for the patches and the free dlcs to arrive. After that there was talk of expanding the romances (more Triss is always good) so I wanted to wait for that as well. Then more information on the expansions was released... you get the picture, I'm sure. It also gives me an excuse (and time) to save up for a GTX 980.

[Xetykins]

Ah ok. I admire your patience

[TmTapani]

Ah ok. I admire your patience

It isn't easy, I can tell you that. But Toussaint! And Fringilla! Argh! Gods damn those books that I've read! I just want it all. The funny thing is that CDPR is the only developer that I trust to give me the full experience when I buy a game. But now I want the extra experience as well, the greedy bastard that I am.

[KBomb]

Lucky you. I still have to wait around 6 months to play my first full playthrough. Bought the game on day 1, played it for a bit (100 hours) to satiate my hype and quit before Skellige. Will play for realsies when both of the expansions have come out, but by the gods the experience will then be GLORIOUS. The wait is killing me though.

You have the patience of a saint, good sir. Everyday I have to talk myself out of playing.

[Wolven_Soul]

So her just leaving and you not knowing what became of your kid is just a good ending then? The Morrigan and Solas romance arcs play out the same until its conclusion. They both join you with ulterior motives, they both bond with you and even love you, they both leave regardless of what happens in the game. Both come back in a DLC/Expansion to close the romance arc for said game. And Witch Hunt is an exception to the "we shouldn't have to pay for the ending" because it was part of DA:O? It is exactly the same thing. I've said my piece, over and over and so i am done. Take care and have fun in this thread.

 

Witch hunt was not really the same thing.  It does not tell us at all what happens with the child.  All it does is let us know that it exists more ore less.  Other than that all it really serves is to let a character that romances her to walk off into the Eluvian with her.  It is not at all unnecessary to close her arc, which doesn't play out till Inquisition.  

 

Even if was the same thing, Trespasser is still the worse culprit because it does this for all of the characters.